I want these neoCon Facists, criminals out of my government, NOW!

[anarchy1999]

I go back to Iran/Contra and I want the criminals from then removed now from any position of power! This in an outrage and we are all sitting down taking it. WHY?

[Mr_Spock]

1. It's called "power"

They have it and can abuse it until the American people smarten up and vote them out of office. Even the "police" of the government are part of the evil clan - so we need new "policemen" too (Congress).

[FtWayneBlue]

3. that song is fun,

but sad. Maybe we could play it at our next peace rally?

[Mr_Spock]

14. I find the song soothing

It so precisely describes my feeling about these awful "ass-holes" in our country that have voted for a clan of RW nut-jobs. "

You get what you pay for"

[Toots]

4. vote them out of office...Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha

Diebold ring any bells. Some people here are still under the illusion Americans have a choice in what happens. The only way we will ever have a choice is if we take those damn machines and throw them in the bay and vote on paper ballots counted by people (election judges). If we have no faith in our judges we have no faith in America.Until those machines are history we will live under fascism.. simple Fact...

[Goldeneye]

7. I wonder just how much fraud it will take

to make everyday americans believe...

Bush selection 2000...not anywhere near enough

midterms 2002...Max Cleland...whose that?

Reselectin 2004...exit polls are never accurate anyways...statistics is a bunch of hooey


2008 will be interesting for sure. Especially since we aren't going to see exit polls until after the fact. And I don't see any reason the republicans would let democrats take back enough seats to start impeachment proceedings for Bush. It will not happen.

[lonestarnot]

11. Maybe in 2006 instead of voting on them people with trash them?

[Mr_Spock]

13. Well, I could never believe anything as much as you do

There may have/was likely some tampering in the Presidential election, but there were an equal number of "don't change commanders mid-war" Democrats who voluntarily voted for this moron. I know, I've met them - even in Kerry's home state of Mass. Even the moderate Republicans I know regret their vote for Shrubco now, but Kerry didn't do enough to convince people he was that much different than Shrub - he need to share the blame in his defeat...

[lonestarnot]

23. Not a defeat just a cheat! n/t

[anarchy1999]

6. "Vote" them out of office? Now that's a joke?

Mr_Spock! Vote on what machine?

[Mr_Spock]

10. With a good sized majority - even these folks can't change that

They can only tweak around the edges somewhat - trust me - there are ways of checking voter intent and we will be more dilligent next time.

[anarchy1999]

15. What planet are you really living on and what air are you really

breathing? Tweak it around the edges, I'm sorry, I can't stop lol.

Enough, good luck with your theories Mr_Spock.

Good Luck!

See you on the other side, maybe, probably not.

[Mr_Spock]

17. OK - prove you theory then. I've read dozens of them

Please post proof positive that the voting was rigged. I know I believe that it was, but I can't prove it so I just have to live with it. If it is so obvious and I am "breathing air from another planet" please post your proof here. I said proof, not heresay or statistics - PROOF!

[anarchy1999]

18. All the proof is here at DU in many posts. I've do not have the time

nor the inclination to help you discover for yourself, good luck and happy hunting.

[Mr_Spock]

20. I thought so

I can't be sucked into this game - it's not productive unless we are dilligently trying to change things moving forward. I trust the people looking for hard proof are doing their best to prove their case, in the mean time we need to be working on changing the minds of independants and moderate Repukes (I've already had some success here). We will win.

[anarchy1999]

24. " I can't be sucked into this game ", no one is sucking you into any game!

How dare you, in all your arrogance and newness to this website say such things? I'm at an absolute loss. Yes, change is what is needed. Good luck in your efforts.

[Mr_Spock]

25. "in all your arrogance and newness" - name calling now - nice!

Since I've been a liberal all my life, I should be insulted by that - but you seem to have a chip on your shoulder this morning so I'll let it slide. I am rather alarmed at your technique - I hope this isn't how you treat everyone who challenges your assertions...?

[anarchy1999]

27. Not falling in Mr_Spock.

I didn't call you a name at all. Yes, I have a chip and thank you in all your graciousness for "letting it slide" this morning.

