How would you respond to these bigots?

[kayell]

My granddaughter is a mixed race child. Her mother is a teacher at a Montessori school where my gd is a student. Yesterday my daughter was out in the hall, where a few of her coworkers were talking together and overheard them talking (they were making no attempt to keep the coversation private and were well aware that she was there). One of these insufferable bigots said, "well I know that everyone feels differently about these things, but I just don't believe that God meant for the races to produce children together" the other replied "I know, I'm not prejudiced, but it just doesn't seem like Gods plan". :mad:

My DD in a fury simply walked off. She said that these coworkers are well aware of my granddaughters parentage. I told her she should have called them on it with something along the line of "You know of course, that you are talking about me and C___" said in the most haughty tone she could manage, while looking straight into their eyes with an expression of complete digust at their bigotry.

She said that she didn't because it wouldn't change anything, that they were the sort that would just hold to their opinion anyway, while I said that they should at the very least be made to know that their conversation was extremely offensive. What would you all do?

[T Roosevelt]

1. My general religious reply

"Why that's mighty Christian of you."

[meegbear]

15. I couldn't have said it better ...

[DemVet]

44. Not a bad reply, but...

....I'd take religion out of the equation altogether. It distracts, I feel, from the disgust of racism.

Speaking from experience, my daughter was in the 2nd grade and came home from school and said some kids called her a "brownie." My wife and I are of different races. I called my daughters teacher and told her of the occurrence. I was assured she would be vigilant for this type of behavior in the future and it would be firmly dealt with. No further incidents occurred.

Bottom line - I'd inform the school administration. This is harassment and racism, pure and simple. DON'T STAND FOR IT AND HOPE IT GOES AWAY. IT WON'T.

[Arianrhod]

66. I think maligning a person's religion

is generally not a good response, even if the behavior in question is motivated by that religion. Perhaps a better response might have been, "Is that what Jesus said? Can you show me that in the New Testament?"

It's difficult to confront people like this without becoming angry, but believe it or not, anger is precisely the response they're looking to elicit. It brings us down to their level, reinforces their sense of self-righteousness, sets up their defenses, and generally does nothing to mitigate the situation. A cool head always prevails--but it requires an extreme amount of self-control. This must be worked on in private, in order to be practised in public.

The Apostle Paul advised us to do good to our enemies, thereby "bringing down coals of fire upon their heads". IMO, the only way to defeat racist attitudes is to bring shame to the racist, and that won't happen if we counter their statements with equally disparaging remarks. Better to walk away, as this woman did.

[Caution]

2. This is of course borderline harassment

In the workplace this is pretty close to harassment. If it happens again she should report it since they were clearly directing the conversation at her.

[sangh0]

13. Call the Civil Rights Division of the Dept of Justice

This is the definition of a "hostile environment". Make them learn that while they are entitled to their opinion, as obnoxious as it is, they are in either a place of business (if it's a private school) or a public facility, they have NO RIGHT to harass children.

And go to the next Parent Teachers meeting and make sure many people hear about it. Let whoever runs this school worry about a gang of angry parents (assuming that local opinion does look down on that sort of bigotry)

[Cassandra]

3. How about...

Oh, that old dodge; I'm not prejudiced, but God is. She might ask them who are they to judge what God doesn't seem to have a problem with.

[PunkinPi]

4. I think I'd say

"there is only one race and that of course is the human race, why don't you try joining it?"

[efhmc]

5. That is a great thought and statement. thanks.

[PunkinPi]

14. you're welcome :)

[Yupster]

59. And that one and only race

was made in the image of god.

[poskonig]

6. God doesn't exist.

Invisible clouds in the sky do not have "plans."
:P

[birdman]

7. Ask them "Why does God want you

to be such a redneck goober"

:grr::grr:

[CO Liberal]

9. So The Rest Of Us Have Someone To Make Fun Of

:-)

[patdem]

8. Wait...the Middle East...that is where Jesus is from no???

The Middle East is so 'mixed' ... what pure bred aryan race does Jesus hail from again?

