Dean fears Clark

[Fixated]

Has anyone else noticed how much Dean seems to be trying to woo Clark and his supporters, perhaps into accepting Clark as a VP? I personally don't want a Dean/Clark ticket. I don't want any ticket without Clark as President. So it will piss me off if Clark stands up there on the 19th and announces his being Dean's running mate.

This all brings me to my point, kinda. Do you agree that if Clark enters the race he'll be the biggest threat to Dean's lead? I think that he detracts from the support of each candidate equally, and probably enough to build up a sizable threat to any front-runner (Dean).

[Kahuna]

1. Put on your flame-retardant suit...

BTW, I agree with you. I'm putting on my flame-retardant suit too.

[Fixated]

2. ....

Forget the flaming, they started a counter-thread.

[janx]

3. This is really silly.

Clark and Dean are allied on many matters. Dean openly admires Clark.

[Kahuna]

14. Then why is Dean trying to undermine and marginalize

Clark by repeatedly referring to what a good VP pick Clark would be?Why did Dean say that his support is not transferrable (to Clark)? On that last one, little does he know. But this does show what a tremendous ego he has.

click link to see Dean's remark about his supporters...
http://www.tnr.com/primary/index.mhtml?pid=650

[janx]

17. ...

Number one, that quote is taken out of context. If I remember correctly, Dean was talking about the young people on his campaign staff--that why he calls them kids--and not all of his supporters. He meant non-transferable to anyone, not Clark specifically.

As to referring to what a great V.P. Clark would be--I have read direct Dean quotes in which he praises Clark, but the V.P. factor is media rumor so far. Nothing more.

Be selective and skeptical when it comes to the media, Kahuna.

[Kahuna]

19. Sorry but...

a day after Dean said (albeit when questioned by asshole Wolf Blixter) that Clark would be a good VP, in Ausin during his Sleepless tour he said that Clark would make a good VP. Sorry but, it does appear as though Dean is trying to align himself with Clark and by so doing, marginalize Clark as qualified to be VP only.

[MoonRiver]

29. I don't think anyone runs for president without having a big ego.

Dean sees the prize right in front of him and of course he's threatened by someone who could snatch that away. Having said this, I really believe that Clark and Dean are on the same philosophical and political page. I do not feel there would be any antagonism on Dean's part if Clark were to enter the race and win the nomination. Btw, if Clark wants to run as #2, more power to him. A Dean/Clark ticket, while not as awesome as Clark for President, IMO, would be dynamite.

[Kahuna]

13. LOL! I saw that.

[junker]

4. 1000 to 1 against in london betting pools

doubtful you will be pissed off. The london betting pools are 1000 to 1 against Clark saying no to the run for the presdency.....


i am an old sombitch hippy. Never never done political work for anyone. When clark says yes he is going to kick some bushbutt, I will sign up and go do some work now that I am unemployed in the bushco depression.....



bushie bastard....here we come!

[liberalnurse]

5. Hang on to your pipe dream and

just wait and see.

[diplomats]

6. He's not running for VP

It would be a coup for Dean if Clark did endorse him, of course, but that story was generated by the Dean camp.

[janx]

18. Correction: It was generated by the media.

There's all kinds of spin going into all of this.

[demnan]

7. Yeah, I remember the flame thread "Kerry is afraid of Dean"

and as a Dean supporter I had to object because look, Kerry is a war hero ok? I also object to anyone saying some candidate is "afraid" of another. Do they know there's a challenge? Yes. I wouldn't accuse any of our candidates of cowardice. It takes a lot to run for office and I respect every single one of them.

[Fixated]

8. ....

And now Kerry is getting smashed by Dean....

[salin]

9. what are we

12? These threads are so stupid. Adds nothing to political discourse. Leave the shallow campaign posturing to the shallow right.

[Fixated]

10. ...

I was stating my opinion. I wasn't intending on elevating the level of debate here at DU. I'm not 12. And I also don't complain about threads that I don't like the sound of.

[salin]

12. perhaps

because you are too busy creating threads that are so .... substantive? :shrug:

[Fixated]

15. ...

Well, you're too clever for me. Stating that one candidate is afraid of the rise of another, major challenger is way too light a subject for DU. I'll go back to polls about aging celebrities.

[Woodstock]

28. He "fears" him? Sorry that sounds like 12 to me

Does he also fear thunder and lightning? Tall people with more hair? Kerry?

A lot of the tone is set by the title of these threads. The ones with the F word in the title get lots of attention, so do the ones that make it seem like the candidates are 12. Not sure if you remember the one that went "Dean is mean"? Or "Dean's wife doesn't look like a first lady"? Now we get "Dean fears Clark." Consider the possibility that you wouldn't have gotten the taunts about your thread if you'd named your thread differently - it would have sounded less bashing/more like you thought an issue through and wanted to talk about it reasonably.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

16. LOL...redundant to state so

[Donna Zen]

11. Admire's Deans organization

He has said that many times. Dean political handlers will try to weaken any potential rival, that is what they are paid to do.

