A light goes off! All this "identity theft" stuff

[Atman]

The credit card companies are looking for new income sources. They're feeling a backlash now as more and more people pay off their balances instead of submitting to userous interest rates and fees. And now, suddenly, every CC company and his brother is lining up to gleefully announce that they've lost all our records.

Watching the news this morning, something just set off that light bulb over my head...they're all yammering about the importance of getting ID THEFT INSURANCE from your CC company. A "mere" $25-50 annually, for something that you are far more than likely not going to ever use. Remember, you're already covered by your CC company for fraudulent charges. This "insurance" is to cover your time lost if you need to write letters and make phone calls and pay for certified letters.

Watch your mailbox for new pre-approved CC's, with your first $50 premium conveniently billed to your new card. Or, those "checks," which, if cashed, sign you up for a new program with an annual fee automatically billed to your card.

This is big corporate bullshit. It stinks to high heaven.

[diddlysquat]

1. Thanks.

You are probably right. We need to buy insurance against their incompetance.

[amazona]

19. why would you need insurance?

I don't understand the argument.

You have FEDERALLY MANDATED protection. You don't need to insure against loss in a situation where there is no possibility of loss.

Yes?

My identity was stolen. I notified the credit card company. By federal law, they pay all but $50. By courtesy, they actually paid EVERYTHING, even the $50.

Credit card companies are screaming to the moon because THEY are the victims of identity theft. Not you. When you're mugged on the street and robbed of a few hundred in cash, it's local news if it be news at all. Because no one cares if Joe Citizen loses his bucks. But it's legitimate business news that organized crime is going after credit card companies for millions upon millions of bucks. OK?

When your credit card account is mugged, you owe at most $50, and more likely you don't owe a penny. Both Visa and Mastercard have pledged you never pay a dime of any loss caused by an identity thief.

Look, I have my own gripes with credit card companies but get on their tails about what they are doing wrong, not what they are doing right.

You don't need to buy identity theft insurance. The OP is correct. Such insurance is fraudulent and unnecessary. Don't buy it.

[kittenpants]

2. interesting...

they know it's pretty much impossible not to have a VISA or Mastercard so they can be as irresponsible as they want & it's our problem that we need insurance. Sounds about right to me.:grr:

[leveymg]

3. It's called extortion, and it's a crime.

It's time for the MBNA executive duckwalk.:mad: :bounce:

[Atman]

8. Who else gets to do shit like this?

"We lost all your personal records. Pay us more, and we'll reimburse you for some of your trouble next time it happens."

WTF? What ever happened to responsibility? WHO THE HELL IS RESPONSIBLE for MasterCard losing our records? NOT US! But the answer is for MasterCard to offer this extortion scheme. It's nothing less than a shake-down. MC doesn't have to tighten its security...WE have to PAY MasterCard more, and for that, they're only offering to pay us pack a few ducats for the trouble of them not doing what they should be doing in the first place.

This is insane! Thankfully, our next president, Joe Biden, will be there to rein them in. :sarcasm:

[Gormy Cuss]

12. Excellent connecting of the dots.

What should happen is that the Congress gets off its collective arse and passes stringent data handling and consumer privacy laws, but I believe you've seen the connection between so-called ID theft and new product marketing for the cc companies. Most news items screaming "ID theft" are really talking about old-fashioned credit card fraud. The Mastercard story for example was about stolen account numbers, not SSNs, DOBs and other true ID theft elements.

Watch next for legislation changing the burden on credit card fraud to consumers.

[KurtNYC]

23. Good point

There is no such thing as "identity theft" -- that is a term they made up to talk about the flaws in their system. Basically they are saying that their system is flawed and you can buy insurance against those flaws severely affecting your life.

Imagine the reverse. If I go to my bank and say 'hey, where is that $300 payment I gave you yesterday? I gave it to some guy who said he was part of your bank. He had a business card with your logo...' Then make them prove that some stranger was not a bank employee. Ludicrous.

[TWiley]

35. Smells like the Mafioso "protection" racket.

Pay me 10% and I will not burn down your store.

It is time to pay the republicans so they will protect us from themselves?

