I have a question about the Bush SS plan

[andino]

I have been reading a little here and there about how Bush wants to trash Social Security and the thing that keeps sticking in my head is the $2 trillion dollars that it would cost to convert to his plan. Has anyone read what would happen if we just took the $2 trillion dollars and invested it into the current Social Security plan and didn't go to his system?? Wouldn't it keep SS out of the red for longer?

[BrainRants]

1. I don't have a link, but recall Paul Krugman saying exactly this. n/t

[Coastie for Truth]

6. Paul Krugman, E.J. Dionne

even Pete Peterson (Nixon's Commerce Secretary) and Norm Ornstein (American Enterprise Institute economist) have said this.

FDR's grand son (James Roosevelt) has said this.

Realize, Bush has a visceral hatred of all things FDR, all things New Deal. It's encoded into his DNA. In addition to adenine, thymine, cytosine, and guanine, the Bush DNA contains "Hate FDR" and "Hate the New Deal" -- it's part of "Unintelligent Design Theory of the Creation of the Anti-Christ"

[aden_nak]

2. Why do you hate American so much? Stop being logical and do as Bush says.

[wryter2000]

3. Interesting question

I don't know the answer, but I'll give you a :kick:

[in_cog_ni_to]

4. It probably would. AND if they took back the tax cuts

for the wealthiest 1% (those who make over $300,000? I think that was the figure.), SS would be just fine. I could live very well on $300,000 a year.

[sam sarrha]

5. actually it is 2 trillion now and every few years the total will be about

12 in 30 years..

they want to edn SSI they feel it is socialism and welfare, there are really really rich people that need that money. removing SSI is a gift to the Fascist Corporations, and canpaign contributions back is the reward

[Coastie for Truth]

7. My "Unintelligent Design Creation Science" Theory of Bush and SS

Bush has a visceral hatred of all things FDR, all things New Deal. He can't help it. It's encoded into his DNA.

The "Intelligent Designer" put it into his DNA sequence.

In addition to adenine, thymine, cytosine, and guanine, the Bush DNA contans "Hate FDR" and "Hate the New Deal" -- it's part of "Unintelligent Design Theory of the Creation of the Anti-Christ"

[tinonedown]

8. any plan makes better sense comapred to his

Including yours which is one sentence long.

[Guckert]

11. Take $20.00 per month and buy some stocks. you own it. now get back to the

Real Problem. SS solvency. rescind the tax cut for the rich and start paying back the money that was pulled from the trust fund.

[TreasonousBastard]

9. Biggest problem is that 2 trillion is largely borrowed money...

and borrowing is a large part of our problem already.

As of now,Shrub really has no plan, just a set of talking points. The 2 trillion comes up because if money is diverted from SS into those private accounts, vast amounts have to be borrowed to pay the present and near-future beneficiaries.

The whole thing makes my head hurt.

[BrainRants]

10. Atrios just posed the following GREAT question...

Under the current Social Security system, it isn't necessary for employers to make Social Security payments in a timely fashion. Even if they're late with their payments employees can be credited appropriately.

However, under a private account system the timing of stock or index fund transactions is critical. Would employers be liable for any lost capital gains due to late payment of payroll taxes? If not, why not?

http://atrios.blogspot.com/2005_03_06_atrios_archive.html#111020341189983529

[Warpy]

12. It would, which is why it hasn't been proposed.

You see, social security is a socialist program that works.

That is the entire reason Bush and his class are hell bent to destroy it. You see, they base their entire existence upon the fact that everything socialist is bad, and that only dog eat dog capitalism combined with Social Darwinism is a a valid system. After all, it serves those born rich very well.

They tried to destroy it in 1937 by exempting their own income. It survived without them. They tried to destroy it in the 1980s by jacking up premiums six times and then robbing them to cover up their tax cuts to themselves. It still worked, and it was still popular.

Make no mistake, this is the closest they've come to getting their wish. They have all three branches of government and might be able to bully Congress into passing this horror. They don't care if they'll be thrown out of power in 2006 because of it. Social security will be on its way to dying, and that is all the owners and rulers care about.

It's ideological, it's visceral, and they're all lying about it.

[JHB]

13. Cannibalistic Manifest Destiny

That's the phrase to describe the colossal sense of entitlement Bush and his "base" have, and their willingness to screw everyone else so that they can exercise their G*d-given right to chew up the world, squeeze every last penny they can get for themselves, then spit it out and move on to the next thing.

One can argue that 19th Century Manifest Destiny was worth all the things that it cost because it laid the infrastructure for a strong and wealthy nation. (not saying you have to agree with that, just that it can be argued.) However, this version lacks even that virtue, since it can only advance by undermining the previously-built wealth and infrastructure, cannibalizing it for the benefit of the well-connected or most ruthless.