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So what is THE conspiracy? * taking over the world, etc?

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The Straight Story Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 12:51 AM
Original message
So what is THE conspiracy? * taking over the world, etc?
Some things over time I have read here over the years (and was lurking a long time before I signed up) seem to revolve around some big conspiracies about bush and co. It all got me to thinking about some things, which I will try to outline here:

1. What is the ultimate goal of those in charge of this grand world conspiracy?

2. Who all is involved, and what do they get from it? Example of what I am thinking here - 9/11. If it was all mihop then there must have been a ton of people involved, from witnesses to people who have worked for the government from years (under both bush and clinton, were both of them in the know on it all? Were loyal employees at the ground level under clinton suddenly now bushbots? Why, what did they get?)

3. Jesus. Yes, I am brining him into this. The reasons relate to the anti-christ and end of the world, from a christian perspective - the (one of them anyway) idea centers around a one world government holding absolute power over mankind. Up until now there were regional powers that tried to be that, but now it is possible on a global scale - is bush part of this (whether knowningly or not) and who else is helping him along to control the people through tracking them, putting them into prison camps, and what have you?
---The whole Jesus angle (and NT/OT) comes down to not trusting those in power to use it in a way that is best for all but for their own ends (be in the world not of it and such). In this light, fellow christians of all stripes (fundies to liberal) should look at bush and others in power in a harsh light - not on a few topics but on the bigger picture (and IF you believe in that bigger picture you probably believe in a conspiracy theory on a deep level run by those in a spirit world and using leaders as pupppets - which includes bush).

4. Does a hatred of bush cloud your thinking to the point that you see bush everywhere (like some see satan's hand in everything)? Are you all bush all the time, he is everywhere and his grip is so deep he can control the tiniest of details - or does your hatred have limits and you see bush as some of the problem but have a feeling there is some deeper thing running things...(and if so, what is that deeper thing)?

5. Lastly - where do you see the world in 10 years, and do you really think someone new in office will change the world or have you lost hope that there will be any major changes because even if bush himself leaves it all runs so deep that it won't matter (and perhaps it must run deep for all the conspiracies to be true, in which case - as noted - do you really think anything will truly change at the core level in 2006/08?)
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Extend a Hand Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 01:06 AM
Response to Original message
1. If you want to call it a "conspiracy"
I guess it wouldn't be too far off base.

This Yurica Report article describes what I think is going on.
http://www.yuricareport.com/Dominionism/TheDespoilingOfAmerica.htm
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rogue_bandit Donating Member (105 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 01:09 AM
Response to Original message
2. Hmmm...
Strictly my own opinion:

1. There are at least three main categories of conspirators. Sometimes they are working in conjunction and sometimes in opposition. They are the greedy, the power seekers and the sadistic.

2. They gain wealth, power or the infliction of pain.

3. Christ taught that the path to heaven lays in your heart...do good on earth and you will have heaven on earth (you don't have to wait until you die). Unfortunately for the conspirators, that truth gives them no gain so they adulterate the truth to play upon a tendancy of people to follow their own greed, power and sadism. The pyramid of conspiracy is based on how greedy, powerful or sadistic a given player is or is willing to become.

4. I believe Bush is a very unhappy person living in hell on earth. I am certain he still drinks and does drugs whenever he can. His life is surrounded by all the pedifiles, addicts, hate mongers, drug dealers, pimps and assorted creeps you find in horror films. I feel pity for him. I don't see him everywhere I turn.

5. I only know how I see myself in relation to the world in ten years. I expect to love more, find myself more compassionate toward all God's creations (including the Bush family) and I expect to work even harder at developing this great experiment of democracy, justice and equality based on the Constitution of the United States and the Bill of Rights.

Thank you for the opportunity to remind myself what I'm doing on earth.
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The Straight Story Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 02:32 AM
Response to Reply #2
9. I think indeed it starts with the individual
Like early christianity change starts with the people and works it's way up. bush is a problem, but more a symptom of a larger problem to me. While getting him out of office is a goal, to me the main goal is to change the hearts and minds of the people in general, without enablers helping him bush loses power (and his cohorts).

We can make a difference, one on one.
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rogue_bandit Donating Member (105 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 03:26 AM
Response to Reply #9
13. I agree entirely
Thanks for the reminder.
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jimmy47nyc Donating Member (35 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 01:33 AM
Response to Original message
3. i hate bush...
no one can claim ignorance of the facts when you have prior knowledge to the worst mass-murder in history. bush lied to me on sept.11 2001 when he made that claim,"i dont know who crashed these commercial jets into the world trade center" but i will find out hunt them down and kill them. george bush would have better served America by telling the country he indeed did know,he was briefed by tenet just 10 days earlier,not to forget the Aug 6 "pdb" and the countless warnings from overseas during the summer of threat.
read for yourself at www.cooperativeresearch.org the timeline to terror.everything our government didnt want to voluntary submit.:mad: :mad: :mad: :crazy: :dem: :hi: :hi: :hi:
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The Straight Story Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 02:35 AM
Response to Reply #3
10. As a sort of side note on all this
I was at work that day. I was writing a perl program when I heard one of the call center people say something about a plane hitting the wtc. I shrugged it off and went back to work thinking it was a small cessna style plane and that the pilot made an error, had a heart attack, or something akin to that.