[Pool Hall Ace]

4. I changed my name recently

and have had to call every credit card co. to let them know. Without fail, they start reading the identity theft spiel, and try to sign me up for the low, low price of only $4.99/month, or whatever, for identity theft protection. I politely turn them down, and they always rebut.

And those darned checks! They always go straight to the shredder.

[H2O Man]

5. The timing is odd ....

I've never had a credit card, and never will, so I don't give this type of thing much attention .... but your post is really an interesting theory. Very interesting.

[undergroundpanther]

6. I NEVER use credit

I don't trust them.
So either I save up in cash or I don't get it.So because I am poor I don't get.So I learn to do it for myself if I can.
The rich people want a debt slave state. rulers seek absolute domination and they will use every way at their disposal to do it,fear and fear of god,fear of disaster, fear of debt,fear of not surviving,fear of not"making it" etc etc etc.WE PAY a lot to assuage our fears.And not just in money..I ask myself how much of this shit is real and how much of it am I TAUGHT I should fear?

They want us to be like them, sociopaths with unlimited greed use fear of losing,uncertainty and differences to exploit us, it goes deep in humanity's collective manipulated psyche.The fear of what if,just in case,or I'm not,or I'll never get,is what fuels their fake "system" of credit and debt and serfdom. Believe in their program like it's the only way to be and they have gotcha.Blind belief in a system that serves the interest off those who exploit us, and fear of being without that system is driving our country crazy.

[Dover]

7. Interesting theory.

It makes some sense. I have never bought that additional identity insurance service because they DO, as you mentioned, cover it already. I suppose they couldn't exactly drop that regular coverage on cards, so they could sell it to us instead, because it might cause them to lose a lot of customers.

Actually, all the news about identity theft has made me consider getting rid of my cards altogether. I don't really need them...they are just a convenience.

[mirrera]

9. I have been suspicious too!

I was just saying that to my husband yesterday. First Citi Group looses our info in the MAIL??? Who mails that stuff anymore? Now the FBI looses Master card info?? I was thinking they needed some good fake IDs for their next set of hijackers. They will find our passports in the rubble...

But your theory makes a lot of sense. plus all the "news" sound bites about Identity theft being common, etc.


www.nobullshirt.com

[bleedingheart]

10. watch the GOP Congress remove your protection so that you must buy

their insurance....

[SouthernDem2004]

11. Only problem with that theory is...

1) They still have copies of your records.
2) They are noy holding anyone responsible for the charges.
3) You are not responsible for fraudulent charges in any case.

[Atman]

13. Why is that a problem for my theory?

It only seems to reinforce it.

If everything you say is true, why ID THEFT insurance at all? You're supposedly covered. This, they're claiming, is different. This is insurance to reimburse you for expensed incurred to "reclaim your identity." It covers costs associated with missing work, paying OOP for certified letters, filing claims, etc. Above and beyond the $50 fraudulent charges protection. It makes perfect sense to me. You don't pay for the $50 fraud protection, that is a government mandate. It isn't a money-maker for them. Obviously, paying exhorbitant fees for insurance you likely won't ever use, has the potential to be a cash cow.

[ozymandius]

14. To me, it sounds like someone is harvesting info. Simple as that. n/t

[flyarm]

15. also data base mining!!

i keep thinking that the * es are doing nation wide data base mining ..on a national level what they have done previously in fla...i dont totally understand it all..but i know they have done it in fla...could this be what they are doing now??

[unblock]

16. this particular case, at least, is not an identity theft case

my understanding is that they stole card numbers and maybe pins, so they can rack up fraudulent charges to your account (for which you are NOT responsible, if you pay enough attention to complain about it instead of paying it blindly) but they can NOT steal your "identity" with this information.

which is not to say that other attacks couldn't lead to identity theft.


the computer anti-virus companies are often accused of having a hand in letting viruses out; even hollywood jumped on that bandwagon in "the net". and in a lower-tech vein, security companies have long been accused of having a hand in local burglaries.

personally, i think there are enough crooks and jokers out there that they don't need to do this themselves.