Fear is not the factor.

The factor is whether "we the people" can separate the politics from the reality. I just read a post, heart-felt an honest it is true, were a very nicely reasoned individual expressed doubts about being a Democrat because Dean's critics made politics seem somehow misguided.

I will repeat my little tale of caution that I've posted here before: The year is 1968 and I was "clean for Gene". It was summer in Chicago and I was answering phones in a hotel room trying to get help and coordinate the movement on the street. At that point, I hated the Democratic Party. Now I come from a long line of Dems including a mother who served as an elected official for 30 years, but my experience caused me to change my registration to "Indy." And more than that, I refused to vote in the presidental election. Now my one vote meant nothing, but I assume I was not alone in aiding the criminal Nixon take power. Two years later at Kent State, my government was shotting at me.

Fear is not the factor; but ignorance is a bitch.

[TacticalPeek]

20. The price of liberty is eternal vigilance.

Electoral politics can be a bitch, too, but we sleep or ignore at our peril.

[Capn Sunshine]

22. AWESOME POST

I hope the idealistic youngsters can understand it.
Your reference to "Clean for Gene" made me smile. I remember one meeting in San Diego where the only people in the room wearing shoes were the operatives from Duluth.

They were like aliens amongst the surfed out madras wearing California kids. We were members of the political movement but decidely forward in our dress. These poor guys were trying somehow to make sense of it : "please, when you go door to door, you have to bathe, it's just the right thing to do And wear sandals, at least? Please???"

Different times.

[Capn Sunshine]

21. The biggest threat to Dean's candidacy

would be polling double digits. Like John Kerry.

Come back when you guys have something solid
LIKE AN ANNOUNCED CANDIDATE

[Fixated]

24. ....

We will in about a week. Should we "come back" then?

[Julien Sorel]

25. And 600 million dollars raised over the internet!

And a campaign that transcends policy! And a candidate who can flip flop on the same issue 10 times in one day! And a candidate who had to grovel to the DNC because he shoots from the hip! And....

Gee, running into a guy who can do all that, Clark doesn't stand a chance.

[w4rma]

23. “doesn’t eat into Dean’s lead…Dean is the only one who could hold his own”

…
Under the Clinton scenario, Kerry would fall into the second tier of Democratic hopefuls, favored by just 16 percent of voters. All the other Democratic candidates would be relegated to the single digits.

Dean’s support among independent- and reform-minded voters seems intact with or without Clinton in the race while Kerry would find his base of support among traditional Democratic voters threatened, according to Herald pollster R. Kelly Myers.

“If Hillary Clinton suddenly expressed some interest in the race, the biggest potential loser is Kerry,” Myers told the Herald. “She doesn’t eat into Dean’s lead at all ... As of today, Dean is the only one who could hold his own (against Clinton).”
…
http://www4.fosters.com/News2003/July2003/July_28/News/reg_pol_0728a.asp

A new Prez Preferece poll
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=190456

Clark V Dean
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=196331

[opstachuck]

26. Everyone fears Clark, not just Dean

but i'm sure if there's anyone that Clark fears it's probably Dean. Either way, I think he'll make the whole process alot stronger and will strengthen our party. this thread is kinda weak

[Woodstock]

27. I talked about Clark for VP because I didn't think he was running

and I thought he'd make a good VP. The two of them together would complement each other, and beat Bush handily. Dean could beat Buth anyway, but Clark as VP would certainly help. Then when it sounded like Clark might run, I still thought (like a lot of Democrats/pundits) that it was really a bid for VP.

That's all there was to it for me.

I think Dean is the better candidate based upon his previous eperience governing. But I like Clark and if he wants to run/be president or nothing, that's fine too. If he's the nominee/beats Dean, that's fine, too, because it will mean that he's done a good job convincing people he can govern/run a good campaign for the first time. I think he'd be a vast improvement over Bush and I prefer him over many of the other Democratic candidates, although I have some reservations.

Don't read so much into things.

[CMT]

30. I actually think he hurts Kerry more than Dean

because they are both going to try and capitalize on their military history, which is a legitimite thing to do. He also, I think, is going to run well in the south which could cause problems for Graham and Edwards who both need to score heavily in that region.

Now Clark and Dean have a friendly relationship. They have met four times during the coarse of the campaign. Clark has said that he has spoken to Dean about defense policy and Dean has on occassion spoken to him on domestic policy. The meeting and the subject of the VP-ship was secondary. Dean, like any good politician, was asking for Clark's support should Clark not run. While it seems increasingly clear he will run--we can't be sure. We were pretty sure that Arnold wasn't going to run in California up until his appearance on Jay Leno then he surprised even the media by saying he was going to run.

[bitchkitty]

31. How tiresome.