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Webb Coroner Confirms TWO Shots To The Head (link fixed)

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indigobusiness Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-19-04 01:31 PM
Original message
Webb Coroner Confirms TWO Shots To The Head (link fixed)
Edited on Sun Dec-19-04 01:55 PM by indigobusiness
Webb Coroner Confirms
TWO Shots To The Head
From Brasscheck
ken@brasscheck.com
12-16-4

No, it wasn't sloppy reporting in the original bulletin - even though several major news outlets took it upon themselves to change the story from one shot to two.

Gary Webb - chief architect of the exposure of the Reagan-Bush White House-sanctioned cocaine importation ring which fueled the devastating crack epidemic of the 1980s - died, in fact, from TWO shots to the head by a .38 caliber pistol.

Excerpt from the story:

Coroner Robert Lyons said his office had been swamped with calls. "It's unusual in a suicide case to have two shots," he said, "but it has been done in the past, and it is in fact a distinct possibility."

http://sacbee.com/content/news/story/11772749p-12657577c.html


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Cleita Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-19-04 01:37 PM
Response to Original message
1. Reminds me of the suicide of Salvador Allende,
He died from something like forty bullets from a machine gun.

Surrre.
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bahrbearian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-19-04 09:18 PM
Response to Reply #1
15. Thanks for making me research that, I'd forgotten all about that.
Really thats how we operate. The Shah, Saddam,,,
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merh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-19-04 01:39 PM
Response to Original message
2. Please fix your link.
I have read of suicides with 2 gunshots to the head, I think it has something to do with the calibre of the gun, the recoil action and the action of the body to the first wound.

Thanks for the link. It is intereting. Does the ex-wife confirm the suicide story because that is what it is or because she is scared?
How will anyone ever know?

========================
"Webb's ex-wife, Sue Bell, discounted such theories Tuesday, saying the 49-year-old Webb had been distraught for some time over his inability to get a job at another major newspaper.

"The way he was acting it would be hard for me to believe it was anything but suicide," Bell said.

She said that before he died Webb wrote and mailed notes to family members and placed his baby shoes in his mother's shed."
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indigobusiness Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-19-04 01:58 PM
Response to Reply #2
6. Suicides
are seldom 'out of the blue'. Clues usually abound, beforehand.

Thanks for the heads-up on the bad link.
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merh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-19-04 04:57 PM
Response to Reply #6
11. Thanks for fixing the link
I still have to wonder, was his ex-wife just trying to stop the questions about his death out of fear, or is that how she perceives his mind set?

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indigobusiness Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-19-04 06:23 PM
Response to Reply #11
13. Sure...thanks for pointing it out,
This story doesn't smell right. I'm afraid to speculate, at this point.

Your point is well taken.

This seems to me the latest mystery in a string of tragic consequences.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-19-04 01:44 PM
Response to Original message
3. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Cuban_Liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-19-04 01:56 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. Yes, a two-shot suicide is uncommon, but they happen.
I saw two in my career.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-19-04 05:30 PM
Response to Reply #5
12. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
Cuban_Liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-19-04 09:22 PM
Response to Reply #12
16. You're welcome.
It's rare, but not at all unheard of.
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AlCzervik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-19-04 01:48 PM
Response to Original message
4. My local station in sacramento that broadcasts AAR
has a local host Kristine craft, she did an interview with Gary Webb on 10/19 of this year, turned out to be his last broadcast. She re-aired it Friday night, after hearing it's hard to beleive he killed himself. I wish she had a web site so you could all hear it but i can't anything on her.
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htuttle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-19-04 02:02 PM
Response to Original message
7. Any time an investigative journalist dies violently...
...it should be viewed with some suspicion. I'd say the same thing about homicide detectives, FBI agents, and scientists working on defense-related projects as well.

However, Al Giordano, a long time collaborator with Gary Webb, seems to think it was a suicide. He'd had some contact with Webb in the months leading up to his death that seems to give him that impression.

Here's Al's obiturary for Gary Webb:
http://narcosphere.narconews.com/story/2004/12/15/184725/08

I don't know myself. It seems hard to believe that a guy who'd been on the trail of the Evil Enterprise for so long would end up killing himself (with two shots) just like that.
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Minstrel Boy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-19-04 02:12 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. Webb said he was being followed by "government men"
shortly before his death. He also said he was receiving death threats, and his apartment had been broken into on several occassions.

He also told Ricky Ross, one of his primary "Dark Alliance" sources, that he was working on a new story of CIA and drug trafficking.

"Gary described the men around his home as 'professionals' who jumped from his balcony and ran away when Gary confronted them"
http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/december2004/141204webbmurdered.htm

Some thoughts on Webb by friend and fellow real journalist, Chuck Bowden:

“He (Gary) was drinking Maker’s Mark whiskey,” Bowden recalled, “and I remember he slapped his hand down on the table and said, ‘I don’t believe in conspiracy theories. I believe in conspiracies.’

“I thought, ‘I like this guy.’ He believed in facts, not theories. In other words, this is.”

...