[G2099]

17. All this could also be leading to "Implants"

Problem = reaction = solution

problem/id thief = reaction/something must be done =

solution/"implants"

[DoYouEverWonder]

29. Yep, line right up

get this chip implanted, or your retina scanned, or that 666 series number tattooed and you'll be all set. No need to worry about ID theft anymore. What could be safer? Of course, eventually no one will be able to do anything or go anywhere without it. Nice way to keep everyone under control.

[MadHound]

18. There is an easy solution to this BS

Pay off your cards, cut them up, and become debt free. Yes, it is going to require so disipline on your part, but once you get used to it, it really isn't a problem. And going to a cash only basis will cut these damn companies off at the knees.

Yes, you might have a bit of trouble at the car rental counter, which is easily countered with a debit card, or finding another rental company. Same for hotels and airline reservations. But, if enough people started going the cash only route, businesses will be forced to drop these CC policies in order to remain in business.

More and more I'm happy I've never had a CC. I have an excellent credit score, I rarely worry about ID theft, and I don't have to pay extra cash for the "privelege" of buying stuff.

[amazona]

20. what a financially unwise idea

The man who carries cash gets mugged. The $500 he intended to spend for Christmas gifts (December is the great month for pickpockets and muggers) or the $1,200 he needed to have a root canal and tooth repair is gone forever.

The man who carries a credit card gets mugged. He spends $10 or $20 letting Citibank know of the problem and getting his letter notarized. (THis is not theory, this is what actually happened to me.) The thief runs up thousands of dollars on the old credit card, and so what? Citibank has already issued me a new card. My Christmas is saved, my tooth is saved.

When the Vietnamese refugees first arrived in the greater New Orleans area, they feared banks and used only cash. Therefore they were targeted for home invasion and robbery. For instance, I knew of a man robbed of $9,000 -- his entire life savings.

The smart person eschews fear and hysteria. There are times when cash is a necessary evil but, for most people, if safety is your concern, you should be choosing and using credit.

[Atman]

21. Thank you. And why is a debit card any better?

It is virtually the same damn thing! It has a mag strip with all your account info on the back of it. And in some cases, debit cards are not covered by credit card anti-theft rules. Frankly, I'd rather have someone gain access to my credit card, which is only hooked up to a billing address and an electronic ledger sheet, than to have them gain access to my debit card, which is linked directly to my bank account, which has actual cash in it. Have you noticed that NO ONE asks for ID or signature for your debit card? Hell, at Starbucks, for one, they keep the info on file...swipe your debit card and you don't even enter a PIN or sign, you just get a receipt.

The debit card argument simply makes no sense to me. You have far more "protection" and far, far more convenience with credit card.

[MadHound]

22. Uh gee Wally, ever hear of a checkbook, or debit card?

A cash only basis does not necessarily mean carrying wads of cash around with you friend. It is, after all, the twenty first century, and things have evolved a bit.

But hey, nice try there friend. You've got the corporate patter down perfect.

[truth2power]

24. Sounded like corporate patter to me, too. n/t

[Atman]

25. Then maybe YOU will explain why a debit card is better

since Madhound didn't. I don't think OP is trying to advocate for the CC companies, but he has a very valid point. The same one we all took for granted for years during he age of Traveler's Checks...sometimes, carrying cash is the LEAST safe way to carry money. Period. You can brush his comments off to being corporate shilling, but it would be far better if you'd address the whys and wherefores to support your assertion.

Properly managed, the fact is, a credit card is often infinitely safer to carry than cash. The problem is NOT the credit card. Currently, it is the irresponsible way the CC companies are handling the data, and forcing US to pay for THEIR mismanagement.

[northzax]

26. and the irresponsible way many people

including myself in the past, utilize credit.

There is nothing inherently wrong with using credit wisely, indeed, one of the reasons that there are so many homeowners in the US is the credit system. Anyone know what the average down payment for a house in the UK is? 50%. in the US? 5%.

credit, used wisely, is a force multiplier and allows you to amortise your income over a longer period of time. it's a tool, like a knife. use it well, and it makes your life easier, use it poorly, and you blled

[MadHound]

31. Credit is one thing friend, we all need to use it at some point.

But consumer credit, as represented by CCs, payday loans, and rent to own stores are nothing but traps for the vast majority of Americans, hitting the poor and working class especially hard. Leaders such as Malcolm X recognized this forty years ago, but apparently the American public needs a refresher course.

