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Kevin Spidel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-13-05 09:56 AM
Original message
More British Documents Leaked
Breaking News Later Today From RawStory.com

Evidence / From After Downing Street Dot Org

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

BREAKING NEWS

Later today RawStory.com <1> will be posting an article that they have been researching for several days. Six new secret British documents have been leaked and made widely available on the internet, including via the links below. These were retyped from the originals to protect the source, but RawStory.com <2> has verified the authenticity and will be reporting on that research, on the significance of the documents, and on the timeline of the events illuminated by this information, known to the British media but new on this side of the pond.



• "Iraq Options Paper," UK Overseas and Defense Secretariat, March 8, 2002

The greater investment of Western forces, the greater our control over Iraq's future, but the greater the cost and the longer we would need to stay. The only certain means to remove Saddam and his elite is to invade and impose a new government, but this could involve nation building over many years. Even a representative government could seek to acquire WMD and build-up its conventional forces, so long as Iran and Israel retain their WMD and conventional armouries and there was no acceptable solution to the Palestinian grievances.

SIGNIFICANCE: UK government anticipated "nation building over many years," in contradiction to public case by Bush administration. British also believed Iraq might acquire WMD without Saddam Hussein in power.

We have looked at three options for regime change...

OPTION 3: A GROUND CAMPAIGN

The aim would be to launch a full-scale ground offensive... A pro-Western regime would be installed... The optimal times to start action are early spring.

SIGNIFICANCE: Timing of invasion already set in March 2002. Aim is not an Iraq which can democratically choose its policies, but a "pro-Western regime."

Most Iraqis see the INC/INA as Western stooges.

SIGNIFICANCE: The head of the INC (Iraqi National Congress) was Ahmed Chalabi; Chalabi is now acting Oil Minister of Iraq. The head of the INA (Iraqi National Accord) was Ayad Allawi; Allawi was Prime Minister of the Iraqi Interim government from June 1, 2004-April 7, 2005.

http://www.afterdowningstreet.org/downloads/ods020308.pdf <3>

• "Iraq: Legal Background," UK Foreign and Commonwealth Office, March 8, 2002

The US... maintain that the assessment of breach is for individual member States. We are not aware of any other State which supports this view.

SIGNIFICANCE: Bush administration's interpretation of international law, which eventually invoked for the invasion, was so bizarre it was not shared by any other nation on earth (including UK).

http://www.afterdowningstreet.org/downloads/fcolegal020308.pdf <4>

• Memo from David Manning (Foreign Policy Advisor to Blair) to Blair on Manning's Dinner with Condoleezza Rice, March 14, 2002

I said you would not budge in your support for regime change but you had to manage a press, a Parliament and a public opinion... Condi's enthusiasm for regime change is undimmed.... Bush has yet to find the answers to the big questions:... what happens on the morning after?

SIGNIFICANCE: Aim was always regime change. Bush had no plan for future of Iraq.

http://www.afterdowningstreet.org/downloads/manning020314.pdf <5>

• Memo from Christopher Meyer (UK Ambassador to US) to David Manning on Meyer's lunch with Wolfowitz, March 18, 2002

"On Iraq I opened by sticking very closely to the script that you used with Condi Rice last week. We backed regime change, but the plan had to be clever and failure was not an option. It would be a tough sell for us domestically, and probably tougher elsewhere in Europe. The US could go it alone if it wanted to. But if it wanted to act with partners, there had to be a strategy for building support for military action against Saddam. I then went through the need to wrongfoot Saddam on the inspectors and the UN SCRs and the critical importance of the MEPP as an integral part of the anti-Saddam strategy. If all this could be accomplished skillfully, we were fairly confident that a number of countries would come on board."

SIGNIFICANCE: UN process was a sham for Blair's sake; aim was not disarmament but regime change, which had already been decided on.

http://www.afterdowningstreet.org/downloads/meyer020318.pdf <6>

• Memo from Peter Ricketts (Political Director, UK Foreign and Commonwealth Office) to Jack Straw (UK Foreign Secretary), March 22, 2002

For Iraq, "regime change" does not stack up. It sounds like a grudge between Bush and Saddam. Much better, as you have suggested, to make the objective ending the threat to the international community from Iraqi WMD...

