DUers! Especially, in the Chgo area, show your love for Dick Durbin 7/22

[wndycty]

Hey everyone. I'm excited to let you know that I have been asked to serve on the Steering Committee of a Dick Durbin fundraiser on Friday, July 22 in Chicago! Tickets are $75.00.

Since this event is from 6:00 PM - 7:30 PM on a Friday night, I encourage those who within 4-5 hours driving distance of Chicago to come to town and make it a weekend!

Please PM me for details or to reserve tickets!

wndycty!

[brainshrub]

1. I wish Durban hadn't backed down after he spoke truth to power.

I'm sure Durban is a great Senator and an honest man, but he's already lost his re-election since he lives in a state with electronic voting machines. His only hope was to grow a pair and stand up to the RW propaganda.

Instead, he apologized like a baby for making an accurate description of what the administration is doing at the prison camps. Durban allowed the Republicans to frame the debate.

My advice: 1) Have him read "Don't think of an elephant." 2) Beg Dean to spend a lot of time in Illinois.

[QuettaKid]

3. F*CK dick durbin......nt.

;

[KittyWampus]

17. And Fuck DU'ers Who Refuse To Get Into The Trenches And Support Him

and don't bother to go after Hostettler for HIS remarks.

[Susang]

32. Cryingshame

:yourock:

[Name removed]

16. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[ElectroPrincess]

2. You must be joking?

Anyone who apologizes for something that is true, deserves to be punished. Nope, no way. We must teach our Democratic Congress Critters to grow a spine or be pushed out of office.

Losing their cushy jobs that includes medical benefits and guaranteed government pension is THE ONLY THREAT that MAY result in our "gutless wonder" representatives showing some resolve.

No Slack! :nuke:

At least no more kissy kissy and group hugs of forgiveness until you STAND UP FOR YOUR CONSTITUENTS ... do NOT EVER back down because now we are "taking notes."

[wndycty]

4. Do any of you have any appreciation for the f$#king hell this man . . .

. . .just went through?

[Nordmadr]

6. I am sure the pressure on him from the Republican

side was intense. I fully understand that, but I expect my leaders to lead, not cave when the heat is on. Not walk back out with their tails between their legs like a scolded pet.

Olaf

[in_cog_ni_to]

8. Even if you and your family were threatened with death???

Just askin'.

THINK PAUL WELLSTONE. HE and his FAMILY were threatened by Cheney at a rally and they are now DEAD.

[brainshrub]

11. Yes. Especially if he was threatened with death.

I expect every last one of my federal legislators to put their lives, and the lives of their families, on the line in order to protect my rights.

As an American it's my duty to die, if necessary, to protect the government... in return I expect the people in power to risk thier lives to protect my rights. Anything less means that person is not qualified to be in the congress.

[KittyWampus]

18. And What Did YOU Do To Back Up Durbin, HUH? Post A Few Lines On DU?

so many DU'ers now make me sick, it's getting to the point this place is close to useless.

[brainshrub]

20. DUers do a lot more than post.

I do what I can, we can't all be Senators.

As much as I would love to serve in the congress, it will never happen. Being a Senator is an enormous privilege, and with it comes the burden of knowing that you will occasionally be threatened by the plutocrats.

Bullying is what plutocrats do best.

I don't expect to agree with my legislators, but I do expect them to show some guts when the cookies are on the table.

[bpilgrim]

59. the 'pen' is mightier than the sword in this battle for the HEARTS & MINDS

how on earth can that 'disgust' you :shrug:

peace

[bpilgrim]

58. well said

:toast:

he are right NOW in a deadly battle with out right RADICALS and if they aren't CONFRONTED, especially in light of everything we now know, they are not worthy to LEAD.

peace

[Nordmadr]

15. Are the soldiers in Iraq not faced with death everyday?

Where is their fucking option out? Can they say, "Hey, sorry the Iraqi insurgents threatened me with death, so I've changed my mind, I'd like to go home now". As a veteran I find that question insulting.

Furthermore, I would have to say the speculatuion about him being threatened with death is just that, speculation. While I certainly would not rule it out, I have seen no evidence of that.

