Shame on you. Shame on you all "Over There" devotees.

[Neshanic]

Right below is a thread aking why no response to graphic war photos. Too real? Oh, it's not packaged for you. That must be the reason and the answer to the question posed. The pictures of the reality show that no one wants to see. It's not like we have been trying to expose the war for what it is, and get photos and stories that tell the real truth. The Pentagon and this administration use televsion for their own purposes when needed, and you have been used.

It's not like you were not warned. False reporters, false stories, false everything. Now a show about a war we are currently fighting in. Dying in. Destroying a country in. Civilians killed like sheep in car bombs. When did we EVER have a show that serialized war when we were fighting it? Oh. maybe the Gulf War was mentioned and a scene or two for the plot, but a serial? Why stop there? When do you become offended. "F Troop Irag", or maybe those nutty Abu Grahib kids in "Hogans Heros 2006?"

In your heart you know this has been a new line crossed. I know it is wrong, and I am not a Hillary/Lieberman triangulation, XBox raiding apologist Democrat, and I will NEVER apologize.

Don't even give the artistic line, or this is how it is over there shit. Since when did anything on television have YOUR best interest in mind since the media consolidation. Oh yes, they have sleepless nights those writers and actors trying to put a face on the war for us numbnuts who can't see what's really happening. You want reality with a touch of shaky-camera edginess? get your freaking ass "over there" and the camera will not be shaking because you like the look of the effect. What a crock of shit. There is no sane reason for this show, unless you are a FOX network and you have shit to sell. Guess what...you all are buying.

Last night, you would think that I was Karl rove on the board. Not one. NOT ONE helped defend me. Sickening, utterly sickening. One way to get people riled up obviously is to comment on the wrongness of a fucking television show. That gets responses.

You get what you deserve. I guess I have just seen this show before and it was called Vietnam. If somebody was told back in 1968 that we would have an "entertainment serial show" aboout a Vietnam-like quaigmire, that the country was fight at the time, on a LIE, they would of fucking puked on you.

It's art, its just a show, it shows what it's really kinda, sort of, maybe, in a writer's mind in an airconditioned office in Burbank. All brought to you by your sponsors.

I have always been amazed to the depravity of what the new next line that gets crossed with nary a wimper. Seems like no big deal for this crowd of angry Democrats. Recounts, Republican criminals, you name it, vent your anger, but defend a televsion show? On these terms at this time, and we still do not know the depth of the sick adminstration that started the war, that begat this obscene show?

Defend away.

[WilliamPitt]

1. This scolding brought to you by...

Pampers.

[Neshanic]

3. Ah, the Reverend Pitt. You going "Over There?"

[WilliamPitt]

4. I'm not even sure what you're talking about

I assume you mean that crappy FX show. I'm amused that Vietnam took several years to get a movie, but Iraq gets a dramatic miniseries before the fighting stops. Ah, instant grat.

No, I just like a good scolding. :)

[Neshanic]

6. Maybe you can work a stream of upcoming episodes on your site.

Like link FX to your site. How cool would that be?

[WilliamPitt]

7. I think I'll pass

We're taking up too much bandwidth re-broadcasting old 90210 episodes.

[VelmaD]

8. Dammit, PDA needs more...

Tori Spelling. You can NEVER have enough.

[Neshanic]

11. Well maybe a Brittany Spears site....

At least she went over there and shot off her yap about her missing footage of the things that really went on.

Brittany Spears opines on the war, and wants to know who copped her tape of the bad stuff.

Now we have really gone down a rabbit hole.

[Gruenemann]

14. That was Jessica Simpson, not Britney Spears

Not that there's that much difference.

[Neshanic]

16. Opps, I have my pop culture icons mixed. Thanks for the correction

Jessica, that's what I meant.

[endarkenment]

28. you have to give her credit

she may play a brainless blonde on tv but it seems that perhaps she is not quite as stupid as she pretends to be.

[Neshanic]

42. See the paradox?

Blond bimbo goes to Iraq with hunky hubby to support troops.