[ShaneGR]

10. It's really simple, hit them with religion.........

Have her ask them where Jesus was born (Bethleham) and then ask her what region of the world this is in. Then have her ask them what color of skin people had there.

[Misinformed01]

11. Halle Berry was a MISTAKE??

Seriously, she should have asked them for a blueprint of God's plans,(at the very least, they belong in the Smithsonian) why they feel they were selected to be privvy to such information from God himself, and didn't they think that insulting God by assuming that he somehow fucked up is somehow blasphemous?

I would have raked them over the coals personally; but I would have shoved their petty religious beliefs right down their throats.

[Muddleoftheroad]

32. Great line

The only mistake about Halle is that she is not with me. ;)

[T Wolf]

12. she should report them

to those in charge of the school. It can be couched in terms of questioning whether these teachers(?) can be expected to perform their duty (teach) toward students against whom they are obviously and openly prejudiced.

Confront and attack them and get them fired from the school. That kind of garbage has no place, especially in a school.

[DiverDave]

16. I would

tell both of them that you will not rest until they are fired!

DESPICABLE!! I better not hear anyone say anything like that, or they are going get 6'1' 210lbs of fury down on their heads!

Go get em!

Dave

[Skittles]

17. she should have said something

these hateful bigots need to be dressed down at every opportunity. They are sickening.

[ieoeja]

18. "F*** you!"

"So what the f--- is my daughter then? A product of Satan? You know what? You can go kiss my f---ing a--! You got a problem with that you piece of sh!t!"


In most respects I believe in a civilized response. But there are certain very few issues where I firmly believe civilized doesn't work. And a racist attack on a child** is one of 'em. The only proper way to handle something like that is with a large stick.

One reason racists feel perfectly free to express this kind of shit is that they practically have a monopoly on violence. All the philosophy in the world doesn't change the fact that the guy with the big stick gets to call the shots if he chooses and if noone else is willing to pick up a stick and fight back.


** An adult can defend him or herself. When I (a white guy) married a black woman I ran into this only once, and that was my supervisor at the time. And she apologized profusely when I simply asked her, "do you think that you, my boss, should be making comments like that?"

After she left me a lot of people came out of the woodwork assuming I would be bitter and happy to hear all of their racist shit. This resulted in a lot of friends surprised to find themselves former friends.

[WoodrowFan]

19. ask them

why God doesn't make mixed race children sterile if he didn't want them to have kids.

not a smooth answer but I HATE when bigots use God to justify their own bigotry.

On a smoother side she could quote Galatians 3:28 "There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus."

or the hymn "In Christ There is no East Nor West"

In Christ there is no East or West,
In Him no South or North;
But one great fellowship of love
Throughout the whole wide earth.

In Him shall true hearts everywhere
Their high communion find;
His service is the golden cord,
Close binding humankind.

Join hands, then, members of the faith,
Whatever your race may be!
Who serves my Father as His child
Is surely kin to me.

In Christ now meet both East and West,
In Him meet North and South;
All Christly souls are one in Him
Throughout the whole wide earth.

[northzax]

23. exactly

you breed a horse and a donkey and get a mule. which is sterile, so you know G-D isn't interested in them breeding. You breed a lion and a tiger and get a sterile liger. you breed an African human and an Asian human and get a human. who can then breed with any other human.

I would ask them if sterility among humans is therefore god's punishment for bad behaviour among parents?

[Catherine Vincent]

53. Thank you!

That's partially what I was goanna say. If humans of different races are able to produce another human, then what's the problem? I can't stand people like that. I know the child wasn't around to hear it but other kids could have heard.

I'll bet those ignorant women are Bush supporters!

[HawkerHurricane]

20. My children...

My parents are Irish (dad) and Scot/English (mom).
My wife's parents are Norwegian (mom) and Venezualan (Dad).
When asked what 'race' they are, I say 'Human'. If pressed, I call them Americans.

If God didn't want children of mixed 'race', he would have prevented them.

[pansypoo53219]

22. gee

and how come i am German, Norwegan, English, French, Russian, Native American, Irish? am i less noticable since i still am the 'prefered' color?