I grant you, for matters such as home loans, business loans, educational loans, etc., one does need credit. But this is, in economic terms, good debt. Consumer credit however is considered bad debt, and can actually hurt your chances of getting home loans, etc. And with the American public carrying such bad debt.(averaging over $8000.00 per person) it puts a drag on our economy. Money supply becomes tight, interest rates go up, etc.

I'm not advocating doing away with all credit, credit is a time proven tool of economic advancement. But consumer credit is nothing but a sucker's game, whose only beneficiary is the CC companies.

[northzax]

32. but consumer credit ca nbe just as valuable

I would never have been able to go to my grandmother's funeral without a bank loaning my the money to do so. It let me pay for it over three months, with a reasonable interest rate. not bad.

I would not put Credit Cards in the same place as payday loans (which are legal loansharking) or rent to own (which is simly predatory leanding)

[MadHound]

38. I would put CCs up there with paydays and RTOs

Granted, their interest rates aren't as exhorbitant as PDs and RTOs, but at rates ranging up there to twenty eight percent, combined with interest fees and now ID theft insurance, you are starting to reach loanshark territory.

As for as predatory lending practices go, CC companies damn near invented the book. Handing out cards to students, those coming off of bankruptcy, etc all qualify as predatory lending.

And I'm glad you got a personal loan to attend your grandmother's funeral. And I bet your interest rate was lower than a CC, without the hidden fees. I wish more people were this smart, but sadly many just whip out the CC and charge it.

Sorry, but I still find most uses of CCs and consumer credit in general to be stupid. And again, most responsible economists and others in the money biz do consider consumer debt to be bad debt. All you're doing is paying off a loan with interests, without any equity in return.

[northzax]

39. no, the personal loan

was my credit card. that's the whole point.

[MadHound]

27. I'm actually advocating more a switch to a cash only system

I've gone cardless for all of my life, and have not had any negative consequences. If you are wanting to rent a car or hotel room from a company that requires a CC, most will take a debit card number instead. Otherwise, I recommend cash or checks.

And apparently a CC ISN'T safer than cash. I can give you over forty million reasons right now. And if you're traveling, well there is always traveler's checks.

The vast majority of Americans got along just fine on a cash only basis until thirty years ago. It is only with the blossoming of our uber consumer society that people have felt the need for a credit card. Gotta keep up with the Jones and all of that nonsense. But as is continously demonstrated by bankruptcies and ID thefts, credit cards are a bane on this country. You may be able to manage your debt load properly, but many can't, and the CC companies target those groups. Besides, you're still playing the sucker's game, paying out good money in fees and interests just for the "privilege of plastic".

[truth2power]

44. Ok...

I went back and read Amazona's post, and you're right. S/he seemed to be advocating for credit cards in the particular case stated.

I do agree that, in a more perfect world, credit cards would not be the problem. But since we have an UNREGULATED credit card industry, which engages in legalized robbery, it would be better if we all removed their source of income, to the extent possible.

As for me, I have a debit card but own no credit cards. I keep such a small balance in my checking account that anyone who stole my card would be lucky to be able to fill their gas tank on what's there, not to speak of going to an ATM and getting, what?...more than is in the account? Mostly, I carry cash, and not much of that either.

[Pockets]

28. A huge profit maker for CC companies

I once had the misfortune of working at a temporary job for an insurance company that handled credit protection plans (similar to the fraud protection model) on store charge cards.

They make huge profits from this because even when people make minimum payments, or a few dollars over, and even when they never use the card, their balance continues to go UP.

In addition, half the people who called said they never signed up for the credit protection plan and did not know they were being charged. I believe them because I had the same experience. I got a charge card from that store and the credit protection plan was in place without my signing up for it. If you check your statement they also place the charge in an area separate from other charges where it's harder to find.

