A Heads Up to All DUers

[kentuck]

I was just reading a post by PeteNYC and he made the comment that more people than we know read DU. And we read that Rush and his ilk slip in every once in a while for a little "intelligence".

That being said, do we need to be a little more aware of what we say and how we say it? I do not mean that we should censor anything we say but only that we be aware that there may be a larger audience than we have imagined?

I think this might be something Skinner and Admin may have already thought about? They may re-think their 5-sentence requirement so as to give more time for posters to contemplate their postings?

If you knew there were officials of the Democratic Party, including Congressmen and Senators - and the opposition Party - reading your posts, would it make a difference in what you post? I doubt it. However, it might make a little difference in "how" you post it. Just a thought. I am not requesting any changes - just to be aware of changing realities.

[patdem]

1. I do not want to live my life to please the likes of lush rimbaugh

fuggedaboudit

[liberalhistorian]

6. I agree totally,

I'm so damn tired of always worrying about what the repukes and wingnuts and all of their screaming, arrogant know-nothing media mouthpieces think of what we "libruls" say and do. One of the major things I love about DU is that we can be ourselves here and interact with like-minded people, we don't have to deal with the repukes and wingnuts. In short, it's a wonderful respite from the rest of the world. I'll be GODDAMNED if I'm going to start censoring myself for said repukes and wingnuts! FUCK THEM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11

[shirlden]

36. Amen and again ...amen

I want to play on your team liberalhistorian.

:kick:

[_NorCal_D_]

40. I'm afraid we're already being watched.

Take a look at these.


http://www.rightwingnews.com/category.php?ent=1159


http://dumonitor.blogspot.com/


www.nukevet.com/mt/archives/001306.html

Not that I give a rats ass. :eyes:

[KCDem]

2. I've always been aware of that fact

and so I do a bit of self-censoring. And I try to keep my syntax really simple so that the bonehead freepers can understand. ;)

[radwriter0555]

3. GOOD! The MORE RIght Wing Assholes and Idiots that know how PISSED

I am at their constant lying, cheating, deception and theft, the better off we'll be.

I am not mincing words to disguise my disgust at this administration and their patsy's like limbaugh.

I hope they're listening, and I hope more people get balls and speak up against this fascist regime. LOUDLY.

[nolabels]

17. Theres that word again, sometimes it gets thrown around here a.....

lot more than people realize. I first thought it to be something like teenagers back in the 70s calling the police "The Pig's", but have come to realize it much more serious than a little police brutality. Especially since by most definitions we really are living in a 'Fascist State'

It's time for another Bush/Nazis thread
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=199853

Kissinger & BCCI spells BUSH & 9-11
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=377323

[radwriter0555]

27. Which word? Right wing asshole? Fascist REGIME?

:bounce:

;)

[Plaid Adder]

4. There is only one thing that all of us should be careful about

and that is posting any information that would make us identifiable.

This is just a basic rule for having a safe and pleasant time on the internet and I urge everyone to be vigilant about this. You do not want to make yourself a target for some wingnut who has nothing better to do with his time now that Our Great Leader has ruined the economy but harrass people who he disagrees with. I have been mailbombed, which is annoying enough, but that's nowhere near as annoying as it would be if this person had managed to find out where I live, etc.

As for the content...well, if Rush and his minions are trawling DU, well good luck and God bless. Maybe you'll learn something.

C ya,

The Plaid Adder

[WilliamPitt]

9. Uh oh

:)

[Plaid Adder]

10. Well, you're different, you're a celebrity.

They know your heavily armed entourage of admirers will beat off the attackers, so they don't bother.

Actually, you could sell that on pay per view. Lone freeper vs. Will Pitt's entourage.

C ya,

The Plaid Adder

[sangh0]

14. I have to 2nd Plaid Adders advice

as someone who has been stalked twice and attacked once. I also had someone who faxed a phony confirmation for an appt with a hooker to my office.

