Ahh cool calculating Hillary.. what have you wrought on DU????

[Perky]

I am both amused and delighted to see so many DUers tagging HRC with a conservative label for supporting the war and lashing out against vidoe games.

Tha Naivete on this site at times is astounding.. Time to grow up kids.

This is Hillary innoculating herself against charges that she will gut the military if elected and is in the back pocket of Hoillywood sleeze.

These are two very known tactics or the right to desroy democratic candidacies.

Is that a bad thing? The last election was lost because the american people were convince that on the "shares my values" question...W was better the Kerry. This is where elections get decided...because the values question is important to the ones who always show up to vote.

So is Hillary comments about Grand Theft Auto flips a few thousand suburban moms and dads in Ohio...all the better.

[BlueEyedSon]

1. Supporting the war = bad. Lying about supporting the war = bad.

[Perky]

2. Which war?

The War in Iraq or the war on Terrorists?

[BlueEyedSon]

5. I dunno, you started ("supporting the war")

[Warren Stupidity]

19. The warn terr is a fiction

They are using and have been using 9-11 to phony up a 'war' against some nebulous enemy that can never be defeated. It is war without end. It is a replacement for the Cold War, which the Cabal now realizes that they were stupid to have allowed to end. Are there bad guys out there trying to blow shit up right here in the USofA? Sure. Is that a war? No. You fight those sorts of groups with your police and intelligence forces. The big lie tossed out by Rove the other day, that we have all once again signed up for, is that we are in a War against Evile Terrsts. What war? What front? What military force are our troops fighting?

Its a warn-terr so we have to scrap the bill of rights. Its a warn-terr so you have to take your shoes off to get on an airplane. Its a warn-terr so every public event is a 'security zone' where unreasonable search and seizure is now legal. Its a warn-terr so public assemblies can be moved to 'free speach zones' out of sight and hearing. Its a warn-terr so it is ok to create a planetary gulag and toss unknown thousands into it for perpetuity, or until the warn-terr is won, which it never will be as it is war without end.

[radwriter0555]

3. Senator Clinton has never ever spoken about running for the Presidency,

other than to say she's NOT considering a run for the Presidency. Every single word you see out in the idiot american media about the fine Senator from New York running for President comes from either (a) some one or organization she's not aligned with nor endorsed, or (b) some republican idiot.

She's never ever said she is considering a run for presidency. Every single statement she's made says she's not.

It's moot... but the GOP uses her like a terrorist. To scare the shit out of more republicans.

[Perky]

11. Ummm...

I think what she has said is that she is focused on getting re-elected to the Senate. I have never heard he utter a Shermanesque like staetment.

[w13rd0]

4. Want us to take you seriously?

Bother to recall that it was John KERRY, not Bob KERREY that ran as the Democratic nominee in 2004.

Other than that, Hillary will likely not be my choice in the primaries.

[Perky]

7. oops soorry only had once cup of coffee

[Warren Stupidity]

6. Sorry but I don't buy it for a minute.

If HRC gets the nomination I will work my ass off to get her elected, but she is simply not my choice for heading the ticket.

Democratic candidates have been coached to 'run to the right' and 'avoid the liberal label' by the bigwigs and dlc puppet masters for 20 years. For 20 years we have been losing ground. For 20 years we have been watching the political discourse move ever rightward as our 'opposition party' tries to win over the ruling party's base by pandering to their worst qualities. Meanwhile 'liberal' has become a bad word. Meanwhile nobody knows what the Democratic Party stands for.

How about we run candidates that stand for and proudly proclaim liberal and progressive values? How about if we are going to have elections stolen, at least people who voted for our candidates did so knowing that they represented a real alternative, that they advocated programs and policies that even the most apathetic voting age adult could understand as clearly different than what the Ruling Party is proposing?

[slor]

10. I agree...

I want someone with better liberal credentials. But I will support her, if she is the one. I also want someone that is going to be radical, with issues such as global warming and renewable energy. The centrist Dems and the right-wing rethugs, have all now had their turn at the driver's seat of this country. It is now time for someone that wants to drive it as a Prius, and not a humvee!

[Senior citizen]

18. Candidates are chosen for how much money they can raise.

Their views don't seem to matter. If our candidate next time supports the right-wing agenda, what can we do about it--vote for the puke candidate? Besides, there will be plenty of operatives here on DU telling us that our candidate really doesn't think that way, it is just being said for electability, or that they'll change their mind once elected, etc. The sad fact is that the rich are different from you and I, but we're supposed to vote for them anyway. I like Hillary, but if the Democratic Party really cared about what the grass roots think, and about democracy, we'd have a Conyers/Waters ticket because that's who cares and who fights for us.

