Dean on Israel-Palestine

[reachout]

One of my major reservations concerning Dean has been his position on the Israel-Palestine conflict. I am uncertain if this represents a shift in his position, or simply a clarification. Regardless, it is the most reasonable statement I've heard on the issue recently, and could well cement my willingness to support his candidacy.


http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A45122-2003Sep8.html


Rivals Criticize Dean For Mideast Comment

Howard Dean came under fire yesterday from two rivals for the Democratic nomination for saying the United States should not "take sides" in the Israeli-Palestinian conflict.

Five days after Dean told supporters in New Mexico that "it's not our place to take sides" in the conflict, Sen. Joseph I. Lieberman (Conn.) accused him of advocating a "major break" from the United States' long-standing policy of explicitly siding with Israel in the Middle East.

<snip>

Sen. John F. Kerry (Mass.) said: "It is either because he lacks the foreign policy experience or simply because he is wrong that governor Dean has proposed a radical shift in United States policy towards the Middle East. If the president were to make a remark such as this it would throw an already volatile region into even more turmoil."

In an interview, Dean sought to clarify his statement but did not back down from his belief that the United State cannot negotiate peace unless it is seen as a neutral party in the region. "Israel has always been a longtime ally with a special relationship with the United States, but if we are going to bargain by being in the middle of the negotiations then we are going to have to take an evenhanded role," he said.

<snip>

[Flying_Pig]

1. I agree...

I am going to "stay put" for a little while longer though, to make sure Dean's recent remarks aren't just a "knee-jerk" response to the petition given him asking that he take a more balanced approach to our relations with Israel, than he has outlined in the past. If he's genuine, then he'll be my candidate. If not, Kerry will be my choice.

[CWebster]

13. Why would Kerry be your choice

since he is complaining of Deans's break in the congressional stooping parade to the Jewish lobby?

[Muddleoftheroad]

2. Dean is a unifier, lol

Let's drive the Jewish vote away from the Democratic Party. Way to go!

[sujan]

4. lets do

and in other news, Arab American voting bloc is growing.

[blm]

14. Iranian-American group already endorsed Kerry.

Dean has been to the right of Kerry on this issue and very ProSharon, even supporting the wall. Dean is now changing his tune to sound more like Kerry and Kerry is smartly baiting him to say more since Dean is obviously adrift on this.

[sujan]

16. FYI

Iranians = subset of Arabs

[blm]

19. Yes...I know.

I'm not a Limbaugh listener.

[sujan]

20. I take that back

Most Iranians aren't even arabs.


Persian 51%, Azeri 24%, Gilaki and Mazandarani 8%, Kurd 7%, Arab 3%, Lur 2%, Baloch 2%, Turkmen 2%, other 1%

http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/ir.html#People

[blm]

22. Haha...try Mideastern.

.

[sujan]

23. then I'd have to include Israel too

Any suggestions?

[blm]

26. Nope. I'm not that brilliant.

;))))

[KaraokeKarlton]

6. I don't think that will happen

You know, it IS possible to be supportive of and respect both sides in this conflict. In fact, that's the only way to solve it. Dean is able to step back and look at things honestly and be impartial while still being respectful and supportive. It's something he's always been very good at doing.

[CWebster]

8. The only vote that matters

and the only issue Jewish voters care about?

[Capn Sunshine]

17. news flash

"the jewish vote" as you refer to it, is gone. HUGE supporters of Bush. Drop by any Synangogue if you don't believe me. They have become one issue voters and are perhaps the singlemost scared of terrorists bloc out there if that's possible considering how scared most New Yorkers still are.

[rucky]

24. The Liberal Jew is Alive And Well, Thank You...

Just because the folks at AIPAC are getting all the press, and yes, some of "my people" have gone to the dark side - there's still huge segment of the Jewish population that sticks to our support of the 1993 Oslo plan. I think Dean was influenced by AIPAC early, until the Jewish Democrats spoke up (I emailed his campaign about his AIPAC comment). I'd like to think that the liberal Jewish voice contributed to his change in policy about the occupied territories.

[sujan]

25. Russ Feingold

The true Progressive.

'nuff said.