Later when another one hit things seemed suddenly different. Then the pentagon. I said screw it and went home to be with wife and daughter. We painted a sign asking people to pray for the families and hung it from our balcony in downtown circleville.

Was a day I will never forget.
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mogster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 06:55 AM
Response to Reply #3
26. Welcome to DU!
:hi: BTW: Good link in your sig. That place is awesome.
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jimmy47nyc Donating Member (35 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 08:52 PM
Response to Reply #26
47.  thank you
for the welcome.. timeline to terror tells everything we need to know.bush cant claim ignorance of the events leading up to sept.11. my feeling is p-nac needed a new pearl harbor to move foward and george bush was the perfect sap.oilmen have no scruples,especially when big money and power are at stake..
thanks again mogster..
:toast: :toast: :hi: :hi: :dem: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
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newyawker99 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 11:45 AM
Response to Reply #3
37. Hi jimmy47nyc!!
Welcome to DU!! :toast:
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jimmy47nyc Donating Member (35 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 08:46 PM
Response to Reply #37
46. thank you...
for the welcome...
:toast: :thumbsup: :hi: :dem:
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Goldmund Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 01:40 AM
Response to Original message
4. I think that one thing that needs to be cleared up is...
...that a "conspiracy" in the wider sense isn't necessarily a couple of guys with black suits making dark deals in some fancy back room. It can be the ultimate product of a common economic interest and a common willingness to put that interest ahead of everything else. On some levels, there are literal conspiracies; on some, implied.
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Media_Lies_Daily Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 01:41 AM
Response to Original message
5. Have you visited the PNAC website? Try reading "Rebuilding.....
...America's Defenses" once you get there.
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Sapphire Blue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 01:54 AM
Response to Original message
6. Conquering by Stealth and Deception
is another enlightening essay available at The Yurica Report.


Excerpt:


Conquering by Stealth and Deception
How the Dominionists Are Succeeding in Their Quest for National Control and World Power

By Katherine Yurica

September 14, 2004

Paul Weyrich’s Secret Manual on How to Win Politically

Since the writing and posting of my essay, The Despoiling of America in February 2004, there is more and more evidence that not only has a cultural war been launched, but that the plotters are winning it. “Dominionism” now looks more like a term that is applicable to both right-wing-religious believers and to the neo-cons who were created and born in an astonishing resurgence of an immoral Machiavellianism: both groups believe in domination and control. While religious adherents adopted a decidedly heretical Christian doctrine,<1> the neo-cons continue to use the American churches to help execute their cabal. It was expressed this way by a Yurica Report talk board participant:

“One of the more sinister aspects of the current crisis is the influence of Leo Strauss on the pro-war, “neo-cons” who are determining so much of our foreign policy. While the Christian right thinks it is running the show, Leo Strauss’ irreligious philosophy is actually in control. Strauss believed that the rulers should not be religious, but should use religion to manage the people — which he evidently regarded as a stupid herd. He also believed that a state of war was great for controlling and directing the masses. So it’s all come together: the weirdest book of the bible , with its mysterious disasters; the scheming behind the scenes warmongers and an incident of terrorism that has served admirably as the Project for a New American Century’s hoped-for ‘new Pearl Harbor.’” Adrien Rain

Americans and the main-stream media have been very slow in catching on to the fact that we are in a war—a war that is cultural, religious and political. One document not mentioned in The Despoiling of America is the closeted manual that reveals how the right wing in American politics can get and keep power. It was created under the tutelage of Paul Weyrich, the man who founded the Free Congress Foundation. Conservative leaders consider Weyrich to be the “most powerful man in American politics today.” There is no question of his immense influence in conservative circles. He is also considered the founder of the Heritage Foundation, a conservative think tank made possible with funding from Joseph Coors and Richard Mellon-Scaife. Weyrich served as the Founding President from 1973-1974.

Continue reading @

http://www.yuricareport.com/Dominionism/TheSwiftAdvanceOfaPlannedCoup.htm
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Extend a Hand Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 02:13 AM
Response to Reply #6
7. Yes!
She really lays it all out-- with meticulous research.
I'ts scary!!!
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Sapphire Blue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 04:04 AM
Response to Reply #7
14. Calling Michael Moore
Please film a documentary exposing the Dominionist movement of the radical right-wing!
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sweetheart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 02:29 AM
Response to Original message
8. how about "criminal incompetence"
The only conspiracy is a full frontal assault on the rights of labour
worldwide, the poor and common folk. This is rather obvious in policy
and hardly needs "conspiracy" status.

