I'm trying to maintain a policy of not responding to Clark flamers.

[MoonRiver]

What's the point. Everytime we react it fans their flames up to the top of the woodpile and draws more attention to them. That's their strategy, IMO. Incite anger and spread the negative spins. I don't know where a lot of these people are coming from, but I do know that ignoring bad behavior often helps when small children throw temper tantrums. It's worth a try.

:argh:

[joeybee12]

1. Some of the posts are bashers

However, if someone simply links an article from the mainstream press that is critical of Clark, how would you respond?

[MoonRiver]

4. I'd read the article and if it looked legit I might respond.

There's a difference between debate and flaming. I didn't know what it was before coming to this board, but now I do.

[Pepperbelly]

5. the real problem with that is ...

that with the echo-chamber effect in play, where something runs on Newsmax or Drudge and then gets sanatized through less controversial organs like Washington Times or Pittsburgh Post-Gazette or Fox News, it can and is picked up by the wires and there is no telling where it will show up. In addition, even with a mainstream link, the original source is often one of the disreputable right wing smear sites.

[w4rma]

2. Not reponding to Dean flamers doesn't work, IMHO.

Therefore, not responding to Clark flamers won't either.

[Name removed]

3. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[joeybee12]

6. Yes, most are centrists...

...however, I think the similarity with the DLC ends there.

The real problem I have with the DLC is that they seem determined to lose elections! The Dems leadership (not simply the DLC) has bent over and taken it for so long that they don't know how to do anything else!

The anger at some is not over their policies, but their lethargy and lack of spine.

[Bertrand]

7. I agree with you

The main reason for Deans support is that he read the tealeaves right on how to build a populist campaign from nothing.

[joeybee12]

8. Yup!

And the more some candidates get endorsements from fellow Washington insiders, the less I like them.

I really think there's a lot of anger that's been building for a while, and this is the year for an outsider. I don't think the DLC or the Dem leadership gets this--in many ways they're like a big corporation that never gets anything done beacuse there's so much red tape and too many people to please.

[kstewart33]

9. You could be right

But my main concern with the Deaners is that in their enthusiasm for Dean, they've become incapable or unwilling to address the issue of electability which is the major problem I have with Dean, other than his anger schtick which drives me crazy.

The new Newsweek poll spoke volumes on this point. Dean gets plastered by Bush compared to the other major contenders. Absolutely plastered.

[Bertrand]

10. I dont think Dean gets plastered

although 14% is a pretty big, there is always time to make up for it (especially with the way Bush is handling his re-election campaign)

I dont think Dean is a cancer in the General Election, but i think he would have a very hard time defeating the Bush Machine in comparison to some of the other candidates.

[TreasonousBastard]

13. Dean is a populist...

and a damn good one.

But, anyone putting their faith in populist candidates might ask howcum we never had a President William Jennings Bryan.

Winning elections is not just about the message. It's about winning elections, and, as a battle-scarred ward-heeler once said-- "That's just about the only real adult game in town."

[TorchTheWitch]

11. I agree

that there's probably a lot of built up anger, but debating and bashing are two entirely separate things. All this bashing of this or that candidate is counterproductive... most of us support a particular candidate, but these bashers are plain stupid using Repug tactics to keep their favorite in the game.

Do you honestly believe that no Repugs come to this site? The bashers are just fueling the Repug's fire for them. Anyone who is willing to use these Repug tactics to bash a candidate should just hang it up and go friggin' vote Republican because they're taking up a lot of personal time to help out the Shrub.

The entire objective here is to beat Bush. PERIOD! These bashers willing to spend so much of their personal time helping out the GOP has no business being here.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

15. What 's Wrong With Being A Centrist?

I am a centrist that leans left and votes consistently Democratic....

I want to fix our system, not junk it and build a new one...

[Bertrand]

14. Why was this message removed????

i didnt attack anyone. What rule did i violate? Whichever mod deleted this, reply and explain.

[salin]

12. I invite all bashers and those fed up with bashers

to participate in my little challenge thread - to try to get folks to see and say something positive about a candidate they do not support; or about their choice candidate for bashing.

If we have to keep reading the bashes, it would be nice to read just a single affirmative statement. It would be helpful for those who do the bash (including Clark supporters who indulge in the Dean bashing), to take a moment and reflect on how the supporters of that candidate view that candidate. Its called bringing a tad of perspective back to the whole thing.

added link: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=379692

[Zero Division]

16. Part of the problem I see is a complete unwillingness on the part of some

Clark bashers to engage in any sort of dialogue with those who offer a defense against the negative claims about Clark.

It seems like hatred of Clark has become a sort of litmus test for some who see themselves as part of an embattled "real left" fighting against more conservative Democrats. IMO, it seems like these people think that you can't be a part of the "real left" unless you hate Clark and refuse to give any consideration to the rebuttals against the negative things which have been said about Clark.

It's like some ugly flipside of Al From's stupid "if you don't oppose Dean, you're an out-of-touch liberal elitist" sentiment.

And please note that I'm only talking about some of those who see themselves as this "real left". Not everyone who shares many of the same concerns and sentiments with those who might be regarded as "farther left" has these same opinions about Clark.

Unfortunately there are some Clark supporters who feed this phenomenon by simply smearing those who criticize Clark as "extremist leftists", instead of simply providing counter arguments against the attacks on Clark.

[sandnsea]

17. It doesn't work

I also thought it would stop if it was ignored. I try to stay out of the obvious flame bait bullshit. But if it's strictly policy, you have to dig in and stand firm sooner or later. Your candidate will be mowed over if you don't. So just put on your flame retardent suit and jump in!