[PATRICK]

50. good to reflect on

What things and ideas the dark side cannot twist and those neutral good ideas and tactics they easily can. Has anyone in the Party structure commented on anything here such as BBV? Or are we whistling in the dark with a few things picked off for the typical slanted characterizations. I love that Cokie style "the internet is buzzing with...".

When we directly impact the outside that stirs the hornets' nest- eventually. Limbaugh, Savage, numerous internet freepers, and everyone else listed by David Brooks in the talk Right chain are dishonest stooges loving the attention and the money but only paid parrots when it comes down to it.

When their various outlet owners and sponsors realize that offending large chunks of the local consumer population with opinionated non-entities maybe isn't so smart in the long run they will get dumped.

And Clear Channel is being attacked locally for the very same reason.

[HFishbine]

31. Wilma

Oh, come on. We all know William Pitt is just an anagram for your real identity -- Wilma Titlip.

[hunter]

13. People have found out where I live...

The first anonymous letter you find in your mailbox that says you are going to hell is pretty chilling. Damn, someone bought a stamp to say that? Or the first phone call. But we still have to stand up for what is right.

Peace be with you always, Plaid Adder.

[karlschneider]

41. I agree that discretion is prudent for most DUers but as for me,

my identity is about as public as it can be. I use my real name and my information is easily available. If any wingnuts wanna fuck with me, fine. I have -more- then enough ...er, 'defensive measures' to deal with anything short of a large Swat team.
:grr:

[ixion]

5. makes no difference to me who reads my posts

I call'em as I see'em... and until the thought police kick down my door and take me away for 'reconditioning' I'll continue to do so.

[liberalhistorian]

7. BTW, we're not DLC

cowards here, you know! Enough of the walking on tiptoes, afraid of the big, bad, wingnut beast, and kowtowing to them! ENOUGH BEING NICE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!11

[Pepperbelly]

54. Some people here are ...

members of the DLC and anything but cowards. You should avoid painting with too-broad a brush.

[Don_G]

8. I Post Here For All To Read

I'm not worried about Limpballz nor his moronic minions. The only line I draw is at bashing the canadiates and other DUers. I'm here to learn and communicate---not hide!

[devinsgram]

11. I certainly hope so,

then they can see that there are a lot of us (critical thinkers) out there who do not need to be told what to think and do not follow like little quivering sheep(consevatives).

[candy331]

15. I hope

he'll soon be reading from the unemployment line.

[piece sine]

12. Thanks, Kentuck

I'm tired of the flame burns for my futile attempts to remind people this is VERY public forum that is often quoted elsewhere. I see a mention of DU in the media at least once a week. That's why I first checked DU out. I'll add that outsiders don't read our threads through the same lens we do. Even some Dems don't. I work with a lot of Dems at this firm (to remain nameless) and some of them who are Dean and Kucinich supporters think this site is waaaaay over-the-top! And they are on our side. Momma Mia, I love it here but I have a thirst for adventure and daring-do.

Oh well, I guess we wouldn't be Democrats if we didn't disagree. (But some DUers' pro-Saddam stuff is ultra-counterproductive. We've got an election to win!)

[ixion]

16. uh, pro-Saddam stuff?

I have never, NOT ONCE, seen a "pro Saddam" thread. Can you cite a few threads?

[piece sine]

18. yeah

There's one just day by leesa in the Bruce Willis thread. You'll see my reaction there, too.

[ixion]

23. you mean this?

Posted by: leesa
"Saddam is not the issue. Saddam was/is a completely defanged
leader, powerless to hurt anyone outside his borders for over a decade. The hurt he inflicted within his borders was there but probably vastly exagerated and as we have seen may have been keeping a lid on his volatile country. The problem is the US, not Saddam. "


How is this pro Saddam? Is it not true that he is now 'defanged'?

