This may be controversial

[dutchdemocrat]

The link is from bartcop.

This may be controversial but slideshow of images from Iraq taken by a variety of photojournalists enrages me. Numbers of dead Iraqis are guestimated at around 30,000. But the US military are not tracking the dead. So who really knows?

I am not flogging gore here... I am linking to an antiwar website that is showing what really happens when you invade a country and kill people. These are not images of statues toppling, or flags wrapped around Iraqis in joy. These are the images the will never show you on TV or in print.

It any Admins want to erase go ahead... But I would find that censorship as I am giving fair warning here.

But I am posting this and asking the fellow DU'ers to change threads if they don't feel like being visually screamed at.

If you don't want to become enraged or get angrier than you already are, hit your back button or close the window and go find greener grass.

Stay away from the link for the simple reason it is not pleasant.

This what happens when a sick group of people in America chose to invade another country no matter what the consequences are, and lying about it all only to enrich themselves and their friends who put them there.

When are we going to evolve as a human species and quit killing each other like this? I hope the Internet will help us all grow.

You know how you felt when the towers came down? Imagine how they are feeling all over the Arab world watching this?

http://www.einswine.com/atrocities/iraq/?pic=0

[qb]

1. Horrifying images - must-see for anyone who supported the invasion

You gave fair warning. This thread should stay up.

[demnan]

2. Goddamn Bush!

[dutchdemocrat]

3. Yes. Damn that man

That's how I feel.

Very Christian of him, don't you think?

Not just the Iraqi people but also his own.

[regnaD kciN]

75. ...and Goddamn Kerry, Edwards, Lieberman, Gephardt...

...and any other Democrat who decided to cover their backsides by voting for the resolution that made it all possible. That goes for Hillary, too.

:argh:

[Bluerthanblue]

4. denial dies hard-

not 'looking' at the awfulness of what is happening allows the awfulness to continue happening-

How many people would have been as upset over 9-11, if they only read sanitized accounts? Bringing HOME the war- is SO important- for ALL involved-

We go about our lives, so many of us, oblivious to what is going on a half a world away- and until people open their eyes- and LOOK at what Bush's version of 'freedom' truly is - they won't be involved- the horror hit home on 9-11, there are "9-11's" going on in many corners of the world- MANY of them as a result of 'American actions'- but until it's in our faces, so many of us choose to be ignorant-

Thank you for those painful reminders- i wish the whole nation would be required to view the truth- and THEN see how many still believe what 'we' are doing-have done is 'right'.

[Solly Mack]

5. This should be on the news everyday

The entire face of war should be broadcasted daily

People need to see this...they need to see the horror.

[TheBigGuy]

6. more anti-americansim from euroland.

people die in wars? No shit.

[Jacobin]

8. May I ask why you are here?

What causes you to attack our allies in the fight against Smirk?

[TheBigGuy]

14. I have no problems w. Americans attacking Bush.

but I do with foreigners. They are guests on this board.

How would some Dutch or German folks like it if I show up on their political boards and attack their countrys?

[DisgustipatedinCA]

19. He didn't attack the country--we're the ones who attack countries

He merely pointed out what our leadership has done, via the armed forces, with the support of the American people (sort of). The fact that we murdered so many people is very important. We shouldn't try to hide our heads in the sand about what we are doing in the world.

[dutchdemocrat]

20. Umm

the site I linked to is run by an American if that means anything.

Ohh... and on edit. I found the link at Bartcop - that evil German guy. Or is he basking in Hawaii?

[Name removed]

24. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Forkboy]

26. Quit being a child

Jesus,Homer and Gary Christ,you're acting like a complete fool.

[dutchdemocrat]

36. I won't even let you have the satisfaction of a retort

You have already shown what your are.

[sushi]

35. We are all human beings

and facts are facts. I am a 'foreigner' and I 'attack' * and Blair and Sharon and Arafat and Mugabe, etc. ALL THE TIME!!!
I think * should go to Iraq and apologize to all the innocent victims of his illegal, unilateral, and UNNECESSARY invasion, including the extended family that lost 12(!) of its members, and especially to all the children who have lost their parents - remember little Ali?