“In a daily newspaper sense, Gary was the best investigative reporter in the country,” Bowden said. “And he was unemployable.

“That tells me all I need to know about this business I’m in. You can get a paycheck every two weeks, as long as you don’t draw blood.”

http://narcosphere.narconews.com/story/2004/12/17/212320/36
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indigobusiness Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-19-04 02:26 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. 'The Big Lie'...strikes again.
Can't have people looking under the rug.
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Ian David Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-19-04 02:27 PM
Response to Reply #8
10. The freepers are quick to believe the Anti-Clinton Arkanside B.S.
Edited on Sun Dec-19-04 02:29 PM by IanDB1
Haven't a bunch of anti-Bush folks died mysteriously?

What about that dead guy that beat John Ashcroft?

The Freepers still buy into that whole Arkanside / Bodycount hogwash.

I think we could make a much better case for our own Bushwhacked Bodycount.

Anyway, here's a rebuttle of the Freeper Conspiracy:


http://www.snopes.com/inboxer/outrage/clinton.htm

Claim: Bill Clinton has been quietly doing away with those who oppose him.

Origins: A new version of a lengthy list of deaths associated with Bill
Clinton began circulating on the the Internet in August 1998. According to it,
there have been close to fifty suspicious deaths of colleagues, advisors and
citizens who were about to testify against the Clintons, with the unstated
implication that Bill Clinton or his henchmen were behind each untimely demise.

We shouldn't have to tell anyone not to believe this claptrap, but we will
anyway. In a frenzied media climate where the Chief Executive couldn't boff a
White House intern without the whole world finding out every niggling detail of
each encounter and demanding his removal from office, are we seriously to
believe the same man had been having double handfuls of detractors and former
friends murdered with impunity?

Don't be swayed by the number of names listed on screeds like this. Any public
figure is bound to have a much wider circle of acquaintance than an ordinary
citizen would. Moreover, the acquaintance is often one-sided — though many of
the people enumerated on this list might properly claim to have known Clinton,
he wouldn't know or remember having met a great number of them.

"Body count" lists are not a new phenomenon. Lists documenting all the allegedly
"suspicious" deaths of persons connected with the assassination of John F.
Kennedy have been circulating for decades, and the same techniques used to
create and spread the JFK lists have been employed in the Clinton version:

List every dead person with even the most tenuous of connections to your
subject. It doesn't matter how these people died, or how tangential they were
to your subject's life. The longer the list, the more impressive it looks and
the less likely anyone is to challenge it. By the time readers get to the
bottom of the list, they'll be too weary to wonder what could possibly be
relevant about the death of Clinton's mother's chiropractor.

Play word games. Make sure every death is presented as "mysterious." All
accidental deaths are to be labelled "suspicious," even though by definition
accidents occur when something unexpected goes wrong. Every self-inflicted
death discussed must include the phrase "ruled a suicide," to imply just the
opposite. When an autopsy contradicts a "mysterious death" theory, dispute it;
when none was performed because none was needed, claim that "no autopsy was
allowed." Make liberal use of words such as 'allegedly' and 'supposedly' to
dismiss facts you can't contradict with hard evidence.

Make sure every inconsistency or unexplained detail you can dredge up is offered
as evidence of a conspiracy, no matter how insignificant or pointless it may
be. If an obvious suicide is discovered wearing only one shoe, ignore the
physical evidence of self-inflicted death and dwell on the missing shoe. You
don't have to establish an alternate theory of the death; just keep harping
that the missing shoe "can't be explained."

If the data doesn't fit your conclusion, ignore it. You don't have to explain
why the people who claim to have the most damaging goods on Clinton — Gennifer
Flowers, Paula Jones, Kathleen Willey, Linda Tripp, Monica Lewinsky, Kenneth
Starr — are still walking around unscathed while dozens of bit players have
been bumped off. It's inconvenient for you, so don't mention it.

Most importantly, don't let facts and details stand in your way! If you can pass
off a death by pneumonia as a "suicide," do it! If a cause of death contradicts
your conspiracy theory, claim it was "never determined." If your chronology of
events is impossible, who cares? It's not like anybody is going to check up on
this stuff . . .
This Clinton "body count" list is not a new phenomenon — multiple versions have
been circulating for years. New victim names are routinely added and old ones
taken off, forming an endless variety of permutations. At this point, there is
no one "official" list.

But where did all this craziness start? In 1994, in a letter to congressional
leaders, former Rep. William Dannemeyer listed 24 people with some connection
to Clinton who had died "under other than natural circumstances" and called for
hearings on the matter.

Dannemeyer's list of "suspicious deaths" was largely taken from one compiled by
Linda Thompson, an Indianapolis lawyer who in 1993 quit her year-old general
practice to run her American Justice Federation, a for-profit group that
promotes pro-gun causes and various conspiracy theories through a shortwave
radio program, a computer bulletin board and sales of its newsletter and
videos.