The only reason I'm pressing the issue, is that it's a RW talking point, that anyone who doesn't support the pResident supports Saddam.

And for the record, I have never, nor will I ever support Saddam, but neither do I support Bush's wars of aggression. The question was: does Iraq have WMD? The answer is: No. What they had was sold to them by US via Rummy. And all evidence indicates that these were destroyed years ago.

This country was not founded on "you're with us or against us." This country was founded on an individual's inalienable right to ask questions of and expect honest answers from the government. I don't think that's too much to ask.

[piece sine]

29. you're dodging Saddam's atrocities

My point -- why can't progressives be allowed to condemn Saddam AND condemn the unilateral way he was removed? We lose a lot of ground by not stressing hard enough to ourselves and others what a living monster Saddam is/was. Sure we defied the UN by going to war, whihctrhey only asked us to delay. How many UN resolutions condemned him? Was 12 or 14?

To Leesa, via your post... there's no evidence that Saddam wasn't every bit as cruel to his own people as claimed. Ask any Kurd, and yes, living in Washington I know a few!

I am stunned by the "keeping a lid it" comment...if that's not pro-Saddam, it certainly gives him the benefit of the doubt.

But the remark "the problem is the US not Saddam" offended me as a liberal America because we have not gassed our own people...we haven't. There was no DU.com in Iraq under Saddam. If you are not bothered by this, you might be taking American democratic freedoms for granted. Most Americans do because they don't see how the rest of the world livers, as I have.

Now... as for me employing "Right Wing talking points," all I can say anyone at DU who ventures too far from DU orthodoxy is flamed like that. I'm new here and it used to mortify me...it's a familiar and paranoid refrain around here. Doesn't 'move the needle' anymore.

[radwriter0555]

32. Hussein didn't gas his own people, there are no mass graves

from his alleged torture camps, and pretty much all the crap spewed about hussein is a pack of baseless lies contrived and propegated by the bush regime to underscore their illegal efforts to take over his country for their profiteering friends.

US Army war college backs up the gas thing; it was from IRAN.

And the LACK OF MASS GRAVES OTHER than those directly attributable to conflicts started up and urged by the bush regime, underscores the lies about that little piece of propaganda.

And the fact there aren't no 12 palaces; and the fact that NO Iraqi ever asked for help from the USA to get liberated.

SO keep it real. Just cause the bush regime been spewing it for a decade or so, don't mean it's true. Best to look up things on your own to verify the lies of the bush regime. Turns out, truth telling isn't something they're real big on.

[ixion]

34. I'm not saying that you were talking RW points...

just that that argument is one. If you don't support Bush, you support Saddam.

And I'm not trying to flame you... just trying to clarify your point, and make my own in return. That's just a debate, by defintion.

No, we may not have gassed our own people, but there's plenty of example of atrocities commited by the US government, so you really can't take the moral highground there.

Think of:
Nuclear testing
Native American Indians
Japanese internment camps in WWII
Gitmo
Depleted Uranium

My point here is that no government is beyond reproach. Saddam was one of dozens of tyrants in the world. He is no longer in power, but many others are.
China's war of aggression against Tibet is a great example of this. No one seems to care too much about that though. :-(

[JohnOneillsMemory]

37. Check the facts re: the US's policies installing and arming Saddam.

There's no reason to shy away from criticising the US's Cold War policies that led to the deaths of millions and defeated every democratic movement that struggled to survive and installed dictators and trained and armed their torturers and death squads. And destroyed their economies and BUSH SR. GIVING SADDAM THE GREEN LIGHT TO INVADE IRAN AND KUWAIT and etc. etc.

Instead of quavering in trepidation of being called a 'blame America leftist,' how about simply holding up the US Constitution with it's Bill of Rights and, if you must, the 10 Commandments and say that you are a conservative who believes in these documents?

[LeahMira]

48. Can't walk and chew gum?

My point -- why can't progressives be allowed to condemn Saddam AND condemn the unilateral way he was removed?

