zanana
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Jan-30-05 05:43 PM
Original message |
Do you consider civilization to be "progressive" or "circular"? |
|
I know there are better words to describe what I mean, but I'll explain; Do you think human beings get wiser and more compassionate with time or do we have cycles of progressive thought and cycless of regressive thought? I used to think it was progressive, but now I think back to when I was a little kid in the 50's, and it seems we're feeling the weight of repression, just like the oppression of McCarthyism. Any thought? (I hope this makes sense).
|
seito
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Jan-30-05 05:47 PM
Response to Original message |
|
We never learn. We have to repeat the same mistakes generation after generation.
|
tanyev
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Jan-30-05 05:53 PM
Response to Original message |
2. 5-10 years ago I would have said progressive. |
|
Edited on Sun Jan-30-05 05:59 PM by tanyev
Current events are making me lean the other way now.
|
McKenzie
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Jan-30-05 05:57 PM
Response to Original message |
3. it should be linear/progressive imvho |
|
Let's assume that all species get those attributes that ensure their survival. We have to ask what purpose love, compassion and all the other character traits that are not necessary for today's world serve.
I have a hunch that if we lived in a way that allowed those traits to flower we'd make the next evolutionary leap. That leap is in the brain methinks, because there is a great lump of it that we don't use as far as we can tell. So why is it there and how can it be unlocked?
I think moving away from aggression and competition, the traits that were necessary early on in our development, could be the key. I have no empirical evidence for that contention, just a hunch (how scientific McKenzie...lol).
One thing is sure, if we keep on going the way we are headed it will be a circular phenomenon...and the circles will get smaller and smaller. We're doing something wrong imo, and it has halted our development.
I will now slink off in case I get laughed at...
|
cornfedyank
(642 posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Mon Jan-31-05 01:29 AM
Response to Reply #3 |
22. i think there are evolutionary deadends..we sure look like one |
|
Edited on Mon Jan-31-05 01:35 AM by cornfedyank
i don't think that one can assume that "all species get those attributes that ensure their survival."
on edit: i have long wondered which way we were headed. Star Trek or Soylent Green. Tuesday is not far. IMHO
|
leanin_green
(823 posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Jan-30-05 06:03 PM
Response to Original message |
|
All energy moves in a spiral. So, although it seems that we are repeating things, we are only seeing them from a different point on the spiral. McCarthyism has given way to what they see as the new face of evil, Liberalism. Same energy, different mask. So, in essence, this is part of the same energetic spiral created by the same like-minded people from the inception of this country. As it weaves it's way throughout the fabric of our American consciousness, it finds new conduits that channel this energetic stream in whatever timeline they find themselves in. All is vanity, there is nothing new under the sun.
|
htuttle
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Jan-30-05 10:49 PM
Response to Reply #4 |
|
History doesn't repeat itself, but it rhymes. -- Mark Twain
|
leanin_green
(823 posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Jan-30-05 11:44 PM
Response to Reply #13 |
18. "All these things that I do ye shall do also, and greater things." |
Just Me
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Jan-30-05 10:59 PM
Response to Reply #4 |
14. OMG! I can't believe you posted my first thought. |
|
I view humanity as progressing in a forward circular-like fashion: a spiral.
Fascinating that someone else has that kind of visual perspective.
|
leanin_green
(823 posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Jan-30-05 11:41 PM
Response to Reply #14 |
17. Try this site, it'll get your juices going. |
|
Edited on Sun Jan-30-05 11:42 PM by leanin_green
It's full of these kind of thoughts, with great science to back it up. http://www.ascension2000.com
|
NC_Nurse
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Jan-30-05 06:04 PM
Response to Original message |
|
Edited on Sun Jan-30-05 06:05 PM by NC_Nurse
I hope that the progressive outweighs the regressive overall. They are both in force at all times. It's a constant pull between fear of change and risk to gain something better. We shall see....
|
DETERMINEDPROGRESIVE
(53 posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Jan-30-05 06:06 PM
Response to Original message |
6. I consider civilization to be Ignorant.. |
Pithlet
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Jan-30-05 06:10 PM
Response to Original message |
7. I believe it is progressive, but |
|
It doesn't always move forward at a consistent pace, and sometimes backtracks.
