Rove & Limbaugh must be delighted how well they are scamming Dem

[MoonRiver]

activists about Clark. It's really pathetic how so many on this board are hungrily falling for every slimy rumor and innuendo the bottom feeders throw out. Every day I feel less connected with party activism based on the their unholy alliance with the Puke hate mongers I'm witnessing here. I'm going to work like the dickens for a Clark candidacy, and then do the same for whoever wins the nomination. I hope its Clark but I won't throw a temper tantrum and help Rove shove * down our throats another 4 years if he doesn't.

All Fed Up

[Frances]

1. I think that most DUers will do the same

They'll work for their choice for the nominee and then work for the Dems whoever wins the nomination. After all, the alternative is Bush.

[NNN0LHI]

2. Quick. Get your Nomex suit on before the flames begin n/t

[MoonRiver]

3. I try to sleep in it, just in case.

Never thought I'd be watching Rove play Pied Piper to DU followers.

:-(

[NNN0LHI]

6. I suspected it would happen. And I was prepared. Others are too n/t

[peace4all]

22. What bothers me more than most of what's going

on in these forums, are people repeating "Karl Rove loves you doing his work for him" etc. etc. I feel that is an insult to most of our intelligence. Screw Karl Rove and I don't care what he thinks. I don't carry on discussions for his pleasure and I don't wonder "what will Rove think?" before I say something. That's my HO.

again, to hell with Rove

[RichV]

4. Not just about Clark

but about several of our candidates. Amazing how quickly DU picks up on smears about all the candidates from the left AND right.

[WillyBrandt]

5. Hear, Hear!

There's no end to the following stupidity at DU by sundry morans:

* "Hey, guys, I heard some Republican operative say that Clark likes to steal little kids' milk money. I don't know if this true, but I'm not sure if I could vote for him now! What do you think?"

* "I hear Clark is being pushed foward by Democratic President Bill Clinton and the Democratic National Committee, instead of the narrow DU clique I belong to, therefore he's not a REAL DEMOCRAT! Shit! Damn! Motherfucker!"

* "He might have voted for Reagan, so I'm sticking with a REAL Progressive, like Dean. No, Dean CAN get elected, since he's not a Progressive (he's not an 'A' rating from the NRA)."

* "Sure he has a great chance of beating Bush, but he's a Republican plant that will futher the Republican cause by giving Democrats power!"

* "How arrogant can this guy be, running for President? I'm voting for one of the other people running for President!"

[seamarq]

8. What happened to the "inclusive" Democratic Partry

We used to welcome people that join the Democratic Party. This site is certainly an embarrassment sometimes. I am truly amazed at how many people on here have taken it upon themselves to determine who is a "real" Democrat.

[MoonRiver]

11. ROFLMAO!

Good one! I'm laughing so hard I'm (almost) crying, which may be an appropriate response, considering the madness going on here.

:crazy:

[Pepperbelly]

7. it took me completely by surprise but ...

I have been here for years and have tried hard to contribute positive notions on the board and the hostility and viciousness floored me but not so much as seeing right wing links used to prove points. By now, of course, as happens in the Grand Wurlitizer, those rightie links are being sanitized by the echo chamber but that is where they are starting.

And Counterpunch.

Strange days indeed.

[jumptheshadow]

9. Let's make a distinction

Let's distinguish between the thoughtful questions that will be asked by any good voter and the ideological or candidate based flaming and scamming. They will be throwing a lot more of this garbage in our direction. We will need to develop a patient and organized response to it.

[coralrf]

13. Good idea...but........

there are few folks asking thoughtful questions and less folks interested in hearing the answers. Rove is no fool when he works at total message control. He knows that it is all that meters in today’s TV addicted semi-literate America. We may not like the fact that such is the battle field but it is what we must fight on. Win the war and you can change it.

Win the war and you can get back to real educational programs as educated folks tend to vote Dem. Rove knows that. Win the war and you fight abuse in Corporate circles as that abuse is the foundation of GOP wealth. Rove knows that. Win the war and you can bust up the media giants and attack those that are robbing the American people of the right to informed consent. Rove knows that. Win the war and out goes Ashcroft, ANWR, unnecessary wars and "The Ugly American" image that Rove so loves. Win the war and in comes Delay to face inquiry about his shady money deals. In comes Ken Lay to face a real threat. In comes Chaney to answer questions for the first time and out goes the National Security camouflage he put on thousands of pages of corrupt policy decisions. ETC, ETC, ETC...

You will not win taking down Democrats. That is common sense.

edit for Gram error

[jumptheshadow]

23. Nice post

Well stated.