[TioDiego]

21. Oh, you don't want to know what I would have done.

Where is Montessori? Do they have a school board?

[shanti]

24. she should have challenged them on it

one should ALWAYS challenge racists about their "beliefs" as not doing so implies acceptance. believe me, i know, because i'm also raising a biracial child. however, i'm in california and incidences like you describe are few and far between.

[Mairead]

25. Her colleagues should certainly be disciplined, possibly sacked

That is a totally unacceptable attitude in a teacher.

There is solid research that demonstrates that the teacher's perception of a child's nature has a strong impact on how the teacher treats the child in class. There need be no evidence to support the perception; mere prejudice works fine.

[DrWeird]

26. My standardized reply:

"I don't think brother and sister should produce children together, but you don't see me giving your parents any shit, do you?"

[ninkasi]

27. Incredible...

I've noticed that people about to make hateful, bigoted statements often preface those statements with "I'm not prejudiced, but..." and then proceed to make prejudiced statements.

They then go on to remove any blame to themselves by imputing their own narrow minded, spiteful views to God. They thus show that not only are they bigoted and hateful, but deceitful as well.

If they object to mixed race children, they may as well overcome their objections now, because even in small rural communities, I am seeing more and more children who fit this description. The children are just like any other children, adorable and precious.

People like those women disgust me. What barren, pathetic, twisted souls they must have.

[LanternWaste]

28. Ask the co-worker....

Ask the co-worker what precise and relevant passages in the Bible specifically forbids interacial marriages, or even disparages it.

Ask the co-worker what part of interacial marriages is in opposition to the three most important laws of the New Testament- hope, love and charity.

Ask the co-worker why she believes God prioritizes skin color over the love between two people.

Tell the co-worker that the terrorists used religion to justify hate, also.

I'm getting pissed of thinking about it. I'd better not write anymore...lol

[Stuckinthebush]

29. Excellent!

"Terrorists use religion to justify hate also."

I love it.

Here is another response,

You know, when people start a sentence, "I'm not prejudiced, but...", then you know that person is a bigot.

[WoodrowFan]

30. They usually use

Leviticus 19:19

`My statutes ye do keep: thy cattle thou dost not cause to gender with diverse kinds; thy field thou dost not sow with diverse kinds, and a garment of diverse kinds, shaatnez, doth not go up upon thee"

but ignore the previous verses..

16 `Thou dost not go slandering among thy people; thou dost not stand against the blood of thy neighbour; I am Jehovah. 17 `Thou dost not hate thy brother in thy heart;...."

[salin]

31. I would add

that I have witnessed that when teachers harbor such prejudiced feelings, that it always comes out in how they teach their students.

Furthermore, given the fact that this conversation was held within my (her) earshot, seems to demonstrate an example of how these prejudiced feelings get shown.

I would then suggest that an inquiry be held to determine if any minority and bi-racial children have experienced prejudiced behavior - by teachers at the school - because this would most certainly interfere with these students' learning.

Why should parents pay tuition to send their children to a school where the children are treated as second class, and subjected to hostile attitudes by "professional" teachers. It is hard to believe that these "professional" teachers would really treat a child the same as others if they believed the child was created in a way that was frowned upon by God (the implication of their statements).

[SpaceCatMeetsMars]

33. Your daughter should have shamed them by

pretending not to realize that they were talking about her and walked up and said, "Excuse me, but I couldn't help overhearing that since you were speaking so loudly. Perhaps you didn't know that my daughter is of mixed race. She is a WONDERFUL child and I cannot IMAGINE that ANYONE could think she should not have been born."

I would hope that would shame them at least.

[Karenina]

35. They HAVE no "shame."

They have a belief in their "superiority" and that's it. No words will disabuse them of that "core value."

[salin]

38. I would then ask in mocked horror/suprise

you don't think other teachers here think that she shouldn't be born... (move into distressed concerned parent mode - one they would recognize if they are parents)... oh no... you don't think that they treat her differently in the classroom... do you think she is okay? Are they harming my baby? (forces them to respond to her as a loving parent).

[im4edwards]

34. daughter is right, nothing she can say will change them but

she could have pointed out that its a shame that they feel that way, ask where it was in God's plan that this got covered (scripture ?) and that they had best get used to it as she was staying and so was her daughter.

For bonus points she could look out the window and note how much fun the kids all had playing together not being caught up in that nonsense.

And for more bonus points she could have inquired if they had an accurate pedigree of their own liniage. Chances are that a few surprizes exist there somewhere over the years. And it doesn't make any difference where you live or what your ancestry is. Youthful hormones rear up exactly the same arund the world and across all national lines.

[CBHagman]

36. I can think of dozens of replies, but here's a beauty.

I seem to recall that Moses married a woman of another race (I just looked up the reference, and it's chapter 12 of the book of Numbers), and if I'm not mistaken, God opted to smite Moses's critical sister with LEPROSY or the like. Needless to say, big-time repentence and eventual healing followed.

So I guess the mildest reply is, "Oh, then I guess you haven't read about how God felt when Miriam complained about Moses's marriage to an Ethiopian."

By the way, who are these people to tell us God's motivation?

Also, there are more multiracial people in society than they realize. Think of the figure skater Tai Babilonia, for example, who is of African-American and Philippine descent, among other things.

On edit: Say: "Intermarriage was good enough for Moses, and God apparently had no problem with it. If you're such an expert on what God wants, where are your burning bushes and stone tablets?"

[Capn Sunshine]

37. I don't know where you live

But those sort of attitudes are very middle 20th century white supremacist.Did anyone use the word mongrel? At a Montessori school no less! WTF?

Did it occur to your daughter that the whole conversation was being staged for her benefit as an exclusionary exercise? It sounds that way to me.

This whole thing sounds at the very least reportable as a harrassment incident, and I'd do it in letter form, and to the admin of the school. It's important to realize the ripple effect these attitudes have, just expressing them and recieving no outrage emboldens and verifies the attitude. I'd cc to the ACLU, the ADL and every newspaper in that bigoted little place where people like this feel free to run their racist mouths off. This sort of talk in 21st century America is just not acceptable in public.

Damn, we have SO FAR TO GO.

[hiphopnation]

39. The best revenge is living well.

My wife is black. I am white. We have a daughter. We live in a chinese neighborhood. People stare. People gossip. People gawk. People laugh. Others are appreciative.

The answer is: NO RESPONSE. If their objective is to get to your daughter, instruct her to not even come close to giving them that satisfaction. If one among them is mature and intellegent enough to engage her on the topic with direct questions, fine. If not, it's not her concern. Tell her to smile and find satisfaction in the notion that she's doing her part to erradicate the world of such bigotry. Then tell her to smile and smell the flowers. :-)

The best revenge is living well.

[RobinA]

48. Agree

Why grace this nonsense with a reply. These people are not educable.

By the way, what part of the country is this? Around here, S.E.Pa, biracial kids are all over the place.

[hiphopnation]

52. We're in SF, CA.

Where there are also alot of inter-racial couples with children. But, even here, there are people who just don't get it. We moved here thinking we'd somehow be "more accepted" but have since learned that the ignorance is EVERYWHERE, and not geographically specific.

Some people understand. Some people don't. I'm in love. What are ya' gonna do? :-)

[noiretextatique]

55. live well

:hi:

[Chovexani]

40. Oy.

I'm going to preface this by saying that the minute someone brings up "God's plan", you should probably drop any pretense of having a reasoned discussion.

That having been said, I would suggest this person read their Bible, specifically the New Testament. It's been my experience, as a former born again fundie, that the people who scream the loudest about the Bible and "God's plan" know very little if anything about the source material for their belief system. Hell, I'm a Pagan and a witch, and I know the Bible better than most of the people who insist on thumping it over my head (ironically, it was actually reading the Bible for myself which caused me to lose my faith in Christianity). I would particularly direct this person to Colossians 3: 9-11 which states:

9Do not lie to one another, since you laid aside the old self with its evil practices, 10 and have put on the new self who is being renewed to a true knowledge according to the image of the One who created him-- 11 a renewal in which there is no distinction between Greek and Jew, circumcised and uncircumcised, barbarian, Scythian, slave and freeman, but Christ is all, and in all.