I spoke with many elderly who have trouble understanding how these scams work who had balances near $10,000 due to these scams, when otherwise their balances would have been nearly payed off.

These companies are pure evil.

Edit: Interestingly, we had on our computer screens the amount of money each person paid into the plan in addition to their CC balances. There were very few if any cases when a card holder actually processed a legitimate claim that paid as much as what they paid into it.

[Just Me]

30. I think it involves CIA or military intelligence infiltratration.

The neoCON cabal seeks a means of thoroughly vetting the financial transactions of every US citizen. There's been quite a few stories about the problems associated with the means by which our new intelligence can sort through huge data dumps.

Anyway, the FBI is suppose to be investigating the most recent event which allegedly involves one person. Has the name of that individual been revealed? :shrug:

Anyway, that's my theory. But, what do I know? Not much, not really.

[Norquist Nemesis]

42. *Ahem* -- Check this out! (long)

This was from Feb 2002, so just think of the possibilities 3 years later. (I emphasized a few items I thought relevant to the continuing evolution of investigating US citizens.) Entire testimony at link.

Congressional Testimony

Testimony of Dennis M. Lormel, Chief, Financial Crimes Section, FBI
Before the House Committee on Financial Services, Subcommittee on Oversight and Investigations
February 12, 2002

http://www.fbi.gov/congress/congress02/lormel021202.htm
"Financial Review Group

In order to provide a comprehensive analysis of the financial evidence, the DOJ and FBI established an inter-agency Financial Review Group (FRG) operating out of FBI Headquarters. Other participants in the FRG include representatives of the Central Intelligence Agency, National Security Agency, Defense Intelligence Agency, Drug Enforcement Agency, and components of the Treasury Department including the U.S. Customs Service, Internal Revenue Service, Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms, Office of Foreign Asset Control (OFAC), United States Secret Service and Financial Crimes Enforcement Network, U.S. Postal Inspection Service, National Drug Intelligence Center, the Federal Reserve, and the Inspector General Community. From the initial focus on the events of September 11th, the mission of the FRG has evolved into a broader strategy to investigate, prosecute, disrupt, and dismantle all terrorist-related financial and fund-raising activities. In the days immediately following September 11th, the FRG was formed with a two-fold mission. On one track, a comprehensive financial analysis of the 19 hijackers was conducted to link them together and to identify their financial support structure within the U.S. and abroad. Collateral to this was the development of a template for pro-active, preventive, and predictive terrorist financial investigations. The FRG has taken a leadership role in coordinating the financial investigative effort, and it is a comprehensive, far reaching effort. To accomplish our mission, the FRG has implemented, and continues to implement, strategies and initiatives to address all aspects of terrorist financing and explore all options. Among these are efforts to organize, catalog, and review vast amounts of personal and business records, develop linkage and time lines concerning terrorist cells and groups, facilitate Mutual Legal Assistance Treaty requests and Letters Rogatory, develop financial and investigative leads in support of terrorism investigations, identify criminally-related fund-raising activities by terrorist organizations, utilize the resources and expertise of the financial services community, develop a centralized financial database, and develop predictive analysis models. By bringing together participating agencies' databases and expertise, the FRG is focusing a powerful array of resources at the financial structure of terrorist organizations. Throughout this process, the FRG has worked closely with the Department of Treasury, which has primary responsibility for the blocking and freezing of terrorist assets.

Through the FBI's historical involvement with the intelligence community, the FBI and CIA quickly coordinated and further combined their resources to investigate terrorist funding mechanisms. This relationship facilitates a seamless interaction between the FBI and intelligence community, and is in addition to other key personnel the CIA and FBI each currently have assigned to the other's headquarters. The FBI in its intelligence capacity also obtains considerable intelligence information through Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act orders. The FRG works closely with this aspect of the FBI's Counterterrorism program in assessing and applying proper utilization of such information, pursuant to Attorney General Guidelines and the orders of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court.