[KaraokeKarlton]

3. Dean has always approached things like this

I'm in a position to already know this because he was my governor. That's why I've never been concerned about his position regarding this issue. I KNOW he will be fair to both sides. He won't turn his back on Israel, but he'll open doors for Palestinians, too. In fact, I am convinced he has the ability to approach the conflict in a rational, sensible way and do a lot to find solutions. I think that more than anything, Palestinians need to know that they are heard, respected and valued as human beings. That alone will go a long way to stop the violence. As long as they are demonized, the violence isn't going to stop. This can be done without alienating Israel, and I think the statements made by both Lieberman and Kerry prove that they are going to favor Israel. Some others would favor Palestinians. I think Dean is the only one who can deal with the situation in a fair and evenhanded way.

[mmm]

5. only Kucinich is willing to punish Israel

he has my vote

[Muddleoftheroad]

9. Care to give a cite?

I'd like to know.

[KaraokeKarlton]

11. Anyone who favors one side over the other

will do a shitty job dealing with this issue. You can't solve anything when you take sides. Both sides have equal responsibility for the mess over there and it's going to take working with both sides in a fair and sensible way to find a solution.

[Atlant]

18. Don't both sides already punish each other enough? (NT)

[IkeWarnedUs]

30. And that attitude is why he doesn't have my vote

Personally, I think Sharon should be sent to a prison in Syria where he can live out his life as some big hairy arab's bitch.

But while that may be personally satisfying, it won't do a thing to bring about peace in the reigon.

Kucinich says things I like, and we need him and people like him to speak for that side of the pendulum.

But there are enough extreemists in power now. We need someone calm and level headed to keep the world from blowing apart.

[sangh0]

7. I think that IP issues

are a political football, particularly during campaigns. Candidates say whatever they think will gain them the most votes without causing them to lose too many other votes.

[Liberal Veteran]

10. I won't be making a selection for preferred candidate based on...

...his or her position on the Israel/Palestine issue.

[CWebster]

15. I sure as hell will

It is a measure of political courage.

[Nicholas_J]

12. Dean has shifted from a AIPAC stance in which

he promises Israel massive funding, to ths current statements:

Dean rejected the suggestion that his seemingly even-handed rhetoric on Israel, coupled with a recent position he took against racial profiling of Arabs, was a bid for Arab votes in the Michigan primary. “That’s silly,” he said. “I’m not thinking about who’s going to vote where.”

Dean also rejected the suggestion that his position on the Middle East had changed any from an interview he gave the Forward in November. At the time, Dean was about to visit Israel on an educational trip funded by an arm of the pro-Israel lobbying powerhouse the American Israel Public Affairs Committee. Dean said of the conflict then, “my view is closer to Aipac's view” than to the view of Peace Now.

http://www.forward.com/issues/2003/03.09.12/news.lieberman2.html

Muslims are very unhappy with Deans position:

In a major foreign policy speech earlier this year, Dean, while calling for an end to Palestinian violence, did not call for an end to Israeli violence, let alone an end to the illegal Israeli occupation.

And when asked whether his views are closer to the dovish Americans for Peace Now (APN) or the right wing, Sharon-supporting American Israel Public Affairs Committee (AIPAC), he stated unequivocally in an interview with the Jewish weekly The Forward, "My view is closer to AIPAC's view."

"At one time the Peace Now view was important, but now Israel is under enormous pressure. We have to stop terrorism before peace negotiations," he said.

Similarly, Dean's official campaign position on solving the Palestinian Israeli problem is that "terrorism against Israel must end," but there is no mention of the Israeli violence that has resulted in over 2,391 deaths since September 2000.

http://www.muslimwakeup.com/mainarchive/000119.html

Which I beleive is what has led to Deans waffling statements of recent.

AND this is the kicker of the reason:

MWU! Helps Defeat Dean in MoveOn Primary
Well, may be we weren't completely responsible for Howard Dean falling short of the 50% he needed in the MoveOn.org virtual primary to gain the group's official endorsement, and all the campaign cash that would have entailed, but we'd like to think we played a small role in his defeat.