But when it comes down to this mal-administration, "the economist" had
it right... they're grossly incompetent. Do you blame a 13 years old
joyrider for conspiracy to crash a car?.. no... its expected... same
with this bush drunk driver.
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rman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 04:42 AM
Response to Reply #8
20. I'd say convenient incompetence.
A collapse of the US and/or global economy won't hurt them nearly as much as it will hurt the little people. Hurting little people is to the advantage of the global dominators, since it takes away power from the little people. In order for them to live in luxury they don't necessarily need us to buy stuff, they just need us to do labor for them, which doesn't have to be voluntary.
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Sapphire Blue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 04:45 AM
Response to Reply #8
22. These are some of the targets of the Dominionist movement
An excerpt from ‘Despoiling America’


Dominionism is a natural if unintended extension of Social Darwinism and is frequently called “Christian Reconstructionism.” Its doctrines are shocking to ordinary Christian believers and to most Americans. Journalist Frederick Clarkson, who has written extensively on the subject, warned in 1994 that Dominionism “seeks to replace democracy with a theocratic elite that would govern by imposing their interpretation of ‘Biblical Law.’” He described the ulterior motive of Dominionism is to eliminate “…labor unions, civil rights laws, and public schools.” Clarkson then describes the creation of new classes of citizens:

“Women would be generally relegated to hearth and home. Insufficiently Christian men would be denied citizenship, perhaps executed. So severe is this theocracy that it would extend capital punishment blasphemy, heresy, adultery, and homosexuality.”<10>

http://www.yuricareport.com/Dominionism/TheDespoilingOfAmerica.htm
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leesa Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 08:51 AM
Response to Reply #8
30. It's not incompetence, it's planned.
Bush is not the driver, but he knows exactly what's going on. Crashing our economy and endless war is part of the plan.
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sweetheart Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 10:45 AM
Response to Reply #30
34. Then they should be charged with treason
Someone who knowingly destroys the constitutional republic when
sworn to protect it is no friend of America.

I guess when you own the courts, there is no end to the crime that
you can get away with without ever being charged... that it has
come to collusion to commit treason. This is way beyond impeachment.

On one hand, granting them the benefit of goodwill, we can presume they're
simply incompetent... but i must admit, the evidence increasingly
points towards your conclusion. Who defends the constitution when
its "defenders" are traitors?
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Patriot Acts Donating Member (306 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 02:38 AM
Response to Original message
11. PNAC IS RUNNING THE SHOW
http://www.newamericancentury.org/

read>> "Statement of Principals", "about PNAC" and "What's New".

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pauliedangerously Donating Member (843 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 02:52 AM
Response to Original message
12. Hmmmm
1. The goal is to acquire as much money as possible.

2. I lean towards LIHOP, but that's it. I also think Paul Wellstone was murdered, but I'm not pushing the issue; it's just my gut feeling. Most of the people involved aren't even public figures.

3. The Jesus thing is just a worn-out, but still effective, manipulation strategy used on the less educated.

4. I don't hate Bush; I just think he's a shitty president and a demented moron.

5. In ten years, I see the world scurrying to find a long-term energy solution. The war on terror is a smokescreen for the desire to secure rights to oil.
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manna Donating Member (77 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 04:31 AM
Response to Reply #12
16. it's more of an agenda than conspiracy
I don't believe it is money that motivates these people, it is power. Money should be looked at as stored energy, these people crave energy.

Also look at the mass population and do their best to suppress their energy, or divert it to useless, profitless, fruitless endeavors.



Root the mind in the physical rather than the mental or worst of all the spiritual.

Convince you your life is real, and that you can die. The limits have been set, so your potential becomes limited.



Sorry for the non rational reply, I'm tired and it should be obvious to anyone half awake that black boxes survive plane crashes, not passports.



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Swamp Rat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 04:15 AM
Response to Original message
15. These are the conspirators were are faced with:
But don't worry, Toutatis will return in 2012 and put an end to it all. :D

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manna Donating Member (77 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 04:33 AM
Response to Reply #15
17. green is in
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Swamp Rat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 04:35 AM
Response to Reply #17
18. Welcome to DU!
Apparently so...

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manna Donating Member (77 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 04:41 AM
Response to Reply #18
19. who thinks he's hip?
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Swamp Rat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 04:45 AM
Response to Reply #19
21. He does n/t
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manna Donating Member (77 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 04:52 AM
Response to Reply #21
23. ok last one
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Swamp Rat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 05:07 AM
Response to Reply #23
24. HAHA! Very good! n/t
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Lexingtonian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 05:12 AM
Response to Original message
25. it's far more banal than you think

But I'll answer them so that they're easy to contrast.

1. The point is to settle all their grudges and resentments and live in the past. The composite: to revisit all the problems of the past in their lifetime and rehash them. More immediately, to revel in themselves and their power and material things. Two key terms: vainglory and immoralism. Think: a gang of 12 year olds with a couple of bullies among them, taking out their rage on a quaint neighborhood.

