Please help w/ question I have about this Plame/Wilson deal

[Enraged_Ape]

The MSM keeps mentioning how the WH wanted to "discredit" Wilson by blowing his wife's cover as a clandestine CIA agent. But how does that "discredit" him? In my mind, that makes him even MORE credible. I mean, with access to that kind of intelligence, wouldn't the Wilsons then TRULY KNOW what was going on?

This has just never made any sense to me, and so I interpret this story as a bunch of BS thrown out to cover the REAL reason why the WH blew her cover: because they wanted to shut down her intelligence-gathering operation on WMDs and shut up her husband in the process. That's the only explanation that fits all the facts.

[writes2000]

1. I tend to trust the whistleblower that spoke to the Washington Post

A high ranking senior official within the administration told the Washington Post that Plame's position at the CIA was leaked "purely and simply out of revenge."

I'm guessing that source is in the best position to understand their motives.

[interestedparty]

9. I'm so glad someone brought this up.

Wonder if they were named as a source and then
asked to testify for the grand jury?

Here are the relevant paragraphs and a link to the story if anyone hasn't seen it.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp-dyn?pagename=article&contentId=A11208-2003Sep27

This is my first post - hope I'm doing this correctly.

-------
Bush Administration Is Focus of Inquiry
CIA Agent's Identity Was Leaked to Media

By Mike Allen and Dana Priest
Washington Post Staff Writers
Sunday, September 28, 2003; Page A01

(snip)

Yesterday, a senior administration official said that before Novak's column ran, two top White House officials called at least six Washington journalists and disclosed the identity and occupation of Wilson's wife. Wilson had just revealed that the CIA had sent him to Niger last year to look into the uranium claim and that he had found no evidence to back up the charge. Wilson's account touched off a political fracas over Bush's use of intelligence as he made the case for attacking Iraq.

Clearly, it was meant purely and simply for revenge," the senior official said of the alleged leak.

(snip)

A source said reporters quoted a leaker as describing Wilson's wife as "fair game."

The official would not name the leakers for the record and would not name the journalists. The official said there was no indication that Bush knew about the calls.

It is rare for one Bush administration official to turn on another. Asked about the motive for describing the leaks, the senior official said the leaks were "wrong and a huge miscalculation, because they were irrelevant and did nothing to diminish Wilson's credibility."

(snip)

Staff writer Richard Leiby contributed to this report.
-------

[Jackpine Radical]

30. Way too simple.

They wanted to take out Valerie too, probly because her WMD sting operation theatened some allies of Cheney from the Halliburton days & the trail would lead back directly to Sneer if she was allowed to pursue it.

[shraby]

2. Shhhh.....MSM doesn't want you to make that

connection. If you do, then you just might think it had to do with the war fixing intell. Then you might make the connection to Cheney and Halliburton who dealt in dual purpose nuclear components when Cheney worked there full time.

[Booster]

7. We have a winner!!!! Mrs. Wilson's covert "company" was getting

way too close to finding out all of the criminal/treasonous activity that Cheney/Halliburton were involved in and Cheney had to somehow dismantle that company. All those trips to the CIA by Cheney weren't for nothing.

[dogday]

3. They tried to make it looked like she sent him and that this

was a partisan effort on their parts. The problem with this scenario is that she did not send him, that part is their lie.

Cheney asked the CIA to check into the purchase of yellow-cake from Niger.

The CIA asked Valerie if she thought her husband would be interested in the Job because of his experience and background.

The CIA authorized the trip, not his wife.

Joe finds nothing and writes his report which either gets back to the WH and they ignore it or it never made it's way to the WH because Pres used those infamous 16 words in his State of the Union Speech....

[yewberry]

4. I think

the "discredit" part was claiming that Wilson had been sent to Africa by his wife (implying nepotism) rather than by an "objective" individual.

The blowing of Plame's cover was revenge for Wilson's discrediting the WH claim about Saddam trying to buy uranium from Niger.

I think.

[John Q. Citizen]

6. Revenge not just for discrediting a story, but discrediting bush's

constitutionally mandated State of the Union address and his big pitch to the American congress and people for the dire need to attack Iraq.

[readmylips]

5. bush criminals were looking for false information....

they already had plans since 2001 to invade Iraq. Wilson was not in the loop of neocons who were the ones gathering and fixing information to finalize their elli gal war. Wilson found the truth. The same way we are in shock about the criminal on-goings of bush/cheney/rove and all, so was Wilson. Wilson tried to stop little bush from telling lies about the Niger products, but little bush did what he loves to do...stick his finger up our a$$es and LIE.