SIGNIFICANCE: Aim was regime change, but that wouldn't sell; WMD issue was useful for PR reasons.

US scrambling to establish a link between Iraq and Al aida is so far frankly unconvincing.

SIGNIFICANCE: Even UK government at the highest levels believed the Bush administration claims of an Iraq-Al Qaida links were false.

http://www.afterdowningstreet.org/downloads/ricketts020322.pdf <7>

• Memo from Jack Straw to Blair, March 25, 2002

We have also to answer the big question—what will this action achieve?... has satisfactorily answered how that regime change is to be secured, and how there can be any certainty that the replacement regime will be better.

SIGNIFICANCE: UK government at its highest levels did not believe the US had any plan to be certain a new Iraqi government would be an improvement on Saddam and would not develop WMD.

http://www.afterdowningstreet.org/downloads/straw020325.pdf <8>


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
This article is from After Downing Street Dot Org
http://www.afterdowningstreet.org/

The URL for this story is:
http://www.afterdowningstreet.org/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=205

Links in this article
<1> http://www.rawstory.com
<2> http://www.rawstory.com/
<3> http://www.afterdowningstreet.org/downloads/ods020308.pdf
<4> http://www.afterdowningstreet.org/downloads/fcolegal020308.pdf
<5> http://www.afterdowningstreet.org/downloads/manning020314.pdf
<6> http://www.afterdowningstreet.org/downloads/meyer020318.pdf
<7> http://www.afterdowningstreet.org/downloads/ricketts020322.pdf
<8> http://www.afterdowningstreet.org/downloads/straw020325.pdf
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ck4829 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-13-05 10:02 AM
Response to Original message
1. Kick'd and Rec'd
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AuntiBush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-13-05 10:09 AM
Response to Original message
2. Kicked - Will Check back later for Report. W.O.W.
How can anyone question the validity of Parlimentary documents is beyond me. This is explosive-stuff.

Kicked for afternoon and night crowd.
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Coexist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-13-05 10:10 AM
Response to Original message
3. kick
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Fight_n_back Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-13-05 10:15 AM
Response to Original message
4. So how does a presidential candidate say "I Told You So"
without maiking it sound like he is saying "I told you so"
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LightningFlash Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-13-05 10:18 AM
Response to Original message
5. This is real eye opening...
Recommended and sent to media.
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rocktivity Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-13-05 10:19 AM
Response to Original message
6. I don't know how "D-OH!" sounds with a British accent, but
Edited on Mon Jun-13-05 11:00 AM by rocknation
maybe the Bush Empire and the MSM should have left well enough alone. They should have considered that their talk of the DSM being impossible to authenticate just MIGHT result in the leaking of additional documents. And as Sante and Kenneth Kimes found out, circumstantial evidence can look as damning as direct evidence when there's enough of it.

:headbang:
rocknation

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AuntiBush Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-13-05 10:28 AM
Response to Reply #6
9. Don't give Rove any idea... :)
Me thinks it's a bit too late for that "and" here's betting there is more to come, if not already there.

Whomever D-T2 is, I thank him/her/them.
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in_cog_ni_to Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-13-05 10:23 AM
Response to Original message
7. I-M-P-E-A-C-H-M-E-N-T
is in our future. They cannot possibly get out of this. They're toast. IMCPO

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sellitman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-13-05 10:34 AM
Response to Reply #7
10. Maybe Blair is toast but...
The Pukes just love junior. The House is the only one who could start impeachment proceedings and with that group their ain't a snowballs chance in hell.

IMHO
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in_cog_ni_to Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-13-05 10:41 AM
Response to Reply #10
11. We'll see. People loved Nixon too.
Edited on Mon Jun-13-05 10:42 AM by in_cog_ni_to
This is going to be VERY difficult to cover-up and if Tony goes down....the chimp and his cohorts ain't far behind. 2006 elections are hanging over the Congresspeople's heads AND the repukes have started rumbling about Iraq along with the Democrats. How much shit are they willing to swallow for this regime? Enough to lose their precious House seats? :shrug: We'll see. :) I have a REALLY good feeling about this.

