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quote, "Thank God for the death of the UN" - R. Perle, March 2003

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protect freedom impeach bush now Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-05-03 10:29 AM
Original message
quote, "Thank God for the death of the UN" - R. Perle, March 2003
Edited on Fri Sep-05-03 10:56 AM by protect freedom impe
from buzzflash.com


What a difference a few thousand dead Iraqi civilians make.
(at least 10,000 dead civilians, likely 16,000 dead civilians,
men, women, children)
What a difference 300+ dead US soldiers make.
What a difference 50+ dead British soldiers make
What a difference a few $70 BILLION dollars spent.
What, No need for the United Nations anymore ? My how the PNAC
cabal comes back begging the United Nations to bail out the
PNAC's failed occupation

--------------------

http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,2763,918812,00.html

Thank God for the death of the UN

Its abject failure gave us only anarchy. The world needs order

Richard Perle
Friday March 21, 2003
The Guardian

Saddam Hussein's reign of terror is about to end. He will go quickly, but not alone: in a parting irony, he will take the UN down with him. Well, not the whole UN. The "good works" part will survive, the low-risk peacekeeping bureaucracies will remain, the chatterbox on the Hudson will continue to bleat. What will die is the fantasy of the UN as the foundation of a new world order. As we sift the debris, it will be important to preserve, the better to understand, the intellectual wreckage of the liberal conceit of safety through international law administered by international institutions.
As free Iraqis document the quarter-century nightmare of Saddam's rule, let us not forget who held that the moral authority of the international community was enshrined in a plea for more time for inspectors, and who marched against "regime change". In the spirit of postwar reconciliation that diplomats are always eager to engender, we must not reconcile the timid, blighted notion that world order requires us to recoil before rogue states that terrorise their own citizens and menace ours.

A few days ago, Shirley Williams argued on television against a coalition of the willing using force to liberate Iraq. Decent, thoughtful and high-minded, she must surely have been moved into opposition by an argument so convincing that it overpowered the obvious moral case for removing Saddam's regime. For Lady Williams (and many others), the thumb on the scale of judgment about this war is the idea that only the UN security council can legitimise the use of force. It matters not if troops are used only to enforce the UN's own demands. A willing coalition of liberal democracies isn't good enough. If any institution or coalition other than the UN security council uses force, even as a last resort, "anarchy", rather than international law, would prevail, destroying any hope for world order.

This is a dangerously wrong idea that leads inexorably to handing great moral and even existential politico-military decisions, to the likes of Syria, Cameroon, Angola, Russia, China and France. When challenged with the argument that if a policy is right with the approbation of the security council, how can it be wrong just because communist China or Russia or France or a gaggle of minor dictatorships withhold their assent, she fell back on the primacy of "order" versus "anarchy".

more..............
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graham67 Donating Member (732 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-05-03 10:32 AM
Response to Original message
1. Richard Perle....
should die of gonorrhea and rot in hell. JMO.
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JHB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-05-03 10:38 AM
Response to Original message
2. He has it exactly backwards...
...and always has.

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sinkingfeeling Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-05-03 10:38 AM
Response to Original message
3. Richard Perle should have to spend the next year or two....
of his life in full battle gear in Tikrit, Iraq.
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dfong63 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-05-03 10:54 AM
Response to Reply #3
4. ... and begging the folks at home to send water and toilet paper
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buckfush2 Donating Member (404 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-05-03 10:56 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. funny how much different this quote looks now
with W begging the UN for troops etc.
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JI7 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-05-03 10:57 AM
Response to Original message
6. if some arab had wrote this
they would have been arrested for the attacks on this alone.
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ComerPerro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-05-03 10:57 AM
Response to Original message
7. The problem is
They are going to be blaming the UN for all the chaos that is in Iraq now. And people here will be dumb enough to believe it.
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Trajan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-05-03 11:59 AM
Response to Reply #7
10. SHEEEESH .....
"... And people here will be dumb enough to believe it. ... "

Cmon tough boy: ... why not kick some sand in our collective faces while yer at it ....

GEEEEEZ: ... these blanket insults REALLY chafe my arse .....

We WERENT 'dumb enough' to believe it then ... and were ARENT 'dumb enough' to believe it now OR in the future ...

We arent even dumb enough to endure your childish and fallacious commentary ....