What happened to give me liberty or give me death?

Now it's give me liberty, until my poll numbers look bad.

Olaf

[brainshrub]

7. That's his job.

His job is to take the heat like a soldier. Boxer did it, so did Conyers.

[coffeenap]

10. I do. But isn't it time for our leaders to stand up and stay standing?

What is the threat that makes these people back down every time? I will support him--he and Obama are my Senators and I am proud to have them. But, what are the people closest to him (and the other dems in Congress,for that matter) telling him? Why aren't they working together to produce proof of threats against them and fighting like hell to unmask this evil admin? I am sure he feels his first priority is to keep his job so he can be effective, but when will they effect the change they are hanging on to their jobs for??

I was so proud of him when he told the truth. He gave me hope that our leaders are ready to take serious action to change this admin. I also know that what he said is still out there and continues to influence people, apology not withstanding. I appreciate that and him.

Thanks for the invitation to the fundraiser--can't be there, but I will support his reelection campaign.

[Rich Hunt]

12. ha

Are any of them even loyal Illinois Democrats?

Maybe some people never liked him to begin with.

Seems a bit strange for people to ignore his tenure in the Senate and use this one incident as an example of why he "has to go".

It's no secret here in Illinois that the right-wing hates Durbin with a passion.

[ElectroPrincess]

14. That's why we pay him the big bucks ... it may be time for him to resign?

[davsand]

24. Have I seen you in the Illinois forum?

Have I seen ANY of the folks in this thread who are bashing Durbin actively posting in the Illinois forum? I dunno. Seems to me the Illinois Dems are OK with Durbin (for the most part.)

-----

I know Durbin and I will defend him with my last breath because he's a man I am proud to have worked to keep in office. I know his staffers and we've worked together on more than one project. I was there when Durbin gave a memorial to Wellstone, and I KNOW how deeply he was impacted by Wellstone's death. There are not many men in DC that I'd personally rate any higher than Dick Durbin.

This whole mess in DC with Durbin (and before that with Dean and Obama) just makes me feel ill because it really illustrates how messed up the GOP AND the Dems really are right now.

Maybe it is because I deal with Illinois government EVERY day, maybe it is because I am a product of Illinois politics--hell--maybe it is because I hold office as a Dem--whatever the reason, I do not feel comfortable with the way we are trying to eat our own.

When you take office, you go in with really high personal expectations and goals. I have YET to know anyone who ran for office (and won) that intended to screw up once they got there. I have known a few who maybe didn't realize what they were in for--but it was universal that they wanted to make a positive contribution along the way. The guys at a national level are no exception.

There are times, in office, that you know what you want to do, but can't make it happen unless you do ______. There is always somebody there to offer a deal. Sometimes the deal isn't too terrible. For instance: Maybe another progressive comes to you and offers help with your project if you'll help with something they are doing. Everybody on the team is happy.

Sometimes it gets really creepy when somebody comes to you direct from the dark side and says, "If you'll give up on this small part of your plan I'll help you." You have to weigh the benefits of a part of the pie -vs- maybe not getting jack sh#t. You also have to know that there is a portion of your base that will chew you up one side and down the other for giving in on ANYTHING.

A few years ago somebody asked me if I was gonna be any less dead if I got buried on my high moral ground. I guess that kind of stuck with me, because since then I have been a lot more able to look at the idea that you CAN move in steps--it isn't gonna happen overnight (no matter how bad you want it to.) I don't go in my office every day just to screw up people's lives, and I can't imagine that ANY office holder does.

I've seen really good projects that would benefit a lot of people get voted down by progressives because they felt it was not enough, or was a compromise. (The same goes for conservatives too, so don't feel that I'm saying the left has sole dominance on idealism.) I have also seen people get chewed up for daring to say that MAYBE a bit of concession wouldn't kill us.

Durbin did an amazing thing in speaking out about Gitmo. Suddenly, our national conversation is about our treatment of the prisoners. Yes, he did apologize, but now there is a focus on WHAT is actually happening rather than a spin out of the WH that "There is nothing to see here--MOVE along!" He advanced the dialog and that is HUGE given the media we have currently.