Pray for a Deep Throat 2 in the US MSM.
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DoYouEverWonder Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-13-05 10:24 AM
Response to Original message
8. Downing Street is leaking like a sieve
Blair must be trying to save his retched soul?

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kimpossible Donating Member (785 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-13-05 10:49 AM
Response to Reply #8
12. No wonder, after the snub Shrub just gave him
No joy for Blair on global warming? No joy for Blair on aid to Africa? Then no joy from Blair on keeping skeletons in closets!
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rocktivity Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-13-05 11:06 AM
Response to Reply #12
14. Holy shite! (I believe that's the eurpoean spelling)
Edited on Mon Jun-13-05 11:08 AM by rocknation
I've heard of cutting off your nose to spite your face. But if Blair, rather than some British Deep Throat, is responsible for these additional leaks, he's cutting off his entire head! Has he decided that he's doomed politically and figures the least he can do is take Gerogie down, too???? That Bersceloni guy in Italy, who demanded the report about that hostage shooting be lightened up, must be getting a little nervous, too.

:headbang:
rocknation
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LightningFlash Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-13-05 11:07 AM
Response to Reply #8
15. Tony Blair and Pat Robertson have no soul left.
They were NEOCONNED long ago by religious extremism and my god....It has become a disease that literally cooked our country.
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helderheid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-13-05 10:52 AM
Response to Original message
13. Thanks Kevin - favor?
Would you let PDA know that the London Times is asking for comments on the lack of media in the US on this issue?

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,564-1649071,00.html

Finally a place our voices WILL be heard!
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Kevin Spidel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-13-05 11:10 AM
Response to Reply #13
16. emailing the AfterDowningStreet Coalition
about this link.. thx!
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Nothing Without Hope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-13-05 11:41 AM
Response to Original message
17. Another piece: READ THIS MAY 1 EXPOSÉ ABOUT THE U.K. ATT'Y GENERAL
Edited on Mon Jun-13-05 12:17 PM by Nothing Without Hope
Revealed in the The Guardian (U.K.), it tells how the top lawyers of the Bush Administration strongarmed the UK attorney general and, in a series of high-pressure meetings, bullied him into agreeing that an Iraq invasion would be legal. These meetings took place in February 2003, the same month as Colin Powell's fraudulent speech before the UN. By that time, the top Bush Admin lawyers had long perfected their arguments for the war's legality and they subjected Lord Goldsmith to a bullying barrage in a series of "gruelling" meetings with five powerful lawyers of the Bush Administration. He had been sent to Washington by Jack Straw to "put some steel in his spine." The decision had already been made to invade - not that they told HIM that - and they and Blair wanted his statement as the top UK lawyer as an additional gloss on their cover story that the invasion was both legal and justified.

To me, the story of what happened to Lord Goldsmith is not only a step in crafting this whole mountain of lies and moral corruption. Here is a man who had doubts about the legality of the invasion even after all the pressure that was brought to bear on him in the UK - and the US bullies brought him to his knees. Even people who mean well, who aren't criminals, can have their consciences overwhelmed by the massed attack of these criminal bullies.

The story also reveals the special usefulness of Bush's pet torture-justifier, Mr. "The Geneva Conventions are quaint" Gonzales. How shameful that he is the top lawyer in our corrupted government. We must REMEMBER who voted for him and hold them accountable.

To put all this into context, here's a site with an excellent timeline for the unfolding of the Iraq War:
http://www.iraqtimeline.com

What the DSM and newly leaked documents reveal suggests that the Administration lawyers who bullied Lord Goldsmith as well as their bosses are complicit.