[Warren Stupidity]

21. I think you have that backwards

The Cabal funds the candidates in both parties that it wants to run, and they are well funded. That is why Dean is such a threat: he established independent funding channels out of the control of the Cabal and undermined the whole system.

[sendero]

20. I agree...

... and well said.

I'm all about taking risks, but intelligent risks. Hillary isn't a good example of an intelligent risk, and running toward rather than away from the glaring failures of Bush** and his Repub advisors is not a winning strategy.


It's time to differentiate ourselves from the multiple failures of the right. And if the economy is headed where I think it is headed, we'll have a populace ripe for a more progressive message in 2008.

[Deja Q]

8. Possible. But they'll still use the feeeeeeear of abortion and "socialist"

health care to ruin her. Enen when it was far better than the corporate mush of the time and far better now.

They will find anything and spin it so much to make the current slophole sound better.

And enough of the idiots will blindly believe it too.

[bunkerbuster1]

17. The OP's point is still valid, though.

of course the Reeps will go with the tried-and-true "Socialist Hitlery da Bitch" line of attack as they have for 13 years already.

That's great for rousing their own folks, and especially for raising buttloads of money for their war chests. But it doesn't necessarily translate into more votes. I've observed over the past 13 years that the Reeps always go overboard and wind up alienating people with their rather ungentlemanly attacks.

That's why guys like Sean Hannity have tried to stay "above" the crude, gutter level junk in Ed Klein's new book. They know there's such a thing as too much piling on.

Anyway, these are all volleys, we're a long way from game/set/match.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

9. Conservative is as conservative does.

Hillary supported the invasion and still supports the occupation. Much like Kerry and Bush.

Smart, cynical, politics? Maybe, in 2004. In 2008, it will come back to bite her pathetic ass.

[chelsea0011]

12. As to Grand Theft Auto..........I play it and won't let my kids near it

This game shouldn't be anywhere near children. And it's a fun game.......for older ads and adults. It's called taking a postion on an easy dafe issue that calms the souls of Middle America. it's why flag burning is being re-hashed in Congress with all the more pressing matters left to fester. Don't burn the flag calms the souls of Middle America.

[fasttense]

13. The last election was lost not because of the values question

but because the repukes rigged it. You can not use those bogus election numbers to support your argument when so many people were prevented from voting and so many machines were malfunctioning, not to mention all the districts that had more votes than voters. It's not who votes that counts but who counts the votes.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

15. Kerry lost the election because he was weak candidate.

On a weak, pro-war platform that pandered to the rightwing.

[Warren Stupidity]

16. exactly. EOM.

[bahrbearian]

14. Its a good thing we have you adults around to guide us,,

because as a child, I would never have given Chimpy the IWR.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

22. See Perky, that's what people are tired of,

politicians who vote tactically instead of according to their consciences.

[Boredtodeath]

23. Not! It's time for the DLC to realize we don't want DYNASTIES

As much as I don't want a Bush Dynasty, I don't want a Clinton Dynasty either.

It's time for the DLC to understand that we don't want or like candidates who say whatever it takes to get elected.

For once, Rove is right - VALUES MATTER - and fake values put on to win votes, matter most.

[radwriter0555]

24. AND BY THE WAY, we didn't "LOSE" the 'last election'. It was railroaded

and stolen courtesy of DIEBOLD.

We didn't "LOSE" the 2000 election either. It was stolen as well.

It isn't winning when the fuckers cheat.

[welshTerrier2]

25. your "innoculation" justification is pathetic

let's see, she should vote with the republicans and bush's neo-cons to spend every penny they ask for to continue the occupation in Iraq ... sure it's US imperialism that's led to the deaths of tens of thousands ... but those nasty republicans won't be able to tag her with a soft on defense, anti-military label ...

by this reasoning, she should always vote exactly the way republicans vote ...

she could start using phrases that stop just short of calling for the mass slaughtering of all the "abortionists" ... no sense leaving herself wide-open to all those who hate the "baby murderers" ... maybe she could even vote for an extreme right-wing judge or two ... ya know, i'm starting to like this innoculation idea more and more ...

she could, like, ya know, totally look and sound like a fucking republican and then, after she's elected, she could do all the things we really wanted her to do in the first place ...that's a pretty small price to pay for 8 years with bush in the WH ...

she could vote against the best interests of the American people, help bush bankrupt our economy, destroy US credibility around the world, aid the cause of US imperialism, and then ... whammo !!!! we'll have a genuine progressive in the WH ...

instead of worrying so much about what the republicans will say, how about having Hillary represent the rest of us ... no, Hillary will never get my vote after seeing her shameless support of bush's foreign policy agenda ...