Film of tour that shows BAD stuff dissapears.

Blond bimbo speaks out wanting to know what happened.

DUer's watch canned entertainment show of war, and screech that is was a good portrayal and other crap, even as blond bimbo stands up and speaks her mind.

She went "over there" and saw. WTF is these DUer's excuses for defending a TV show as "good portrayals" that never went and blond bimbo says otherwise.

Amazing. Simply amazing.

[King Coal]

61. Pampers, Will? Pampers?

Well, Will, I guess that Depends on your age.

Yeah, I tried 'em. I just couldn't get used to crapping in my pants.

[K-W]

2. I feel the same way about CSI devotees. EOM

[seabeyond]

5. i wasnt in any threads to agree with you, because i agree with you

and not particpating in this at all to feed the sickness of it.

i didnt see hte show, not going to see the show have no desire to see the show. just the idea of this show is sick to me. i want no part

rock on

[ProfessorGAC]

10. I Wouldn't Watch That Show At Gunpoint!

I'm completely on board with both of you. It's pathetic and an obvious moneygrab at the expense of 1800 dead soldiers.
The Professor

[catnhatnh]

12. Of course you have the right not to see it...

...But don't we condemn people who don't read a book, yet want it banned? After all, to some "Christians" just the idea of a book about a teenager going to a school for sorcery is sick...
I watched part of it.It was pretty graphic and I thought the character developement was pretty superficial.I might watch it again. I personally see no harm in the show coexisting with the war and might actually praise it if I find it helps bring discussion to the underlying policies of the war...Regards...

[ProfessorGAC]

15. Your Standards Might Be A Little Low

Just sayin'. There is a great leap between censorship and boycotting.
The Professor

[catnhatnh]

23. But no leap at ALL...

between people who boycott things they haven't examined...And thanks for your take on my "standards".While at times I'm sure my posts sound as supercilious as yours at least I feel no compunction to repeat my sig line as if quoting one of the greats, ala...
The Cat

[ProfessorGAC]

26. Turn It Down A Notch, OK?

I don't need to see murder to know i don't want to see one! And, i don't need to see the show to know that i loathe the premise.

You watched it. You admitted you didn't think much of it. I would suggest that your standards were too low for watching it in the first place, and you validated it by suggesting it wasn't very good.

Could you be any more sensitive? I think it's clouding your better judgment.
The Professor

[seabeyond]

22. did you hear me anywhere tell you not to watch the show

or anyone else. yes i think it is profitting off dead bodies, and horror of war and a manipulation of peopple. and i would watch it feeling this premise because?

no, i wont support it, and that means not watching first second or third time

i dont watch reality shows either. think they are horrible, manipulative of public and a quick cheap easy lazy buck for the network, pplaying ont he worst of who we humans are. agian. do you hear me tellign anyone not to watch

started a fight, where there was no fight

[ProfessorGAC]

31. And With A Tad Too Much Sensitivity

Wanted to tell you what you should do, got mad at me when i told him what he should do. Interesting sense of fairness by that cat.
The Professor

[seabeyond]

33. and this is the liberal bullshit, that pisses me off

and i am not gonna take that either. i have children begging me to get the filth out of their lives. too much, too much they are saying. you tell me to think about kids, you tell me to be a parent.,

the natural makeup of all kids, evolution, development, they dont want this adult world, shoved into their world. as society is demanding they suck it up and experience. fuck that shit. you dont tell me what my kids have to experience, especiallly when
A
it isnt healthy
B
the kids dont want it

the arrogance. because parents say, can you not put sexuality, or fucking on the kid channels anyway. can you keep the porn off that. can it be a kid perspective instead of sexually adult behaviors, to entertain all.

dont worry. i am a parent. i am responsible. we dont watch any of the shit. we dont want to. having a tv off doesnt hurt us at all. i have all day to spend with kids, be connected to and talk to. i dont have a job that takes me away. i am not poor, it is not hard for me to feed and keep kids healthy. not to mention, afford all the luxeries, like books and positive entertainment around my kids.

