Why I Don't Want Clark to Grab the Nomination

[Enraged American]

I don't sincerely think we Democrats can beat George "I steal elections" Bush. But I do believe that the election can be a breath of fresh air to allow the people to realize that there are other issues out there and that Bush is an asshole.

Clark will hardly make this possible. He will capitalize off of the military guy persona. AP has already said this. I want the Democratic candidate to get rid of the prevalent fear in America, not profit from it.

Clark plays the election like how Ahnuld plays the election in California. Of course Clark isn't an inarticulate beast who bashes unions every chance he gets; but he resembles Ahnuld in how he needs a waiting period of sorts for pretty much every thing. At this point, he's nothing but a personality. I respect him greatly for liberating countless Kosovars (I have met Kosovars who almost worship Bill Clinton and Madeleine Albright), and I would certainly vote for him in the general election (I would never let Ralph Nader take my vote); but he only ranks ahead of Lieberman (this guy I wouldn't vote for in a general election if you paid me) and Bob "Patriot Act" Graham in my book.

Most disturbing of all is his stand on trade. His position is very lukewarm, like Dean's, and I feel that such a position might get him corporate support; but it's never going to bring jobs back.

[Brian Sweat]

1. I think we can beat Bush.

You pessimism is misplaced. It is not based on fact. Bush's numbers stink like a loaded huggie.

[Enraged American]

2. You're assuming

that we live in a democracy.

[IranianDemocrat]

4. Kucinich, Green or Dean right?

?

[Forkboy]

7. what are you...a parrot?

:eyes:

God forbid someone might actually have some thoughts you dont agree with.

[Enraged American]

9. No

Kucinich or Gephardt. Green is out of the question.

[Brian Sweat]

15. Yes, I do assume we live in a Demacracy

and while I know that Bush took office in 2001 as a result of much shenanigans, I believe this to be the exception, not the rule.

[IranianDemocrat]

3. If people like you were in charge you'd elect another McGovern.

Then after that person loses by another landslide you'd say "Well he wasn't liberal enough." And youd continue the cycle over and over again untill you got someone to the left of Karl Marxx and transform the party into a joke. I'm not saying we should nominate Lieberman, but holding biases just because someone is from the military is ridiculous!

[VolcanoJen]

5. But just a couple days ago...

... you started a thread saying "Wesley Clark will be the most electable candidate."

And yes, we do live in a democracy, and yes, we will beat Bush. Yes, Yes, Yes.

[DemExpat]

8. Clark may be the best guy to bring in the most Dem votes....

to make it harder for Bush to get away with fraud.....

DemEx

[Enraged American]

10. He is the most electable

I just don't like him. And he is not the most nominatable in the first place.

[DemExpat]

13. Well, why didn't you just say that, then?

'I don't like Clark!'

:-)

DemEx

[diplomats]

17. I'm kind of confused

are you saying you don't want the candidate you think is most electable to actually get the nomination? I'm not quite sure how to respond to that.

[Langis]

11. Yes we can beat Bush

I was a supporter of Dean, but now I am going to step back and watch everything unfold. I really think Wesley Clark is the most electable candidate so far though. He has the right wingers shitting their pants.

[Pepperbelly]

6. I suspect that is why ...

elections are held.

[Bread and Circus]

12. Are you saying....

you don't want Clark to win the nomination
because he might win the general election?
So rather, let's put someone in there who is
sure to lose? That is a very strange strategy indeed.
Isn't that what Nader kind of did already?

Can we have some sanity in this country?

The fascist right wants to bankrupt medicare and SS
to get rid of them and some on the left want to
bankrupt the Democratic party to get rid of it?
Why all the scorched-earth tactics?

What the hell?

[diplomats]

14. On his blog, Josh Marshall pointed out that

Clark is a lot more comfortable discussing foreign policy issues than domestic issues at this point. I assume he'll improve in that area. I also suspect that over time his military experience won't be so front and center. It's being written about now because it's the biggest thing people know about him. That should change.

[VolcanoJen]

16. So.... it's hard, but let me see if I get the gist of this...

I like Clark, but I don't like Clark, he's electable, but not nominatable (sp), but we can't beat Bush, so he's really not electable, so let's neither nominate, nor elect, Clark... in fact, why bother voting at all?

Is that what you intended to convey?