2. The Nixon/Reagan people and Right activists of 1960-1980, who glommed en masse inside government agencies (i.e. the Pentagon and CIA) and well paying think tanks, are the real VRWC. They have an easy time with people older than ~35 because they represent The Old Way Of Doing Things since the early Reagan years, which people that age and older favor by majority for some problematic set of reasons. Their value system is very materialistic and vanity has amazing importance, that's why power attracts them. They are the last generation(s) that are still colonialists and colonial plutocrats of nearly medieval European varieties, that is their historical meaning.

3. The American Christian Right is not Christian- its content is the old, very materialist/Nature theist/physicalist, paganism of pre-Christian Europe. Given a Christian patina. Their theology is always a mix of theistic Nature worship and occultism (will-centered cultisms), with the latter presently the dominant and moving very close to Manichaeanism. The American Christian Right is a religious survival of medieval Europe.

4. The Right is trying mightily to change this society, using its powers of governance at multiple levels to try to change all social, religious, political, and financial things to its liking. 'Bush' is inescapable as the figurehead of the effort. The Right has hijacked the public arena. If you study cults, one important element is ensuring that the environment the Followers are in is radicalized and they are always either on the offensive (better) or the defensive (also important) so that they can think of themselves as combatants in a crucial conflict for the salvation of the world. But don't forget that the weak inherent faith of the Followers- their abyssmal dependence for reinforcement in megachurches and from televangelists and Fox News Channel to maintain The True Faith is evidence- is the true sign of the belief system starting to fail.

5. The Right is stripping the country down to barely functioning...which has to do with it attaining all the power it wanted, but more so with the proper assessment that the country is rejecting them and the pathetic things they profess to believe in. You can look at it as a payout- we get rid of the bad management system for X trillion dollars, for which they consider us suckers, in return for which we return to control and declare the lot of them the slaveholders and toppled Confederacy of the late 20th century.

They imagine the loot and fame or infamy obtained outweighs the verdict of American history we shall obtain against them, and our being the continuity of the American ideals and example of redemption from the Past in world history. In that misjudgment they're the fools and mediocrities we've known them for all along.
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Mist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 07:52 AM
Response to Reply #25
29. Very succinct! Especially the inherent weak faith part of
rw xtians--they seem to think constant noise equates to faith. But while I see the Manichaeanism of the rw xtians, where does the "paganism of pre-Christian Europe" come in? I thought they were practicing a version of extreme Calvinism (the "elect" being favored in this life).
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Lexingtonian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 09:16 PM
Response to Reply #29
48. Calvinism -is- pretty exactly that

The God of Calvin is hardly the God of the Bible. The God of the Bible is not very much the (extreme) theist's God as is generally and conventionally pretended. In the Hebrew Bible (Old Testament) there are four or five names of God. 'El' or 'Elohim' (the emphatic plural form of El in Hebrew) is the one associated with a godhead that is theistic and Nature-controlling. 'YHWH' is the inwardly transformative power and considered the highest or most valuable or supreme form of the godhead.

For the God of Calvin essentially being a Jupiter/Wotan/Zeus kind of Indoeuropean god, it's really there in Five Points Calvinism.

http://www.mslick.com/tulip.htm

Total Depravity (also known as Total Inability and Original Sin)
Unconditional Election
Limited Atonement (also known as Particular Atonement)
Irresistible Grace
Perseverance of the Saints (also known as Once Saved Always Saved)


This is a god who is pretty tribal- there are people who simply don't get at chance. No one measures up to Calvin's god, and the cardinal sin in Ancient paganism was the way the gods destroyed people who figured they could attain the level or talk back- no prophets or redeemers among Men.

There is also the implicit or explicit materialism of all pagan religions- Other People are not real, aren't human in the profound sense of the word. Spirit or soul is a material and individual quality/entity, not possible to actually share. Which is not a Biblical idea in the least.
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bush_is_wacko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 09:49 PM
Response to Reply #25
50. I'm with you on this one too. While I think there are some Biblical
ramifications the basics are right there in you statements. Texas wanted to succeed from he union in order to keep their slaves back then, now they want to make the entire world bow down to them. By Texas I really don't mean that state specifically I mean the "moral values" they stood for at that time.

I often feel like I'm back in that redneck high school in Kansas where the richest rednecks with the most powerful daddy's got away literally with murder and it was all nicely wrapped up in a little propaganda package that all the "normal parents" would accept because it had the signatures of all the intimidated school officials on it!

This did happen in the eighties a great deal and I can see it happening at institutions of learning again.

These people took their time this time around though and they planted people in all the right places. They have pacified MANY parents into believing everything must be OK because the media has been intimidated into submission rather effectively.

BTW, I am over 35 and there a whole bunch of us out here that KNOW what we are seeing. It is history repeating itself to a lot of us. We are not going to be pulled in this time. We know the truth and we are passing that truth down to the next generation so that they can recognize the truth. This time it really isn't generational like it was in the Nixon years.
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dbt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 07:16 AM
Response to Original message
27. Kicked and recommended.
1. The ultimate goal of those "in charge" is the transfer of wealth into as few hands as (in)humanly possible. "Wealth" can encompass everything from money to (get ready for this one) water.