my point. you arent making it hard on me. you are making it hard on working class working their ass off all day long to come home and work some more.............in a whole different grab ya by the balls

in all your arrogance tell me, how dare i.......tell you what to watch. i wouldnt dare, as you insist child watch all the adult world, all the time. commercials, driving down the street, all of tv, programming, our fuckin president flippin off the nation

wtf

[ProfessorGAC]

36. You're Not Talking To Me, Are You?

I was agreeing with you. Did you mean that to someone else, or just raving to a sympathetic ear?
The Professor

[seabeyond]

38. just ranting to a sympathetic ear?

lol lol . yes i was just ranting to someone i felt understood. i have a lot of people in my life right now, that isnt understanding. lol lol. so many battles. now.....i am off to the lions. good christian folk. with bushie boys finger to all the u.s. sittin in my brain. lol lol

have a good day. you are fun. i always appreciate

[ProfessorGAC]

39. Cool! Same Page!

Just didn't you yelling AT me, when you were trying to yell at someone else. Rant anytime.
The Professor

[endarkenment]

9. npr ran a story (promo piece?) last night on it

I swear the producer or director or whoever he was (not bochco) did not get it at all. He thinks he is not taking sides. Several callers tried to point out that simply by telling the story from the viewpoint of the american forces, telling the story of three of our soldiers, he ends up with an audience caring about 'the good guys' constantly under attack from nameless faceless enemies, 'the bad guys' and that this is taking sides and it is biased. His claim to integrity is that that they aren't taking any help from the DOD so the DOD does not have story line approval.

So suppose the story line took six characters, three of our soldiers and three insurgents, and we got involved in the humanity of all six of these people - that would be not taking sides - would your objections stop?

[Neshanic]

18. How convenient of NPR and the new management there.

[endarkenment]

29. not npr's fault really

the radio show was doing a pretty good job of covering the issues, although it really did smell of commercial promotion given that it was on the night the show premiered. It was the tv show's director (producer? writer? I don't know his name even) who did not get the bias angle at all.

[bryant69]

13. You will NEVER apologize

Does that apply to just this issue or to your life as a whole?

And are mad that peple watch this show, or are you mad that people aren't paying enough attention to war photos you posted?

Bryant
Check it out --> http://politicalcomment.blogspot.com

[Neshanic]

17. For my stance on this show. No apology ever.

[bryant69]

21. OK

Like you are on the maiden voyage of the Titanic Two which promptly sinks, and you are trapped out on the froazen ocean in the middle of Icebergs, and there's just you and one other person in the life boat, you got no food, no drinkable water, giant squids are lurking around sticking their tentacles out of the water, and this other person turns to you, and says, "don't you think you were a little hard on "Over There," you still wouldn't apologize?

For the record, I've never personally watched the show - I'm more into Battlestar Galactaca and The Simpsons.

[Gildor Inglorion]

19. Simple solution...

quit watching TV. I gave it up 20 years ago, and I haven't missed a thing.
:D

[fishnfla]

49. I disagree

you are missing something. You dont get to get yourself all worked up over something as worthless as a stupid fucking television program. :eyes: You obviously dont understand that the more controversial it is, the more people pimp the whore's folly.


2 and 1/2 half years TV free now. Emphasis on free.

[kentuck]

20. "Over Here"...as from an Iraqi viewpoint ?

Showing the good guys and the bad guys, except in their movie, the Americans are the "bad guys". Would America accept that?

[5X]

24. I am with you 100% n/t

[Jara sang]

25. What about "Profiles From the Front Line"?

That came out before this one. That was just as sick in my opinion. These two shows are definitely the contrivances of policy makers and pure propaganda.

