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BevHarris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-03-04 10:50 AM
Original message
Preliminary info on Volusia County
Edited on Fri Dec-03-04 10:53 AM by BevHarris
And this is very preliminary.

1. Volusia has several anomalies consistent with fraud, but these anomalies could possibly be explained by extreme stupidity combined with a complete breakdown in election procedures in 33% of the precincts at once.

2. There is a history in Volusia of likely fraud in a presidential race (2000) but the presidential contest in Volusia in 2004 could not have swayed the result in Florida, unless taken in conjunction with a number of other counties. The data for the other counties is not yet available due to stonewalling the records request in Florida's biggest counties.

3. The specific anomalies in Volusia show a highly unusual pattern that does not appear to be present in any other location in Florida. The specific pattern is very much consistent with fraud, but the mechanism implied by the anomalies would indicate local, inside fraud rather than outside penetration or national scope.

4. There are other races in Volusia that would also have made attractive targets for fraud, on a local level. The most significant contest, and the most lucrative target on a local level, was the supervisor of elections race. The current supervisor, Deanie Lowe, is retiring. The race between two candidates was as follows, Ann McFall (the underdog, who was the protege of Deanie Lowe) and Patricia Northey, favored to win, who had vowed to clean up the elections office, including promising to fire a key person with a high level of access.

The candidate promising to clean up the elections office lost, though she had been favored to win. She lost by about 4,000 votes, out of 229,000.

5. If fraud did occur, and if the mechanism implied by the specific anomalies was used, the most votes that could be affected, by our calculations, was about 20,000.

6. We have additional auditing to do, specific to the types of anomalies we found. There are significant problems, in that chain of custody is not intact in Volusia County for most of the key documents and records.

I have been told that people will be very disappointed that Volusia County does not appear to hold the key to overturning the presidential race. As a nonprofit, nonpartisan, 501c(3) we cannot work on overturning specific candidate races. What we can do is investigate anomalies, and you don't know until all the steps are complete what the answers will be. (Kinda like doing your taxes).

But regardless, it is what it is. We're looking for the truth, not engaging in partisan politics.

We are working on two additional investigations, one with decidedly national implications. Because of the time pressures on that, we have provided the information we have on that to decisionmakers and make-it-happen types, and if they figure it out first, that would be great. In the mean time, we'll continue to work on that.

We do not travel with a high-speed scanner. It was recommended to me that we get a digital camera to get photos of documents so we can get them on the web more easily. However, for those interested in the Volusia poll tapes, that is 900 pages; We would rather not pull out the ones we find most interesting to publish them on the web at this time, because we have additional investigations we are doing, such as interviewing poll workers from these areas, and we don't want this work to be pre-empted by damage control actions, once they know what our specific theory is and where we're focusing our attention.

Concurrently, there is a court hearing today on whether to dismiss a case to set aside the Volusia County election. That is a separate action, and will affect two things:

1) Our ability to look at more documents, as they may become sequestered as evidence, and we are not plaintiffs in the case

2) The wisdom of putting materials on the web. As long as there is active litigation, I think it's a dumb idea to stick evidence on the Internet. (You don't see the defendants doing that, do you?) All that does is give the opposition a detailed road map to use in preparing their case. While it is true they have the same raw documents, when we put them on the Web, that comes with analysis and singling out what conclusions we think can be drawn -- in other words, giving away the case.

This update is an informal one, not the final conclusion for Volusia. We are still collecting documents.

Thanks,

Bev Harris

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DTinAZ Donating Member (325 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-03-04 10:55 AM
Response to Original message
1. Wrong forum?
I'm pretty sure that your topics should be posted over in "2004 Election Results and Discussion" and not here in "General Discussion" IIUC (I'm a newbie, but I *might* just be correct).

And why in the world don't you ever post anything in your own discussion forum over on your website?????? That's quite a mystery, as are many other things, such as the explanation behind the *other* Votergate film (I guess it's the one at "VotergateTheMovie" dot something-or-other....)

DT
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BevHarris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-03-04 10:59 AM
Response to Reply #1
3. I like DU because it helps vet out arguments.
Edited on Fri Dec-03-04 11:00 AM by BevHarris
I often transport info from here to the other location, after it is criticized. I get more forceful critiques from DU members than from BBV members, who tend to be mostly supportive all the time.

People here were asking for an update on Volusia. That's why I posted it. You're probably right that this might be better in the voting forum. I certainly don't mind if the mods move it.

Bev
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DTinAZ Donating Member (325 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-03-04 11:11 AM
Response to Reply #3
7. sure....however....
...I don't think the moderators are going to move your threads for you, Bev. Please consider starting them in the 2004 Election Results and Discussion forum yourself.
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MsConduct Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-03-04 11:24 AM
Response to Reply #7
10. What? Your new here and you've designated yourself the board...
police? Wow....why not let the moderators worry about where threads should go?
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BeHereNow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-03-04 11:33 AM
Response to Reply #10
15. LOL! DU Board Police!
That is funny...
Note to Bev:
PLEASE get your priorities straight!
The REALLY, REALLY important thing for you
to focus on is which forum you post in!
Got it?
Now CONCENTRATE! (ROTFLMAO!!!)
Give Andy a hug for me?
BHN
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DTinAZ Donating Member (325 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-03-04 12:02 PM
Response to Reply #10
22. no big deal...
...I was simply trying to be helpful, folks, so you can just ignore me and go back to....whatever. I made a suggestion, admitting to being new...how *presumptious* of me!