[H_NeverAgain]

47. Xenophobic?

Poor boy, you're offended because a damn alien dares to show you the effect of the US politic. What's about the feeling of Iraqis?

I've no problem with patriotism; I can understand that one is proud of his country and culture. But when it becomes ultra-nationalism, it's the best way to fascism.

And if you find that giving the foreign perception of USA is criticizing USA, may be it's because there is something wrong with USA. The author of this thread had only given information, if you don't like it, you'll be better trying to change the politic of your country than blaming the messenger. BTW, another way that one's can have to avoid criticism about foreign policy can be stopping to interfere in internal policy of others countries...

For information, I'm also a damn alien. But sorry, you can't label me Eurotrash, as I come from Japan. Yes, it seems that USA have some problems with country all around the world. You can believe the official propaganda about the "coalition of willing", but actually USA has cooled all its alliances. The matter for all countries is now how to deal with USA, as USA is the principal threat of the world peace, even considering North Korea (and it's a serious menace for me as I'm in range of their missiles).

The last point, I sincerely sympathize with the American opposition of the present US government. I understand the shame one can feel when one's government betray its country. But people who defends imperialist and aggressive politic under the cover of patriotism endorses such politic, and is responsible of it.

I agree that it's maybe not a very constructive post, but I want to precise for some that the world is a little bit broader than USA and Europe. :-)

[arcos]

51. Bush may be YOUR president...

but sadly, whatever HE decides to do affects EVERY SINGLE HUMAN BEING on the planet. I'm sorry if you don't like us foreigners participating, but it is not anti-Americanism... it affects US ALL!

[nolabels]

73. How dare you make such a claim, not only stole my vote, but is......

The process of trying to take a lot of other things away from the rest of us. As person born in Southern CALIFORNIA, I can guaranty you that *, that son of Bush #1 is no way getting any support from this person willingly. As a SoCal native I claim my heritage of my brethren and fellow native born American Indian (another derogatory name given to people with many nations of their own). I am born from this world, not into it; we are all part of the whole

If you’re a European please understand of us having deal with your continents passing the torch to this side of the Atlantic Ocean. I don't think that most of the people living over here ever wanted the mantle of Grand Imperial Colonists, but some how it has seemed to have migrated over to here. I would be more than welcoming any helpers on processes on how to extradite or eradicating this abysmal thing that has been thrust upon


http://www.media-criticism.com/Baltimore_Sun_Iraq_2000.html

Remember the 2000 Coup d’Etat!

Progressives should not soon forget what dark forces installed the lackluster George W. Bush to the position he’s achieved.

What follows are some special memories of the 2000 presidential election:
• May, 2000. Thousands of black voters evicted from the Florida voter rolls supposedly because they are ex-felons. Nearly all of these never were criminals, however, but nearly all of them are black. 4,000 of them never bother to get back on the rolls. The list of people to evict was prepared by a firm hand-picked by Florida Secretary of State Katherine Harris. Counterpunch, November 16-30, 2000.)
• 11/7/00: Election day. Palm Beach, Florida. Dozens, maybe hundreds, of angry voters attempt to tell the Election Board that the Butterfly ballot being used was too confusing.

That night, Gore handily wins the national popular vote, but the result in Florida—key to the election with its critical electoral votes—remains uncertain.

In Palm Beach, city with many elderly Jews, 16,000 ballot votes are made with both Patrick Buchanan and Al Gore specified. Thousands of angry voters claim they intended to vote for Gore but the ballot confused them. On TV Buchanan later admits the 3,000 votes he alone received in that county were certainly a mistake. This is significant because that number of votes handily exceeds Bush’s alleged final margin in all of Florida.
• Soon afterwards the Florida counties begin their recounts while Secretary of State Harris—who served as co-chair of Bush’s Florida campaign but failed to recuse herself in the aftermath of the election, as would have been appropriate—tries to stop them. In critical, Gore-leaning Dade-Miami County, a disturbance is
(snip)

[dutchdemocrat]

61. Freepers are always on the expatica.com board

Screaming about Europeans being all gay, laughing at the French who died in heat waves, taunting everyone.

How do I feel about them?

I hate them and fight back.

