US News: Chuck Hagel is just a little pissed off. Ok, more than a little.

[Tandalayo_Scheisskopf]

Nebraska Republican Sen. Chuck Hagel is angry. He's upset about the more than 1,700 U.S. soldiers killed and nearly 13,000 wounded in Iraq. He's also aggravated by the continued string of sunny assessments from the Bush administration, such as Vice President Dick Cheney's recent remark that the insurgency is in its "last throes." "Things aren't getting better; they're getting worse. The White House is completely disconnected from reality," Hagel tells U.S. News. "It's like they're just making it up as they go along. The reality is that we're losing in Iraq."



That's strikingly blunt talk from a member of the president's party, even one cast as something of a pariah in the GOP because of his early skepticism about the war. "I got beat up pretty good by my own party and the White House that I was not a loyal Republican," he says. Today, he notes, things are changing: "More and more of my colleagues up here are concerned."



Indeed, there are signs that the politics of the Iraq war are being reshaped by the continuing tide of bad news. Take this month in Iraq, with 47 U.S. troops killed in the first 15 days. That's already five more than the toll for the entire month of June last year. With the rate of insurgent attacks near an all-time high and the war's cost set to top $230 billion, more politicians on both sides of the aisle are responding to opinion polls that show a growing number of Americans favoring a withdrawal from Iraq. Republican Sens. Lincoln Chafee and Lindsey Graham have voiced their concerns. And two Republicans, including the congressman who brought "freedom fries" to the Capitol, even joined a pair of Democratic colleagues in sponsoring a bill calling for a troop withdrawal plan to be drawn up by year's end. "I feel confident that the opposition is going to build," says Rep. Ron Paul, the other Republican sponsor and a longtime opponent of the war.

http://www.usnews.com/usnews/news/articles/050627/27bush.htm

[mopaul]

1. woah!---the tide IS turning, more proof every day

[Tandalayo_Scheisskopf]

2. Yup.

We are getting to the One Crystalline Moment.

[calimary]

11. I find I dare to entertain this thought, myself.

Still hesitant, of course. But I'm allowing myself to consider it seriously. What if we really HAVE hit the straw that broke (or maybe is in the process of breaking) the camel's back? Do we dare ...

Well, whatever, I'm gonna keep working toward it.

The Great Awakening. Now playing around an office water cooler, in a grocery checkout line, and while filling up at the self-serve. America starts to wake up.

We just can't get complacent. This ain't over, folks.

[Jackpine Radical]

21. I have unabashedly joined the optimists again at last.

I think it's gonna happen. I can smell it, I can taste it. This isn't like all the other times. The momentum is growing. There are 95-5 online polls out there indicating the people are suddenly awakening. We NEVER before saw the kind of headlines & editorials that are now starting to show up.

[FreedomAngel82]

34. I agree

The other times people said it there was some tides turning and people waking up but not like this. This is big. Bush's approval raiting is still low and Congress has a raiting of 19% from Friday. Don't forget Bush's relationship to Hagel (he's close to the Bush family and has connections to the ES&S company).

[FreedomAngel82]

33. This is very big

It's just beginning and I think we'll be seeing more and more each day. These next few weeks I think will be very interesting. I think this is what will bring Bush down. I'm an empath and about a week or two before the election I had this feeling that something really big will bring him and his administration down. I never saw anything but I think this is it. It had to be something that everybody will agree upon. And if Chuck Hagel is mad then something is up. Plus I read a quote here this past week that said Murdoch was pissed at Bush and wants revenge. Remember Murdoch is a capitalist and his show has been doing very crappy since November 2nd, 2004 and he recently hired General Clark as a pundint. And now Chuck Hagel! Of course I'd be pissed if they take all the credit for this and not John Conyers.

[babsbunny]

12. We have to all email him and thank him

and encourage him!!!

[AuntiBush]

31. And fast!

And I've been meaning to mention I luv your blinking-car!

Yes, tide is turning in deed. Hope it turns a bit quicker here in June.
Getting a tad nervous about Syria/Iran rumor.

[Tigress DEM]

42. Rats abandons ship before it sinks....

and smart Republicans disconnect themselves prior to the Impeachment Party so they don't get caught up in the gigantic FLUSH as WE the People cleanse ourselves of all the Bulshitvieks stinking up OUR Country!

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

3. BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

OK, I've got a real bad case of Schadenfreude, and I'm not the least bit ashamed. Jeebers, Chuckie, you shoulda thought about how this whole clusterfuck would come out *before* you got behind President Rainman.

But it's just loverly to see some of the Repubs back away from El Chefe. Pretty soon he won't have anybody but KKKarl and a few dead-enders like Dobson and Santorum.