Peace.

[Discord]

38. If we had proof, it would be a moot issue and the

election laws would already have been reformed. Its the fact that the voting irregularities were the largest discrepencies in US history, with the 2000 election irregularities coming in a distant second. We all KNOW it happened even if we lack the proof.

[Snap]

28. Powerful/Slippery BASTARDS

surrounded by easily confused true believers.

[FtWayneBlue]

2. Beats the hell out of me.

I am not sitting down. I am standing up trying to make myself heard. But what can we do against the powers that be? One idea that makes sense is to make it illegal to profit from war. period. I think that would fix their wagons.

[anarchy1999]

9. Oh yes, god forbid anyone read "War is a Racket" by Smedley Butler!

That would just be too much for our kids to handle, wouldn't it?

[democrank]

5. Just relax.

Everything is beautiful. Bush is spreadin` freedom. Global warming is a tree-hugger myth. We don`t torture. Economic well-being is on the rise. Justice Department is keeping a close eye on librarians. Makin` great progress in Iraq. We`re safer now.

[anarchy1999]

8. Righty oh, buy the line, hook and sinker. I'm in. It's so much more

comfy, ain't it?

Can you help us get an SUV?

[Senior citizen]

12. Just finished re-reading "Out of Control"

by Leslie Cockburn, about Iran-Contra, and I agree that it is totally unacceptable that these people should be back in power.

Of course it is also totally unacceptable that we should no longer have checks and balances in government, free and fair elections, freedom of speech at town meetings paid for with taxpayer dollars, separation of church and state, etc.

Not everyone is sitting down taking it. Thousands of people have been arrested in mass demonstrations since BFEE took power. The problem is that with rigged elections, it is not possible to throw the crooks out through the usual political process, and with homeland security money used to beef up crowd control nationwide, it is not possible through violence either.

Here on DU it is a bit like Kansas. Many of us are acting against our own best interests in hoping the economic crash comes quickly, because we don't have much else to hope for. The U.S. refuses to recognize the World Court or the Geneva Convention, and has sent an anti-U.N. representative to the U.N. Wolfowitz, of PNAC is now head of the World Bank (see "Confessions of an Economic Hitman" by John Perkins), and BFEE has very few allies left--those remaining are doing so in spite of popular opinion in their countries.

In attempting to piratize Social Security, BFEE stepped on the third rail of politics, and has lost a lot of support. The recent Supreme Court ruling in favor of older workers sueing for discrimination, indicates that the Supreme Court, which consists mainly of older people, will not back BFEE when it comes to Social Security. Almost every Republican in Congress has someone in their family dependent on Social Security, whom they'd have to support personally if it was cut.

But there isn't going to be a revolution. All we can hope for is a crash.

[anarchy1999]

16. SHITTE! I did not need to read this. A CRASH is all to hope for.

I heard it right after 9/11 from someone I hold very dear, I didn't need to hear it here from you now, out of the blue. But I do respect you and you and he are probably both right.

[0007]

19. "All we can hope for is a crash." Or another country coming to

liberate us.

[Senior citizen]

22. Please don't hope for another country liberating us.

The only thing for sure when one country liberates another, is that a lot of innocent people die. A crash would be a lot less genocidal.

[0007]

26. Not necessarily so! I grew up in the 30's, wouldn't want to wish

those days on anyone. Lots of disease, TB & malnutrition.

[prairierose]

32. My parents lived through that too... and my father says

that he really isn't looking forward to this

but I think that...we will have no choice but to try to get through the one that is coming. I am trying to prepare for it the best I can and get my family ready too. We are all students of history so we see it coming and are lucky enough to possess knowledge and skills that hopefully will help us survive.

[0007]

36. Mental toughness is what it's all about, perishables are just that,

they're soon gone. Sticking together with love & determination, helps.

