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kuozzman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-09-04 01:11 AM
Original message
Kerry/Edwards' lie is unforgiveable
Edited on Thu Dec-09-04 01:27 AM by kuozzman
I'm sorry, but they really did turn their backs on thousands of people who worked their ass off to support their campaign, not to mention the millions of us who thought that looking into incidents/results in Ohio was necessary.

Some comments, and pieces of a Nov. 20 article:
http://www.nyobserver.com/pages/story.asp?ID=9879

2:30 a.m. Eastern standard time November 3 in Copley Square in Boston, Massachusetts, where Kerry's supporters were gathered and vowed to hold out for a full count in Ohio:

Edwards declared, "It's been a long time, but we've waited four years for this victory. We can wait one more night." He continued, "John Kerry and I made a promise to the American people that in this election every vote would count and every vote would be counted. Tonight we are keeping our word and we will fight for every vote. You deserve no less."

John Kerry turned tail and ran out on his supporters in order to preserve his "image" in that fateful morning-after concession speech. In order to avoid looking like a "sore loser"—the phony chivalric gesture that, in fact, is designed to enhance his own image, not address his voters’ concerns. In order to avoid looking like Al Gore. For the sake of history, for the sake of maximum clarity and rationality in our political culture, we deserve the most exacting count possible, even if that means (horror of horrors) litigation.

Why wouldn’t John Kerry allow the votes to be (re)counted? Why the pre-emptive concession? (Which has no legal force: He has to be President if an Ohio recount goes his way.) Why deny his supporters the certainty that the votes had been counted and counted fairly? Why did Mr. Kerry’s nerve fail him? Why do yet another flip-flop and repudiate the words of John Edwards about making sure every vote is counted?

In Ohio, where a switch of some 68,000 votes could have changed the name of the next President, the count deserved maximum scrutiny. This point becomes clearer every day.

Mr. Kerry’s failure to aggressively pursue the counting and recounting at the outset—that morning, when the evidence was fresh on the ground—has made it virtually impossible to know the vote with the exactitude we deserve. Especially if the Democratic Party is going to change its principles on the basis of 68,000 votes in Ohio.

Mr. Kerry, for instance—if he were smart, if he were truly forward-thinking and unselfish—could have changed what is now becoming the Master Narrative of the Election (a "mandate" based on "values" means: get pious or else). If he had made the speech I suggest (or some version of it), he could have changed the focus from Mr. Bush’s popular-vote win (only 51 percent anyway) to a narrative about the unresolved closeness of the margin. About how the country remains divided—at least electorally—rather than the false (based on misread, inaccurate exit polls) triumph of righteousness (and self-righteousness).

The Democratic Party would be exposing the scandal of the failure to reform our voting procedures to affirm fairness (no more four-hour lines in minority urban precincts, as in Ohio, and similar abuses) rather than getting its collective knickers in a twist over how to appease the intrusive, self-proclaimed moralists by discarding its principles.

Instead the brainwashing began immediately:
NEWSWEEK: "Nothing but a miracle could save Kerry, and the candidate and his advisers saw that the long wait and inevitable court fights would paint Kerry as a sore loser. Advisor Ron Klain presented an aggressive legal strategy, but Kerry decided to spare the country."

Then of course the AP and many others magically disproved the "conspiracy theories" without really even discussing them in detail.

He made it all about him. All about how he’d look, about his image, perhaps about his future, his pathetic dream of running another inept campaign. What about his followers, who put their hearts into the campaign and were cheated of certainty so Mr. Kerry could bask in the goo-goo congratulations of the sappy and wrong-headed "spare the country" editorialists.

But in fact, he hasn’t spared the country anything. And note that not everyone thought "nothing but a miracle" could have made a difference in Ohio. Advisor Ron Klain obviously didn’t, and there’s a bit of imprecision in Newsweek’s account of the Klain/Kerry conflict. Newsweek’s own voice seems to accept unquestioningly the judgment of one Kerry faction that "Nothing but a miracle could save Kerry," although clearly there was at least one person in the Kerry camp who disagreed, and we don’t hear anything about his reasoning.


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UpsideDownFlag Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-09-04 01:12 AM
Response to Original message
1. 'kerry's unforgiveable', combined with referencing FR....
it wont work on me. sorry.
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TheDebbieDee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-09-04 01:15 AM
Response to Original message
2. Anybody got a good chili recipe?
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Kurovski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-09-04 01:28 AM
Response to Reply #2
11. Full of beans?
"Meathead Chili" was the name of a recipe I had from an old roomie

...Lemme see if I can find it...
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TheDebbieDee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-09-04 01:39 AM
Response to Reply #11
15. This time of year is the best time to eat chili......
I once had a recipe for chili made with venison. MMmmmmmmmm, good! :-)
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nothingshocksmeanymore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-09-04 01:16 AM
Response to Original message
3. You're using Freerepublic to bash Kerry?
We really are getting a bit loose around here
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kuozzman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-09-04 01:25 AM
Response to Reply #3
9. That's not even where it was originally printed or where I got it, I
came across it in a news database through my University, so no link(password). But I now found that NY Observer's site doesn't need a PW, just my database, so made the change. And who gives a shit where it was printed? Nice to see that you guys thought about the things it said though. Way to have an open mind!
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nothingshocksmeanymore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-09-04 01:33 AM
Response to Reply #9
13. OK fine.. Rosenbaum was not in Kerry' court in the primaries and
this is his sour grapes which are familiar in tone and whinyness. Yes, Kerry should have spoken out like AL Gore and got CREAMED that way. As near as I can tell, they have used the resources they have to challenge votes and vote patterns several places throughout the country since election day.