Here is the thread where this was posted at DU on May 1:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=132x1755978

Here are excerpts from the article:

http://observer.guardian.co.uk/politics/story/0,6903,1474190,00.html

Iraq, the secret US visit, and an angry military chief


The legality of the Iraq war exploded on to the agenda last week, causing chaos to Labour strategy. Here we reveal the key US officials who persuaded Britain that invasion was legal - and the astonishing reaction from our military chiefs
Antony Barnett, Gaby Hinsliff and Martin Bright
Sunday May 1, 2005
The Observer

(snip)

… The Observer can reveal that this great-grandson of a former Republican president {William Taft IV, U.S. State Dept.} played a critical role in persuading Goldsmith {Lord Goldsmith, the UK Attorney General} that the war against Iraq was legal. Taft was one of five powerful lawyers in the Bush administration who met the Attorney General in Washington in February 2003 to push their view that a second UN resolution was superfluous.

Goldsmith, who had been expressing doubts about the legality of any proposed war, was sent to Washington by the Foreign Secretary, Jack Straw, to 'put some steel in his spine', as one official has said.

On 11 February, Goldsmith met Taft, a former US ambassador to NATO who was then chief legal adviser to the Secretary of State, Colin Powell. After a gruelling 90-minute meeting in Taft's conference room 6419, Goldsmith then met the US Attorney General, John Ashcroft, followed by a formidable triumvirate including Judge Al Gonzales, Bush's chief lawyer at the White House.

Goldsmith also met William 'Jim' Haynes, who is Defence Secretary's Donald Rumsfeld's chief legal adviser, and John Bellinger, legal adviser to Condoleezza Rice, then the National Security Adviser. This group of lawyers is as renowned for fearsome intellect as it is for hard-line conservative politics. Bellinger is alleged to have said: 'We had trouble with your Attorney; we got there eventually.' From copies of Goldsmith's legal advice to the Prime Minister published last week, it is clear that these meetings had a pivotal role in shaping Goldsmith's view that there was a 'reasonable case' for war.

(snip)


I find myself pitying Lord Goldsmith in a way. His moral compass was functioning, but first the people in his own government and then those in the Bush administration focused all their powers of lying and logic-twisting on him. For them, the end they desired justified any means they chose. For him, an ethical sense was there, was initially troubled, and was finally snuffed out by sheer bullying and lies and force of personality as he was confronted by one aggressive neocon lawyer after another. These people were fully prepared with a battery of deceptions and twists for any ethical doubts. They knew that what they were doing flouted all law and morality, and they had arguments and falsified documentation ready for people who still might harbor such quaint notions. Such bullies are so very useful to the Bush administration; it's a major reason why they want Bolton in the UN.

To me this incident is a microcosm of what must happen again and again in the subverting of moral people in the government and elsewhere to the service of the neocons. It is ugly, perverse, and tragic. And in the case of Lord Goldsmith, who was acting in a sense as the legal conscience of the UK in this, it had consequences that are still unfolding.

I don't imagine Lord Goldsmith sleeps very comfortably these days. But human maggots like Gonzales - and of course his leash-holder, Bush - do.

ed:typos
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Nothing Without Hope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-13-05 12:19 PM
Response to Original message
18. Major kick! n/t
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Nothing Without Hope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-13-05 12:59 PM
Response to Original message
19. Keith Olbermann will be talking again about the DSM tonight
and mentioning the info in the Sunday Times. And we need to send him this NEW information too.

Keith's email: KOlbermann@msnbc.com

From his emailed newsletter today:

Just as the U.S. media -- albeit a month late -- scramble to get on top of the so-called "Downing Street Memo," the Sunday Times in London unveiled another leaked document which confirms and goes behind the message of the memo. Meanwhile, Walter Pincus of the Washington Post has a related, front-page report on Sunday. "Ministers were warned in July 2002 that Britain was committed to taking part in an American-led invasion of Iraq and they had no choice but to find a way of making it legal," the Sunday Times reports. http://www.editorandpublisher.com/eandp/news/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1000955273

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Nothing Without Hope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-13-05 01:00 PM
Response to Original message
20. Keith Olbermann will be discussing the DSM again in tonight's show
and mentioning the info in the Sunday Times. And we need to send him this NEW information too.

Keith's email: KOlbermann@msnbc.com

His show is live at 8 PM ET.