[Enraged American]

19. OK

1. Clark is "electable." He has probably the best shot at winning even though he WILL NOT win since Bush is a de facto dictator.
2. Just because he is electable does not mean I should support him. Lieberman is infinitely more electable than Kucinich (this does NOT mean that his views are more attractive; he is simply a better politician than Kucinich). Will I ever vote for him? No.
3. I think a lot of people on this board should get out of the Democrat = good mentality. Sure, ANY of the Democratic candidates (with the possible exception of Lieberman, who is openly anti-Palestinian and imperialistic) is better than Bush; but if some Democratic candidate tried to outdo Bush's imperialist image drastically to win the election, I'd go with the status quo. Political parties in this country have no basic platform; this isn't France where the party stands for ONE platform. There have been Democrats in the last century LEAGUES worse in their confrontationism and war-mongering (*cough* Truman vs. Ford).
4. I want a candidate who speaks for the worker. Face it, there's more than tax cuts that is causing the unemployment. Clinton is no angel in this matter since he expanded NAFTA to include Mexico. Kucinich, and his very decent, more electable counterpart Gephardt, are Democrats who have proven that they will fight for the worker. I don't want a corporate Democrat; I want a union Democrat.

[WhoCountsTheVotes]

33. yep

except Lieberman's better than Bush, not because he's policies are substantially different, but because of who would be on Lieberman's team. I guess sometimes GOP Lite is better than the real thing.

We do need at least competent people right now, because the world is rapidly slipping into war and chaos.

I totally agree about Kucinich and Gephardt, and I think Edwards and Moseley-Braun are good as well.

[mlawson]

18. ??? Why do you think Clark could "grab" the nomination???

I can't imagine that happening. He has little name recognition, and I seriously doubt that the DNC/DLC big shots will back him, or even allow him to be nominee. I don't know if the fix for Kerry is in, yet, but it won't be too long.

I suspect that Clark is running for VP. And so is Edwards.

[Enraged American]

20. I never said that.

I specifically said he wasn't nominatable. This thread is supposed to show my discontent with Clark.

[Enraged American]

21. Kick

[ima_sinnic]

22. I pretty much agree, esp. "he's nothing but a personality"

Clark just doesn't seem to have a lot of substance, seems vague, neophyte, and even unconfident. Not bashing, just stating my perception of him. I think his ability to run with the election is highly overrated. Still, things may change of course, but at this point he doesn't inspire me or anyone I know to switch from supporting Dean.

[unfrigginreal]

23. You're suggestion that Dean is lukewarm on trade...

show's either how little attention you've been paying or that you have nefarious reasons for posting. Dean has been very vocal in suggesting that we have to enforce International Wage standards on our trading partners.

Perhaps you wouldn't be so enraged if you truly believed in a Democratic platform.

[Enraged American]

24. Don't make me laugh

"We need to enforce international wage standards"? Who DISAGREES with that statement? The Commerce Sec. said the EXACT same thing last week. HAHAHA!

I want specifics (eg. "I will sign _____ when I am elected to stimulate US-based industry").

[unfrigginreal]

25. Well fill in the blank, Genius...

then maybe the rest of us will know what you're talking about!

[Enraged American]

26. Uh

Kucinich for example said he would do away with NAFTA. Gephardt has a voting record to prove he hates free trade. Dean is just giving a politically correct, pre-cooked answer.

[unfrigginreal]

27. Is it possible that Dean is giving the answer that most Americans ...

relate to? I believe that may be the case.

If you're a one issue voter then I doubt that Dean can win you over...if you care about America, then I suspect that he will!

[Hippo_Tron]

28. While I disagree...

You are entitled to your opinion.

[OneBlueSky]

29. I want to keep pointing out this article in Clark's own words . . .

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=103&topic_id=11938

until I read it, I had an open mind and was thinking he might be just the right guy to take on Bush . . . based on his own words, seems like he's pretty much Bush-lite, at least on the Middle East . . . damn shame . . .

[Enraged American]

30. Kick

[bloom]

31. kick for pitt

[yellowdawgdem]

32. Anger

Maybe if we just get all the information on Clark first, this'd take care of itself. I have alot of anger, though not a Dean fan, particularly. My anger is that Dean has worked his butt off to get contributions, reach out and energize people at grassroots level, and to become the frontrunner fair and square. Now it looks like Clark can just walk in at this late date, and claim the nomination because of his connections, etc. To me, that is a rip off.:mad: