Man, the sun is brutal anymore.,

[fighttotheend]

I was in the sun yesterday for an 1 1/2 hrs. and I got so sun burned I mean I can feel the heat coming off my skin, it is red, it hurts I feel like I've been cooking on someone's grill. The sun is just so strong anymore its scary. I live in PA and for a couple of weeks its been hot, we've had high temps before but this sun is slowly cooking all of us, (like if I was in an oven) I am thinking it has something OZONE layer, as it was our shield against the sun's deadly rays and now it's being destroyed. Soon we are all going to need our own little device that when we go outside, we turn on our own little protective shield, I hope someone invents one soon!

But anyway today --I opened my email and NRDC is starting a virtual global warming march which sounds good to me I am concerned about all environmental problems and we need to start caring about all of them so I joined I thought some of you would be interested aswell! We have so many things we need to change,-- Here's what my email said:


Global warming is fast becoming the number one environmental problem of our
time. Apart from its far-reaching impacts on people, global warming may prove
disastrous to the wildlife of Greater Yellowstone, the Arctic National Wildlife
Refuge and other vulnerable BioGems that are already suffering the effects of a
changing climate.

Today, we're asking you to take an important step in our campaign by joining
the "Stop Global Warming Virtual March on Washington." This unprecedented
Internet effort is led by Robert F. Kennedy, Jr., Senator John McCain, NRDC
trustee Laurie David and other environmental leaders.

Please go to http://www.stopglobalwarming.org/campaigns/sgw/partner/nrdc/
to join this historic march, and invite your family and friends to do the same.
Together, we will demand that Congress and the Bush administration take the
necessary and long overdue steps to reverse potentially catastrophic changes in
the Earth's climate.

The Virtual March on Washington will move across the United States via the
Internet from one town to the next, educating people about the impacts global
warming is already having on our environment, and highlighting personal stories
along the way. Through an interactive map, you can track the progress of the
march in real time as more and more people join.

The world's leading scientists now agree that global warming is real and is
happening right now. According to their forecasts, extreme changes in climate
could produce a future in which erratic and chaotic weather, melting ice caps
and rising sea levels usher in an era of drought, crop failure, famine, flood
and mass extinctions.

The good news is, we have the technology to avert such a catastrophic future.
All that's lacking is the political will in Washington.

That's why we're asking you to march with us -- and enlist others to join -- so
that our growing numbers will help light a fire under Congress and the White
House.

Please go to http://www.stopglobalwarming.org/campaigns/sgw/partner/nrdc/
and make your own commitment to stop global warming. Our grandchildren will
thank us for taking this momentous step in the right direction.

[Kraklen]

1. Everybody understands the difference...

between the ozone hole and global warming, right? I mean, it's important to get our science right.

[Toots]

14. What in your opinion is the difference?

I realize there are many factors at work here and the loss of ozone being only one factor but it plays a huge role in Climate Change. It is the destruction of the ozone ( a protective barrier from suns harmful rays) that has been named as major contributor to Global Warming.

[fighttotheend]

18. HERE, HERE well said!!!

[Kraklen]

20. Oh, for crying out loud.

No, the ozone hole has not been named as a major contributor to global warming by anybody with any credibility.

They're two completely different phenomenon.

The ozone hole, which occurs sporadically over Antarctica, is due to the degradation of the ozone layer due to man made radical initiators such as chlorofluorocarbons. It causes an increase in UV radiation under those areas affected, resulting in problems typically involved with U.V. exposure- cancers, mutations, etc.

Global warming is caused by the release of greenhouse gases, mostly CO2. These gases absorb infrared radiation, a completely different part of the spectrum from UV, which translates into heat. The long term build up of these gases results in generally warmer climate.

Just because they both involve pollutants and they both involve the atmosphere, doesn't mean they have anything to do with each other.

That's kind of like saying that the rising sea levels are caused by seabirds getting caught in plastic six-pack rings.

[Igel]

27. "HERE, HERE well said!!!"

(Sorry, it all but cried out for snarkiness.)

[fighttotheend]

29. The Science of Ozone Depletion

http://www.epa.gov/ozone/


Ozone depletion is the result of a complex set of circumstances and chemistry. This page has links to articles that give overviews or broad information, shorter pieces that focus on specific aspects of ozone depletion, images and animations of ozone levels and ozone depletion, and international organizations that issue regular updates.

Please note that this site is intended only to provide general information about the science of ozone depletion. Therefore, it is written without detailed citations of original research. If you need such references, please see either the answers to frequently asked questions, by Robert Parson, or NASA's Ozone Resource File , both of which provide detailed information and full citations to original papers. You can also find many original papers at the CIESIN site .

EPA has another web site about global warming. Please visit that site for information on global warming science, projected impacts, governmental policies, and other information.

[Kraklen]

30. I'm quite aware of the science of ozone depletion.

And the science of global warming.

I wish everybody was.

[fighttotheend]

33. Ozone is a greenhouse gas; may be different but still linked

and both should be taken seriously

[Kraklen]

37. Ozone absorbs infrared radiation.

To compare it to CO2 is ridiculous.

[fighttotheend]

38. Ozone is greenhouse gas, CO(2), CH(4) N(2)0 and halogen source gases

the accumulation of these gases changes the radiative balance of the Earth's atmosphere. The balance is between incoming solar radiation and outgoing infrared radiation. Greenhouse (like you said) change the balance leading to the warming of the earth's surface.

[Kraklen]

39. Anything with a dipole moment will absorb IR.

If it's a gas then it would be a "greenhouse gas."

The trivial amounts of IR absorption by the ozone layer would contribute nothing to global warming.

One could argue that man-made ozone pollution might contribute to global warming, although offhand I'd say that's still trivial to CO2 pollution, and still has nothing to do with the natural ozone layer.

[fighttotheend]

41. well, you have your opinion I have mine and others have theirs

though not a big link I believe there is a link, though two different issues I believe it is still one big issue, our earth.
I can read and research all I want to find studies that show the two are linked and you could research and Find the two are no way linked it all depends on what we believe and think. They are both problems no matter who looks at the issues. The balance of the earth is shifting and it seems like we can all notice something is wrong and what we have to do is change it.

[fighttotheend]

40. oh, did you join the virtual global warming march?

It is something you seem to be concerned with and it is a much needed, as it becomes more and more of a problem.

[Toots]

32. Ozone loss allows an increase in UV rays which kills plankton

Something on the order of 90% of all of the photosynthesis that occurs on our planet occurs by (or within) algae. So it would stand to reason that converting CO2 to Oxygen is the best way of keeping CO2 out of the atmosphere. Tell me how allowing the destruction of plankton/algae with UV rays can not but add to the greenhouse effect. I said it was a major factor not the only factor also there is the fact that the so-called chlorofluorocarbons are in themselves greenhouse gasses. There is a connection that few will deny.

[Kraklen]

35. Sure, CFCs absorb infrared.

Obviously. But they exist in miniscule amounts and absorb miniscule amounts of IR compared to the major contributes, such as CO2.

[hatrack]

34. Actually there is some interaction

Global warming does indeed influence the destruction of ozone in the stratosphere.

Ozone destruction is the function of several things - chlorine transported to the stratosphere by CFCs and their kin is one. Temperature is another. The process also requires the presence of ultraviolet radiation from the sun.

Here's where the temperature influence comes into play. As more and more of the sun's radiation is trapped in the troposphere, the lowest level of the atmosphere, the temperatures of layers higher drop. The radiation which would normally reradiate out to space can't do it.

This means that stratospheric temperatures tend to drop over time. It's been measured in both the Antarctic and Arctic. In fact, scientists recorded the lowest levels of Arctic ozone ever seen this spring, in part because ozone depletion picks up when temperatures drop at that altitude.

So, the two phenomena aren't causally connected, but there is a link just the same.

[Kraklen]

36. I'm sure climate change could effect the ozone layer.

Not sold on the other way around.

[shanti]

48. and a major contributor

to the huge increase in skin cancers.

[prodigal_green]

2. The sun is brutal

From: http://www.solarviews.com/eng/sun.htm

The Sun is the most prominent feature in our solar system. It is the largest object and contains approximately 98% of the total solar system mass. One hundred and nine Earths would be required to fit across the Sun's disk, and its interior could hold over 1.3 million Earths. The Sun's outer visible layer is called the photosphere and has a temperature of 6,000°C (11,000°F). This layer has a mottled appearance due to the turbulent eruptions of energy at the surface.

Solar energy is created deep within the core of the Sun. It is here that the temperature (15,000,000° C; 27,000,000° F) and pressure (340 billion times Earth's air pressure at sea level) is so intense that nuclear reactions take place. This reaction causes four protons or hydrogen nuclei to fuse together to form one alpha particle or helium nucleus. The alpha particle is about .7 percent less massive than the four protons. The difference in mass is expelled as energy and is carried to the surface of the Sun, through a process known as convection, where it is released as light and heat. Energy generated in the Sun's core takes a million years to reach its surface. Every second 700 million tons of hydrogen are converted into helium ashes. In the process 5 million tons of pure energy is released; therefore, as time goes on the Sun is becoming lighter.

[fighttotheend]

9. Though, I'm not scientist I'm thinking the sun may be getting lighter but

its UV rays that once did not penetrate into the earth as much are now getting through more easily now a days and is becoming very harmful to us and our skin (skin cancer and all) but I dont need a scientist to tell me something is wrong I just know I think we all know and can tell first hand the sun's rays and temp. changes and all this isnt good. (*this deals with the Ozone not to be confused with global warming also a big issue!)

[Karenina]

19. Being a canary in the coal mine...

having experienced a "rare" side effect of medication, my melanin-rich skin is ALLERGIC to sunlight, so I MUST pay very close attention. I do agree with you, Fighttotheend, as I've had to dive for cover earlier and earlier every year.

Oh, and as for your point about climate change, I followed you and IT IS HERE. There is a SERIOUS COLD WIND a-blowin' in western Europe. The weather pattern is quite bizarre and startling...

[julianer]

22. I sympathise

I've got the same allergy. Summer comes around and I have to hide away.

My mother started getting itchy little bumps and rashes in her forties and thought it was a chemical reaction. Now I have the same thing at the same age, so I think in my case it's genetic.

[prodigal_green]

23. I'm just playing with you

Your original post is important. I'm just feeling a little silly today from the heat (NYC--up to 95 degrees today).

[fighttotheend]

26. NYC, my birthplace and where I grew up(Bronx) moved to PA some yrs ago...

MISS IT, but The trees and wildlife (a little more space to breath--lol) make up for all the things I miss!

[jojo54]

3. Hey neighbor!

or, almost neighbor? I'm in south Jersey (20 miles southeast of Philly), and it's been a bitch here too.

No matter how it's sliced, we're hurting the environment big time. But check out this thread http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=228x7218 for a different take on the subject.

[fighttotheend]

7. Oh, brother at least the ppl responses were on the money :-)

[ChiciB1]

4. Try Florida For A While!!

I realize we don't have snow, but my next vacation, if I ever get one will be "Going North"! In the Fall, not sure I'd be able to handle SNOW! I've lived in the south since FOREVER!!

And we have LOTS of humidity. I can recall playing softball and during the night games, if you wore glasses they got fogged up!

It's been Global Warming to the MAX here, not to mention what I'll simply call a malfunction of weather conditions! We've already had our fist Tropical storm last week-end!

Everything is going haywire, all over! And what do the "Corrupt Ones" do??? Give Big breaks to Energy companies, relaxing the regulations and tax breaks!