Legitimate arguements from Americans on Europe... not a problem. I often support Americans who pose great discussions.

Unfortunately I have to read tripe behind headers like these nugget of American wisdom.
-------------

French children to (sic) cheap to pay for dead parents

Chirac has love child with Japanese woman!

French Muslim school open for bomb business

Power outage is Britain's Fault

Iraq Killed Its Own Children before the first shot

Tons of Chemical Weapons

You Believe This Iraqi or the Leftist Losers?

EU trade barriers kill

http://www.expatica.com/www/marketplace/FORUM.asp?country=&FORUM_ID=82&CAT_NAME=&CAT_ID=5&Forum_Title=International+news&whichpage=1&pagesize=15

[DisgustipatedinCA]

9. I'm with him 100%

And I'm an American.

Wars aren't video games, nor are they limited to jingoistic cheerleading. I think the original poster is giving you a chance to see some of those we murdered, up close and personal.

Don't you care about the thousands of innocents that we murdered?

[dutchdemocrat]

11. Why am I anti American?

When you have Brits and Poles there as well as some of my fellow Dutch countrymen waiting in Kuwait to go in (they won't until sufficient testing of depleted uranium has been completed and so far its too TOXIC!). It is after all... a coalition of the willing including luminaries such as Nicaragua and Nauru.

Why am I anti-American for giving you the chance to see what war is doing to normal people on the other side of the planet?

Do you consider these visuals anti-American propoganda? You are a well disguised Republican if you ask me.

You have over 1000 posts 'Big man'. But you have shown how small you really are.

Methinks a deer carcass doesn't mean much difference to you than a dead kid.

And yes, there are a lot of dead and fucked up kids in these pics.

If you want to Euro Bash, why don't you join your kin in Freeper land and leave us progressive thinkers alone?

[TheBigGuy]

15. How would Europeans like it if I showed up on a European board.

and stareted attacking The Netherlands, Italy, etc. etc.

Thats my big beef w. your posts.

Just showing up to attack America on American politcal boards is not going to get you a warm welcome, not even here at DU.

[DisgustipatedinCA]

17. Disregard this, dutchdemocrat

You'll have a fine welcome on Democratic Underground. There are plenty of us who understand that the earth is a global village and that the US isn't conferred special status in the final analysis.

Welcome to Democratic Underground, dutchdemocrat.

TheBigGuy: I wish you'd be a little more accepting of others' opinions, even when they're not 'murcan.

[dutchdemocrat]

21. I am defending myself

I am defending myself which I should not have to...

As I found the link at Bartcop (an anti-American American?) and it led to another American anti-American website, not to a European anti-American web horror show of my own creation.

This war is about information. I cross linked to the wounded soldier's thread to show the whole story. I am a journalist. A pretty 'Fair and Balanced' one at that.

If you don't like it. I warned you. Yes there are a lot of pictures of dead and mangled children and adults.

You think I am anti-American for shoving in your face what is really there.

Click.

Zapper.

Change the channel.

See you.

[Name removed]

23. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Forkboy]

28. You're deranged

[scarletwoman]

30. BigGuy, that is TOTALLY uncalled for!

What the hell is your problem? Other DUers have posted links to pics of people who have been ravaged by the war, I don't recall you calling THEM "kinky".

I think you're way out of line. I don't know why you've got such a hair up your ass about Europeans, but you're looking like just as a big bigot as any rightwinger.

Observations of FACT do not constitute "anti-Americanism" -- unless YOUR definition of being "American" includes studiously avoiding the truth.

I'm utterly ashamed to see this kind of zenophobic bigotry on this board.

sw

[Bluerthanblue]

37. at least the Dutch don't go out, make war on another country,

and then have their president take his 'working vacation'- while our soldiers are killing and being killed-

If you can't have compassion for the dead and dying in Iraq- how are you any different than Bush?- they have FACES and FAMILIES- (or did have) hell, i wonder if America could show the kind of ....tollerance for foreign invaders that the common folk in Iraq have-....

i believe America is made up of GOOD people (at heart) but we tend to be VERY un-involved in the sorrow that much of the rest of the world faces on a daily basis- just look at the 'power-falure'- we couldn't handle a day or two without chaos- and totally disrupted lives- The Iraqi citizens have been living for HOW LONG NOW? without essential services???-

We are far to 'cloistered' here as it is- Don't like to see suffering people-? the answer is NOT - "don't look" --- it is "STOP THE KILLING"-

i'm gettins so sick of this society-

[sushi]

74. You are the kind of American

that a lot of ignorant people outside America don't know exist!
I think people should read more, travel more, and become more educated. This will take a long time. Why? That is for another discussion.