2. There are, at the top, relatively few people involved. Compartmentalization is well understood and well utilized by whoever the BFEE is working for. Those at the bottom of the pyramid are convinced down to their tiny souls that they are working on behalf of Good and Morality. There is quite a different view from the top. As to 9/11 MIHOP, those at the bottom got Revenge Upon Ragheads; those at the top got Power. Again, at the top of the pyramid, it would have taken relatively few people to MIHOP.

3. Jesus is about the simplest and most effective trick that the Right Wang has ever had. When you want large groups of people to give up their thought processes utterly, you use the Jesus Lever. Instant Avalanche, which goes precisely where you aim it. It bears pointing out that Jesus Of The Right bears almost no resemblance to the real guy.

4. bu$h himself controls next to nothing. He can't string two sentences together. He is a marionette and, in his rare lucid moments, he damn well knows it. It is hard work NOT to hate his Handlers, for they have their tentacles in every aspect of daily life. Hell yes, there's some deeper Thing running this country and the rest of the world. It's as simple--and as complicated--as figuring out who Poppy reports to.

5. The world in 10 years? If the BFEE (and those above them) are not somehow derailed, I think we are talking feudal.
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bvar22 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 11:43 AM
Response to Reply #27
36. I agree with you.
This conspiracy started soon after the end of WWII by the people who financed Hitler. They learned from their mistakes.

Who are they?
"There are, at the top, relatively few people involved. Compartmentalization is well understood and well utilized by whoever the BFEE is working for."

The mysterious they exist in the supraworld of International Corporatism above the framework of National boundaries and jurisdictions. They are not bound by treaties or laws. They answer to no one. They are the handful of people who have won the game of International Capitalism.

They could not care less about "who gets an abortion" or "who buys a gun" or "who gets married", but they are delighted that the two major political parties in the USA use these issues as their points of difference. The only issue that concerns them is the continued amassing of power and capital into fewer hands. They own both political parties in the USA, and their agenda continues unabated whether the Democrats or the Republicans are in power (though they prefer the socially frigid Republicans).

They are the people whose emissaries attend the conferences of the WTO and the IMF. Their plan is to control the people and resources of the World. Their police force is the military of the USA.
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dbt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 01:53 PM
Response to Reply #36
42. Thank you. I am now scared to death!
:evilgrin:
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ignatius 2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 10:00 PM
Response to Reply #27
51. Point # 3..I saw a sign which said , religion is what keeps the poor
from killing the rich.

Religion IS indeed the opium of the masses..a cheap form of mind control.
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Warren DeMontague Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 07:18 AM
Response to Original message
28. Conspiracy? Only if all the stupid people are in league.

I prefer to think of it more like a virus of unabashed idiocy.
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shadowknows69 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 09:21 AM
Response to Original message
31. I desperately look for reasons NOT to believe C theories.
but then I read the news and see story after story that plants those seeds of dread back into my mind. The way I look at it is a person of any reasonable intelligence should at least examine the possibility that the worst theory could be true and then ask themselves what would they do if reality unraveled. I know one thing. If the shit does starting hitting the fan with greater frequency, I'm seeking out the most hardcore conspiracy theorist and asking him/her what the hell comes next and where can we go that's safe.
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bigtree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 09:31 AM
Response to Original message
32. The present imperialism that is being directed out of the White House is
Edited on Tue Mar-01-05 09:37 AM by bigtree

the invention of a banished ruling class - enriched by the selling of the influence of their positions in government - who had nursed their broken ambitions in exile, and had instinctively constructed their sympathetic webs of wealth to obstruct the remedies of the reformers and hatch the next generation of world capitalists who would inherit the patronage of the next conservative presidency.

Through our nation's faith, and in the trust we place in our representatives that they would be humbled to serve the will of the people, and by their good judgement lead, we have been betrayed by a ruling-class oligarchy which has perpetuated its role and influence in our governance; not by the quality of their service, but through the advantages of patronage and association.

This Republican administration is a reflection of that tiny percentage of the nation's citizens who have maintained their wealth and influence through the last century. Despite the persistent poverty of generations of Americans who work and struggle with no guarantee of success or survival, this same working-class of people routinely elevate these power-brokers to the cadre of the privileged few who would lord over their wealth in the offices of our government.

With our votes, cast for hollow promises of representation in the division and disposition of our contributions of blood and sacrifice, we get no more than spattered remains of precious meal from a pig's trough. And in turn, we assure their ascendency to that two-percent confederation of corporate interests who routinely divide the fruits of our labor for their own benefit and purpose.

Their aim is to enrich their two-percent confederation of corporate interests in our government who perpetuate their class in and out of office by manipulating our precious contributions to democracy; from federal appropriations; to corporate tax breaks; and through sly deregulation schemes that allow them to slough off their responsibilities to worker safety, or to the protection of the community and the environment.