I WANT THEM GONE.... Yesterday!

[babydollhead]

5. also in Pennsylvania

kids got burned so badly from just a short time in the sun...blisters.

[fighttotheend]

6. I know, my sister was one of them and she had sunblock on.

[TimeChaser]

PA here as well

I was pulling weeds in the sun for a little over an hour when I had to go lay down feeling sick from too much sun. My shoulders (Which had spf 50 sunscreen) were already getting tender.

[RamblingRose]

8. I live in Atlanta and when I take my kids to the pool, I seem to be the

only parent that puts sunscreen on my kids and myself. Another parent told me the other day that since it was cloudy they didn't need to worry about sunscreen. Having grown up in Florida, I've gotten some of my worst sunburns on cloudy days.

Then I wasted my breath telling them about the ozone hole and skin cancer in Australia and they looked at me like I was totally crazy. After all, evolution and global warming are just theories.

[azndndude]

10. You guys are pussies, come to ARIZONA, we will show u HOT!

[RamblingRose]

17. Just because it is hot in Arizona doesn't mean the UV index is greater

http://www.theozonehole.com/uvindex.htm

[TX-RAT]

21. or west TX

I dove hunt in Yuma every year, in early Sept it's so damn hot we only do morning hunts, regularly 110+.
Thats hot!

[shanti]

49. true dat!

n/t

[theboss]

11. Global warming does not cause skin cancer

That would be ozone depletion.

Get your environmental crises straight.

[fighttotheend]

12. Yes, I know... Two different things but still one concern., I was telling

my story and also letting ppl know about the global warming march that is in need of marchers just was telling my two concerns about the earth sorry I should of separated them better

[maxsolomon]

13. guess what? ithe sun is a ball of NUCLEAR FUSION.

put on sunscreen, and not ban de soliel spf 4.

ozone holes are just a theory!

[fighttotheend]

44. The ozone hole is a well-defined, large-scale destruction of

the ozone layer

http://www.epa.gov/ozone/science/hole/index.html

The ozone hole is a well-defined, large-scale destruction of the ozone layer over Antarctica that occurs each Antarctic spring. The word "hole" is a misnomer; the hole is really a significant thinning, or reduction in ozone concentrations, which results in the destruction of up to 70% of the ozone normally found over Antarctica.

The science of the ozone hole is quite complex, but our understanding of the many factors that combine to create it has improved greatly since the first investigations in the 1980s. Unlike global ozone depletion, the ozone hole occurs only over Antarctica. Using several instruments on satellites, planes, and balloons, scientists have produced detailed graphs of the size of the ozone hole.

Two international organizations issue regular bulletins about the ozone hole

[maxsolomon]

52. no, the ozone hole is just a THEORY

like evolution & gravity! ;>)

[Lone_Wolf]

15. I NEVER used to get sunburned as a youth...

Back in the 70's and 80's, I would be out in the sun for hours and hours without sunscreen, and at most, I would get a tan. However, now I get sunburned if I am not careful.

I'm convinced that the UV radiation getting through the atmosphere to the earth's surface is increasing. The ozone layer is getting thinner or something.

[julianer]

24. I heard on the radio

the other day that the ozone hole over the Antarctic is actually getting better. The regulations in the late 80's about stopping CFCs in aerosol cans seems to have at least stopped the deterioration. The report said that we could expect the hole to diminish slowly over the next few decades.

[tnlefty]

16. I can relate. For years when I was going out to work in my yard

and didn't want to get burned then long sleeves and long pants were enough protection. For the past 3-4 years I've noticed getting slightly burned through clothing - even darker shirts, etc. I wouldn't even consider being at a pool for more than an hour without tons of sunscreen.

[Lorien]

25. I have a friend who has been studying climate change in the

Antarctic for over forty years.From the rapid changes he's been seeing lately, I seriously doubt that life on earth will continue beyond the next 100 years. Most of us, from what he has told me, will see forest and crop failures and experience more wars over resources during our lifetime. The information he gave me made me decide long ago not to have children, because I sincerely doubt that any child born today will live to see sixty.