Also of interest, verses 12-14 of the same chapter:

12 So, as those who have been chosen of God, holy and beloved, put on a heart of compassion,kindness, humility, gentleness and patience; 13 bearing with one another, and forgiving each other, whoever has a complaint against anyone; just as the Lord forgave you, so also should you. 14 Beyond all these things put on love, which is the perfect bond of unity.

This is amusing to me, because verses late in this chapter are used by Promise Keepers, the Southern Baptist Convention, etc to justify the subjugation of women, ie male "headship"--they conveniently forget the immediate verses before, which ostensibly contradict this. Basically, in laymen's language, these verses tell us that everyone is equal in Christ, that race is one of many false distinctions, a thing of the flesh used by Satan (who in Christianity is seen as the "lord of the flesh") to divide people and keep them from uniting in Christ.

These are only two examples I can think of off the top of my head. BTW, these verses are taken from the New American Standard Version, which is easily searchable at http://bible.crosswalk.com. I find this site very helpful when dealing with fundies online, when I don't have time to flip through one of my hard copy Bibles. Hope I was of some help to you, and good luck with the bigots. It's things like this which make me very wary of having children (I'm in an interracial relationship).

--C

(I had to put a space in the chapter and verse because it was coming out like that licking smiley in preview, which I think is hilarious :P)

[swinney]

41. REPLY TO BIGOTS WORKS

God did not intend for blond headed men to marry black headed women.

God did not intend for blacked eyed people to marry blond eyed people.

God goofed! He did not intend for his only son to be dark skinned and long haired. He intended for his son to have blonde hair. Goof.

God goofed. He put some in hot temperatures and others in cold temperatures to affect skin coloration.

God did not intend for short people to marry tall people.

God did not intend for horses of different colors to be mated.

God did not intend for uneducated people to marry educated people.

much good info at www.liberalslikechrist.org
the guy is good, very good.

[Iris]

42. This happened in a Montessori school?

I thought those places were a little more open-minded. If I had a child in that school, I think I'd like to know that their teachers were saying this kind of crap.

[jiacinto]

43. Tell the supervisor or their boss

Those commments are illegal and she could sue the living pants off the school for it.

[sangh0]

46. RIght! Make their bosses quake with fear

about a lawsuit. Their bosses will inform them that the rest of the country thinks they are criminals.

[jiacinto]

61. That will get them to shut up quickly

nt

[Hamlette]

64. file a complaint with the DOJ

or your state non discrimination agency.

This is illegal conduct the school can lose all federal and funding unless they stop it. The employees should be fired or at least disciplined.

[Blue_Chill]

45. Response

Simpley tell them how you feel about what they said. Honestly without losing your cool.

I'm a white hispanic and I am often mistaken for american. I have been present when good ol boys have said things about hispanics. I simply infrom them as to my background and tell them that I think they are both racist and that their opinions disgust me.

[jiacinto]

63. I am 1/.2 Chilean

So I have heard simliar things.

[kayell]

47. Thank you all for your helpful replies

I'm going to print this out and give it to my daughter. Whatever she chooses to do, at the very least she will know that there are people out there who are sane and rational.

[radwriter0555]

57. Your daughter's schools employees need to attend some CLASSES

themselves on cultural diversity.

I suggest a call to the head of school to get this serious problem under control, then a mandatory attendance at a diversity training seminar for these idiots.

[mkregel]

49. I would have been so tempted

To take the nearest chair I saw and start swinging it all all those racist a******s, thank God I wasn't there. My newborn son is half Asian/ half white so I take these things kinda personally.

[noiretextatique]

50. ask her/him if god is a white supremacist

and if s/he would like to reinstitute miscegenation laws, like the ones that used to exist in this country in order to acheive "god's plan." i would also remind her/him that few of americans are "pure," and s/he probably has an ancestor or two of a different race. and, as others have mentioned, i would report it to the supervisor or owner. such blatant bigotry should be challenged.