You hit on one of my pet peeves... either/or thinking. Why are issues always framed in terms of "either you're with us or you're against us." Why can't people despise dictators and at the same time despise pre-emptive attacks on sovereign nations. IMO, the issue in this case should have been framed as "how can we stop the atrocities of which Saddam is certainly guilty and at the same time avoid an unprecedented pre-emptive attack on the entire nation of Iraq."

But the remark "the problem is the US not Saddam" offended me as a liberal America because we have not gassed our own people...we haven't.

Well, not lately and as far as any of us knows we haven't gassed anyone, but this nation has an execrable history when it comes to the treatment of American Indians... every bit as cruel at the time it happened as anything Saddam was able to do today with the weapons and means at his disposal. I also wonder what could be said about exposing our own military to Agent Orange and a few other noxious substances. We may not have known that Agent Orange would have the effects that it now seems it does have, but we had no evidence that Agent Orange was benign either. We were willing to take that chance for whatever reasons.

[FlaGranny]

22. Some people think if you state that Saddam

had nothing to do with 9/11 that you are pro-Saddam. The same way if you don't like the administration's policies you are anti-American. I have never seen even ONE post on this board that was pro-Saddam.

[bearfartinthewoods]

46. well there was one the other night that was recruiting

for people to go and fight against the US in iraq....

blessedly it was locked. mods are on the ball.

[prolesunited]

58. Was it a regular DUer

or one of our many new "friends." I have seen plenty of infiltrators post outrageous comments just to see who around here will take the bait. Do you have a link to that thread so I could check it out?

[patdem]

21. Pro Sadaam???? please you need to splain yuself!!!!

I have not seen any Pro Sadaam threads or even comments please, guide me to a thread where that has occured?

[piece sine]

30. Please see poster #23's research.

and my response to #23 criticism of my response.

[Catherine Vincent]

19. If Tom Delay or any of his aids are reading these messages:

YOU'RE A MAJOR LEAGUE ASSHOLE!

[Wickerman]

20. I'll start workign on my grammer and spelling

keepn it simpull so thet da freeprs can understind it.

[Not a robought]

24. Yes, I try to write with one syllable words

most of the time but it's so damn hard. Sometimes throw in some bad spelled grammar. :evilgrin:

[Cappurr]

25. Doesn't it bother any of you that you might reflect poorly

on the very issues you expouse? We all have a good time laughing at the Freepers. But I gotta tell you, some of the posts here are just as wacked out. Two years ago I was talking to Joe Liberman's Aide and he read the site.

This doesn't mean you can't express your opinions, but if you could express them in an intelligent, thoughtful way and try to document some of your point if possible you'd get a lot more respect from outsiders (both Dem and Repug) reading this site. And you wouldn't have stupid, embarrassing posts reproduced on other sites or talked about by Rush Limbaugh.

[Wickerman]

28. Someone smart enough to be Lieberman's aide

is intelligent enough to sift through the bullshit posts. With 30k registrations and thousands of daily posts someone is going to say something on any given day that Rush can use as he wants - fine, drive the freepers here. I hope while they are lurkng they learn something.

[FubarFly]

26. I'm a concerned citizen. I am breaking no laws.

And I will say what I damn well please.

Quite frankly, the more people who read DU, the better.


They can have my keyboard when they take it out of my cold dead hands!!

(uh oh. ;-) )

[dani]

33. there's been a few DUers who have been irresponsible

A few people who have written irresponsible things that have been used against DU. Here's an example, and I think Neal Boortz also used this (in an article he wrote) to smear DU:

http://www.rightwingnews.com/crackpots/kelly.php

Tragically, Michael Kelly was killed in a humvee accident while traveling with the 3rd Infantry Division in Iraq. Kelly was the editor-at-large for the Atlantic Monthly, an excellent writer, and I have particular soft spot for him because he actually gave a passing mention to RWN in an editorial.

