Why do some here bash Chavez?

[Jamison]

I don't understand this. He's probably the most progressive leader in the world at this moment. He is doing so much to help the poor in his nation, and from what I've read on threads here today, he's even offering to help some poor people here. This is a guy who knows and preaches about the evils of Bushco and stands up in defiance to them.

I sometimes feel like telling Chavez bashers to leave here and take their criticisms over to freerepublic.com.

Anyone else feel this way too?

[H5N1]

1. It's a mystery to me, as well

What do they expect from the man?

[Missy M]

2. Yes, I feel the same as you....

Chavez is for helping the poor and less fortunate have a better life, health care, education and a part of the pie. Why he gets criticized on DU is beyond me.

[bladegrip]

3. Chavez

Is he not a Dictator? That is what I have been reading

[Jamison]

8. He was Democratically elected...twice.

[MildyRules]

22. So was

Hitler.

Being democratically elected doesn't mean one can't become a dictator.

[K-W]

40. No, but it means one isnt a dictator.

Anyone can hypothetically become a dictator. Chavez isnt a dicatator and that is what matters.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

45. Hitler was not elected to Chancellor....he was appointed to that position.

[Telly Savalas]

9. Chavez was democratically elected in elections

which were observed by many international parties including our very own Jimmy Carter who testifies to its legitimacy.

[Dhalgren]

11. No, he is not a "dictator". He is a fairly elected democratic

leader of his country. The people of his country support him to the tune 70+%...

[0rganism]

13. A popularly-elected dictator who allowed a recall challenge?

Who woulda thunk it. :crazy:

[Bridget Burke]

15. Where did you read it?

Perhaps you would benefit by reading even more!

There are many threads on Chavez & you can pick up lots of info.

[ChairmanAgnostic]

16. democratically elected presidents are dictators

but only if they disagree with Washington DC.

He won election with 76% of the popular vote. How is that a dictatorship?

He has done more to add assets, health care, education and jobs to the extremely poor lower class. If you ever saw Caracas, you would not believe the abject poverty and suffering that existed up the mountainside. Shanty buildings, shacks, and destitute poverty. Add a very small group of super rich, and you have Caracas.

because he dares criticize Bush and his policies, he is called a dictator. Yet, real dictators are promoted as democratic leaders (Pakistan, for ex) Remember that Bush tried to do a "revolution" on him in 2001.

Recently, DEA agents were thrown out because they were trying a repeat performance.

[SeveneightyWhoa]

34. Perhaps you should quit..

..getting your information from far-right sources?

[Media_Lies_Daily]

46. Reading in what? NeoCon Daily?

[no name no slogan]

4. Hey, James Carville worked for his opponents

Carville was a consultant to Chavez' opposition in the recent referendum. Of course, he always has been an opportunistic whore, but this was the straw that broke the camel's back for me.

And people wonder why progressives don't trust the DLC?

[lostnfound]

20. That's disgusting. nt

[On the Road]

5. Some Democrats Bash Chavez

and a lot of mainstream news sources. It's easy to develop a negative opinion of him even if you're aware of biased coverage.

There's no question Chavez has a lot of enemies in Venezuela and acted in some demagogic ways. He's leading a constitutional struggle against an entrenched elite, and is using every legal means at his disposal. You can interpret that positively or negatively.

It's usually pretty easy for the US political establishment to whip up hatred against a foreign leader, especially from a small country where most people have no other sources of information. Look at the image Castro has over here.

[Mika]

17. John Kerry was one of the Chavez bashers.

:puke:

[Laughing Mirror]

27. Yes he was and we must conveniently try to forget that sad fact

Has he apologized to Chávez for his bashing or at least tried to enlighten himself about what's really going on down Venezuela way? One would think not.

[Dhalgren]

6. Viva Chavez!

People who trash him, here and elsewhere, have an agenda that they feel is moved forward by attacking this proved progressive. I say screw them. We need a Chavez in this country; we have the movement, we just need a real leader...

[CityZen-X]

7. Hugo My Hero!

This guy is the victim of Bu$h*t propaganda, he is the real deal as far as working for the underdog. The rich freak elites in Valenzuela hate him. Does that tell you what time it is!?

[manic expression]

10. Because they're ignorant

and they buy every neo-con imperialist lie, hook and sinker.

Either that, or I guess helping those in need and making sure people get what they deserve isn't acceptable with some people here.

on edit: Viva Chavez!

[Laughing Mirror]

26. Ignorance it is

not helped in any way by the Chávez bashing coming not only from their president Bush but their would-be president Kerry. Yes, sad to say, him too.

[Voltaire99]

12. Because "Democrat" is no longer a term with much meaning

If the tent is so large that it can include belligerent anti-Chavez neoliberals, then the tent is in disorder and needs a delousing.

I agree Chavez is the light of the hemisphere, perhaps of the world. It is not only against the Bushes and Cheneys that Chavez looks good. In his vigorous progressivism, he makes the corporate-friendly Hillarys and Kerrys of this world pale by comparison.

Let us remember that while Chavez puts progressive values in action, the Bush-lite chumps running the Democratic party are trying to send more troops to Iraq. There is simply no comparison.

[Dhalgren]

18. Good response! Dead on!

[Telly Savalas]

14. Because they're bored and want a good flamewar.

Sometimes religion gets a little boring, ya know.