My question is: That classified memo was carried openly by Colin Powell on to Airforce One. Why was Powell carrying a classified document for all to see? Classified documents have different levels of restrictions from Secret to Top Secret, and they are carried in their appropriate jackets. Red Jacket for Top Secret.

[galloglas]

8. Writes 2000

makes a good point.

Malice is hard to tie down as a motive that "makes sense". And the Evil Bastards at 1600 Penn are, indeed, filled with malice.

But, on balance, I think you are right. It was Valerie Plame who rode the desk that would not forward the information that would make the "Lie For War" seem real. Consequently, George Tenet had to take credit for the 16 words that should not have been in Bush's speech. The sixteen words I hope will hang the whole bunch from a lamppost.

If Plame had rolled over and played ball, Tenet would never have had to answer "slam dunk" to George Bush about WMDs.

IMHO, they outed Plame to get even with Plame. And to roll up her network of coverts so they could not all come in write Joe Wilsonesque stories.

But, in all probability, they saw it as a certain "two-fer" the price of one. Why waste two bullets if one shotgun shell does the job?

[democracyindanger]

10. They wanted to make the Niger trip

seem like some kind of boondoggle that Plame sent Wilson on. A stupid ploy that blew up in their face.

[galloglas]

11. Troll or Crushed under Misinfo??

uhhh...

You state "seem like some kind of boondoggle that Plame sent Wilson on ".

Been out of the Universe long??

Plame sent Wilson nowhere! She did not have the authority. She did not decide the case needed to be checked in person, that was Cheney'sidea.

If you truly believe that, expect the Men in Black very soon. They will draw blood samples to see if you are infected with a replicable virus that causes political delusions.

And neither Plame nor Wilson can be considered "stoopid".

OTOH, could you reread the note Scotty McClellan sent you here with??

[democracyindanger]

12. Hilarious

You've been here all of what, 45 posts, and you're already pointing fingers and shrieking troll?

Puh-lease.

I was simply laying out what ChimpCo tried to do. The "stupid ploy" was Chimpy's, genius. If you still have problems with comprehension, spend some time here.

[galloglas]

22. Want to run my 45 against your best 45 ??

I checked some of your other posts before I wrote it. The better trolls hang around a long time, so maybe your good. But in the 15 posts of yours I read, I found nothing thoughtful.

You Said:

"I was simply laying out what ChimpCo tried to do."


Yep. That's what Trolls do. Beat the Party Drum, drown out, distract and drop in pieces of misinformation... letting them stand when not asked.


"The "stupid ploy" was Chimpy's, genius."


Really?? Chimpy said that?

Love to have a link on that, Slick!

But not some stupid misdirection to "EnchantedForest" that you have under your hotlink, where you question my comprehension.

And, "No", I didn't have to go there to see it.
Anyone who clicks a hotlink like that risks infection.

But, I imagine you already knew that, didn't you??

[democracyindanger]

27. Ho-ho-ho...kay, tough guy.

You've got me nailed. I'm a troll. And you believe it with so much of your dear little heart, you should alert on me to the mods. You should do it over, and over, and over again until you rid DU of my trollish prescence. And if the mods don't get rid of me because I'm so clearly a troll, then obviously it must mean they're in on it, too.

I'm flattered, really and truly. In GD I've been called a jerk, an asshole, told that I needed a nap--but this is the first time I've been outed as a troll. You must be some kind of troll-discoverin' superhero, loaded for bear with your awesome troll-killing posts.

:rofl:

[Enraged_Ape]

18. Don't worry, D.I.D., I knew what you meant

I guess I still don't understand, though, how that would somehow "discredit" Wilson, particularly since, in retrospect, he's been proven 100% correct. It just seems so obvious as to how and why this whole nasty business came about, that this ridiculous "explanation" of the MSM just seems pathetic.

BushCo really must be in serious trouble, and they really must know it.

[democracyindanger]

25. Thanks Ape

It's surprising to think about how they would think such a brazenly thin, stupid ploy would work--but then you gotta remember that they're brazenly thin, stupid people.

[Tactical Progressive]

31. Yes, they say it like they believe that

Joe Wilson's wife sent him on an all-expenses-paid vacation.

Actually, since they make themselves believe whatever they need to believe, that probably is what they think.