[genius]

51. Those people are sick

I'd speak to the director of the school about having the co-workers fired for cause.

[_Jumper_]

54. At least 1/3 of Americans agree with those bigots

:(

[maha]

56. She can't stand for this.

Definitely this must be reported to the school's administration.

[SlutBunwalla]

58. A response straight from the bible - one of my fave stories

Tell your daughter to look them straight in the eye and remind them of the story in Numbers about what happened to Moses' siblings Aaron and Miriam when they spoke against Moses for marrying an Ethiopian woman:

Numbers

<1> And Miriam and Aaron spake against Moses because of the Ethiopian woman whom he had married: for he had married an Ethiopian woman.
<2> And they said, Hath the LORD indeed spoken only by Moses? hath he not spoken also by us? And the LORD heard it.
<3> (Now the man Moses was very meek, above all the men which were upon the face of the earth.)
<4> And the LORD spake suddenly unto Moses, and unto Aaron, and unto Miriam, Come out ye three unto the tabernacle of the congregation. And they three came out.
<5> And the LORD came down in the pillar of the cloud, and stood in the door of the tabernacle, and called Aaron and Miriam: and they both came forth.
<6> And he said, Hear now my words: If there be a prophet among you, I the LORD will make myself known unto him in a vision, and will speak unto him in a dream.
<7> My servant Moses is not so, who is faithful in all mine house.
<8> With him will I speak mouth to mouth, even apparently, and not in dark speeches; and the similitude of the LORD shall he behold: wherefore then were ye not afraid to speak against my servant Moses?
<9> And the anger of the LORD was kindled against them; and he departed.
<10> And the cloud departed from off the tabernacle; and, behold, Miriam became leprous, white as snow: and Aaron looked upon Miriam, and, behold, she was leprous.
<11> And Aaron said unto Moses, Alas, my lord, I beseech thee, lay not the sin upon us, wherein we have done foolishly, and wherein we have sinned.

Seems God's not too fond of bigots. Never hurts to remind them of that.

edit for grammar

[mkregel]

60. hmmmm....i see my next bumper sticker

especially if i ever drive thru the south...

[Catherine Vincent]

62. Moses married an Ethiopian woman?

That's not what I saw on the movie "The Ten Commandments". I saw a white woman playing the part.

[ElsewheresDaughter]

65. i agree with your daughter..i wouldn't validate them...nor give them power

with a response...let the bad energy flow around and pass on by her...

[Liberator_Rev]

67. Here's the Bible passage without the distractions:

Thanks to whomever pointed out God's reaction (for those who believe book of Numbers) to those who condemned Moses' "mixed marriage".

In order to make the passage even more powerful, I've removed all the distracting and repetitive stuff and made it available on our web site.

GOD's view of critics of "Mixed Marriage" ?
Book of Numbers 12: 1-15
"While they were at Hazeroth, Miriam and Aaron spoke against Moses because of the Cushite (i.e. Ethiopian) woman whom he had married; . . . Suddenly the LORD said to Moses, Aaron, and Miriam, "Come out, you three, to the tent of meeting." So the three of them came out. Then the LORD came down in a pillar of cloud, and stood at the entrance of the tent, and called Aaron and Miriam; and they both came forward.
And he said, "Hear my words: 'Moses is entrusted with all my house. With him I speak face to face-- clearly, not in riddles; and he beholds the form of the LORD. Why then were you not afraid to speak against my servant Moses?" And the anger of the LORD was kindled against them,. . . and Miriam become leprous, as white as snow. . . Then Aaron said to Moses, "Oh, my lord, do not punish us for a sin that we have so foolishly committed.
But the LORD said to Moses, "Let her be shut out of the camp for seven days, and after that she may be brought in again."

It's at the bottom of our http://www.LiberalsLikeChrist.Org/racism page.

See what Christ might say about the "Christian Coalition" & "Religious Right" imposters.