[anarchy1999]

21. Anyone else this AM?

n / t

[Beam Me Up]

29. Because

a) Most of us are too busy earning a living or too tied into the system in one way or another to rock the boat.

b) The full significance of what is happening (theocratic fascism) hasn't hit us yet and when it does it will be too late.

c) The CON keeps us distracted with all sorts of emotional issues that have no relevance to what is actually going down.

d) The extreme right wing has been working for years to gain control of all that it has: executive, congress, judiciary, media and military, CIA, etc., and have pretty much gotten everything they wanted. All that is left is US.

e) They have stolen elections and they've done this by not allowing the majority of people see that they ARE a majority. We do not get an accurate reflection of ourselves as a society in the mirror of the corporate owned news media; they portray us as they want us to see ourselves--which is as a diverse and disorganized group of issues and opinions.

f) They have compromised many political and other public figures with blackmail.

g) They have successfully marginalized much of our leadership--and when they haven't been able to do that, they have assassinated them either figuratively or out-right.

e) They control vast amounts of wealth and influence in circles that you and I have no access to--including international criminal sendicates.

ETC.

Edit to add:

...knowledge brings responsibility. If we acknowledge that an inner circle of ruling elites controls the world's most powerful military and intelligence system; controls the international banking system; controls the most effective and far-reaching propaganda network in history; controls all three branches of government in the world's only superpower; and controls the technology that counts the people's votes, we might be then forced to conclude that we don't live in a particularly democratic system. And then voting and making contributions and trying to stay informed wouldn't be enough. Because then the duty of citizenship would go beyond serving as a loyal opposition, to serving as a "loyal resistance"—like the Republicans in the Spanish Civil War, except that in this case the resistance to fascism would be on the side of the national ideals, rather than the government; and a violent insurgency would not only play into the empire's hands, it would be doomed from the start.

Forming a nonviolent resistance movement, on the other hand, might mean forsaking some middle class comfort, and it would doubtless require a lot of work. It would mean educating ourselves and others about the nature of the truly apocalyptic beast we face. It would mean organizing at the most basic neighborhood level, face to face. (We cannot put our trust in the empire's technology.) It would mean reaching across turf lines and transcending single-issue politics, forming coalitions and sharing data and names and strategies, and applying energy at every level of government, local to global. It would also probably mean civil disobedience, at a time when the Bush regime is starting to classify that action as "terrorism." In the end, it may mean organizing a progressive confederacy to govern ourselves, just as our revolutionary founders formed the Continental Congress. It would mean being wise as serpents, and gentle as doves.

It would be a lot of work. It would also require critical mass. A paradigm shift.

Paranoid Shift

[anarchy1999]

30. Where is Traficante?

Anyone remember him? He was famous on the floor of the House for Saying "Beam me Up"!

[Beam Me Up]

33. They took him out

of congress as I'm sure you know. As to what he's up to these days, I don't know. Hopefully he's alive and well.

[mopaul]

31. we're doing everything except do something about it

i hear ya, unless someone actually makes these fuckers cease and desist fucking up the world, they'll continue doing so.

[anarchy1999]

39. Thank you Mopaul. I'm at my wits end. How do we get them to stop?

How do we get to win?

[Zorra]

34. Here's one possible method for removing the neocons:

Get 1/4 to 3/8 of the population to:

A) Go on an indefinite national General Strike,

B) Engage in an extended blanket corporate boycott,

C) Pull all their money out of the bank,

D) Stop paying all bills,

all on the same day.

Yeah, the ensuing economic collapse would lead to a chaotic "Road Warrior" society.

Personally, I'd rather die going road warrior than have all my hope, freedom, and my very life slowly sucked away by these twisted fascist neocon pigs.

I'm gonna die someday anyway, maybe tomorrow, maybe 40 years from now.

Whenever; I'd prefer to die free rather than whining about having to kiss some jackboot's fat fascist neocon ass for the rest of my life.

[Al-CIAda]

35. Who is at fault for not exposing the PNAC?

Who is at fault for not exposing the lies of 9/11?
Who is at fault for not exposing the election fraud?

Who decided to NOT talk about such things?

[porphyrian]

37. I'm fucking furious, but what do we do?

If we work within the system that they control and aren't afraid to work outside of, we cannot win.