Her list, called "The Clinton Body Count: Coincidence or the Kiss of Death?"
then contained the names of 34 people she believed died suspiciously and who
had ties to the Clinton family. Thompson admitted she had "no direct evidence"
of Clinton killing anyone. Indeed, she said the deaths were probably caused by
"people trying to control the President" but refused to say who they were.
Thompson said her allegations of murder "seem groundless only because the
mainstream media haven't done enough digging."

Ah, but they had. If not before she put her list together, at least afterwards.
Anyone who continues to state the mainstream media has given these claims short
shrift is being disingenuous.

Since 1994, various respected news outlets have been confronted with versions of
the "Clinton Body Count" list, run their own investigations of a few of the
claims, and found nothing to substantiate what they looked into. Those
investigations would culminate in yet another story about an oddball conspiracy
rumor.

But conspiracy theories don't die that easily. These "body count" lists and the
many specious claims contained therein continue to circulate in cyberspace and
beyond: yesterday's newspaper articles are forgotten with the next day's
delivery, but e-mail lives forever.

Let's take this new version apart line by line. The sections which appear in a
highlighted color are the "Clinton Body Count" e-mail, while the sections in
ordinary text color are my comments.


Much of the evidence will never be known because many people who were witnesses
or who possessed evidence of some kind suffered mysterious deaths prior to
being able to come forward.

In other words, "We can't prove that all these people had information damaging
to Bill Clinton, but since they're dead now we can simply assert that they did
without fear of contradiction."



The list compiled here is not complete and is not detailed. It is presented to
show how extensive the problem is and to illustrate that all these deaths could
not be just a coincidence.

Translation: "If I included all the details, it would expose what a canard this
list really is. And hinting that there's even more than I could list here makes
it sound all the more ominous."

The rest (including a point-by-point, case-by-case rebuttal):
http://www.snopes.com/inboxer/outrage/clinton.htm
(link fixed on edit)


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indigobusiness Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-19-04 09:07 PM
Response to Reply #10
14. It boggles the mind. n/t
Edited on Sun Dec-19-04 09:12 PM by indigobusiness
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rman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-22-04 04:22 AM
Response to Reply #10
21. much of this was going on under Clinton as well
of course he was no more personally involved then any other president.
Such deaths are as much associated with Clinton as with any other president.
Clinton probably did know this sort of thing was going on, and he might have wanted to stop it. But a president's power is limited, and possibly a left-leaning (if only ever so slightly) president has less influence still, in the face of a power structure dominated by corporate and criminal interests.


"... by the time you become the leader of the country, someone else makes all the decisions. You may find you can get away with virtual presidents, virtual prime ministers, virtual everything."
- Bill Clinton, speech sept 1989
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nascarblue Donating Member (693 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-22-04 04:57 AM
Response to Reply #10
24. Anybody seen a Bush bodycount list article?
I came across one right after Webb died. Abbie Hoffman was even on it. Anybody know of a Bush sr./Bush jr. bodycount article?
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lovuian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-19-04 09:32 PM
Response to Original message
17. Oh PLEAASSEE!!! Did he shoot himself in the head and say dang
I need to shoot again!!!

This is so Bogus Coroner report!!!
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indigobusiness Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-20-04 09:02 PM
Response to Reply #17
18. The facts speak. The Coroner's opinion stinks. n/t
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DemBones DemBones Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-22-04 05:49 AM
Response to Reply #17
26. It happens. nt
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Generator Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-20-04 09:44 PM
Response to Original message
19. Holy mother of shit
I didn't even have to read this-I knew it was Gary Webb.

I'm catching on. Some days I really don't know if any of us really knows what we are up against and what we would lose to change the powers that be.
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indigobusiness Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-21-04 12:55 PM
Response to Reply #19
20. Ain't it the truth?
The wicket just gets stickier.
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nascarblue Donating Member (693 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-22-04 04:44 AM
Response to Original message
22. Why is it we never hear the investigation results?
Edited on Wed Dec-22-04 04:47 AM by nascarblue
With all of these deaths the last 3 or 4 years, why is it that we never hear any follow up to the death? There should be an article on the deafening silence about all these uninvestigated cases...

There's James Howard Hatfield, Fortunate Son author...http://www.lovearth.net/fortunateson.htm

Athan Gibbs, Sr the paper trail machine maker http://www.tennessean.com/obits/archives/04/03/48330576.shtml

The of course there's Webb, here's a link with his recent articles, he did a peice on how the military has been farming first person shooters.. good article...
http://www.newsreview.com/issues/sacto/authors/garywebb.asp


Who else?
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RBHam Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-22-04 04:51 AM
Response to Original message
23. IMO, Webb knew he was in danger....
He set his affairs in order just in case he was "suicided"...

Especially after his nemesis Porter Goss was promoted to Chief Shadow Killer..
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DemBones DemBones Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-22-04 05:48 AM
Response to Original message
25. I have personal knowledge of a suicide who shot himself twice in the head.

I also know someone who put a bullet through his head when playing Russian roulette. The police dug the bullet out of the ceiling and he put it on a chain to wear around his neck.

This COULD be a suicide.
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indigobusiness Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Dec-22-04 06:31 AM
Response to Reply #25
27. Yes. it could be. Under normal circumstances...
I would certainly think it was.
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