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[LiviaOlivia]

4. I don't believe a word out of his mouth. This man wants money.

He's a corporatist and his voting record supports that.

He's a decoy duck for his Bush/Rove masters.

[me b zola]

28. "He's a decoy duck for his Bush/Rove masters."

Indeed. Straight from ES&S to the Senate...amazing,a-huh.

I still think that Hagel is going to their *man* for '08. He publicly distances himself from the neo-lunatics, but always votes with them.

[FreedomAngel82]

35. I think so too

I'll still send a nice note to show that I'm liking what he's doing. Getting away from Bush. That's what's important. You know Hagel had a hand in the 2004 "election" for Bush since he has a big investment in ES&S. In his first senate race 80% of his votes were counted on ES&S and his state hasn't had a republican senator for years before he came along.

[Cobalt Violet]

5. "More and more of my colleagues up here are concerned."

Just how many deaths and other casualties does it take to get repukes "concerned"?


To little to late. Ever heard of that concept you bunch of mudering scums!

[radar]

9. Comment reminded me of the Danziger cartoon

I saw in BartCop today...

[EVDebs]

6. This war was a GIGANTIC miscalculation. Hagel knows that

Republicans will be held accountable. Dems were just pulled along for convenient 'cover'.

[LightningFlash]

7. Oh Hagel, I thought war was GOOD??!??

Support the inquiry and full fledged investigation......Do it before America takes to the streets senator. :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:

http://www.rumormillnews.com/MEDIA_EMAIL_ADDRESSES.htm

http://www.usalone.com/index.htm

Keep the heat turned on full blast with all of 'em

[LiberalAndProud]

8. Hagel talks the talk

He talks out of one side of his head and votes out of the other. What he says does not matter.

He had the right reservations about the war and voted for it. He had the right reservations about Bolton and intends to vote to confirm (I have a letter that says so).

Pay NO attention to what this man says.

[shance]

26. That's my first reaction. I have a hard time overcoming his ES&S ties

and his attempt to cover it up his partial ownership and profitting from the worlds largest electronic machine producer, and *ballot tabulator*.

AND his miraculous two upset wins on votes that were tallied on (his) ES&S machines.

[FreedomAngel82]

36. Yep

So I wonder what's up? Is he getting revenge on Bush and he wants to make a 2008 run??

[shance]

38. Could be. It could also be a game of "good cop, bad cop".

It's difficult if not impossible to think there is anything that can be trusted from such individuals who have engaged in such continuous conflicts of interest.

[Jackpine Radical]

10. Just think of it as one more vote for impeachment.

How many Puggies have now turned besides Hagel and Freedom Fries?

At this rate we won't have to wait until after the 2006 elections.

[calimary]

16. That's how I'm looking at it. YES, I know. He ain't no saint.

But we've got a greater goal here, guys. We need the numbers. We need the numbers of Senators and Congresspeople who indicate they either are getting uncomfortable about the war, or they're starting to make noises about demanding accountability or answers in Memogate, or they had misgivings initially but went along because that's what they thought their duty was, or some such, or MAYBE even the rare ones who actually invoke the "I" word. This is what we need. We NEED the "freedom fries" guy to turn, and express a change of heart. We NEED a Hagel and, frankly, Senator Whothehellcares. As long as we get 'em on board. When we have enough, IMPEACHMENT goes beyond being an option, it becomea a probability. If you actually have people on THAT side expressing concern or misgivings or regret or doubt or anger, GOOD! When one speaks out, maybe three or four others are quietly nodding in agreement - not quite ready to speak out, themselves.

Now, they'll watch and see what the reaction is. Sooooooooooooo... what we need to do is provide MUCHO MUCHO BEAUCOUP BEAUCOUP positive reinforcements to all these people. HOWEVER ELSE we view them, let's not look gift horses in the mouth. We must cautiously but warmly welcome and applaud this. Call their offices, either local or regional, or to Capitol Hill TOLL FREE - (877) 762 - 8762. Tell them thank-you and that they have your support - that you aren't fooled either and you appreciate their willingness to see with clearer eyes, and to look beyond the calculating, manipulative bullshit from this White House. That they seem able even to recognize that it IS bullshit is something. The koolaid wore off early with them. Let's make sure they have plenty of other "things to drink" than seconds on koolaid, shall we? Encourage them to keep seeking the truth, and to hold the White House accountable. Perhaps even say something like "as a Democrat, I want you to know it's noticed and appreciated." Positive reinforcement.