[Forkboy]

22. A warm welcome

he's gotten it from everyone but you :shrug:

[sushi]

39. Great, do it

I suggest you join the people who aim for a world without bullies like *, Blair, Sharon, Arafat, Mugabe, etc.

[sushi]

46. What a silly post

I'm sure DD is not anti-AMERICA. Countries can't DO anything. It's people that do good/bad things and, as a result, give their country a good/bad name. We are anti the foreign policies of your leader who, as the leader of the free world, should set a good example. Is he?

I love America to bits, have a relative married to one, have been to school there, love to visit (can't wait to go again although I'm a bit scared of flying now), grew up with its magazines (my father had a subscription to Time or Newsweek and, my absolute favorite, National Geographic), and love, and order from, its catalogs.

You can certainly attack other leaders if you want. Go ahead, attack The Netherlands and Italy, etc. etc. Be sure to include your reasons. I'll join the debate.

[ima_sinnic]

54. you are a real wingnut

Nationalism is a freeper trait--not needed or welcome here. We are all neighbors, citizens of planet earth. I for one welcome any and all to this board because what our deranged "leaders" do has painful repercussions for everybody in the whole world. Thank you dutchdemocrat for your contributions to this board and I apologize for the lack of class of a certain poster.

[Sterling]

55. You are the only one not welcoming him here.

I submit you are the one who does not belong here.

I would have thought you would have had your fill of freedom fries already.

:eyes:

[lumpy]

64. You are wrong, Big Guy

We welcome European input. You do not speak for the bulk of DUers.
So maybe you would be welcome at a more, shall we say, tight ass forum yourself.

[Forkboy]

69. Please BigGuy

Dont even THINK about speaking for all of DU.If all the responses show you anything it should be that you dont have a clue.

[tinnypriv]

71. I consider Britain to be the 52nd state of the USA

Do I get to criticise? :D

[saskatoon]

12. Surely you posted that as

portraying what the hawks would say, though even they could not surely, be so crass. If you MEANT what you said you are to be so pitied.

[dutchdemocrat]

25. Okay I got the reply to thing down

It is not a massive attack. Thank you. I was getting worried.

We are on the same side.

After all.

Out with Bushco. Please.

Get him out.

[scarletwoman]

31. dutchdemocrat, I think you have misunderstood

Saskatoon's post was directed at BigGuy, not at you!

sw
:hi:

[sushi]

45. Surely you know

that America is divided? The ignorant are for * mainly because, I think, they're scared, because, well, they're ignorant, or blind. The thinking people are against *'s policies, as you can see in DU. We just have to keep our fingers crossed, because you and I don't get to vote in the US election. I wish we could take the place of those Americans who don't bother to vote.

Can you imagine if the world gets to vote in the US election? Actually, we should(!), because what happens in the US affects all of us. Now we can't do anything about it, and have to depend on the US voters.

I remember a New Yorker not recognizing his Vice President, when a picture of Cheney was flashed to him. I think it was on 'Letterman.'
Of course every country has ignorant people, but it's more important for the whole world that the ignorant in the US becomes the minority.

I'm starting to ramble. Sorry.

[lumpy]

66. We are doing our damndest to get Bushco out.

Agonizing every minute of the day & night to get rid of the nest of rats in this deplorable administration.

[Forkboy]

13. You need to grow up and not be SmallGuy

[dutchdemocrat]

29. Sorry, I feel like I am being whacked here....

Apoligies Forkboy. Really. But mate... he's being pretty crude. I see alot of Brits here. Do they get bashed as well?

How have I been anti-American?

What the truth is ok as long as it does not come from an objective source... right?

Someone who only gets the BBC, German TV, Dutch TV, Belgian TV and French TV for his anti American drivel.