[endarkenment]

27. These shows are the 21st century version

of the wartime propaganda movies from wwII, updated to be 'reality tv' and made less obvious with a dose of spielberg inspired realism. Until they show the war from both sides, which they never will, it has to be considered propaganda. Then again I haven't seen it so I have no idea what I am talking about :-)

[trekbiker]

64. Huh???

how can you be so sure they wont show the Iraqi side?? I have a feeling they will try and present both sides of this conflict, for better story lines if nothing else.

and that first episode was nowhere close to "wartime propaganda movies from wwII".. it definately was not pro-war, rah-rah, John Wayne hero crappola... It presented more of a picture of the insanity and waste of war. But it's too soon to see where it's heading. I will watch a few more episodes before I render a verdict. The first episode pretty much relegated the iraqi fighters to typical Hollywood bad guys.. we'll see..

[A-Schwarzenegger]

65. One thing on portrayal of (dead) Iraqi fighters ...

There were at least 3 prolonged silent scenes of US soldiers
standing there staring (in awe, horror, paralysis?) at the bodies
and faces of Iraqi fighters they had just killed. I don't
think that is typical Hollywood, to depict the "enemy" as
human and worthy of being looked at as human beings, dead OR
alive. Those were not dirty, filthy, ruthless, foreign terrorists
lying there in those scenes, they were human beings.

[endarkenment]

71. they are, regardless, peripheral to the show

I am not saying that the show is going to be as bad or as one sided as the WWII films - we've gotten too sophisticated for that. I am also not saying that the people involved in the production of this show are not trying to be balanced. I'm saying that given the format they cannot present a balanced viewpoint. They would have to have 6 main characters: 3 Iraqi insurgents and 3 american soldiers, and we would have to follow, in approximately equal depth, the lives of all six of these characters before the show presented a balanced perspective.

Yes, it seems from your comments that they tried to portray the seriousness of war and the humanity of all involved, but tell me the names of these Iraq dead?

[A-Schwarzenegger]

72. Ha! I cant even tell you my name half the time.

And if somebody in one of these threads hadntt said
the name "Bo" I wouldnt have remembered any US soldiers names.
I'm old, man! But when I saw these scenes I saw what the
creators were trying to do and my hope remains that this will
be one little chip in the wall of the war. Watch it if you get a chance.

[endarkenment]

68. I listened to the very earnest director of the show on npr

explain how the show realistically portrayed the lives of three american soldiers. As several callers pointed out, this means that the audience will care about these characters and not really care so much about the faceless nameless 'enemies' who will be trying to kill these three people on a regular basis. The show might give a realistic portrayal of what it might be to live as a US soldier in Iraq, but it cannot give a balanced unbiased perspective.

[trekbiker]

74. you may be right..

but I think there's a good chance Bochco will introduce some Iraqi civilian characters. If he doesnt he is missing a great opportunity for more realistic and interesting story lines

[Kazak]

30. Had our cable turned off months ago...

Lovin' it. :D

[KarenInMA]

32. Nice Righteous Indignation you got there.

Did you see the show??

I liked it. It didn't preach one way or another. It was a pretty good glimpse into a soldiers life, if you ask me.

Save your fury for someone else.

[Neshanic]

35. Hey, get a real glimpse, head on over there for real.

[soup]

34. um, Neshanic, the thread you referenced at the beginning

of your rant?

"Right below is a thread aking why no response to graphic war photos."

is a thread asking for a response to graphics made by one of DU's many talented graphic artists.

[Neshanic]

37. Oh no! I am horribly wrong! I love the show and it's premise now.

You and you laser point have completely swayed me to watch the show and LOVE it. The premise is so cool! What an idiot I am!

Lets have an "Over There" party at your house! Lots of chips and dips and we can talk about how realistic and cool the show is. Then we can get on DU and bitch about the real important stuff. You know, not that we don't get any news or real reporting, cause we don't need it, we have the show.

God.

[soup]

43. Not quite sure how my post elicited that response,

But, ok.

Guess we'll see ya next Wednesday night. If you miss the flashing 'Party here!' strobe lights, look for the van in the driveway with the Attack Iraq? NO! bumpersticker still attached.

