"I will fuck you up! Don't fuck with me!" ---What is happening to us?

[Bluebear]

Instead of simply driving away or calling the police, Raquel Shaw got on a cell phone and called her husband, witnesses said. She waited in the area for several minutes until her husband arrived in a Mercedes.




A chiropractor who killed a man at a car wash in March was angry because the victim called his wife "a bitch" during a traffic altercation, according to courtroom testimony Tuesday.

"Look out for who you call a bitch," Stephen Shaw was heard saying moments before he shoved Lawrence Weiss, 60, to his death at the Fabulous Freddy's car wash, 1101 S. Fort Apache Road, at Charleston Boulevard.

Shaw, 36, a chiropractor, is charged with second-degree murder in the March 11 death of Weiss, a retired music executive.

Authorities said Weiss and Shaw's wife, Raquel, were in a traffic dispute near the car wash just before the attack. In a fit of rage, police said, Stephen Shaw shoved Weiss into a propane tank cage, causing Weiss to suffer a fatal head injury.

http://www.reviewjournal.com/lvrj_home/2005/Jul-13-Wed-2005/news/26873319.html

[GreenPartyVoter]

1. Unreal!

[Bluebear]

2. Need for revenge will trade his BMW & Mercedes for prison time

At least, hopefully it will.

[bribri16]

38. He's probably on meth. n/t

[Radio_Lady]

40. This gives ROAD RAGE a new meaning! Jeeze... what a story!

[Touchdown]

3. Rampant nationalism/triumphalism does that to people.

When a people are looking at massive debt, and an economy that isn't ever going to allow them out of it, not to mention a belligerant leadership, we get this kind of belligerant behavior in the general populace as well. Look what happened to Rome on it's way to collapse. Gladiator action anybody?

Notice I didn't say the "N" word?

[Uncle Joe]

25. I would be willing to bet a dollar against a doughnut

That he is a major FOX news fan.

[Divernan]

28. Same attitude as people with "The Power of Pride" bumper stickers

I can't understand how all these conservative/probably church-going Christians use this bumper sticker. I was taught that "pride goeth before a fall" and that hubris is not a virtue. This guy and his wife seem to have bought into viewing a wife as the property of a husband, and if someone disses her, they have dissed the husband. Sort of "How dare someone mess with what's MINE!?!"

She's an adult - she could have called a cop if she felt threatened.

[SteppingRazor]

4. Shaw seems like a pretty nasty guy, but...

It also seems like he didn't intend to kill the man. I think 2nd degree murder is a little harsh. This is definitely nothing worse than manslaughter. Let the punishment fit the crime.

[Bluebear]

6. He wasn't even at the scene.

The damsel in distress called her husband to come down to the station and I think that's what is really going to hurt him. He had time to premeditate on the drive, maybe?

[Finder]

8. Well, he did intend harm...

so it sounds like Murder II--sort of like a crime a passion.

I can't believe this is over name calling. Why didn't the wife just tongue lash him back or smack him for that matter?

[barb162]

12. She wanted the guy to get a real beating so she called hubby

[Sterling]

34. The wife sounds like real bitch.

If hubby wants to come talk about it with me he can PM me and I will tell him where he can find me.

[WI_DEM]

41. no

when the man was called by the wife he had time to think about his actions. He could have told the wife to let it go or to call the cops and he decided he had to come to "Raquel's " rescue and act like a he-man. I think the charge fits the crime. The wife is the instigator though and will get no punishment.

[paula777]

5. Some people are just filled with rage and can't control their behavior

In Los Angeles, we have had a bunch of freeway shootings. If these 'gang members' get behind you and decide you are driving to slow, they pass you and as they are passing you, the passenger shoots several rounds at you. Scary stuff happening out there - escpecially because I'm one of those 'slow drivers'

[Jokerman]

7. Second degree my ass

He traveled to that car wash seeking revenge for the insult to his wife. Sounds like murder to me.

[truebrit71]

9. Obviously has a small penis....

;-)

[shelley806]

10. I'm surprised that he had enough patients to afford a Mercedes!....his

bedside manner can't be that good.

[devilgrrl]

17. Just because he drives a Mercedes doesn't mean he can "afford" it

I've known plenty that drive BMW's, Benz's, SAAB's, etc... and other than that, haven't a pot to piss in. It's all about status.

[shelley806]

33. LOL! Well, his status has certainly taken a nosedive I'd say! eom

[Stinky The Clown]

11. I also see this as modeling the behavior of 'our leaders'

Can't you realistically imagine Newt or Cheney or Rove or Mehlmean or DeLay or a hole host of RW thugs doing this shit?

I can.

[Bluebear]

14. And right wing talk radio

The hopping mad "We're not going to take this shit" anymore exhortations from Hannity and the like is infecting our behavior. I am not saying this guy even listened to him, heck he may be a Democrat for all I know. But the mood in this country is not good.

[dddem]

30. I agree

I've said before, people seem to be in perpetual state of 'pissed off'.

[Straight Shooter]

22. Well, yes, as a matter of fact, the American Enterprise Institute VP

The gorilla who shoved the ballerina off her bicycle. We don't even have to imagine it. It happened.