This is important because other people on the Hill will be watching for reaction. If they see that, here, there actually ARE people waiting by the side of the road for them to roll in - holding flowers and sweets, perhaps they might feel emboldened to speak out for themselves. If they see that a barrage of criticism and condemnation that inevitably results from the flying monkey brigades is MET AND MATCHED, or MAYBE even OUTSHOUTED by a larger group of people bearing "attaboys" and "attagirls," which side do you think will get their attention?

And not only their attention, either. Because as this gains momentum and more people start feeling safe enough expressing their misgivings in public, there will be more of this kind of thing for the media to have to cover. See what they're being forced to do because of sheer public and online outcry? There's such a storm about this in extra-conventional communication systems that it simply can't be ignored. And then, with all the things that are coming out - these are offensive items, not defensive. THEY are being forced to react. To comment or refuse comment, or issue denials. LBJ, who in his day was one helluva dirty street fighter, once advised a cohort to go ahead and make any outrageous accuasations or insinuations about an opponent, regardless how out-there they seemed. The point was: make your opponent deny them.

Just the same as the smear job against John McCain in the 2000 South Carolina primary. That he'd cheated on his wife and fathered an out-of-wedlock mixed-race child was a COMPLETE, UTTERLY LUDICROUS, BALD-FACED LIE. But a whispering campaign was started, as I recall reading, when a kkkarl rove or rovian associate called a bunch of morning shock jocks in South Carolina radio markets and planted the rumor. And also, telephone calls were made to people from purported "pollsters" asking the simple question: "would you vote for John McCain IF YOU KNEW THAT he'd fathered a black child out of wedlock?" The use of the phrase "...if you knew that..." MERELY plants the notion. It doesn't even have to be true. It doesn't even have to be in the same solar system as true - it just needs to be put out there as a notion. As one of those shrugged "I'm just SAYING..." disclaimers. It's not a statement. It's put as a question. And - hey, I'm just ASKING... No harm done, 'eh? Yeah, sure. No harm done. It's out there now. Injected into the national dialogue. That's how they poison the well.

Anyway, the point is, these are offensive jabs that are now being thrown, not blocks or counter punches. The White House is now forced to react to all this stuff. As more memos come out or are reported, or the reaction continues to come out and be of an adverse nature. We need this. We need every grain and speck of this. Any and all help is welcomed because this is an ENORMOUS task. IMPEACHMENT is an enormous task - made all the more challenging because there WILL BE those who say - oh, for heaven's sakes, we CAN'T have ANOTHER impeachment. We just had one! You'll cheapen the concept and power of impeachment if you have another one this soon. Whaddya gonna do, impeach every president who comes along? So we need ALL the allies we can get.

And the more we get, the closer IMPEACHMENT comes to evolving from an option to an inevitability.

[LightningFlash]

20. We don't only want it, we DEMAND it for the suffering people of Iraq.

We know there's lots of pro-corporate kooks on both sides of senate and congress who will NEVER support making this stop and putting the liars on the hotseat. But that doesn't mean we don't picket and lynch every last one of them, to FULLY support it!!!!! :mad: :mad:

It's like when republicans get mad...They protest, picket, start a whole freaking fire!!!!! And make it expand and expand.

Democrats do the same damn thing now and stop hiding it by being nice!!!!! :thumbsdown:

Go swarm them all DEMANDING THEY DO THEIR JOBS, this isn't about nothing else. http://www.usalone.com/index.htm

[Lecky]

27. What she said...

:)

[FreedomAngel82]

39. I agree all the way

I despise Hagel myself with his ES&S ties but if HAGEL comes out against Bush then you know this is something big. Is he running for his Senate seat again? Anybody know? I really don't know what to think about it but I sent him a nice note and didn't tell him my party affiliation or anything like that. I just told him I don't know what made him change his mind on Iraq but I'm against it and how I hope there can be a full investigation on the documents from Britian to honor our fallen soliders and their families and if Hussein really didn't have WMD's (heh) then we should leave etc. Hopefully things can happen now.

[chrisbur]

13. Doesn't he get to play president if/when

Chimp and Darth go down?

[LightningFlash]

14. Nope, instead its Hastert.

Once Tom DeLay is booted like a crock, its Hastert and then from there another great runoff will probably be forced.

[chrisbur]

15. Ah damn! There I go

with the H's again.

[FreedomAngel82]

40. That's why 2006 is important

And to make Pelosi the majority leader so it'll be her instead of Tom DeLay. Maybe we can also have an investigation on the 2004 election and Dean can release whatever it is he was going to say. :shrug:

[alfredo]

17. It's about time the repugs started acting like they

have some sense.

[Disturbed]

18. If McCain speaks out about the DSM or

is critical of the Bush Regime regarding how they are screwing up the Iraq Occupation then the snowball will roll rapidly down the hill.