[peace4all]

24. what's the sense in pleading

with real DUers about doing Rove's work when it's not them but mostly real live trolls? I wish people would start making the distinction and stop accusing DUers of being Rove puppets. Sincere DUers ask sincere and legitimate questions.
Did any one ever stop to think that by not making the distinction between trolls and sincere Dems they could be doing Rove's work as well? It's the same with not making the distinction between "bashing" and asking honest questions.


ed, clarity

[coralrf]

10. Saywhat.....thank you!

It is enormously disenchanting to see these "enlightened" posts on DU.

Take for instance the totally lame "Clark waffled" on the war. It is critical to Rove and Limbaugh that Clark's military history be bruised right now. Bush has nothing but a shameful military past consisting of combat dodging, use of political pull, AWOL and being grounded as an F102 pilot. Clark has medals, victories and unlike Shrub who failed to get Ossama, Saddam or Omar, Clark has Milosevic on trial in the Hague.

For an excellent article on anti-Clark crap read TPM's essay on the "waffling" found at:

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/sept0303.html#092003302am

Hey DU'ers do yourself a favor. Read the damn resolution that you call a "resolution to go to war". It was anything but that. Rove has you kissing his ass on that issue and it will cost us in the future.

And try this concept out for size. As you gain more info on an issue you may change your ideas about it. The value in having a human being rather than an issue programmed automaton is in just that human character, the ability to reflect and change. Pundits call that waffling and they do a great disservice to the USA when they do it. Sure there are examples of gross reneging on prior commitments, Bush is commander in chief of that lot, but to manipulate a good democratic candidates intentions is foolish.

In the end, in 2004, only one Democrat will face down Bush. Rove will use anything he can to win. One of his and certainly Limbaugh’s most potent weapons will be "Even the Democrats say their man is a waffler, a war monger a whatever..." They WILL DO THAT!!!. And it will be effective.

[MoonRiver]

14. And the wingnuts are already using lib sources to trash Clark.

Like little patsies Dems are putting ammunition in the hands of our #1 and only political enemies. Another board I go to is predominantly rightwingers. They have been blasting away at Clark using Counterpunch, Democracy Now, as well as their dear Limbaugh. They spin that libs are verifying Limbaugh's crap. Of course the wingnuts ignore everything good written about Clark, or especially anything debunking their lies. I expect that from them. I'm shocked to see the same behavior from Dems.

[coralrf]

15. Wing nut is a Wing nut....

and there is no changing that. You cannot make a dog recite poetry and you are not going to enlighten a wing nut. I do not bother with them. I do think effort aimed at Democratic "Suicide Prevention" a worthy cause and I do hope others will help.

[gulliver]

12. Great post ...

... and absolutely right in my opinion. Republicans will do whatever it takes not to face Clark in '04. They know Bush will not only lose to Clark, but Clark could shift the entire political balance of the country.

Wouldn't it be nice if, for a change, Dems would take innuendo against their candidates with a grain of salt?

[jonnyblitz]

16. insulting the intelligence of people who have legitimate concerns and

who just want to find out what is what without your shrill voices screeching in our ear that we are agents of Rove and Limbaugh, as you Clark supporters INSIST on doing, is getting old...I am ex-military and I find it refreshing that an ex-army general such as Clark is as progressive as he is and I would probably have no problem voting for him if he is chosen, but that will be IN SPITE of SOME his supporters on here...

[Pepperbelly]

17. But does ...

it not dismay you to see Newsmax and Drudge links used to bash a Democratic candidate at the Democratic Undergroud? And does it not dismay you that the originals have now been cleansed ala' the echo chamber now and their original gop origin is now obscured?

It dismays me a LOT.

[coralrf]

19. As all of our mothers used to say:

Consider the source and ignore it! Links to Newsmax are not credible.

The seeping of RNC talking points into the flow of this board is disconcerting. Sure the RNC scum will encourage it but for us to be susceptible to it? Makes you feel a little low does it not?

[QC]

21. I even saw Frontpage Magazine, the David Horowitz mouthpiece,

cited here yesterday as a source for an anti-Clark post.

Talk about going through the looking glass....

[coralrf]

18. You have missed the point....

What is being said here and missed by you is that the crap on DU is false. Dems are running with RNC lies and what we have asked these enlightened folks to do is check out what they are saying BEFORE they say it. Rove hates that.

AS for ex-military: so am I, a well decorated Viet Nam veteran at that. It means absolutely nothing my man. No one owes you a thing for that.

You are entitled to your opinion and to support any candidate you like and NO ONE in here ever said you were not. What we did say is if you want to jam ours do it accurately and factually or expect to get jammed back.

[seamarq]

20. I have no problem with people that have legitimate questions....

however, I do have problems with people that constantly cite rumors and right wing propaganda as fact regarding any of the candidates. BTW, Clark has NO corner on shrill supporters on this site! You are being disingenuous to assert that.

[mitchtv]

25. I am disgusted with these so called Dems

they are getting no examples from kerry and Dean and leiberman, and the rest. the only ones with clean hands are Braun and sharpton