From his emailed newsletter today:

Just as the U.S. media -- albeit a month late -- scramble to get on top of the so-called "Downing Street Memo," the Sunday Times in London unveiled another leaked document which confirms and goes behind the message of the memo. Meanwhile, Walter Pincus of the Washington Post has a related, front-page report on Sunday. "Ministers were warned in July 2002 that Britain was committed to taking part in an American-led invasion of Iraq and they had no choice but to find a way of making it legal," the Sunday Times reports. http://www.editorandpublisher.com/eandp/news/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1000955273

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Just Me Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-13-05 01:12 PM
Response to Original message
21. These are the ones previously released and authenticated in the UK?
Is that correct?
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evermind Donating Member (833 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-13-05 02:13 PM
Response to Reply #21
24. They are the ones we've been discussing here since Jun 8th
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Spazito Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-13-05 01:45 PM
Response to Original message
22. Kick
:kick:
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Nothing Without Hope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-13-05 01:55 PM
Response to Original message
23. Transcripts are now up at Raw Story - how have they been authenticated?
I've just emailed Keith Olbermann about this development, but I'm sure he won't speak about them wiithout knowing more about their authencity.
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Nothing Without Hope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-13-05 02:31 PM
Response to Reply #23
25. Okay I can partially answer this myself:
from AfterDowningStreet.org:

http://www.afterdowningstreet.org/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=205
BREAKING NEWS

Later today RawStory.com will be posting an article that they have been researching for several days. Six new secret British documents have been leaked and made widely available on the internet, including via the links below. These were retyped from the originals to protect the source, but RawStory.com has verified the authenticity and will be reporting on that research, on the significance of the documents, and on the timeline of the events illuminated by this information, known to the British media but new on this side of the pond.

Last week we were made aware of additional leaked documents regarding the Iraq war. While some of these documents were posted online at various Web sites, we wanted to be certain on the chain of custody. The documents in question are transcribed from the originals and then copied. We wanted to be sure that what we would be posting and distributing to the coalition members was authenticated fully. As we are an advocacy group, we asked Larisa Alexandrovna of Raw Story to take the information and investigate it. We agreed that the coalition would act responsibly in this matter and wait on the facts to drive the advocacy, not the advocacy to push the facts.

The Raw Story article is scheduled to run later today at which point we would have released the documents along with the article. This morning, several prominent Web sites posted the documents, thereby creating some confusion. Raw Story also posted the documents in order to help keep the focus on the context that is forthcoming. We ask that you act responsibly in distributing the documents. When the Raw Story article goes out today, the documents that are now posted will have context. The documents on Raw Story and here at ADS are the ones that the chain of custody was established for. We cannot speak to other documents circulating on the Web. Please be ready to distribute the article and documents when we post the article later today. We apologize for the confusion.

(snip)


The Raw Story site's banner on this currently says that the "narrative" will be put up "late tonight." From what is said in this ADS.org excerpt, it will include the research done on the authenticity. Let's hope the case is strong enough to convince people like Keith Olbermann and the few other corporate reporters who have been covering the DSM.

We will have to be cautious about other copies of documents that are appaently circulating around the web.
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lala_rawraw Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-13-05 05:12 PM
Response to Reply #25
26. this might help too
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Nothing Without Hope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jun-13-05 07:16 PM
Response to Reply #26
27. OUTSTANDING, Lara, Thanks! This needs to be added to Feb 2003:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x3847225
Thread title: "This May 1 EXPOSÉ ABOUT THE U.K. ATT'Y GENERAL complements the DSM:"

This May 1 Guardian/Observer article is not to be missed. Lord Goldsmith was shipped to the US and put through "gruelling" meetings with 5 top Bush Admin lawyers - and came out the other end saying that the invasion would be legal. This was in Feb 2003 and is a key part of the timeline.

I've posted on this previously (back on May 1 when it first came out) but it never really picked up the interest that I think it deserves. Even now it hasn't attracted much attention.

The lineup of Bush lawyers who took Lord Goldsmith in hand with their practiced lies and bullying is quite a collection of sterling characters.

There is also this Iraq timeline site, in case you didn't already know about it:
http://www.iraqtimeline.com
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