Durbin has done a wonderful job as a Dem leader and I honestly think a lot of Dems don't realize just what he's dealing with because it has never really been Durbin's style to grandstand and throw a tantrum. Not everyone can BE a diva, nor should they aspire to be, because Divas become marginalized when they get overly dramatic.

I'll be glad when this storm passes on here, and everyone moves on to a new outrage. I'm hoping the next one is the GOP.


Laura

[ElectroPrincess]

25. Until Dems like Durbin TAKE ON and DON'T BACK DOWN ...

Don't expect a reprieve coming any time soon for those who value THEIR CAREER over the welfare of their constituents.

We've put up with the pink tutus in the Democratic Senate for too long. Now, it's fight the good fight, resign or get voted out.

[iconoclastic cat]

26. I must ask you this, though: Why did he "need" to apologize?

Not once, but three times?

[Susang]

36. Why don't you ask him?

He's your senator, correct? He's mine as well and I've always gotten a response when I've written him, so I suggest that you do the same, perhaps you'll get your answer.

Personally, I didn't find it to be much of an apology. It was more an apology for unintentionally hurting anyone's feelings, which is a lot different than apologizing for the remarks themselves, at least in my book.

[bpilgrim]

53. the CARTOON-WORLD-VIEW is enabled by this type of flip-flopping

there is NO DOUBT about how his comments are being reported in the M$M.

why do we let them continue to foster this DANGEROUS story-line :shrug:

i wish he would have clarified his remarks by pointing DIRECTLY to the neoCONs policy instead of our troops since it isn't ALL our troops, as the reTHUGs predictably like to shout out and is the only thing true in their argument.

if he adjusts his sights and focus like a laser i got his back... if not and he moves-on he will deserve all the scorn he receives.

this is battle for hearts and minds & we must NEVER surrender to the CARTOON WORLD VIEW.

peace

[More Than A Feeling]

29. Amen, Sister!

Couldn't have said it better. I am an Illinois Democrat myself, and I appreciate Dick Durbin and what he does for us. We are better off because he is in the senate. This one incident in no way negates years of loyal service to the Democratic cause.

[im10ashus]

57. Excellent post!

I am formerly from Chicago, just moved to Manhattan a year ago, and I don't GET this Durbin bashing. Obviously, I would have liked him to stand his ground, but I haven't been able to follow this as closely as I'd like. I DID email and call him telling him I support him when this all started. He needs our support now, more than ever, and this hate will divide us all. I supported him while I lived there; I'll continue that support from afar. Peace!

[Edgewater_Joe]

46. Boo Friggin' Hoo

Do YOU know the kind of Hell HE just gave to Democrats by backing off on the truth and letting the thugs of the Republican Party bend him over and Diallo-ize him?

I'm not going to abandon him like others on this board, but he's lost A LOT of chits with me on this one. I'll vote for him on election day, but if he wants me to do anything else for him he's got to re-earn my trust. He bitterly, BITTERLY disappointed me and he has to atone.

[bpilgrim]

51. does he understand the HELL our SOLDIERS and IRAQIS are going through?

:shrug:

peace

[wndycty]

52. Evidently he does or he would not have spoken up in the 1st place!

:kick:

[bpilgrim]

56. i thought so, too till he caved into the CARTOON-WORLD-VIEW

which only serves to PERPETUATE the hell.

if he gave it much consideration surely he must have known the right would be screaming bloody murder and known how damaging it would be to the cause to STOP these RADICALs if he then went back on what he said and feeding the perception that it ain't that bad... just a few liberal wackos who hate bush being over the top.

why do they feed this perception?

if it was an off the cuff response to a reporters ? i could understand perhaps but as you noted obviously he is aware of the HELL and gave it careful deliberation before he took the floor.

anyways... i hope he just decides to focus on the neoCONs the ones RESPONSIBLE for this FASCIST POLICY abroad & right here in the homeland.

:hi:

peace

[Nordmadr]

5. Durbin just embarassed me. I sent him a letter of support for

not backing down...and then he backs down. He is not tops on my list at the moment.