Most of what he claims he wanted to see has occurred. Votes are being counted, hearings are being held and the press is not focussing on calling Kerry "SORELOSERMAN".

The author, of course, thinks a certain other candidate would have done better though that is only implied.
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TheDebbieDee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-09-04 01:41 AM
Response to Reply #9
16. Kuozzman, Have you had any good chili, lately?
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Merlot Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-09-04 01:54 AM
Response to Reply #16
19. I had some great chili at whole foods market
it was made with salmon instead of meat.

Oh, so delicious!

ps I didn't read the original post, I'm just here for the chili
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Kurovski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-09-04 02:08 AM
Response to Reply #19
22. And Salmon is so good for you!
I think Venison is better for you too, free of hormones and other garbage at the very least.

Ground Turkey is nice, too.
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TheDebbieDee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-09-04 02:09 AM
Response to Reply #19
23. Salmon meat in chili? MMMMMmmmmm. How exotic !
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TrustingDog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-09-04 02:13 AM
Response to Reply #23
24. chili doesn't even need fish or meat.
It's all in the spices and beans and love of stirring it.
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TheDebbieDee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-09-04 02:19 AM
Response to Reply #24
26. I've heard of chili with pineapples. Ever tried it?
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Kurovski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-09-04 02:21 AM
Response to Reply #26
28. I love a good Pineapple,
but I'd have to draw the line at putting it in Chili. Pizza, too.

Is it true that in Mexico they put chocolate in Chili?
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TrustingDog Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-09-04 02:34 AM
Response to Reply #26
30. peaches are good too. mmmmmmm,doggie.

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Kurovski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-09-04 02:19 AM
Response to Reply #24
27. I always put just OODLES of beans in chili
I think ALL beans are magic.

I notice Merlot got some good stuff at Whole Foods, I once got the best veggie tamale there.

It was over a decade ago, but I still remember that damn tamale.
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JI7 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-09-04 02:37 AM
Response to Reply #24
31. i like the chili from Wendy's
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LittleClarkie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-09-04 02:00 AM
Response to Reply #9
20. But not so open that my brains fall out
Why should I have an open mind for something that has been said and resaid over and over since November 3.

Sorry, dude, I will continue to have Sen. Kerry's back, all the way to 2008 if need be.

If this person doesn't believe that John Kerry is a good man, that's his problem, not mine.
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LiviaOlivia Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-09-04 01:18 AM
Response to Original message
4. Thanks for reminding me to buy toilet paper.
Edited on Thu Dec-09-04 01:53 AM by LiviaOlivia
I noted your edit. Freudian slip? Copyright violation definitely.
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Sydnie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-09-04 01:22 AM
Response to Original message
5. I'm not buying it - sorry
I still believe. I believe in Kerry and in Edwards. I believe that they wanted it more than any of us did. I believe they still do (but maybe not more than we still do).

I also believe that Kerry wanted us to go "get it for ourselves" much like he did in '71. I believe we must expect more from ourselves than we have ever given to any cause before. I believe the future of our nation depends on it.

I believe .... do you?
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txindy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-09-04 01:32 AM
Response to Reply #5
12. Very nicely said!
:toast:

I believe. And that belief has only grown stronger since Nov. 3rd.
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dmac Donating Member (414 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-09-04 02:03 AM
Response to Reply #5
21. Absolutely! and glad to know I have company! n/t
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Diane L Donating Member (67 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-09-04 01:22 AM
Response to Original message
6. Won't work on me either....
there are still those who have not been paying attention.
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donheld Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-09-04 02:29 AM
Response to Reply #6
29. Welcome to DU Diane L
:hi:
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Hong Kong Cavalier Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-09-04 01:25 AM
Response to Original message
7. Your current link is dead.
And the link you had there before you changed it went to FreeRepublic.com. Got anything that acually makes sense?
'Cause I'm not buying it, either.

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buff2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-09-04 01:25 AM
Response to Original message
8. FReeptards
:boring:
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Kurovski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-09-04 01:26 AM
Response to Original message
10. The election isn't over until Jan.6
I'm waiting.

Sorry :-)
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zann725 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-09-04 01:48 AM
Response to Reply #10
17. Me too!
Besides, Kerry is a strong 'finisher!'

"So I still believe..." :kick:
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Straight Shooter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-09-04 01:38 AM
Response to Original message
14. "Why wouldn't John Kerry ALLOW the votes to be recounted?"
What-ev-er. Thread number 3,286 of the crybaby refrain.

:eyes:
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bhikkhu Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-09-04 01:49 AM
Response to Original message
18. A fine hatchet-job, but on the wrong people
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BikeWriter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Dec-09-04 02:17 AM
Response to Original message
25. Am I lost? Did I wander into freeper land?
Is this faux news?
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