As for this guy, he got more and more steamed on the way to the car wash. His adrenaline was probably going 90 mph by the time he arrived. Being well-educated in physiology, he knew damn well what his adrenalin combined with his body strength could do.

I say murder, not manslaughter.

[CrispyQ]

13. Murder vs manslaughter

snip...

Defense attorney Pete Christiansen did not dispute that his client shoved Weiss.

However, he said Stephen Shaw never intended to kill him.

"What happened should have never happened," Christiansen said. "But it's not a murder case."

===

The justification that because someone didn't intend for something bad to happen has become a common defense of perpetrators in our society. We all do things that cause events that we didn't intend. There are consequences for your actions. Regardless if your actions caused events you didn't plan, you are still responsible for what you have done.

I need some education here. I'm not sure what the difference between manslaughter & murder is. Is it intent? Does this guy's attorney think he should be up on manslaughter charges instead of murder? Cuz, personally, I think murder is an appropriate charge here. The guy definitely intended to intimidate & threaten. I hope this guy gets some major prison time. I'm curious what others think.

We are not as far from having crawled out of the cave as most people would like to believe.

[Bluebear]

16. Shaw didn't offer any medical assistance either...

Police say Shaw walked away after Weiss hit his head and someone else summoned medical assistance. Shaw did not appear to show any interest in Weiss' injuries, police say.

http://www.reviewjournal.com/lvrj_home/2005/Mar-31-Thu-2005/news/26191190.html

[JanMichael]

21. He's a fuckin' chiropractor, wtf could he have offered? A realignment?

Or maybe a foot massage?

I mean the guy's an obvious violent fruitcake but what sort of emergency medical treatment do you expect from chiropractors?

[Bluebear]

23. I expect he knows at least to apply pressure to a bleeding wound

Hell, don't we all know that?

[JanMichael]

26. I don't know of too many killers that provide assistance to their victims.

I also thought that you were refering to actual emergency medical care because he was a "Doctor" (My quotes not yours) which got me going. Sorry if I was wrong:-)

[Bluebear]

29. Nah, I just quoted the paper/cops who said he didn't offer assistance

I think that will confirm the prosecution going for murder 2. Instead of saying "oh, what have I done" and staying at the scene and helping, he instead saw the guy bleeding and just walked away.

[Finder]

18. Also, seems the wife fibbed

about him pushing her down. The husband may have thought the other guy assaulted her--which is a bit illogical but seems a lot of illogical emotions were exhibited here by all parties.

[Gormy Cuss]

15. Here's hoping our justice system works

Wow, I wonder about the chiropractor's history. That's a considerable amount of rage for name-calling. He had no business initiating a confrontation in the car wash. I'll be interested in the outcome.

[devilgrrl]

19. Now his Yenta of a wife will have to call him in prison.

That guy looks like he couldn't care less about what he did.

[dogday]

20. We are a nation of rage and love

We balance that fine line everyday. The idea is not to cross over to the rage part and stay on the love. The path is not always straight, it bends and so do we. We are a nation of violence, we are numb to it. It is everywhere in our lives.

I hope that I never cross the line this guy has, you can never go back to anything in your life after this. Things will never be the same for this man, he can't take this back...

[fishnfla]

24. road rage is the quintessential american phenomenon

comes from sitting around on your ass too much, and having ass for brains

[Hope springs eternal]

27. The schools here are no different...

In suburban Philly, it's all about the violence...

[Bluebear]

31. Welcome to DU HSE

Glad to have you.

[Rex]

32. Looks like someone watched WAY to much TV!

nt

[earth mom]

35. There's a LOT of road rage out there especially in the big cities....

that's one reason we left Southern California which is an insane place to drive! One night I had gone to the store near my house and made a quick right in front of this guy turning left and he followed me all over the place as I tried to lose his ass! I was terrified! I even went to a small police sub station and he followed me there and I was too scared to get out of the car. Since it was around 10 there were few cars on the road and it was difficult to lose him. After about an hour, when I finally thought I'd lost him, I went home and he found me there! Luckily my dh and my dad calmed him down but I tell ya, it was a frightening experience! He may have killed me if it wasn't for my dh and my dad! :scared:

[alcibiades_mystery]

36. 2nd degree murder seems like an overcharge

They're probably doing it because he contemplated going down there to do the man harm, and it's therefore depraved indifference. But this still seems like a manslaughter charge to me.

[lateo]

37. Anyone want to guess who he voted for?

Hmmm...

[chaska]

39. Not to excuse what he did, just want to point out something...

I once had a girlfriend that tried to turn me into that Mercedes guy. She created this big conflict with a neighbor and almost had me about to kick the guy's ass. Then I came to my senses and realized that he too was an old man. And you don't beat up old men.

[msongs]

42. but you woulda beat up a young one cuz WAS a bitch? n/t

[sendero]

43. All I can say is....

.... it is very clear to me that the husband and the wife are a match made in heaven, peas in a pod, deserve each other.

And I'll bet 10 dollars to a donut she did cut the guy off.