Olaf

[cthrumatrix]

27. good to know DU'ers never make a mistake

[Nordmadr]

35. I never claim to not make mistakes. In fact I am sure I make

them fairly often. We are all human, but if you read my other post here as well, #15, I think I explain my reasoning fairly well. I did not say I was banishing him from my thoughts for all eternity, I simply stated that I was disappointed in him. I was then questioned as to whether or not I feel he should stand up for what he believes even if he was receiving death threats. If the soldiers in Iraq have to fight for this governments causes to the death, should we expect no less from our elected leaders?

Now if he was simply grandstanding before with his comparisons, which I don't believe he was, then it becomes easier for him to back off some, but in the end, it makes him appear weak. This is not the time to appear weak. Not with hungry wolves lurking about.

Olaf

[bpilgrim]

60. smart DU'ers know how to accept CRITICISM

and smart leaders are paying attention to what the folks who are paying attention have to say.

that is all

peace

[KharmaTrain]

9. Post This In The Illinois Forum

Also, drop Bartcop a note. I know he's coming to Chicago around that time...he might want to join in on the fun.

[earthside]

13. Oh, no!

:sarcasm:
But if people show up they might be considered anti-American by the Republicans ...

And paying $75.00 might cause Rumsfeld to compare you to Jane Fonda ...

If you go it will be seen as undermining our troops ...

What will President Bush, our leader during a time of war, think about you if you go to a Durbin fundraiser???

wndycty should apologize for even posting this message.

-----

Yes, deserved sarcasm.
:sarcasm:

[kentuck]

19. Has Durbin hurt his re-election chances?

It's hard to imagine in Illinois but sometimes events are difficult to predict.

[ProfessorGAC]

22. No

He's a dead solid lock! He won the last election in a walk, the state is turning even bluer, and the Republican party is in disarray after the Keyes fiasco and Ryan disaster. I don't know a single person who voted for Keyes (even some older conservatives), and Ryan got trounced by a marginal candidate for the Dems.

Durbin is safe, despite this.

The Professor

[KharmaTrain]

23. He Won With Over 60% in 2002

He'd do 65% today. He's very popular in what's turning into a bluer and bluer state.

Don't pay any attention to what Richie Daley spewed...he's pandering to his buddy Denny The Bastard Hastert...and having Daley diss you works to one's advantage downstate.

As the other post stated, the GOOP in Illinois is still in disarray. It's gonna stay that way next year since the news will be dominated by George Ryan's trial.

[Nordmadr]

21. kick. n/t

[Logansquare]

28. I stand by my Senator

I think the "apology" was a mistake, but he's a hell of a good senator, and he hasn't made too many mistakes IMO. He votes as one of the most progressive in the Senate; punishing him for caving to the flying monkey squad is throwing the baby out with the bath water.

[Catrina]

30. I like Durbin

but was very disappointed when he apologized. First of all, the rabid rightwing is still calling him a traitor, he has now lost the support of many Democrats, and if he is as popular in Illinois as you say, I find it hard to understand why he apologized for telling the truth! Maybe someone can explain that. He has not benefited one bit, from what I can see.

Having said all that, though, and having watched Democrats cave time after time to the rantings and ravings of the anti-American, rightwing machine, maybe the blame goes to the fact that Democrats do not have an effective counter machine to slap these loudmouths down the minute the start flapping their lips.

Why do we not have an organized group of thousands, ready to go into action as soon as a situation like this occurs?

How on earth did they manage to make such a big deal out of a simple remark that most people would not even have noticed had they not been working hard to distract from the truth of what Durbin said?

How come the same outrage wasn't apparent from the left after Santorum's shameful Nazi remark about the Democratic party, or Frist's characterization of a Senate vote on judicial nominees as 'kiilling and assassination' of those nominees?

Maybe the fault isn't with Durbin et al, but with the fact that there is no organized support, other than a few people writing letters to support him, which I did. I did not know what else to do.

The rightwing puts money into their efforts ~ eg, right now, why is there no organized effort to characterize the silencing of Durbin as Nazi-like in itself? Where are the attacks on those 'American haters' Rush Limbaugh et al? Who refused to fight for their country, etc. etc? We have so much material, but it rarely gets used.