The FRG has created and continues to develop a centralized terrorist financial database in concert with coordinating and assisting in the financial investigation of over 250 individuals and groups who are suspects of FBI terrorist investigations. To date, the FRG has cataloged and reviewed over 321,000 financial documents obtained as a result of numerous financial subpoenas pertaining to over 10,500 individuals and accounts. Over 104,000 of these documents have been verified as being of investigatory interest and have been entered into the terrorist financial database for linkage analysis. The FRG has obtained financial information from 54 FBI Field Divisions and 11 Legal Attache Offices, and has reviewed and documented over 66,000 financial transactions. These records include over 149 foreign bank accounts and over 5,300 foreign wire transfers.

The FRG is both an operational and coordinating entity with pro-active and reactive responsibilities. There are any number of approaches that can be utilized in investigating these networks. Success lays in careful coordination of these approaches. By way of example, various FBI Field Offices have launched criminal financial investigative initiatives geared at fraud schemes with a potential nexus to terrorist financing. The FRG is coordinating these initiatives as I will discuss later in my statement. As an operational body, the FRG conducts national and international investigations from its headquarters in Washington, D.C., while collecting information and directing leads to the JTTFs located in each Judicial District, as well as leads to other FBI Field and Legal Attache Offices around the world.

As a participant on the National Security Council's Policy Coordinating Committee (PCC) on terrorist financing, chaired by Treasury Department General Counsel David Aufhauser, the FRG continues to function in a leadership role in the efforts to target Non-Governmental Organizations (NGOs) believed to provide financial support to known Foreign Terrorist Organizations (FTO) and other affiliated terrorist cells. The FRG is currently actively involved in the coordination of twelve multi-jurisdictional NGO investigations. In order to disrupt the terrorist financing channels, the FRG has coordinated these and other FBI terrorist investigations with the terrorist designation and asset freezing efforts of the Department of Treasury's Office of Foreign Assets Control (OFAC) and Operation Green Quest. These efforts have resulted in the freezing of millions of dollars in foreign and U.S. bank accounts. Specifically, the joint efforts targeting Al-Barakaat, the Holy Land Foundation for Relief and Development, the Global Relief Foundation, and the Benevolence International Foundation have resulted in the execution of numerous search warrants and the disruption of the fund-raising and money remittance operations of these and other NGOs. Financial investigations of these entities have revealed that approximately $200 million in contributions passed through these organizations each year. The FRG will also coordinate with the Department of the Treasury in its other initiatives in order to help ensure their success.

The FRG has conducted an aggressive national and international outreach initiative in an effort to share information regarding terrorist financing methods with the financial community and law enforcement. The review group has built upon long-established relationships with the banking, debit, credit and financial services communities in the United States and abroad. The international outreach initiative is coordinated through the network of FBI Legal Attache Offices located in 44 key cities worldwide, providing coverage for over 200 countries, territories, and islands. The FRG has become an international model for investigating the financial components of terrorism. As a result, the FRG has assisted several foreign countries in their efforts to establish a financial terrorist investigative component that mirrors the structure of the FRG.

A significant focus of the FRG is predictive/preventive analysis. In this capacity, the FRG conducts data mining and financial profiling to identify common characteristics of terrorist financing. The FRG has developed numerous data mining projects in order to provide further predictive abilities and maximize the use of both public and private database information. This information will be used to identify terrorist cells operating in the U.S. and abroad in an effort to prevent further terrorist acts. Through the FRG's aggressive national and international outreach and liaison efforts, appropriate information regarding patterns and profiling is shared and coordinated with appropriate private and public sector entities. For example, the FRG meets regularly with representatives from the banking community and the financial services industry to share such information and to jointly develop and refine methods to detect and identify potential terrorist and/or terrorist activity. The FRG is also reviewing and conducting additional financial analysis of prior terrorist acts in an effort to identify links and patterns that would complement current and future terrorism investigations.

The FRG directly supports the FBI's Counterterrorism Division through financial analysis of terrorism investigations. While the FRG plays a key role in the overall Counterterrorism effort, it is but one piece of the big picture. Accordingly, careful coordination at all times is critical to ensure financial investigations complement the overall strategy and do not adversely impact other efforts. Based on the FRG's role in the FBI's Counterterrorism Division, its international investigative abilities, and its close association with the intelligence community, the review group is in a unique position to coordinate anti-terrorism financial investigations domestically and internationally, and to ensure those investigations are in harmony with the overall goals and objectives of the United States' Counterterrorism program.