Whose only American angle is CNN on the tube or the Internet?

I am sorry for offending Big Guy but he took the first swing.

I am tired of being beaten up by freeperish Du'ers around here.

What's up?

[Forkboy]

32. It was directed to BigGuy

I dont even know what my post count is :shrug:

Look at the top right of posts to see who their replying to.

[scarletwoman]

33. Again, the post you are responding to was directed at BigGuy, not at you.

Helpful hint -- look at the "response to" number in the upper right corner of people's posts, that shows which post they are replying to.

sw

[Sterling]

56. You are totally welcome here.

Even at DU there are a few assholes. Don't let them ruin it for you.

[Forkboy]

68. No apology needed DD

He was being a total ass.I dont blame you for being defensive.

Glad to have you,and your opinions,here on DU :hi:

[GirlinContempt]

38. Holy crap!

People are still on that "Holy crap, you say anything bad about a countries actions and you are anti-country" trip? Jebus.
That is SO five minutes ago. The new trend is accepting that as an international player, asking for international support, you're going to recieve international feedback. Up and coming trend for all you scenesters: Not parroting Dept. of Homeland Securitys cathprases (anti-american drops from vocab.!)

[Ani Yun Wiya]

50. Perhaps...

The whole world needs a lot LESS of your nationalistic nonsense.
The post addressed the results of this government's actions.
It did not even get into the petty tripe that passes for patriotism.

Edit for punctuation.

[Clark Can WIN]

63. Your attack on those who bring injustice to light

suggests that you support injustice.

[Jacobin]

7. You are preaching to the choir

You may not have been on this board last fall when hundreds of us DUers sent letters, emails, faxes and made phone calls to senators and representatives begging them NOT to vote for the invasion. YOu may remember the millions in this country who took time to march in cities all over the country demanding that Bush* NOT invade and give the arms inspectors more time.

Bush* was bound and determined to invade Iraq and steal its oil and was just looking for an excuse to do it. There is no stopping this madman short of impeachment (which won't happen because republicans control congress) or the next election.

These pictures are the direct result of having a brazen madman who is amoral having stolen the last election.

It won't happen again. Of that, I am certain. In the meantime, keep notes and preserve the evidence because the sonofabitch in the WH and his cabal should all be tried for war crimes.

[saskatoon]

10. Good for you, let's all pass them on

I had just got the same file and am making a list of those whom I am going to send them to. The trouble with sending to every member of Congress especially the hawks is that only an aide will open it and the person we want to see it never will. Nevertheless let us make a pledge to send out so many each day, they will be seen by many people if we hang in there. It's the children, the little children that break your heart.

[dutchdemocrat]

16. And what's equally as evil

is this thread showing your own - torn apart for Dubya...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=299581

[sushi]

42. Another sad picture

Keep posting, DD! I recently read that 9 have committed suicide, an undisclosed number have been sent home for psychological reasons, and there are about 100(!) psychiatrists in Iraq to deal with all these problems. All this for an unnecessary war. I'm already thinking of *'s library when he's finished. Do you think it will include these pictures, and all the funny things he's said?

On the other hand a few soldiers have married local girls. I'm amazed how they find the time to meet and court the girls! I bet they had to covert to Islam because Muslim families demand non-Muslim men to convert if they want to marry their daughters, and when a man is in love he will do anything to get the girl!

[maggrwaggr]

18. our tax dollars at work. Next tax day

print out a few of those and send them in with your returns.

I think every American should be forced to look at these pictures before the next election.

And it would be nice if we could just all quit paying our taxes, all of us, all at the same time, so that this kind of thing can't ever happen again. Shut the government down and don't let it start up again until we get a new one.

It's a crime. No exaggeration, no hyperbole. It's a crime.

[Character Assassin]

27. Guesstimated at 30,000 by whom, precisely?

This may be controversial but slideshow of images from Iraq taken by a variety of photojournalists enrages me. Numbers of dead Iraqis are guestimated at around 30,000. But the US military are not tracking the dead. So who really knows?

What the website you link to shows is incontravertable proof that it has pictures of dead and wounded people, most of them likely at the hands of American and/or British forces.

So how, then, does that correlate to 30,000 dead and from which data?