Durbin was facing criticism from his own party, also. From wimps who would rather look good rather than do what's right. Still, I do not think that apologizing has done anything good for him, except maybe shut up the fanatics until they find their next target. Which they will and again, we will not be ready for them! And we will witness another apology from a beleagured Democrat! :-(

[Logansquare]

34. I hated it too, but imagine being attacked by a machine

It wasn't just public opinion, Durbin was assaulted by one of the most effective propaganda machines that has existed outside of an outright dicatorship. I talk a little about branding, and how we need to fight back with more of the same here:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=1875107&mesg_id=1876333

[Catrina]

37. Thank you

I will check it out. Durbin is a good man, and many good men fell victim to other oppressive regimes in the past. Maybe this situation should be the catalyst to build a counter machine, rather than waste the energy adding fuel to the fire.

[Susang]

33. As do I

He has done so much good for this state and is an incredible man.

I may not like the way things turned out with this so-called apology, but I understand why he said what he said. The people on DU who are dissing him can all kiss my ass! :grr:

[LoZoccolo]

38. A lot of people on DU can kiss my ass!

I wonder if my ignore list has reached 300 yet. I've kind-of decided that if someone posts something here that's a big enough breach against practical politics, they have wasted my time and likely will not get the opportunity to do it again.

[Susang]

41. Can't let them get you too mad

After all, it's just the internet. ;-)

[LoZoccolo]

39. I just counted; I have 286 people on ignore.

Getting close, though.

[Nordmadr]

40. Good to see you are so tolerant of others and differing views.

Why don't you go ahead and add me to your list.

Olaf

[LoZoccolo]

43. I am tolerant of others and differing views.

I also realize there are only twenty-four hours in a day, and only a year and a half until the 2006 elections. If I find people using patently ridiculous logic, or showing a tendency to speak very brashly from an ill-informed perspective, I will not waste the time I give to my country and it's people on getting further snared in someone's objectionable cant when they are disrespecting the cause itself, the people involved in the cause, and their resources in acting intellectually or strategically lazy or overemotional. It's also very rare that I waste even more time trying to correct people who are just here to show off or engage in rhetorical masturbation. Do you waste your time listening to right-wing radio hosts who repeatedly lie and use twisted logic?

[Nordmadr]

44. No, but I guess my point was that 300 ignores seems to me to

be an exhorbitant amount, that at face value, reflects an unwillingness to listen to different opinions from people that are, in all likelihood, going to agree with you with you more often than disagree. Nearly 300 people on this board have annoyed you so much that you feel they are no longer worthy of any consideration on your part whatsoever?

It seems to me that having open discussions with people about things you disagree on would sometimes lead you to see something as you had not perceived it before. There can be many solutions to a single problem. I do not make a habit of listening to right-wing radio hosts, but do on ocassion, to remind myself what it is I am fighting against. That kind of close minded mentality breeds yes men and is at least partly responsible for the predicamnets we find ourselves in today.

Your statement seemed to be indicative of a lack of understanding as to why individuals would be upset with Senator Durbin's apology. I was upset that he had apologized, as I indicated in this thread. It seems to me that Senator Durbin is an intelligent man, and likely put some thought into what he was going to say on the Senate floor before saying it, and considered what some of the reactions would be. He decided to say it anyway becasue he believed in it. If you believe in something, have the guts to stick with it when you come under fire as you surely will. If you do not believe it, you should not have said it to begin with. The waffling and apologizing hurts us more. Does my differing opinion mean that I have no cognizant understanding of the inner workings of politics? I don't believe so, but I am open to the fact that it may be possible.

Politics seem to me inherently emotional. It covers such a broad spectrum of issues that you can not help but become emotional about it when it deals with something you feel strongly about. It is our lives, our country, our environment, and our very humanity at stake. So when I see someone back down under pressure, I feel we have lost something. I don't believe we can afford to lose much more. Not now in this time. Our environment is warning us. Our economy is warning us. Our neihbors are warning us. Do we have to get hit in the head with a yield sign before we look?

Olaf

[LoZoccolo]

45. I generally disagree with a lot of people on DU.

This is because I want to be in the business of getting things done, making actual progress, and I feel that most people here are here to complain and vegetate. I also have more moderate views. However, I've found that when people post good things at DU, they tend to be very good.