Anti-terrorism financial investigations represent a comprehensive labor intensive long-term commitment. It is anticipated that in order to prepare predictive analysis in support of this effort, tens of millions of financial documents (bank records, travel records, credit card, and retail receipts, etc.) will need to be collected, thoroughly analyzed, and placed in a central database for relevant financial evidence. This evidence can then be integrated with other terrorist evidence collected by law enforcement and others. As I previously stated, the FRG has initiated a number of data mining projects in order to fully exploit the growing financial database and pro-actively identify and target potential terrorists and terrorist activity. This includes the use of predictive pattern recognition algorithms.

Given the enormity of the task and the long-term nature of the effort, I cannot sit here today or next week and tell you we have all the answers. It will take time to effectively and pro-actively address terrorism financing. This is not to say that progress hasn't been made. In conjunction with pro-active long-term efforts, the FRG continues to aggressively conduct intensive financial investigations as circumstances arise; dedicating necessary resources to react immediately to new information and evolving events. The FRG has made substantial progress in our efforts and I would like to offer this Subcommittee a brief summary of this progress, subject of course to restrictions related to the disclosure of information that might compromise or undermine ongoing criminal investigations.

We have focused our financial investigations in four main areas: (1) mission specific terrorist cells such as the 19 hijackers, (2) so called "sleeper" cells that are more loosely organized but blend into communities easier through legitimate employment, (3) terrorist groups that fund their terrorist activity through fraud schemes, and (4) the funding of terrorist organizations through Non-Governmental Organizations (NGO) and charities. I would like to focus the remainder of my statement on describing what we are doing in these areas and what progress has been made."

[flvegan]

33. I think that the CC companies are setting up their underwriters to pay

off any claims that might come in. The CC finance co isn't gonna pay, so their insurance carriers will. Probably won't even blink if it comes in under a set amount.

Yeah, yeah...sort of tinfoil hat-ish if I do say so myself.

[Pockets]

34. I suspected a terrorism plot or scare

I suspected the credit information was being stolen by professional terrorists, or that we are supposed to think that, so that they could wreak havoc on our financial system. It's not so much that they want to use our credit, as it is that they want to know each of our financial situations, particularly those with money.

[donsu]

36. kick

nt

[nini]

37. I have a credit watch wthrough Equifax

covers ALL my credit cards. Notifies me is credit is applied for using my SSN etc..

Having been a victim of identity theft I would never be without some kind of watch on my credit again. It's easier to spend $30 a year or so than deal with the aftermath of ID theft.

[Pockets]

40. Good idea

Whether or not losing our info is a conspiracy, it is a good idea that everyone safeguards their own financial information like they would their other property.

Although protection on individual credit cards are scams (IMHO) the comprehensive route you went sounds like a good idea.

[Eastside Blue]

43. Another alternative...

I've also been the victim of identity theft. The individual used the "instant credit" that you get when someone signs up for a new credit card. They just spent up to that limit and never cared to get the actual card - the address given didn't even physically exist.

I turned on a 7 year fraud alert with all three credit reporting agencies and get yearly free credit reports from https://www.annualcreditreport.com/cra/order?phone#WesternStates to ensure no new accounts have been opened in my name.

[Carni]

41. I agree completely and taking this one step further

I would be willing to bet that if you WON'T sign up for insurance then in the future you will be on your own if the cards are stolen and that people will be financially bound to pay what is charged in a bogus manner. I think this is a massive scam in other words.

[DemBones DemBones]

45. I'm betting the work to get the insurance to pay would

be monumental. We bought trip protection insurance last year, which was fortunate since we were unable to go on our trip, but the hoops we had to jump through to get them to pay off! :grr:

[spanone]

46. I saw that report and thought the same damned thing.

It is fucking extortion. Pay for the insurance or pay the price. Well what God-fearing, American loving, human being wouldn't cough up 25 bucks for a lil' old insurance.