Unfortunately, some of folks at the Democratic Underground view this as a happy occasion & a great opportunity to take cheapshots at Kelly. It's sad to see people so fanatical & eaten up with hatred that they publicly gloat over the death of people who dare to disagree with them politically...

9215: "This warmongering chickensh*t chickenhawk is more deserving of death than innocent Iraqi children. It will be good not having to see his stupid face on the editorial pages. He and others of his bent are the ones who hyped this slaughter, let's not forget that."

Kanzeon: "I find it hard to be sad... Frankly, the less conservative pundits, the better. Though I wish they'd just consider their career options flipping burgers at McDonald's."

EDITED BY AMDIN: COPYRIGHT

And here's something a bit tamer from Boortz that uses quotations from the DU forum:
Why socialists hate rich people

[TreasonousBastard]

38. Obviously, there is something...

going on. DU seems to be noticed, and is having some influence out there.

That being the case, they are going to find stuff in here to use for the attacks no matter what we do.

That comment was along the lines of the Satanic Trinity just after 9/11 that got Maher fired, and the others crucified.

I would worry about some overexcited asshole or shifty disrupter advocating unsavory and highly disreputable and illegal actions, and hope the mods catch them in time.

Other than that, fuck 'em. Let them sift through a thousand cat posts to find some ammo.

[Pastiche423]

35. Uh...

I post my opinions here, because it's one of the only ways I have to get my voice "out there".

Why do other people post?

[Name removed]

39. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Q]

43. A kinder, gentler version of watch what we say and do?

- This fits right in with the conservative Dems not wanting the 'extremists' to talk about their right wing evolution or Bush*-Lite politics. That's 'bashing' and makes us 'look bad'.

- There are many 'off the wall' threads...but they're usually the most popular posts on DU. There used to be quite a few 'conspiracy theory' threads about stolen elections and 9-11...but they made us 'look bad'...so no one discusses them anymore.

- What about a list...things we can discuss and still appear PC to our phantom visitors?

[Name removed]

53. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[WhoCountsTheVotes]

42. Watch out for people posting threads with anti-Democratic

and anti-American titles. Rush's first gimmick will be to get someone to post a thread like "I hate America" and a few troll comments, than read it on the air.

[oasis]

44. Or "Why are so many at DU against our troops" which is total b.s.

[Zorra]

45. How can republicans get to sleep at night knowing that they....

voted for bush, a person that knowingly subverted democracy by fixing the 2000 election in Florida. Then bush and the PNAC knowingly allowed terrorists, in what the PNAC described as "a Pearl Harbor type event", to fly aircraft into the World Trade Center on 9/11 and kill 3,000 Americans in order to forward their agenda to attack and colonize Iraq and create a global empire? If any republicans are reading this, here is a link:

http://www.raytal.com

to let you read about the PNAC plan. Anyway, how do you republicans feel about all the innocent people that have been killed because of bush and his administration? Particularly our poor soldiers right now? You republicans are responsible for putting really evil people in office that are currently destroying our country, our democracy and our civil liberties. The California recall. Redistricting in Texas and Colorado. Electronic voting devices - all the results of republican evil. If you guys had a valid philosophy you could actually win a valid election, but you don't so you have to cheat. Your party is consistently and inherently deceitful and immoral and I could never be a republican because republicans are responsible for everything that is wrong with the US and I would die from shame and guilt. Admit it, Bush is a colossal failure and has destroyed our economy by lying us into a fiscally devastating war and occupation and giving tax cuts to wealthy people that don't even need the money while millions of Americans have lost their jobs. Our deficit has gone through the roof. You, as a republican, are personally responsible for a huge morass of human misery. But it's not too late to mend your ways, relieve yourself from the guilt, and become one of the good guys. Become a Democrat, and always vote Democrat. Help us build a better world for ourselves and our children O8). Republicans and the republican agenda are the only things holding us back from evolving into the country envisioned by the Founders of our nation. Imagine it - a nation with no republicans - a veritable Utopia. Join us, you'll be glad you did, I promise. No more guilt. No more sleepless nights. Even you, Rush, but it might be a few years before you sleep well because of the magnitude and sheer staggering numbers of all your, uh.... fibs. And by the way -
Vote for :dem:Dennis Kucinich