The means to their end is in the unelected, unchecked executive appointments gifted by this two-percent confederation to their power-driven lackeys, to lord over our regulatory agencies; to infect and obstruct the very institutions which are there to protect and assist the common citizen; by under-funding them and intimidating the public servants; barely allowing the emasculated institutions to survive; giving them a reluctance to respond to any but the entrenched, monied interests.

Its also in the systematic targeting and suppression by the forces of our executive government, of groups and individuals who raise their voices in disagreement with its practices or policies. And in the arbitrary expulsion, without due process, of those who would immigrate to America and dare to criticize their benefactor.

The mischief is in a manipulated foreign policy which exploits the resources of the defenseless around the world for the benefit of a minority of industry leeches.

The mischief is in a trumped-up, bloody invasion of a sovereign country and in the theft of its oil and its resources, and in the occupation and auctioning of the vanquished country's industry away from its citizens.

It's in the shackling of countless generations of Americans to a corporate agenda of U.S. world domination, supported by the perpetual sacrifice of the lives and blood of generations of our sons and daughters in a continuous world war.

The present war with Iraq is the ambition of the corporate wing of the conservative establishment who views Iraq as a potential wedge against the domination of Mideast oil-producing nations which, in many respects, are openly hostile to American economic interests in the region. Having failed to turn the first war to their corporate advantage, the exiled power brokers brooded and plotted to revive a public campaign against Saddam Hussein which would unseat the dictator and allow the U.S. to install an authority there compliant to American business concerns.

The election of George Bush and Dick Cheney was a watershed for the military corporations. Both had been stalwart supporters of the multibillion dollar military industry; Bush in his home state and Cheney, wherever he could exploit his tenure as defense secretary during the first Iraq war, and build on his past deal-making with the coalition members.

During the 2000 campaign Cheney complained that "developments of new military technologies (had) reached all-time lows." But that would only be a concern to the industry, not to the average American. The U.S. arsenal is full of high-tech weapons that don't work or that they don't use.

This call for a new generation of weapons is intended to facilitate the agendas of Bush administration hawks who would project U.S. influence around the globe like mercenary carpetbaggers; through intimidation from the force of our weaponry; with our soldiers; and through the supplying of ‘commercial’ armies whenever a commitment of our forces is politically difficult, or prohibited by Congress.

President Bush intends for there to be more conquest - like in Iraq - as the United States exercises its military force around the world; our mandate, our justification, presumably inherent in the mere possession of our instruments of destruction.

One would expect that President Bush would be humbled by his lack of experience in the military and that his same shallow depth of involvement in foreign affairs would cause him to wield our armed forces with caution and restraint.

Yet, upon assuming the moniker of the commander-in-chief he reflexively aligned himself with the armed forces' bureaucracy which has, in the last decade, involved itself more with the projection and preservation of U.S. monied interests around the globe, than with the actual defense of democratic ideals of economic and social justice.

It was that alignment which fostered the unprecedented appointments of hundreds of the who's-who in the military industrial world to the most sensitive positions in our government offices. (see my post: Bush's Military-Industrial Warriors, http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=1499287)

The CDI reports that the United States military budget exceeds that of the next 25 nations combined; $400 billion a year, and that's just the public accounting. Russia follows the U.S. with a $60 billion defense budget. U.K. spends only about $35 billion a year.

Since 1992, the United States has exported more than $142 billion worth of weaponry around the world. North America accounts for more than 65% of the world's arms exports. Of the 43 countries with over $500 million in arms imports, 23 obtained 2/3 or more from the U.S.

With the new money appropriated for homeland defense ($38 billion for FY 2003), virtually all of the big defense contractors — Boeing, Lockheed Martin, and Raytheon have started hawking their products for use in domestic security.

In order to replace weapons used in Afghanistan, and in concert with the military conflict in Iraq, most U.S. weapons makers have increased production. Bombs are big business again and the Bush administration has opened the candy store, exporting death, conquest, and perpetual war.

With a share of 24% of U.S. arms exports, Lockheed-Martin is the world's largest arms exporting company. Lockheed leads the pack of defense contractors who do business with the U.S. with valuable Pentagon contracts worth a total of nearly $30 billion and an advertised $70 billion backlog.

Lockheed has 125,000 employees in the United States and overseas with 939 facilities in 457 cities and 45 states throughout the U.S.; internationally, with business locations in 56 nations and territories.

Lockheed leads the defense industry in lobbying expenditures. Lockheed Martin made over $10.6 million in campaign contributions to candidates and party committees from 1990 to 2000, including $3.4 million in donations in the run-up to the year 2000 elections.

The company actively lobbies for the need to retain substantial numbers of existing nuclear weapons while developing new ones. Lockheed Martin receives more than $1 billion per year from the Department of Energy - to operate the Sandia National Laboratories (involved in the design and production of nuclear warheads) and help run the Nevada Test Site for "sub-critical testing" of new nuclear weapons designs.