[dutchdemocrat]

34. The Gaurdian... From England. Tens of Thousands

On the O'Reilly Factor, retired Army Col. David Hunt said it is "confirmed," evidently from his sources, that coalition forces have killed over 100,000 Iraqi military.

Just to indicate bloodlust.

---------

Shock and Awe did not just take down a few buildings. I took a median from the Guardian. The number could go over 50,000.

---------

http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,2763,1021466,00.html

Mass graves to reveal Iraq war toll

Jamie Wilson in Baghdad
Tuesday August 19, 2003
The Guardian

The task of identifying thousands of Iraqi soldiers and civilians who died during this year's war has begun with the exhumation of a mass grave at one of Saddam Hussein's former palaces in Baghdad.
The Iraqi Red Crescent, the Islamic version of the Red Cross, which is coordinating the exhumations, said 45 bodies had been recovered since vthe palace beside the Tigris river, now used as the coalition headquarters.

Nobody knows exactly how many Iraqis died in the war, but an Anglo-American research group, the Iraq Body Count, has estimated the number of civilian fatalities at between 6,000 and 7,800. The number of military casualties is between 10,000 and 45,000.

"It is very important for the families to get the bodies back, but this has to be done in an organised, respectful and scientific way," said Nada Doumani, of the International Committee of the Red Cross, who estimated that there were between 10 and 15 mass graves in Baghdad.

The volunteers carefully remove the bodies, which are checked for anything that may identify them.

If that fails they are taken to the Medico-Legal Institute in Baghdad, where they are forensically examined.

Those that remain unclaimed after 10 days will then be reburied in a marked temporary grave at a public cemetery, until somebody comes forward to claim them.

Many places where retreating Iraqi troops or arriving Americans buried the dead are known to locals, but the Red Crescent has urged people not to disturb the graves in order to avoid the destruction of identification evidence.

Ali Ismael Ahmed, the Red Crescent official in charge of exhuming bodies at the presidential palace and other sites in Baghdad, thought that the biggest mass graves in Baghdad were likely to be at the airport. But the Red Crescent had not been told when, or even if, it would be allowed to start exhuming bodies from the site.

Mr Ahmed said that some families were unlikely to ever get the bodies of their relatives back.

"During the war the American soldiers told my volunteers not to go near the bodies in burnt-out tanks, because they would almost certainly have been attacked with depleted uranium," he said.

"We never knew what the Americans did with these bodies, and we probably never will."

Another problem the Red Crescent faces is creating a comprehensive list of those who are missing. They have asked families to register missing loved ones at local offices.

Hussein Abdul Razaq, 49, a taxi driver, was one of those at the Red Cross centre in Baghdad yesterday. His son Ala, 21, was in the air defence, based at Deir, near Basra. Mr Razaq has not heard from him since March 18, two days before the warbegan.

He said that his son had wanted to desert from the army. "I encouraged him to go. If I had not pushed him to go back they would have executed all of us, his whole family. I did not expect to see him again, I saw death on his own face, I knew he was not coming back."

[Sterling]

57. At it again?

I am sure we only killed a handful of Iraqi's.

:eyes:

[dutchdemocrat]

60. Yes...

a handful?

[Character Assassin]

72. What a quaint, charmingly dim reply

At it again?

If, by that statement, you meant "Are you questioning all sources of information that attempt, or are attempted, to be portrayed as either definitive or accurate absent verification", then yes, I am 'at it again'.

I am sure we only killed a handful of Iraqi's.

That put's you in the minority. It would seem much more likely that it is in the thousands.

[GirlinContempt]

40. Thanks

for posting that.
Though disgusting and horrifying, it's important.
Thanks :)

[dutchdemocrat]

41. Thanks!

My dutch dad lives on sunny Saturna Island, between the big island and Vancouver... population 300. No cops. 40 square miles. One pub, two stores... I love it there on holiday.

I live in Groningen in the North of Holland and am a dual citizen of NL and Canada.

Thanks for some moral support.

I do live on a bridge between Dutch and Canadian societies.

Having spent some time in Canada I understand North American culture more than most over here in windswept, tulip-filled, rainingallthetime Holland.