Before our expose of the alleged "anti-war" candidate's glaring inconsistencies regarding the Israeli/Palestinian issue and US foreign policy toward Iran, Dean looked like he had a strong chance for a MoveOn endorsement. However, our article, along with others, helped sway potential Dean voters, who began to wonder whether Dean was all that he really claimed to be. Not only does Dean sound hawkish on some foreign policy issues, his positions on the death penalty, welfare "reform," and gun control leave much to be desired.

Yes, Dean was against the invasion of Iraq, but he also leaves the option open for a preemptive strike against Iran. So what gives

http://www.muslimwakeup.com/archives/000130.html

Young Muslims of the Democratic Party Faith, actively worked against Dean in the MoveOn Primary, and actively supported Dennis Kucinich.


Combine this with Kucinich coming in second place in that race and Dean has powerful motive to try to waffle his position to one that may seem acceptable to the Kucinich supporters.

[Character Assassin]

21. Wow. Just how stupid is Kerry?

Sen. John F. Kerry (Mass.) said: "It is either because he lacks the foreign policy experience or simply because he is wrong that governor Dean has proposed a radical shift in United States policy towards the Middle East. If the president were to make a remark such as this it would throw an already volatile region into even more turmoil."

Oh, I get it, John. I mean, of course you're right, after decades of trying the same goddamn things over and over and over and nothing changing other than the names in the headlines and the obits. Why, anyone with 'foreign policy experience' knows how well things have turned out so far.

Yeah, that's it, let's not do anything different and pretend it's somehow, magically, working.

Righto, Johnny.

[Cha]

27. No...."the president"(sic) just says things like "God told me to

kill sadam"...and do you think the press reported on that?

The press covers up every malpropism that comes out of the stump's mouth.

So that's a disingenous thing to say right there.

[sujan]

28. beats the hell out of

'Dean Dean Dean Dean' anyday.

[blm]

29. Not stupid at all. He's baiting Dean on this because Dean is adrift

on this issue and has conflicting statements. Kerry wasn't specific and is just pointing to an issue that Dean needs more examination for his inconsistencies.

from the Doc:

Israeli aid constitutes 30% of the total US foreign aid budget, which renders Israel to be the largest recipient of US aid in the world. It promotes the illegal occupation of Palestinian land in order to establish settlements for Jewish immigrants, transforms Palestine into a military test ground, and violates US law and abuses of human rights.

Since 1987, the US congress has annually been approving a foreign aid bill totaling an average of $3 billion of American taxpayers' money to Israel, $1.2 billion in economical aid, and $1.8 billion in military aid.

After the gulf war in 1991, the US has additionally been offering Israel $2 billion annually in federal loan guarantees, which brings the total US foreign aid to Israel to about $5 billion, or $13.7 million per day.

Seventy five percent of US military aid to Israel goes into purchasing US-made military equipment, such as tanks, machine guns, bullets, helicopter gunships, and more. The US depends on Israel to test new military technologies in war conditions. For example, uranium-depleted ammunition has been fired at civilians in Palestine.

http://www.miftah.org/Display.cfm?DocId=753&CategoryId=4

Dean traveled to Israel on a trip sponsored by the American Israel Public Affairs Committee (AIPAC). After meeting with Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon, Dean stated: “I do not think that as long as Yasser Arafat is president there will be peace." Before leaving, Sharon asked if Dean would support requests for new loan guarantees to Israel. Dean “promised him he would.”

http://www.aaiusa.org/countdown/c120602.htm

Last December, Dean told the Jerusalem Post that he unequivocally supported $8 Billion in US loan guarantees for Israel. "I believe that by providing Israel with the loan guarantees...the US will be advancing its own interest," he said. His unconditional support for the loan package, in addition to $4 Billion in outright grants, went further than even some of the most pro-Israel elements in the Bush administration, like Paul Wolfowitz, who wanted to at least include some vague restrictions like pushing Israel to curtail new settlements and accept a timetable to establish a Palestinian state.

http://www.muslimwakeup.com/mainarchive/000119.html

Dean believes the Bush administration should be giving Israel $4 billion in military aid to fight terrorism, not the $1 billion it proposed last month.

http://www.jewishsf.com/bk030418/us02.shtml