Fucking fuck, fuck, fuck, fuck, fuck

[Brian Sweat]

I just don't fucking get American voters. Today, voters in Winter Park, FL overwhelming passed a measure to by out the local electric company an create a municiple electric authority.

I am not saying that this is a bad thing. It's just that it confuses the fuck out of me. This is the kind of thing that Republicans tell us is just plain bad. This is big government. It's socialism. It's everything that Republicans say is wrong with Democrats and liberals. Winter Park is in Orange County which leans slightly Democratic, but Winter Park itself is an afluent white middle class suburb. These people, who probably voted just as overwelmingly for Bush in 2000, just rejected everything for which the Republican party stands.

Will someone please explain to me why the fuck so many people support liberal Democratic ideas, but vote for Republicans. The state of Florida as a whole will elect Jeb Bush governor at the same time that they pass referendem for smaller class sized, smoking bans, high speed rail, draconian commercial fishing restrictions and so many other things that Jeb himself is dead seat against.

Fucking fuck, fuck, fuck, fuck, fuck.

[Wonk]

1. Unrelated question...

Why do some DUers post threads with titles that give absolutely no info about the contents of the threads they're posting?

You still have time to edit in something better than "Fucking fuck, fuck, fuck, fuck, fuck".

[NewYorkerfromMass]

7. I dunno... but I meant to hit the Dean, Dean, Dean, Dean, Dean thread

:)

[Brian Sweat]

31. "Fucking fuck, fuck, fuck, fuck, fuck"

expresses how I felt when I saw the report on TV. I wanted to get it off my chest.

[alcuno]

2. It's not the message, it's the messengers.

We need better ones because we have the message.

[okieinpain]

3. because dems get up and say stupid shit like

there aren't any hurricanes named after black people. or we defend some dumb ass that has killed somebody, because he's to stupid to know that killing someone is wrong. or some other stupid ass thing.

[Nevernose]

6. What the Hell does THAT mean?

:7

[TennesseeWalker]

14. crudely put, but very much reflects much of what I see.

[dmr]

4. Well,

First, your link didn't work for me, so I don't know the particulars.

Second, my village founders in NY created it's own power supply many decades ago, so while everyone else was without power, we had it, alibet with rolling blackouts. The best part is our electric bills are much cheaper.

[Brian Sweat]

27. I'm not debating the merits of municiple power.

My experience is that it works better than protected monopolies. I have worked for two private power campanies. They make government agencies look like models of efficiency.

I just don't understand why people in a largely Republican community would everwhelming vote for something that their leadership is telling them is bad. If they don't agree with the Republican message, why are they Republicans.

Also, my link didn't work for me either. Maybe this will work better.

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ibsys/20030909/lo_wesh/1779197

[dmr]

28. I realize that, actually

I got tangled up in your subject title that I mis-read your initial statement, so my apologies.

Thanks for the corrected link. :)

[sugargoose]

5. They think they are R

because they don't like abortion.

No one other than corporations can possibly agree with any other position they have. Seems to me like,,,,,,,,,,

[TennesseeWalker]

8. LOL

"All politics is local". I live in the most Republican place IN THE WORLD....Northeast TN is heavily infested with (R)'s. However, if you go to the local county commission meetings, they're all asking for the county, state or federal government to come up with grants and loans and socialist solutions to every single problem. Everybody here loves their social security, but hate "welfare people".

They used to call these kinds of people "southern democrats". Now, they're very confused Republicans. Sex, abortion, guns, taxes and welfare/affirmative action separates them from the Left. Pretty much sums up the mindset of the current people calling themselves Republicans.

[John_H]

9. This is good news.

Take it for what its worth. The ugy truth? They vote for republicans because they think the rethugs want to "get the gov. off their backs" becuase the rethugs do a good job wrappingthemselves in the flag. In short, because we're not doing a good enough job letting them know th ugly truth: that rethugs won't give a shit about them until they make six digit contibutions to their party.

To me this initiative tells me that if y'all work hard down there Winter Park is ripe for the picking.

[TennesseeWalker]

10. Kick...I wish you hadn't named this thread "fuck".......

..more people would read it if you hadn't done that.

[Brian Sweat]

30. I'm sorry, but I was mainly interested in expressing my frustration

and my bewilderment. I title the thread after the first thing that came into my head after I saw the report on TV.

[alfredo]

11. corporations world wide are quickly buying up our utilities.

Power and water will be the next oil. We are fighting against a German company that has taken over our water works. Our city is fighting back. The city is very republican but has elected Democrat mayors for as long as I can remember.


Our battle is against an outsider who wants control over our water supply. There should be no D or R to this, it is money against the public interest, and everybody here has a lot at stake.

[oustemnow]

24. Have you read The Enronization of America?

It's by a gent named Vijay Prashad, and it tackles those very issues.