[mattclearing]

40. I watched the show out of curiosity, and here's what I came up with.

And I didn't pay a great deal of attention, but the impression I am left with is that it was brutally graphic, fairly realistic, and altogether depressing to watch.

Given the amount of media attention regarding the situation on the ground in Iraq, and the amount of footage being broadcast on American screens, a grim re-enactment may be the closest we get to actually being able to show the American people what their Bush votes result in.

You shouldn't jump to conclusions. That was not a rah-rah go USA kind of show.

It was violent, harrowing, and difficult to watch. I probably won't watch it again because it was painful, but I applaud the makers' efforts.

I think they meant to bring an accurate and unappealing portrayal of war to a large audience, and I support that fully.

[Neshanic]

44. How surgically precise.

"Given the amount of media attention regarding the situation on the ground in Iraq, and the amount of footage being broadcast on American screens, a grim re-enactment may be the closest we get to actually being able to show the American people what their Bush votes result in."

Lets see, we get nothing on the truth, so a show base on non truths makes us more informed? It helps especially when the plots get real sexy.

[mattclearing]

50. Did you even watch the show?

And if not, then how do you know what you're talking about?

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

41. Zzzzzzzzzzz...

[Neshanic]

45. Wake up...Fox is on.

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

47. TV Sucks. n/t

[stanwyck]

46. Well, at least give the show this

it reminds over-medicated, under-educated, over-stimulated, under-achieving Americans that there IS a war going on in Iraq and people are dying.
Maybe a few thousand will turn away from some celebrity reality show long enough to remember these people, our soldiers and Iraqi civilians.
If it accomplishes that, then, fine.
Besides, any show that has the freepers in full froth is probably worth it just for the entertainment value of reading their about-to-stroke-out indignant posts on Free Republic.
How dare a show portray war in a way not in keeping with German propaganda films?
Damn that "Hollyweird" anyway.

[A-Schwarzenegger]

48. Don't listen to hysterical reviews

from people who havent even seen the show.
The show is anti-war. I couldnt give less of a
flying fuck what network it's on, who makes
money off it, or any other bullshit hysterical
distraction. It's anti-Iraq-war. It will inevitably
help to build the growing public momentum against
this war. Its purpose is to sicken people against
the war, and that's what it will do. Resume hysteria.

[trekbiker]

59. agree... I watched it..

I thought it was a somewhat rough as to story and situations. A little too "Hollywood" and definately borrowing from "Saving Private Ryan" type shooting and effects. I did like the sargent character though. I agree that it seemed to take an anti-Iraq war stance but it may be too soon to tell. I may watch future episodes because I am interested to see how they treat the Iraqis. Just dumb, crazy bad guys?? or will they present more balanced views from both sides of the conflict??

Since we aren't getting any "real war" footage out of the corporate MSM this show may be turn into a positive contribution to anti war sentiment. Still too soon to tell though.

[Kalish]

66. van could

be proud.

eh?

[ScamUSA.Com]

67. yep

my thoughts as well

[noamnety]

51. Cause and effect

cause: "Anyone who thinks this show is cool is a major league sicko."

effect: "Last night, you would think that I was Karl rove on the board. Not one. NOT ONE helped defend me."



Pick a side. Be the abusive bully telling us what we're allowed to think. Or be the oppressed victim. I get confused when you try to be both at once.

[rinsd]

52. Sorry I don't pay attention to sanctimonious people...

...who condemn something they haven't seen. Especially when they make up straw men.

Check out freeperville, you'll find some strange bedfellows in your irrational hatred.

"NOT ONE helped defend me."

Adding victimhood to your holier than thou bullshit...quick add how long you've been a Democrat and you'll hit the sanctimonious trifecta!

[Neshanic]

53. Trifecta? Looks like the gang of three, you above you and Arnie.

The fact that you cannot see the awfull premise and direction this show takes pretty much sums up all three of you.

The fact that Jessica Simpson has more balls than you all three speaks volumes.

MTV is casting for the next "Real World". you guys should give it a shot.