|
PowerToThePeople
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Jan-30-05 06:15 PM
Response to Original message |
|
Like a tree. Progressives want to grow and mature into a "great" tree, like the sequoias in Cali. The repukes are constantly trying to cut us down/trim us. Either clipping branches to stop further growth or attacking the root system if we grow too much. We are having to fight on all fronts which makes true growth very difficult.
|
Ms. Clio
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Jan-30-05 06:28 PM
Response to Original message |
u4ic
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Jan-30-05 10:37 PM
Response to Original message |
10. I don't know if I can describe this properly |
|
but I see society as a balancing act. Polar opposites are the driving force...tolerance, love, humanity, etc on one side, and greed, power, corruption, war, etc on the other.
Most of us aren't at the opposite ends...we're somewhere in between. The polar opposites feed off each other...especially the power side, as when the progressive side is tipped too far in it's favour (which also incorporates free will), they try to tip it to their favour, using fear and anger to control, and the progressive side then uses the misdeeds of the regressive side to further it's cause. And on it goes.
I think it's a delicate balance...and I do think most of us actually lean towards the progressive side...but the other side, though smaller, is much more vocal, organized and adamant.
I hope it makes sense...
|
K-W
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Jan-30-05 10:40 PM
Response to Original message |
11. progressive, patterns will naturally result |
Taxloss
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Jan-30-05 10:43 PM
Response to Original message |
12. Human beings don't change |
|
But civilisation is the accumulated sum of all human achievements, so it naturally improves. Minus some catastrophic collapse, it will continue to improve.
|
not systems
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Jan-30-05 11:06 PM
Response to Original message |
15. Neither because the world is a chaotic system... |
|
thus human society and each human life is also.
We make advances and we regress based on non-cyclical events.
We have no trajectory toward a better future although one has happened in many ways because of human action and ideals.
The creation of the idea of universal human rights for example.
Different eras are echoed in current times but that just because the range of human action is somewhat limited.
I agree that we are in a time of oppression but it is not part of some predetermined cycle.
The future is unwritten.
|
AgadorSparticus
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Jan-30-05 11:16 PM
Response to Original message |
16. i would say it was more cyclical. no matter how much we "advance", |
|
the same trials and tribulations of human nature still haunts us as a civilization. for example, for all our advances in technology and information, we still lack the conscience, character, integrity, etc. to guide us in our actions. the same arrogance, egotism, greed, and avarice still afflicts our leaders as it did with all the leaders of fallen civilizations in the past.
but overall, we may go back and forth between moving forward and going backwards, but in the bigger scheme of things, we are very much the same as always.....
|
Greybnk48
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Jan-30-05 11:45 PM
Response to Original message |
19. I think the Holocaust |
|
put the kybosh on any idea that humans were progressively becoming more and more enlightened on a linear model. Sadly, history repeats. On an upnote, we can hope we are slowly spiraling upward to enlightenment.
|
mopinko
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Jan-30-05 11:50 PM
Response to Original message |
20. read "nonzero" by robert wright |
|
who also wrote "the moral animal" very interesting stuff. i agree with him that, although there are loops and twists, the overall direction of human history is toward a more complex, and ever more integrated society. (just reading It now, tho.)
i think that eventually the wastefulness of war will become clear to us humans, and we will give it up. although right now we seem mired in our worst impulses, i don't think that violence has ever been rejected by so many people. and i think that the ridiculous lengths that the shitheads have HAD TO go to to sell this war proves it.
|
bloom
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Jan-30-05 11:50 PM
Response to Original message |
21. Since we are destroying more species by the day... |
|
Edited on Sun Jan-30-05 11:51 PM by bloom
finding ways to kill in increasing numbers....
becoming more estranged and mentally ill....
I think we are going backwards.
|
Dark
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Mon Jan-31-05 01:30 AM
Response to Original message |
23. Overall progressive, but circular in small eras. Spiraling upwards. n/t |
tishaLA
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Mon Jan-31-05 01:53 AM
Response to Original message |
|
It is more or less arbitrary.
|
DU
AdBot (1000+ posts) |
Tue Apr 23rd 2024, 07:49 PM
Response to Original message |