Sweeping generalization and ad hominem fallacies .....
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leesa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-05-03 11:09 AM
Response to Original message
8. The UN will come out of this mess stronger than ever
They were dead-on right about their approach to Iraq. Had the US not refused to lift sanctions, Saddam would have been removed from power by his own people years ago. How could we have stolen the oil though?
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loudnclear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-05-03 11:43 AM
Response to Original message
9. Can we please post this all over the media internet sites....they need to
be reminded that they also played a role in ripping the UN to shreds by promoting the administration's lies and propaganda without comensurate opposition.
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newyawker99 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-05-03 01:09 PM
Response to Reply #9
15. Hi loudnclear!!
Welcome to DU!! :toast:
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leftyandproud Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-05-03 01:17 PM
Response to Reply #9
16. you forget!!
half the country WANTS to rip the UN to shreds...Every puke I speak to wants the entire organization destroyed.
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Cocoa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-05-03 12:00 PM
Response to Original message
11. about as wrong as wrong can be, I'd say
Edited on Fri Sep-05-03 12:06 PM by Cocoa
and there were a whole lot of whores right there with him. Time to Google on "Peggy Noonan United Nations".

edit: jackpot on the first hit! The reliabe Noonan wrote a column "Back with a Roar" about Bush's speech at the UN, with this great line:


But it’s all right: The United States will come to the U.N.’s aid and protect its member states from Saddam.


http://www.peggynoonan.com/article.php?article=115
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ElsewheresDaughter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-05-03 12:03 PM
Response to Original message
12. because Sharon/Israel is in violation of over 100 UN resolutions
Edited on Fri Sep-05-03 12:17 PM by ElsewheresDaughter
and Perle is a memeber of Israeli Defense Board too

to name but a few:

UN Resolutions

1955-1992:

* Resolution 106: ". . . 'condemns' Israel for Gaza raid"

* Resolution 111: ". . . 'condemns' Israel for raid on Syria that killed fifty-six people"

* Resolution 127: ". . . 'recommends' Israel suspend its 'no-man's zone' in Jerusalem"

* Resolution 162: ". . . 'urges' Israel to comply with UN decisions"

* Resolution 171: ". . . determines flagrant violations' by Israel in its attack on Syria"

* Resolution 228: ". . . 'censures' Israel for its attack on Samu in the West Bank, then under Jordanian control"

* Resolution 237: ". . . 'urges' Israel to allow return of new 1967 Palestinian refugees"

* Resolution 248: ". . . 'condemns' Israel for its massive attack on Karameh in Jordan"

* Resolution 250: ". . . 'calls' on Israel to refrain from holding military parade in Jerusalem"

* Resolution 251: ". . . 'deeply deplores' Israeli military parade in Jerusalem in defiance of Resolution 250"

* Resolution 252: ". . . 'declares invalid' Israel's acts to unify Jerusalem as Jewish capital"

* Resolution 256: ". . . 'condemns' Israeli raids on Jordan as 'flagrant violation""

* Resolution 259: ". . . 'deplores' Israel's refusal to accept UN mission to probe occupation"

* Resolution 262: ". . . 'condemns' Israel for attack on Beirut airport"

* Resolution 265: ". . . 'condemns' Israel for air attacks for Salt in Jordan"

* Resolution 267: ". . . 'censures' Israel for administrative acts to change the status of Jerusalem"

* Resolution 270: ". . . 'condemns' Israel for air attacks on villages in southern Lebanon" * Resolution 271: ". . . 'condemns' Israel's failure to obey UN resolutions on Jerusalem"

* Resolution 279: ". . . 'demands' withdrawal of Israeli forces from Lebanon"

* Resolution 280: ". . . 'condemns' Israeli's attacks against Lebanon"

* Resolution 285: ". . . 'demands' immediate Israeli withdrawal form Lebanon"

* Resolution 298: ". . . 'deplores' Israel's changing of the status of Jerusalem"

* Resolution 313: ". . . 'demands' that Israel stop attacks against Lebanon"

* Resolution 316: ". . . 'condemns' Israel for repeated attacks on Lebanon"

* Resolution 317: ". . . 'deplores' Israel's refusal to release Arabs abducted in Lebanon"

* Resolution 332: ". . . 'condemns' Israel's repeated attacks against Lebanon"

* Resolution 337: ". . . 'condemns' Israel for violating Lebanon's sovereignty"

* Resolution 347: ". . . 'condemns' Israeli attacks on Lebanon"

* Resolution 425: ". . . 'calls' on Israel to withdraw its forces from Lebanon"

* Resolution 427: ". . . 'calls' on Israel to complete its withdrawal from Lebanon'