[rinsd]

55. We can argue on premise....

...whether a TV show with war as its centerpiece of drama is inherently a good or bad thing(the record is mixed).

We can't argue the direction it takes because you haven't seen it. Promo and reviews don't count.

It wasn't enough for you to say this just isn't for me. I will note that a few posters did indeed say that,some went further than that. The difference is you went after people with some holier than thou bullshit. Most poeple don't like that attitude and you got the reaction you were looking for. All this manufactured rage over whether people watch a TV show, are you that desparate for the attention?

[A-Schwarzenegger]

57. Hey, he's sure drumming up viewers

for a show he's never seen. But whatever happens,
don't think fer yourself! Kick!

[MadJohnShaft]

54. I thought it really sucked

As TV, it is poorly written - plot relies on people doing idiotic, illogical things. If they are new recruits and still green - haven't they seen any war movies? You don't stand up when the bullets are wizzing by overhead. Dumb.

Morally it is a travesty. Won't watch again.

[NYCGirl]

60. I guess the military doesn't show them war movies as training.

:eyes:

[Connie_Corleone]

56. Shame on you for acting all high and mighty.

First of all, there's only been one episode so far, so I don't think one can be an "Over There" devotee from watching one episode.

Second, you said all of this last night. Why are you still going on about it?

Is someone forcing you to watch? If you have a problem with the show, write Fox.

[Generator]

58. Well I had some of the same thoughts

A show about a war that is going on right now??? Mash and China Beach were two of my favorite shows once. China Beach was some hardhitting stuff-but it was mostly about character development. And of course the Vietnam war was over by a decade by then.

It has crossed a line. I agree. It's not entertainment. I wouldn't watch it. It would make me feel like shit. I already feel like shit that they are OVER THERE and whatever part I played in it, or my country played in it. I'm weak, I admit. I don't want to think about it more than I already do. NOW-if it was a Documentary that is different. I saw a short one on MTV last year that was heartbreaking. But on the other hand, if it brings the war home and makes it more real that people are dying-and that we need to bring the troops home-that is a good thing.

Didn't see your post last night.

And I'm the last p.c. person around. Some things feel wrong though, and obviously, if someone had a Teevee show about how you were fighting and dying while you were fighting and dying-of course that would piss you off. I get your feeling about it.

It bugs me that everything is becoming just fake reality. Even the show about the new INXS singer bugs me-because the guy died. You can't recreate everything like it's the same thing that existed beofre. What's next, auditioning to be the new Beattle?

All that said, I haven't seen the show..maybe it can do some good..though what I read in t.v. guide said it was not "political"..and maybe that is the worse thing of all..no understanding of why we are over there makes it just seem like it's just the way it is when as we all know-and we don't even know-what the hell we are doing there, when we will get out and ultimately-it's a national disgrace.

[geek tragedy]

62. You're bashing people for watching a show you've never seen?

Sounds like Spongedob Stickypants rhetoric.

[LittleClarkie]

63. Gee, I would defend

If I knew what the flying fuck on a stick you were talking about.

Sorry your thread didn't get responses.

Nice tantrum though.

Yeah, we're just a buncha Repub lite Rove wannabes.

We'll defend when we've done something that needs defending, thanks.

[JHB]

69. Can one be a "devotee" of something that's only been on once?

I haven't seen it and don't intend to, but the question occured to me.

[LSK]

70. if this show reveals the horrors of war, im all for it

Americans have a view of war that is all glory and no guts. Americans need exposure to the horrors of war more often. War is not cool. War sucks. War is bad. That message must be banged over all these war mongers here in the US.

Europe had their cities destroyed twice in the past 100 years. They learned their lesson.

Americans need to learn that war is horrible and should be avoided at all costs.

If this TV show does that in any way, them Im all for it.

ps: I have never even heard of this show until about 15 minutes ago when reading in GD.

[Neshanic]

73. "if this show reveals the horrors of war, im all for it"....

It will have to do since we only get a dribble of censored infornation about what is really going on, unless you are Jessica Simpson.

But what the hey...it's entertainment.