[ArkDem]

42. So is it 60 or 100?

[Lorien]

43. 60 for us

100 for the rest of life on earth.

[misanthrope]

45. At least you...

..are attuned to the future. I would concur with most of what you say, with one exception: life will continue, in some form. It likely won't resemble what we think of as normal, but life (human or not) will find a way.

Make no mistake, the clock is ticking down to the last stages of our civilization. I'm very thankful that I was born when I was because I won't see the worst of it.

People bringing children into the world today have no idea about the horrors and misery in store just a few decades down the line. As the globe's weather becomes more erratic and deadly, resources will dwindle and populations will continue to rise. Humans, as is borne out in the historical record of our collective behavior, will react to all this in a violent and selfish manner.

Without hesitation, homo sapiens will become highly murderous over dwindling resources and, when push comes to shove, will use any and all means possible to either have it all or "take everyone with them" if they can't get what they want. Folks, we're just naked apes with great dexterity, not gods.

On a personal level, I believe we can't give up as, in the end, all that matters is how you live up to your personal responsibilities in this regard. You've got to sleep with your conscience, after all.

But that aside, I'm saying by 2050, it all goes up in smoke. The handwriting's on the wall.

[itcfish1]

28. I Am Not A Scientist

but last year I had a spot on my back that turned out to be cancer. I am relatively young and my doctor said that skin cancer is getting so common even amoung teenagers. Just a note I have never been a sun worshipper. I would say that climate change or ozone hole has to cause the rise in skin cancer.

[shanti]

51. a friend of mine

had the worst stage of melanoma and she was NEVER a sun worshipper either, being born and raised in michigan. however, she did move to california... luckily it was caught in time, but it did make a recurrence, again caught in time. scary stuff! :scared:

[donsu]

31. used to be you could stay out in the sun for several hrs/half a day

before burning. nowadays it takes 15 to 20 minutes.

this morning while waiting at a stop light, I saw a gaggle of young men on rental scooters all with shirts off and lily white skin, and I thought to myself: you boys are going to be hurting this evening from severe sunburn.

sunburn lotion mostly doesn't work. and just what chemical is in sunburn lotion that supposedly reflects UV rays?

[SmokingJacket]

46. If you don't go out much, your skin is much more sensitive when you DO

go out.

People are spending less and less time walking from place to place and aren't getting lots of small doses of sun, so their skin can't handle huge doses as well.

As you know, skin that has a light tan doesn't burn like pale white skin.

Just my take on it... I believe in global warming and ozone depletion (of course) but I'm not so sure that the problem isn't partly that we've become an indoor species...

[shanti]

47. wear your sunblock!!!!

really, everyone should know this by now. they won't protect us, you have to protect yourself.

[fighttotheend]

50. Unfortunately SPF 200 isn't available...

I had sunblock on, though now I am going to upgrade.

[Xithras]

53. No joke, the world REALLY IS is getting brighter (Global Dimming)

No joke. Human-created particulate pollution and the net effect of contrails caused the light levels on the surface of the Earth to DROP from 5%-10%, depending on location, from the 1960's to the 1990's. Since 1990, stricter global anti-pollution laws have reduced particle pollution in the atmosphere and are causing sunlight levels to return to their normal levels. From the perspective of those of us born in that period, the world really is getting brighter.

Depending on which estimate you look at, global sunlight levels have increased between 2% and 5% since 1990.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_dimming

This global brightening IS related in a way to global warming as well, but it's something we're going to have to live with. Scientists used to wonder why global warming didn't show up sooner, but most now understand that Global Dimming caused by particulate pollution actually lowered the Earths temperature and masked the earlier stages of Global Warming. Now that particulate levels are going down and the sunlight is returning to normal, global warming is expected to accelerate slightly.