[REP]

47. What Would Be Great

is if DU had a language usage bootcamp. I see so many stupid errors (forming plurals with an apostrophe, subject/verb disagreements, etc) that sometimes it's hard to read the board. I'm not talking about eveyone becoming skilled writers, and I'm not bagging on typos, but just some basic language skills.

[Iverson]

49. my writing would stay the same

Hi, kentuck. Since most people choose to stay anonymous here, there is no way that we can be certain that people with various jobs or degrees of fame post here. Even if they do, our arguments must be advanced on their merits and not to impress celebrities. Besides, they are all grown up and can take a little candor; I assume that that would be their motivation in checking in here.

I think that we should all be aware of what we write because we want to be convincing and thoughtful, not because particular individuals may be peeking.

Cheers.

[Name removed]

55. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Iverson]

65. Thank you, PeteNYC.

:toast:
This calls for a bottle of stout.

[kayell]

51. The day that I start self censoring my posts to not offend/incite RWers

is the day that I give away my first amendment rights willingly. Ain't gonna happen!

[Name removed]

56. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Ruby Newsbee]

52. There's too much importance on who may be watching.

If Big Names lurking impress you or intimidate you then it's a personal thing. But to suggest we post in a manner to accomodate them is ridiculous. If those Big Names are lurking they are wanting to read what the people are saying in their own language, from their own thinking caps and their own hearts. I couldn't care less who reads this board or any other board.

[union_maid]

57. Probably doesn't make much difference.

I would certainly like to see much less candidate bashing for one thing, but fact is, they can come here and do it themselves if they want to use this board for talking points. A dittohead can come here, register, claim to be a liberal and say anything he or she wants and if Rush or anyone else wants to hold it up as a example of the Democratic view, there's nothing to stop that. That's the nature of the internet. Anonymous. Can't take much at face value.

[Patriot_Spear]

59. Look, I come to DU to let my hair down and be among friends...

I already 'live' in an environment where I have to qualify my words. Sure, DU is a little rough around the edges sometimes- but it's worth it.

The banter here on DU flesh's out arguments weak and strong; Even the tinfoil folks have some interesting facts to throw into the mix. There is already way too many 'measured words' floating around the net- let's keep our honest, unadulterated DU dialouge as a wholesome change of pace.

[the_real_38]

60. It means we need to remember...

... to say things like Rush Limbaugh is a fat, lying sack of s***, or "we ought to bring that the fairness in reporting act", which would force him and his ilk to have a balanced set of opinions, by bringing the left on to the show.

[kentuck]

61. All I'm asking is that we be aware...

Read the post and stop jumping to conclusions.

[bluedog]

62. I don't agree

the day Americans feel the need to filter their comments....and opinions...is the Day that America Died!!!

[Deb]

63. Perhaps I am alone in this (?)

If I thought that R/L wing party officials were reading this board my self-imposed censorship on posting "singing to the choir" threads would quickly end.

Both parties hold responsibility for the damage done to our country these past several years. Oh, what I would give to know their eyes read my rage! The wallpaper in their mighty offices would curl from the multiple tongue lashings.

Better for DU and my membership that I continue to believe pollster driven politicians can't be bothered to read any constituent's thread here.

[Ruby Newsbee]

64. excellent post Deb

especially this part:

"Both parties hold responsibility for the damage done to our country these past several years. Oh, what I would give to know their eyes read my rage! The wallpaper in their mighty offices would curl from the multiple tongue lashings."