Plan for Iraq - What would a plan look like?

[paulsbc]

i keep hearing everyone extolling the "we had no plan" mantra, but what would a plan in Iraq look like beyond what we are doing (this was asked to me tonight at a dinner party and I didn't have a response that made any points, I don't think. We had just watched Bill Maher on HBO and the conversation turned to politics...)

To wit.

Bush/Bremer are claiming that the "plan" is to bring democracy to Iraq and that we are on the process of doing that, first by the local councils around the country and the national council and ministers just appointed, then with the drafting of an Iraqi constitution, followed by national Iraqi elections.

During this timeframe, the US is training Iraqi police and military replacements to take over regular duties from the US and other troops in the country, and, at least attempting to provide security from the Baath party remnants and apparantly other anti-US groups now in Iraq from other countries.

After the security situation is resolved, the Iraqi elections held and a 'democractic' government sworn in under a new Iraqi constitution, our forces (at least the majority of them anyway), would turn over all control to the Iraqis and "go home".


So, given the above.

What part of a "plan" is missing?
What is the current leaders position on improving the 'plan'? For example, Dean has said we need to stay the course and involve more UN, but hasn't laid out anything beyond that to my knowledge, has he put forward a better plan that Bush/Bremer on Iraq?

I know Kucinich (who I like more and more after each debate), is just completely against us being in Iraq one more day. At least THAT I can understand and get behind, but the other candidates seem to just be just like Bush at this junction...

Anyway, long post, late-night dinner party and had a wee too much beer :) Would love to hear comments from the group..

[Resistance Is Futile]

1. Iraq plan

1) don't invade.
2) end of plan.

[paulsbc]

2. well

that was my point, but given we are already there....

that is one reason I like Kucinich at this point, his Iraq "plan" seems simple.

a) we had no business going to war
b) so get the fuck out.

can't get much better of a plan than that :)

[RC]

3. We can't just walk away

Total chaos would reign. Like that's not happening now.
We, meaning bu$h&co, invaded and trashed the place. Things are so bad over there that there needs to be a plan for a plan before anything else can be done.

The only option I can see is turning Iraq over to the UN and then leave 100%.

Then arrest and try bu$h&co for war crimes and crimes against humanity. After a fair trial, carry out the sentance.

[Jacobin]

4. Of course we can

We "just walked" (well we were run) out of Vietnam and it has been recovering nicely ever since.

There IS chaos there NOW. IT will be worse. They want us GONE.

More troops equals more repression equals more guerilla warfare.

Its gonna be a clusterfuck no matter how long or short we stay.

Invasion was a MASSIVE, IDIOTIC, STUPID, LAMEBRAINED idea, and staying longer will only make it worse.

[auburnlib]

8. we can't

We can't just leave. If you know anything about history you should take a look at the Congo. The Belgians picked up in the middle of the night and took off and look at the place today. What America needs to do (I know this is easier said than done) is to get tough with the forces that are still loyal to Saddam. Those who are running the war are treating the current situation like an out of control American city. What they need to realize is that this is still a war. Go on the offensive and use snipers at night, use the Iraqi police and let the citizens see this so they will begin to believe that Iraqis are getting control,and let the Iraqi police conduct public capital punishment of those who kill troops and Iraqis. Also, gradually shift control to the Iraqis on a quicker pace. However, while the post-war performance isn't exactly perfect, America is still in control. I recently read an article relating this to the Tet Offensive. While the United States ended up taking smashing that particular offensive, they quickly lost the image war at home. To win that, the government needs to start being more open and honest about the situation.

[Ms. Clio]

10. it's not just "forces who are still loyal to Saddam"

It's ordinary Iraqis who are fighting to kick out foreign occupiers of their country. Why do so many ignorant people seem to think that the Iraqis don't love their (5,000 year old) country at least as much as Americans do?

And public capital punishment??? That's just grotesque. What do you really think that would accomplish, except to prove to them and the world that the Gestapo has truly arrived? Oh, and good touch, turning it over to the Iraqi collaborators, that will really win hearts and minds. Maybe we could have some public amputations and beheadings while we're at it.

Jesus. I never cease to be amazed at the crap people spew here.

[sandnsea]

5. Do what with Saddam?

Do what with sanctions? Do what about the belief of every person who has ever had anything to do with Saddam that he would product bio/chem/nuclear weapons without the sanctions? This simplistic 'logic' just makes me want to throw up.

[aneerkoinos]

6. US plan for Iraq

is to privatize (=destroy) the economy and infrastructure of a former socialist country, especially oil, but also everything else to make Iraq dependent of US corporations, create a US dependent elite to rule the country a là Latin America, that can guarantee continued US military precense in a all-important geopolitical area. Then US military can "leave" and "democracy" can be established.

Of course this rule by proxy is something most Iraqis will not accept, even if it meant relative stability, so wellcome death squads and oppression, increasing armed recistance and more body bags of GI's. This plan will not work, they know it but stick to it anyhow because they are testosterene pumped morans and can't even imagine admitting they were wrong and must walk away without the goodies they went for.

I prefer the French plan.

[paulsbc]

7. no one?

else has any input? oh well..

[carpetbagger]

9. A plan.

1. Fire Rumsfeld, and replace him with John McCain, or better yet, Eric Shinsecki. Replace Wolfowitz and the rest of the wierdos in the DOD.