I love it though - Summers in Spain, Italy and Greece when everyone gets 3-4 weeks off. That's what we look forward to all year.

Thanks

[GirlinContempt]

43. Anytime

glad to hear you're part canadian ;) heh

I got the same kinda crap from other people awhile back when I made an 'anti-american' post.
I just stated that if it's anti-american to disagree and blah blah blah then I guess I am anti-american. I got crap from a bunch of jerks, who didn't really seem to realize the point of the post was that I wasn't... but whatever.

Keep bringing the information. :)

[dutchdemocrat]

44. In retrospect

This war is all about propaganda. They want everyone to see

THIS

and they don't want to let you see

THAT

You should know

THIS

But

THAT

is top secret.

So no matter how much you hate what you have seen in the images - if you even chose to go there. These are still tools to battle what Bushco does not want anyone to see.

They are deflecting as much as they can. They will do what they have to in order to retain control.

[deek]

48. Important link

Thank you for posting. This is what war looks like, not the night vision explosions and the choreographed cheering of paid people. This administration will allow no blood to be shown to the public. That is the outrage. If mainstream America were allowed to see the results of Bush's "war", only a handful would still support it.

I remember having a protest sign (in the early stages of our invasion) with the picture of the young sisters buried in rubble. A woman stopped and said she found the sign very offensive. Yes, it was offensive. That was the point.

[RainDog]

49. 6000 to 7000 Iraqi dead is the top and bottom estimate

at Iraq Body Count site. I'll find the url and post it here. I don't know where the thirty thousand figure comes from.

Six or seven thousand is bad enough.

http://www.iraqbodycount.net/

[Terwilliger]

52. that's the civilian count

and it's probably higher

I'll bet 20,000 are dead including military

[Jacobin]

53. How bout Iraqi soldiers?

Remember shock and awe and the unholy hell of bombardment. Those soldiers were all someone's brother or father or uncle or son.

They wouldn't have been killed but for the illegal invasion.

We count our soldiers killed, but don't count theirs? I don't think so.

[laruemtt]

59. and isn't this what * called

the "most humane war" last nite? give me a few minutes with that scumbag. i'll make him eat these pictures. i'll pull him out of his psychotic messianic trance before he's allowed to do anymore damage. if these aren't war crimes, then there's no such thing.

[teknomanzer]

58. If there is a hell...

Bush and his gang will inhabit its lowest depths.

[MrPrax]

62. Why the dramatic build up?

"This may be controversial but slideshow of images from Iraq taken by a variety of photojournalists enrages me."
why controversial? your on a chat forum? take vit C and listen Allman Brothers!!

"Stay away from the link for the simple reason it is not pleasant."

well that WAS the whole point of your post?

the slidwshow was brought to you by???
several photojournalists, but copyright © Einswine.com
made this POST

Realy props for really players

[dutchdemocrat]

65. Attacked again?

The purpose of the lead was to ensure the thread was not deleted due to violations of DU posting rules and I did not want people to chuck up their lunch without decent warning. Some people don't want to see images like this at all... because they are upsetting.

Do you think this guy, Einswine, is in Iraq taking all these pics? Some are culled from Arab television. I have seen others in the Arab press. He has just gathered them. Your copywrite arguement is dead.



Why are you trying to attack me anyway? Don't shoot the messenger.

[lumpy]

67. Hang in there dd.

There are a few 'confused' posters on this forum ( I am trying to be nice in using the word confused).

[Buns_of_Fire]

70. Welcome, dutchdemocrat

Just felt I needed to say that. Sometimes we need our noses rubbed in it, just to keep everyone honest. :hi:

[HFishbine]

76. 6 MB

http://www.wirecom.com/happy.mpg

[dutchdemocrat]

77. let us nod to happiness

[dutchdemocrat]

78. forgot to thank you

Thanks for the visual. Great juxtaposition.

[HFishbine]

79. Thanks

Let us never forget the lying, smirking fucks who brought this about.

[hippiegranny]

80. this is a good link

lest we forget that "casualties" are real flesh and blood people.

oh, and dutchdemo, most of us "get it." not sure what that nationalistic rant earlier was supposed to prove. he does not speak for all of us.