[alfredo]

48. If McCain does, they will be saying he is positioning

himself for 2008.

I noticed something about Condi Rice while watching her on "this Week." She shakes here head no when she tells a lie. She also turns her head to the side. She's a horrible liar.

[Mass]

53. And he will be. No doubt about that

Anyway this morning, he was saying Bush was a great president.

What amazes me is that people here still think McCain is at the side of the people and not of his pal Bush.

[alfredo]

57. she reminds me of a bobble head.

[Burried News]

56. She'll be wearing a neck brace alot after she reads you post :

[Independent_Liberal]

19. Another Republican jumps ship!

I knew it would happen! I knew it!

[Mass]

22. They have been saying the same thing for months now

Nothing new, here. When we hear Warner or Voinovich say that, we will be able to say the tide is turning.

[Tigress DEM]

43. Ah, go ahead, say it!

Now it's firmly a trend and if the other Republicans get the idea that distancing themselves from the loser pResident and his band of evil thugs is a good thing after all the freepers whine to them about what we're posting here.... well, so be it.

[Mass]

45. NO trend here, unfortunately,,,

All these guys except Mr Freedom Fries have said the same thing during the campaign, and they all supported Bush at the end (with the exception of Chafee who did not voted for IWR anyway).

F* them anyway as all of them were talking more or less against the war and none had the courage to do the right thing at the end. Had Hagel and Chafee had the courage to vote against Bolton as they should, that would be another thing. But they are cowards.

[lumpy]

23. Hagel is only concerned for his own

neck. No sympathy from me.

[dchill]

41. Still ...

it works for our side, though.

[spindoctor]

24. Hagel is ambitious. He wouldn't say these things if there was no gain.

So my conclusion is that there IS a Republican movement to kick the neocons to the curb and Hagel's money is with them.

This is good news...really good news.

[Mass]

25. Hagel has been saying these things since 2003

You are right with the fact that he is ambitious, but he has always been one of the most reticent Republicans concerning Iraq. As for Chafee, he voted AGAINST IWR.

I dont see how having them talking like that is new.

[Beam Me Up]

29. Do I smell TOAST?

:popcorn:

[understandinglife]

30. My email to Senator Hagel:

Dear Senator Hagel,

You may find the three sources of information of some use:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x3885693

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x3742495

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=3894053&mesg_id=3894053

Peace,
xxxxxxx

http://www.missionnotaccomplished.us - Impeachment of Bush and Cheney; indictment and prosecution of all members of the Bush regime who participated in the deception, should be campaign promises of any candidate worthy of our vote in the 2006 Congressional elections.[/

[FreedomAngel82]

32. THIS IS HUGE!

If Chuck Hagel is coming out against Bush then this is VERY VERY big!!! Hagel was connected to the ES&S voting machine's and also was once going to be Bush's VP choice and he is very good friends with the Bush family for over twenty something years. So if Chuck Hagel comes out against Bush then you know some shit is going down!!! OMG!

[Mass]

54. Not at all

he has been for months now. I dont know if you are right about the VP thing, but Hagel has been extremely critical of Bush in 2004, and I doubt he is a great friend of Bush at this point (if he was at any point).

He may be more in agreement with Bush Sr's political ideas, though.

I dont know why you are so excited about that, but, IMHO, there is nothing either new or huge here.

[dchill]

37. If Chuck Hagel votes "No" on John Bolton ...

then I will accept his sincerity.

Temporarily.

[Mass]

55. He will not

He wants to be president, so he needs to keep the neocons happy, whatever he thinks and says.

[donheld]

44. So what's he gonna do about it.

He could call for senate hearings on the DSM for a start.

[Mass]

46. Nothing more he has been doing for two years

Talk on TV and continue to support Bush in his votes (same thing for Chafee).

But we can count on AP to write articles telling us that Hagel disagreeing with Bush on Iraq is a change in a couple of months.

[berni_mccoy]

47. BOOM

Right on the heals of one of the lamest Presidential Radio Addresses ever too! I bet that radio address PISSED off a ton of Republicans.

The next couple weeks are gonna be a political fireworks show!

:popcorn:

[kentuck]

49. Would Hagel be any different from George Bush ?

I tend to think almost any Repub would be better than the dumbass now up there...?

[confludemocrat]

50. PLUS U. S. deaths are undercounted. Mention that Hagel (n/t)

[Bouncy Ball]

51. They've been in their "last throes" for a LONG fucking time.

I mean over a year now. Or more. That's a long time to be in your last fucking throes.

Hey Hagel, they're lying to you.

[patricia92243]

52. They are all positioning themselves for the Presidential run. The Republi

Republican Primaries should be fun to watch this go-around.