[quaker bill]

12. Being a resident of Winter Park

and a volunteer for Al Gore in 2000 and a modestly affluent caucasian male, I voted to kick the greedy corporation out.

I believe that public utilities are a good thing. They were invented to stop market manipulation by greedy corporations in the first place.

All that being as it may, the vote passed because my power goes out every time it rains. It rains alot in Florida. It is like that for many here.

Driving through town, you could tell where the power goes out most frequently by the campaign signs.

As an aside, I have been push-polled twice, by what seemed to be a call center in India to get me to vote against the City takeover. I don't like that.

Clear enough?

[Brian Sweat]

29. I am not faulting you for voting for the initiative.

If I lived in Winter Park, I probably would have done the same.

My frustration is that we are being told that Americans are so conservative, but the vast majority of Americans openly support so many liberal (even socialist) ideas, but they vote for Republicans.

[TiredTexan]

13. I truly think its the voting machines....

There are so many anamolies in the results that we simply have to get all of the computer machines thrown out. On small elections, the GOP doesn't risk being caught, but on the larger ones, they do what needs to be done.

The day before the 2002 Senate election in Georgia, Max Cleland (Vietnam vet, and triple amputee and very popular senator) was ahead in the polls anywhere from 8 to 12 points, depending on the poll. His opponent, who had attacked Cleland for being unpatriotic, was given no chance to win. Nonetheless, a last minute fix to several thousand voting machines, and an unexplained surge in last minute votes took the election from Cleland for the GOP. Three elections in the same county in Texas ended up with a margin of 18181 for three GOP candidates. Voting machines in Santa Clara county in CA were contacted via wireless transmissions during voting on 3 occasions. Machines are sold by republican operatives and campaign contributers.

This is happening all over the country.

Only written handwritten ballots, locked and sealed ballot boxes, and Dem observers of the counting are going to stop these "anomalies," that always are in the favor of the GOP candidate.

Otherwise, we'll keep getting the GOP, who is cheating, and getting us to pay for its cheating with our tax dollars.

"Those who cast the votes decide nothing.
Those who count the votes decide everything."
- Joseph Stalin

[TennesseeWalker]

15. One last kick. I think it's important to talk about WHY

people vote against their own self interests.....

[fabius]

16. This is actually GOOD news.

People like local control over essential services that's why we're still trying to take over Enron-owned PGE. Even Republicans get pissed when the electric bill goes up. In fact they probably get pissed worse than Democrats.

Democratic candidates just need to hammer on this.

- What's wrong with public utilities?
- What's wrong with universal health care?
- What's wrong with better education?

The reason they vote against their self-interest nationally is advertising and propaganda.

[TennesseeWalker]

17. Exactly.

We need to explain EXACTLY why what R's propose is going to gut the very things that keep them going. If you can relate it to them personally, they'll stop reacting to wedge issues like race and abortion and guns.

The blackouts will really help us with this one. Privateers are seen as uncaring of people. That's why "privateers" is a word worse than "liberal" to lots of older folks.

[NewYorkerfromMass]

18. Privateers? never heard that word before

a twist on profiteers? anyway, sounds like a good way to shed light on the Reaganization of America.

[TennesseeWalker]

19. NOW you're thinking...

...google the term....you'll be surprised...:)

I told you it was mostly older people who are most familiar with the term.

[Sick of Bullshit]

20. In the 16th, 17th and 18th centuries, privateers were pirates

hired by governments to loot treasures that were headed to other governments. One of the most famous privateers was Captain Kidd.

Therefore, it seems reasonable that modern "privateers" are private sector "pirates" who are entrusted by the government with the looting of public wealth.

[TennesseeWalker]

22. You got it.

That's our key to winning. Re-educate them on Privateers. Listen, the big utility companies are scary to locals. They hate them, and don't think they invest enough into the communities. Corrections Corporation of American, Tennessee-American Water Company, non-TVA owned utilities....they hate 'em.

Traditional Harry Truman/FDR type democrats. We can get them back with this issue. Will transcend race and religion. Blackouts are good, because they're seeing the effect of the Privateers and the greed of the eighties. People who remember the Depression know and understand this stuff INHERENTLY.

Our ticket back. I guarantee it. And it's going to come...just you wait and see. Then, we can go back to trying to stop people from owning guns and forcing people to have abortions (BWAH=ha!) People have been CONVICED Democrats want all kinds of babies killed. Convinced! My GOD, how stupid can you get?

[tinanator]

21. dammit I thought this was a Jay and Silent Bob thread :(

Anybody here who doesnt know Jay's Rap oughtta learn it.
1,2,3,4,...

[TennesseeWalker]

23. "fiften bucks, little man, put that shit in my hand"

My Jungle Love!

[Chovexani]

25. Who smokes the blunt?

We smoke the blunt! :smoke:

[sasquatch]

26. Hopefully they are starting to come around

We'll call it a twelve step plan to evolving to decent human beingO8)