* Resolution 444: ". . . 'deplores' Israel's lack of cooperation with UN peacekeeping forces"

* Resolution 446: ". . . 'determines' that Israeli settlements are a 'serious obstruction' to peace and calls on Israel to abide by the Fourth Geneva Convention"

* Resolution 450: ". . . 'calls' on Israel to stop attacking Lebanon"

* Resolution 452: ". . . 'calls' on Israel to cease building settlements in occupied territories"

* Resolution 465: ". . . 'deplores' Israel's settlements and asks all member states not to assist Israel's settlements program"

* Resolution 467: ". . . 'strongly deplores' Israel's military intervention in Lebanon"

* Resolution 468: ". . . 'calls' on Israel to rescind illegal expulsions of two Palestinian mayors and a judge and to facilitate their return"

* Resolution 469: ". . . 'strongly deplores' Israel's failure to observe the council's order not to deport Palestinians"

* Resolution 471: ". . . 'expresses deep concern' at Israel's failure to abide by the Fourth Geneva Convention"

* Resolution 476: ". . . 'reiterates' that Israel's claim to Jerusalem are 'null and void'"

* Resolution 478: ". . . 'censures (Israel) in the strongest terms' for its claim to Jerusalem in its 'Basic Law'"

* Resolution 484: ". . . 'declares it imperative' that Israel re-admit two deported Palestinian mayors"

* Resolution 487: ". . . 'strongly condemns' Israel for its attack on Iraq's nuclear facility"

* Resolution 497: ". . . 'decides' that Israel's annexation of Syria's Golan Heights is 'null and void' and demands that Israel rescinds its decision forthwith"

* Resolution 498: ". . . 'calls' on Israel to withdraw from Lebanon"

* Resolution 501: ". . . 'calls' on Israel to stop attacks against Lebanon and withdraw its troops"

* Resolution 509: ". . . 'demands' that Israel withdraw its forces forthwith and unconditionally from Lebanon"

* Resolution 515: ". . . 'demands' that Israel lift its siege of Beirut and allow food supplies to be brought in"

* Resolution 517: ". . . 'censures' Israel for failing to obey UN resolutions and demands that Israel withdraw its forces from Lebanon"

* Resolution 518: ". . . 'demands' that Israel cooperate fully with UN forces in Lebanon"

* Resolution 520: ". . . 'condemns' Israel's attack into West Beirut"

* Resolution 573: ". . . 'condemns' Israel 'vigorously' for bombing Tunisia in attack on PLO headquarters

* Resolution 587: ". . . 'takes note' of previous calls on Israel to withdraw its forces from Lebanon and urges all parties to withdraw"

* Resolution 592: ". . . 'strongly deplores' the killing of Palestinian students at Bir Zeit University by Israeli troops"

* Resolution 605: ". . . 'strongly deplores' Israel's policies and practices denying the human rights of Palestinians

* Resolution 607: ". . . 'calls' on Israel not to deport Palestinians and strongly requests it to abide by the Fourth Geneva Convention

* Resolution 608: ". . . 'deeply regrets' that Israel has defied the United Nations and deported Palestinian civilians"

* Resolution 636: ". . . 'deeply regrets' Israeli deportation of Palestinian civilians

* Resolution 641: ". . . 'deplores' Israel's continuing deportation of Palestinians

* Resolution 672: ". . . 'condemns' Israel for violence against Palestinians at the Haram al-Sharif/Temple Mount

* Resolution 673: ". . . 'deplores' Israel's refusal to cooperate with the United Nations

* Resolution 681: ". . . 'deplores' Israel's resumption of the deportation of Palestinians

* Resolution 694: ". . . 'deplores' Israel's deportation of Palestinians and calls on it to ensure their safe and immediate return

* Resolution 726: ". . . 'strongly condemns' Israel's deportation of Palestinians

* Resolution 799: ". . . 'strongly condemns' Israel's deportation of 413 Palestinians and calls for their immediate return.
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legin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-05-03 12:27 PM
Response to Original message
13. From the bottom of the article
This is an edited version of an article that first appeared in this week's Spectator.

This is the my fourth black mark for this magazine in the last month.

1. They published the Nike factory in Vietnam story posted here.
2. Looking around the Spectator site I noticed they have Mark Steyn writting for them.
3. If you go over there now you probably find an interview with Berlesconi.
4. And now this.
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legin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Sep-05-03 12:38 PM
Response to Reply #13
14. The Berlusconi article
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