No, but I guess my point was that 300 ignores seems to me to be an exhorbitant amount, that at face value, reflects an unwillingness to listen to different opinions from people that are, in all likelihood, going to agree with you with you more often than disagree.

That might be because you don't know why each person was ignored. I come to DU for a few reasons...why would I want people distracting me from those? I think I have a right to manage my time.

It seems to me that having open discussions with people about things you disagree on would sometimes lead you to see something as you had not perceived it before.

I agree. But when people are being open-faced ridiculous, and using stupid and manipulative tactics to push a point that doesn't have what it takes to stand on it's own, showing off, or pushing a counterproductive agenda, they are disrespecting my time and resources, and are disrespecting the cause of everyone I hope to serve in doing political work. They are not adding to my perception of things. I don't think that it's unreasonable to expect people to be credible, and give my limited attention to people who are willing to establish and maintain their credibility.

Your statement seemed to be indicative of a lack of understanding as to why individuals would be upset with Senator Durbin's apology.

I don't think so at all. Some people have expressed disappointment without going so far as to be destructive or self-gratifying; I haven't put them on ignore. I'm somewhat disappointed myself.

Politics seem to me inherently emotional. It covers such a broad spectrum of issues that you can not help but become emotional about it when it deals with something you feel strongly about.

All I ask is that it not interfere with progress. We need more kung-fu and less drunken barfighting if we intend to get what we want.

[Nordmadr]

48. Now we are having a productive dialogue.

This is because I try to be in the business of getting things done, making actual progress, and I feel that most people here are here complain and vegetate. I also have more moderate views. However, I've found that when people post good things at DU, they tend to be very good, and that's why I stay.

While we would probably disagree on some of our politics (I tend to be significantly left of center, though it is hard to tell these days)I also want to see things get done. My fear is that we will find we can't fight against radicals moderately.

That might be because you don't know why each person was ignored. I come to DU for a few reasons...why would I want people distracting me from those? I think I have a right to manage my time.

This is also true. I do not know why you ignored these individuals. Some may have attacked you, annoyed you, perhaps trolls, etc. You are certainly entitled to managing your time as you see fit, but again I would just like to express my OPINION that I feel you may be cutting off alot of reasonable discussion with a list that large. Someone ignored for "X" reason will then never be able to have a potentially enlightening and valid discussion with you.


I like the kung-fu analogy. Focus and control.

Olaf

[bpilgrim]

54. r u bragging or disturbed?

i have 0 on ignore because i prefer DU uncut ;->

or did i just make the CUT?

peace

[Susang]

31. If I had the money

You know I'd be there!

Hope you're doing well! :hi:

[Robbien]

42. Me too

There are so many causes which need help and all my money is committed for the next several months.

I did write LTTE of support for Durbin which the Sun-Times called and said they were considering. Its just a little thing, but little things may help.

Hope this event is a success for Senator Durbin.

[orleans]

47. what's the fund raiser for?

shouldn't we be putting the little money we have into candidates who are running in 2006?

[TheUnspeakable]

49. I love and support my Senator..............

and tell him so regularly (well maybe not the "love" part, but the "support' part) I hope that everyone that is bashing him here knows his record and what he stands for. This whole fiasco just makes me sick-Nobody is more supportive of our troops than Durbin. This man is on the senate floor day after day fighting for more money for them, better benefits, better equipment etc.,-Standing up to these disgraceful Repukes ALL THE TIME! So, he felt pressure to apologize-I realize how disappointing that is, but in this case,I think he felt that the sheeple would NEVER understand what happened and our military is his soft spot-I don't think he could bear the thought that they might think he was dissing them (which of course he wasn't-thanks again fair and balanced media) I would love to attend this fundraiser but don't know if I can afford it.
STOP BASHING MY SENATOR!!!!! (please) you're doing just what Rush,O'lielly, etc. want you to do.

[wndycty]

50. Kick

:kick:

[Jacobin]

55. For crying and whimpering like a baby and reneging on the truth???

In your fucking dreams