Now that that little inanity has been so roundly debunked, they'll just go on to the next delusion that they need to believe. I guess that would be "it's not a crime to out an undercover CIA agent engaged in an ongoing operation".

[linazelle]

13. It doesn't make sense. What was there to discredit? They were

discredited. Only in Bizarroworld...

[linazelle]

14. .

[linazelle]

15. .

[linazelle]

16. .

[linazelle]

17. .

[electron_blue]

19. I know, that doesn't make sense to me either

Doesn't seem like they wanted to discredit him, so much as to scare the sh*t out of him. I see it as a major threat.

[linazelle]

20. .

[Generator]

21. Same thing I asked, I agree

Never understood the answer either. "Nepotism" doesn't change the facts. Either there was some proof Saddam was trying to buy yellow cake from Africa or not. It doesn't make it less credible because "a wife" " a woman" or not any woman "a CIA covert woman" "sent him". And she didn't send him. So it's false anyway. As is everything that ever crosses the lips of anyone with or defending this administration.

The point was to get Plame. They could have find another way to get Wilson. They could have just made up one of their usual lies, innuendo, smearing by association. Smearing by association with a CIA WMD expert? No makey sense. I think the risks here was too great-which means the payoff-getting rid of Plame was worth it to them.

[Enraged_Ape]

23. I'm so glad other people feel the same way I do

It really does look like the whole point of their operation was to shut Plame down and get her husband to shut his piehole about the yellow cake farce. In fact, it seems quite OBVIOUS that this is the case. The rest is all talking points that don't make a lick of sense on even a moment's scrutiny.

[galloglas]

26. You're Right!!

"which means the payoff-getting rid of Plame was worth it to them."

Absolutely.

The Administration is faced with making some case for war whenever they want to intimidate some country (take your pick...Iran, Syria, Libya, etc.).

The only case to be made is one of WMD. And Valerie Plame had been sitting on WMD Central for a long time. She was running the entire operation in the area of the world that, in Rumsfeld's words, "is floating on oil".

If George Tenet can't get her to go along with stories of existing WMDs in 2002 to 2003, they have to get rid of her. That was their cause for war!

Larry Lindsey had to go when he said the Iraq War would cost a hundred billion. The guy who acknowledged that the $398 Bn "MediCare Prescription Benefit" was originally computed at $540 Bn was gone in sixty seconds. O'neill was gone, Richard Clarke was gone...

But Valerie Plame was an intelligence operative, not a Presidential advisor. So, when she could not be intimidated (much like they tried to do to Sibel Edmonds) into compliance, they had to get rid of her.

I hope if, and when, this ever gets in front of a Congressional inquiry, that they will call on her successor at the CIA WMD desk for Africa, Central Asia and the Mideast.

That person would have a real story to tell.

[Enraged_Ape]

28. Yes, I want to hear from her successors

Although I'm sure it's probably classified, I want to know about the damage these *#)@ards have caused. It had to have been substantial. I wonder how many operatives DIED over their stupid, evil, petty act?

[garybeck]

24. answers

1) it was "discrediting" him because, according to their "story" Plame recommended Wilson for the job to go to Niger. in other words he couldn't have gotten the job just on his merit, his wife had to recommend him.

2) it wasn't just to discredit him, it was an act of revenge against him, to ruin his wife's career.

3) beneath the surface is much more. the real reason Plame was outed is because she was invoved in a CIA operation that was about to discover connections between Saudi Arabia and terrorism. Bushco needed to end that operation. They had a fake company set up with many employees, infiltrating many other organizations. When Novak outed Plame and the fake company, the entire operation was terminated and everyone's cover was blown. Not just Plame.

[galloglas]

29. Plame's Successor

Right, Gary,

And, under oath, in front of a full Congressional hearing will probably be the only way to ever hear about the damage that was done to our own spy network by outing Plame.

One doesn't become informed well enough to know whether there are, or are not, WMDs in any country without knowing who is running the infrastructure, and who owns that infrastructure.

Unlike the rest of us who might watch Sibel Edmonds and try to make sense of her careful phrases, while she speaks with a mouth full of gag orders, I'll be Plame knows every name, comapny and "entity" that Edmonds refers to.

Can you imagine her successor being asked,

"How many operatives did you inherit when you took over the Central WMD desk from Ms. Plame?"

"Uhhh. Why none, Mr. Chairman."

"Why is that?"

"Well, they were all killed between July 6th and July 20th, 2003."