(oh, BTW...if I were here only to criticize, then I'd point out that it should be "You're new here" and not "Your new here"...but then I'm not here to criticize...)
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AP Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-03-04 11:29 AM
Response to Reply #7
13. I'll look for your opinions in this thread too:
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asjr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-03-04 11:33 AM
Response to Reply #7
14. Who in hell are you??
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BeHereNow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-03-04 11:35 AM
Response to Reply #14
17. Bev's DU advisor
Seems Bev can't figure out what to do here at DU.
Thankfully she now has her very own personal DU advisor.
ROLF!
bhn
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MsConduct Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-03-04 11:48 AM
Response to Reply #17
21. LOL One good laugh deserves another! n/t
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On the Road Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-03-04 11:38 AM
Response to Reply #3
19. Thank You, Bev -- This is Wonderful
Do you have any estimate of the timeline at this point? Will the specifics need to be kept hidden until the lawsuit goes to court?

I also didn't realize this, although it makes perfect sense:

As a nonprofit, nonpartisan, 501c(3) we cannot work on overturning specific candidate races.

Are you prohibited from sharing the findings with non-501c groups who may want to contest the election? Is that happenning simultaneously?
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AP Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-03-04 11:03 AM
Response to Reply #1
5. As a long-time DU'er, let me say I don't agree with anything in that post.
GD is a fine place for this info. It's impotrant, and this is the most active forum.

And the only mystery I'm worried about is why 4 Fl counties seem to have lost so many e-votes.
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BevHarris Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-03-04 11:17 AM
Response to Reply #5
9. Yup. Same four counties refused to give up ANY diagnostics.
Which is why we're litigating. We'll get the records, the question is when. Generally, the more they resist giving you stuff, the juicier it is.

Bev
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Quakerfriend Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-03-04 10:56 AM
Response to Original message
2. Thanks Bev!!
Can't thank you enough for all that you are doing!! Our prayers go wish you.
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zann725 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-03-04 11:03 AM
Response to Original message
4. Thanks for the update...and your tireless efforts!
n/t:kick:
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Vidar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-03-04 11:10 AM
Response to Original message
6. Thanks, Bev.
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Fla Dem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-03-04 11:14 AM
Response to Original message
8. Agree, your findings should not be posted. Why tip your hand.
Certainly an occasional update "we're moving forward", or "things are looking good"...meaning you are finding evidence of fraud, or "not looking good"...meaning you are not finding substantial evidence of fraud would let us know how the investigation is going.

Your determination and pursuit of truth is awesome. I don't know how you can keep it up.

Take care of yourself and your team...don't burn yourselves out.


:yourock: :yourock: :yourock: :yourock: :yourock: :yourock:
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MsConduct Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-03-04 11:26 AM
Response to Original message
11. Thanks for the update, and all your hard work. n/t
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Kenergy Donating Member (834 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-03-04 11:29 AM
Response to Original message
12. Thanks Bev for the update n/t
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milkyway Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-03-04 11:35 AM
Response to Original message
16. Bev, keep investigating, and don't get hung up on a media relations
Edited on Fri Dec-03-04 11:36 AM by milkyway
campaign. It doesn't matter much right now if the mainstream media covers the election fraud issue or not. Many people are desperately hoping the election will be overturned, but only two things can cause that to happen--the counting of votes that flips a state such as Ohio, or else overwhelming evidence of systemic criminal fraud. A few minutes coverage by the mainstream media will not magically lead to the election being reversed.

We had wall-to-wall media coverage in 2000, yet the Dems still lost an election in which they received more votes. A public outcry to reverse this year's election will only have an impact if it is preceded by actual vote counting or evidence of fraud that shows it should be reversed.

Concerning yesterday's little dust-up with Olbermann and his staff, while some people here are attaching far too much importance to it, you must admit the outcome was not the best. But it's over, and it really doesn't matter all that much. Have you ever thought about hiring a volunteer simply to answer phones and take messages? I know you have a very small staff, and you should be concentrating on investigating fraud rather than handling the media (or being a webmaster). I'm sure there are DUer's in your area who would be happy to volunteer some time to sit by a phone and take messages.

Thanks for all you do. I noticed you posted here late last night, and early again this morning. Try to get some sleep! Saving democracy requires a good night's rest.
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MsUSA Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-03-04 11:37 AM
Response to Original message
18. *hugs* and thanks Bev.
We're hanging on your every word.
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SeattleRob Donating Member (893 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Dec-03-04 11:47 AM
Response to Original message
20. Go Bev!
There are a lot of us out here rooting for you! Keep up the good work!

:kick:
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