2. Make Paul Bremer go away. Give him a large toilet seat, a Burger King crown, and let him administer to the pigs on your ranch. Pull up some old face from your daddy's rolodex who might convince the world you're serious. Schwartzkopf? Eagleburger? Maybe get on your hands and knees and ask Zinni to bail you out.

3. Get on our hands and knees, go to the UN, say we were wrong, and ask for help. The world still likes us in spite of our actions. They'll come through.

4. Turn over daily function of the reconstruction to the UN.

5. Stop doing aggressive searches and sweeps that do nothing except piss regular Iraqi citizens off.

6. Announce local elections for December 1st.

7. On December 2nd, announce that the locally elected officials need to appoint a council, or just use the puppet council, and give them 30 days to draft a constitution for a federal republic. Make them include a bill of rights and universal sufferage, but let them do the rest.

8. Have the locally elected officials choose regional delegates to appoint an interim government. Screw Chalabi.

9. Screw Chalabi.

[Feanorcurufinwe]

11. Kerry Iraq Plan and How to Pay for it

John Kerry's Plan for Involving the UN and Providing Security in Iraq

“We need a United Nations resolution for a multinational force under U.S. command. Part of that is to turn the political, humanitarian and government component of this over to the United Nations. That is the fastest way to get additional countries invested. It is the best way to reduce the cost to the American people.”

-John Kerry on Face the Nation (September 14, 2003)

1. GET A UN RESOLUTION AUTHORIZING A MILITARY FORCE UNDER U.S. COMMAND

Kerry’s plan calls for working through the UN to create a multinational force under U.S. command and control. This will enable us to recruit participation from nations with the security-building capacity needed in Iraq. There is no peacekeeping situation in which the percentage of U.S. forces has ever been this high; we need to spread the risk and share the burden. The United States will always retain command and control over all forces. Under Kerry’s plan, we will not send any additional American troops to Iraq. Once the security situation stabilizes through the participation of additional international forces, there would be an increased potential for the U.S. to reduce its force level in Iraq – and bring some U.S. troops home.

2. PUT THE CREATION OF A NEW IRAQI GOVERNMENT AND THE RECONSTRUCTION OF IRAQ UNDER THE AUTHORITY OF THE UNITED NATIONS

This aspect of Kerry’s plan is key to getting a larger international military force, and greater participation and funding on the civilian side. In return, other nations must contribute a substantial share of the multi-billion dollar reconstruction bill. UN member nations would also be expected to contribute expertise in reconstruction tasks. Effective American diplomacy is needed to bring this about. Simply passing a UN resolution incorporating these points, while necessary, will not be sufficient. Achievement of these goals will require a major U.S. diplomatic effort to increase military and financial participation by others. Sadly, we had such support following September 11, but have squandered it by our unilateralist policy in Iraq.

3. TRANSFER AUTHORITY AND RESPONSIBILITY TO IRAQIS

Kerry’s plan calls for the UN to transfer control over governance to Iraqis as soon as reasonably feasible. In order to accomplish this, the UN would preside over the phased-in transfer of control over governmental functions to a representative body of Iraqis in accordance with an announced timeframe of benchmarks pegged to the Iraqis’ ability to assume greater governing responsibility. In this way, power could be transferred in phases to the Iraqis without the need to wait for completion of a constitution and general elections. The announced benchmarks would provide the Iraqis a clearer picture of their future by giving them an understanding of the steps they would need to take to assume control.

4. ACCELERATE EFFORTS TO TRAIN AND EQUIP IRAQI SECURITY FORCES

Kerry’s plan calls for expanding the training operation for Iraqi security forces by involving our allies to provide more classrooms, more trainers, and more on the job training. The actual number of trained, capable Iraqi security personnel is woefully inadequate. Our allies are well positioned to change this by serving as mentors to Iraqi police, civil defense and military forces, and providing interim security personnel while this process is ongoing. A key task of the UN is to develop a plan that provides a foundation for Iraqi security.

Paying for the Plan

FINANCE THE COSTS BY ROLLING BACK TAX CUTS FOR THE WEALTHIEST AMERICANS

Kerry believes that we should roll-back the Bush tax cuts for the wealthy in order to pay for our responsibilities in Iraq. John Kerry and Senator Joseph Biden have introduced an amendment in the United States Senate that would do just that -- pay for the cost of U.S. efforts in Iraq by reducing the tax cut for the wealthiest 1% of Americans. Further, under Kerry's Plan greater international funding participation should eventually reduce the cost to the American taxpayer.

WINNING THE BATTLE AT HOME

America’s military strength also depends on a strong U.S. economy. For the U.S. to afford to pay to build communities in Iraq, we need to put people back to work and improve our schools and health here at home. Senator Kerry has proposed a State Tax Relief and Education Fund that will give $30 billion to states to stop cuts in educations and health care. Instead of tax cuts aimed at the wealthy, Senator Kerry would take an additional $30 billion to invest in the American people with domestic programs to help the states provide services to our communities, to support education for our children, and to restore jobs eliminated over the past two and a half years during the Bush Administration’s job-destroying “recovery.”

http://www.johnkerry.com/issues/iraq_plan.html