The ex-Lockheed Martin employees with the most direct connections to nuclear and missile defense policy are:

Former chief operating officer Peter B. Teets, who is now Under Secretary of the Air Force and Director of the National Reconnaissance Office (NRO), a post that includes making decisions on the acquisition of everything from reconnaissance satellites to space-based elements of missile defense.

And, Everet Beckner, who served as the chief executive of Lockheed Martin's division that helped run the United Kingdom's Atomic Weapons Establishment. Beckner is now Deputy Administrator for Defense Programs at the Department of Energy's National Nuclear Security Administration, charged with oversight of maintenance, development, and production of nuclear warheads.

In their new positions, both Teets and Beckner are well-positioned to make decisions on procurement and research programs that will directly or indirectly benefit their former employer (Lockheed),which has major portfolios in nuclear weapons, missile defense, and military space systems.

Lockheed Martin also produces the Trident II, a nuclear missile with first strike capabilities. The firm is also heavily invested in ballistic missile defense.

The Arms Trade Resource Center, reported that 80% of Lockheed's business is with the Department of Defense and other federal government agencies. It is also the largest provider of information technology services, systems integration, and training to the U.S. government. Such business has grown substantially during the Bush tenure, especially in fiscal year 2002 as plans for war were formulated.

The ATRC report calculates that Lockheed was awarded $17 billion in defense contracts in 2002, up from $14.7 billion in 2001. First quarter sales for 2003 were $7.1 billion, an 18% increase from the corresponding quarter in 2002.

Bechtel will benefit directly from efforts to expand testing and production of nuclear weapons. Bechtel is part of a partnership with Lockheed Martin that runs the Nevada Test Site for the U.S.

Bechtel runs the Y-12 plant in Oak Ridge Tennessee, which makes critical components for nuclear warheads; and it is involved in the management of the Pantex nuclear weapons plant in Amarillo, Texas.

Bechtel's $1 billion-plus in annual contracts for "atomic energy defense activities" are likely to grow substantially under the Bush nuclear plan. In 2002 Bechtel earned $11.6 billion.

The company has built more than 40% of the United States' nuclear capacity and 50% of nuclear power plants in the developing world. That's 150 nuclear power plants.

Bechtel is also in charge of managing and cleaning up the toxic nuclear waste at the 52 reactors at the Idaho nuclear test site from our '50's nuclear program, as well as two million cubic feet of transuranic waste buried on the site, such as plutonium-covered shoes, gloves and other tools used at the nuclear lab in Rocky Flats.


At a military industry conference hosted by the American Enterprise Institute, defense policy advisor Richard Perle mused that, "It would be better if we simply handed the money to the defense industry and let them invest it themselves, . . . but Congress likes to control that . . . , but it gives the impression that the merchants of death are unduly licenced."

Perle then made a weak plea for less regulation of arms exports ($140 + billion since 1992), and suggested that export licencing be consolidated into one agency. I wonder who the administration executives will suggest to head that office. Industry lawyers; resumes at the ready!

You can hear the regret in his statement. If we would only just give the industry the money they want, no strings attached; they would provide for the nation's defense needs. The industry wants us to believe that they are the best judges of what the next generation's needs are in terms of weaponry. But the existence of these corporations and their new hi-tech boondoggles will not make us anymore secure than the existence of these same executives in our government have kept our sons and daughters from dying in senseless wars.

These are excerpts from my book, Power Of Mischief: http://www.returningsoldiers.us/pompage.htm

Download the book for free!
http://www.returningsoldiers.us/Power%20Of%20Mischief4.pdf

Here's my list of numbered, linked references for the book (253 links):
http://returningsoldiers.us/biblio.htm
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JohnyCanuck Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 10:24 AM
Response to Reply #32
33. Great stuff, can I print this off an use it as a handout?

I'd naturally keep the URLs for the links to your book included as well and also include with the handout the URL for the thread at DU.
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bigtree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 01:37 PM
Response to Reply #33
41. absolutely
the book made a few pennies but the info, unfortunately, has proven timeless and vital. That seems to be the legacy of the effort, to inform.
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KingoftheJungle Donating Member (355 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 11:11 AM
Response to Original message
35. Look here...the Council of National Policy
One member (Jack Abramhoff) was just busted making illegal contributions to Delay. They are also behind the voting machine companies, the defense industry, ExxonMobile and Shell, the media, and all other kinds of big business. They have also formed a relationship with the Knights of Malta and Opus Dei, who are the CIA and the Vatican's mob, respectively.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=103x109621

http://www.cephasministry.com/state_of_the_union_cnp_w-z_bios.html

http://www.blessedquietness.com/journal/prophecy/cnp-1.htm

http://www.insider-magazine.com/ChristianMafia.htm
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Enraged_Ape Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 11:58 AM
Response to Original message
38. This is nothing more or less than a giant "smash and grab"...
by the biggest crime family in history, along with all of its historical enablers and co-conspirators.

I sincerely doubt that this cabal has any religious designs whatsoever. They merely use the insane fervor and fear of the fundamentalists, rapturists, etc., to advance their only real goal: to steal and extort as much money as is humanly possible from the United States government, its taxpayers, and any other countries they can get ahold of, in as short a time as possible.

This group doesn't care about anything happening any later than four years from now; that's for the rest of us little people to worry about and, eventually, clean up. In the meantime, they will ensure themselves enough wealth and ownership to rule over us for decades--if not centuries, assuming we as a species last that long.
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DARE to HOPE Donating Member (552 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 12:04 PM
Response to Original message
39. Who is responsible for the chemtrails?
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dbt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 02:11 PM
Response to Reply #39
44. Ultimately? Clinton, I'm afraid.
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Old Deuteronomy Donating Member (116 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 12:20 PM
Response to Original message
40. On the Jesus thing...
I believe the Shrub is a forerunner of the anti-Christ and wil help usher in the end time Arnageddon, yes... it has been long coming and is now upon us (the one world government concept spoken of in Biblical prophecy). We are in the beginnings of it all NOW and will see it unfold... probably not in my lifetime for I am OLD now, but soon... soon...
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adigal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 02:05 PM
Response to Original message
43. Read "Confessions of an Economic Hit Man"
It blew me away. I had no idea people like James Baker, Schultz, Bush 41 and Cheney hop from administration positions to positions on the board or as officers of companies like Halliburton or the Bechtel Group. We are, as the author says, for the corporations, by the corporations and of the corporations." You and I don't matter one tiny little bit to these bastards.
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Frederik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 05:36 PM
Response to Reply #43
45. Read this
www.onlinejournal.com/Special_Reports/021805Stanton/021805stanton.html

The same names, over and over again.
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bush_is_wacko Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Mar-01-05 09:34 PM
Response to Original message
49. I do believe it is possible that bush is the anti-Christ
Edited on Tue Mar-01-05 09:35 PM by bush_is_wacko
I believe the conspiracy is MUCH deeper than JUST bush. I don't even think MOST of the players are PUBLICLY known figures. Will we uncover them all? Not likely, but we are well on our way to uncovering those that participated in the last attempt to create a "New World Order and are also involved in this attempt."

I'm really not sure EXACTLY how I feel about the Clinton's, but I can tell you, I don't trust them very much anymore and it isn't because of a WH blow job. It is because they were NEVER the unknowns their campaign manager made them out to be. I now know their history and they were both involved in the Nixon debacle and what I have read about their involvement doesn't look good for either one of them. They were covering things up and at least Hillary was giving some very bad advice regarding charging a president with conspiracy.

When the conspirators of present day are exposed for what they are the "unknowns" are likely to do the same thing they did last time. lie low for a while and try again later.

I am nearly certain bush has just had his head handed to him on a silver platter by the Europeans and I believe they basically told him to stop what he is doing or they will find a way to stop him as a group. It would be quite easy for them to collapse our economy in one fell swoop. They hold our banknotes, so to speak, and they can decide to cash in on them at any moment. I think they know better than we do what bush is really up to. I think they know he is creating crisis all over the world right now and I think they are concerned enough to unite to derail bush's plans.

If you read the Bible and the prophecies it contains you can see that bush is either reading it like a script and acting that script out or being given instructions as to what his next move will be. Do I believe that this will indeed cause the end of life as we know it here on earth? NO! I believe in God and I even believe Jesus did exist and went through something similar to what the Bible details. I'm not sure if I believe he was really the son of God or if the message was more profound in that we are all the sons and daughters of God and our sins were washed away by an event in history.

There is no one alive from that era so we can only guess at what the monks that interpreted the Bible really had in mind as to the message. The message was purposely complicated and contradictory and incomplete. I believe there were some prophets of that time that were legitimate and others that were involved in a "conspiracy" to to capture THE ONE TRUE RELIGION because it gave them power! Power is what the "conspirators" of today are after. That is in direct contradiction to the religion they are stepping all over to get at that power. Oil is power, weapons are power, currency is power. They are after all of it. They want to reign supreme over the entire world and that really is a possibility if you have control over science, industry, politics, religion, and currency. This may be the first time in history that those things are within the true reach of one group of people. I, however, don't think the rest of the world is going to allow that to happen.

Humans have been fighting this battle for a very long time and I have no doubt the Bible gives clues as to where the human race will end up. "The meek shall inherent the earth" is really a fairly uncomplicated message. Ultimately, good will triumph over evil. I fear that there will have to be much more pain and unbelievable suffering and turmoil before we really get to that breaking point the Evangelicals/Fundamentalists Christians believe we are coming to. And I believe they will be given more and more information teat is designed to reveal to them the true nature of the man they are currently worshiping like a God.


This may sound crazy, but the Bible really does document natural disasters from history. It may blow them out of proportion or give meaning to those events that didn't really happen or don't really apply, but the documentation is there nonetheless. Who knows, maybe this event in history will be the start of yet another form of religion?
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