[Guyfromkansas]

19. Cause

hes slowly nationlizing the economy, taken land from poeple and gave it to the poor which sounds like a good idea just improves image in the country but helps nothing since most will be to poor to work the lands which hurts the economy. Hes arming a miltia to fight off possable invasion.

Fifth Republic Movement is also turning into an armed miltia who said if opposition tries another referendum and get enough sigs to make it legal they wouldnt stand for that ie civil war?

Socialism is a nice thought but look what happens in far socialist nations they fall into brutal dictatorships.

[Qibing Zero]

24. And the alternative?

What most people don't seem to understand, is that if you have 60-80% living in poverty, you can't expect them to have a chance to move up in a capitalistic society. That's just insanity. People like to say that a completely free market gives everyone a chance, but (especially in a country with so many poor) all it does is increase the already existing divide. Give them a base first, level the playing field some, else they stand no chance whatsoever.

[no name no slogan]

25. Just like Chile under Allende?

Chavez has seen the writing on the wall. He knows damn well what happens to left-leaning leaders of Latin American countries who buck the conventional lapdog mentality so desired by Washington.

The Allende presidency in Chile is a prime example of what can happen to a democratically-elected government that does not kowtow to the desires of international capital.

If you dare to redistribute wealth, use your country's resources to benefit ALL the people (not just the elite), and speak out against the rampant imperialism of your northern neighbor, you're abducted and assassinated-- if you're lucky.

If you're not lucky, you and any of your supporters will be detained and tortured-- as will your family and friends. Your democratically-elected government will be replaced by a junta of military thugs who have no truck with human rights and will spare no expense to make themselves richer and more powerful.

Given the history US action in the region, Chavez is doing the only sane thing he CAN do: arming militias against yet another coup attempt, and defending the people from probably yet another attempt to overthrow the popular government.

Yes, state control of the economy by a left-wing government can be ugly. But history has show that, in Latin America, it's not much better under a right-wing government, either.

[bvar22]

30. Yes!

Just look at the brutal dictatorships in Sweden and Denmark!!!

[SeveneightyWhoa]

35. Totally.

Canada, which many Americans would describe as "socialist", has quite a brutal government. I've been tortured by the Feds a few times, actually.

:eyes:

Nice try.

[K-W]

44. That post doesnt even make sense.

hes slowly nationlizing the economy, taken land from poeple and gave it to the poor which sounds like a good idea just improves image in the country but helps nothing since most will be to poor to work the lands which hurts the economy. Hes arming a miltia to fight off possable invasion.

Too poor to work the lands? What on earth does that mean? I am to assume that previously all Venezualan crops were planted and harvested by millionaires?

Fifth Republic Movement is also turning into an armed miltia who said if opposition tries another referendum and get enough sigs to make it legal they wouldnt stand for that ie civil war?

Are you asking a question or making a statement?

Socialism is a nice thought but look what happens in far socialist nations they fall into brutal dictatorships.

Yah, Finland is a real dicatotorial hell hole.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

21. Red baiting corporate neo-libs paying their "patriot" dues.

Hugo is a leader who defies the capitalists by being a socialist for the people and won't play the kiss the boss game.

The DLC types get nervous when someone challenges their right to keep the American people deluded by shouting "SOCIALIST!!" and "LEFT WING!!"

Chavev, Lula, Fidel, et al, are a threat to the American oligarchy disguised as a democracy.

[earth mom]

23. Maybe those Chavez bashers are FROM freeperville. nt

[slor]

28. Because he is EVIL!!!!

He is trying to help the poor! How dare he fight against the New Christian Free Market Values System! Oh yeah, and he hates Freedom!

[blindpig]

29. 100+ years of propaganda

The most minute trace of socialism will trip the radar of the guardians of The Amerikan Way. Fear of redistribution is always in the back, if not the fore of the mind of the Ruling Class. Remembering the fate of their Russian counterparts they trot out all of the familiar imagery to keep the masses full of hate and fear and oblivious to their oppression.

It is kosmic karma that we have no Chavez to lead us, the punishment of the gods for being a nation of narcissistic sheep.

[Idioteque]

31. I think Lincoln Chafee said it best actually

When Condaleeza Rice was being questioned for her appointment to Secretary of State, she spewed the administration's anti-Chavez rhetoric. This was Chafee's response.

" It seems to be a hypocritical approach to our foreign policy in some ways, in particular how we deal with some of those democracies such as Russia, Senator Biden said, uneven or undemocratic or some of the Turkmenistan, Uzbekistan, Tajikistan, even Musharraf, President Musharraf, and then on the other hand have a completely different view of, say, Iran, as Senator Biden was saying. It seems to magnify our differences on one hand and on the other hand, we magnify our similarities. In particular after having just come back from South America and meeting with President Chavez. Here he has gone before his people, high, high turnout. Just had a referendum, and as one of the people from our embassy said, they cleaned their clocks and kicked their butts. It seems to me to say derogatory things about him may be disrespectful to him, but also to the Venezuelan people. How do you react to that?"

[tomg]

36. Idioteque, great quote. Do you know

what Rice's response was. Incidentally, I hope all went well with
the problem with the teacher and the pledge. That was you, wasn't it?

[Idioteque]

47. Rice's Response

"CONDOLEEZZA RICE: Well, I have nothing but good things to say about the Venezuelan people. They are a remarkable people, and if you notice, Senator Chafee, I was not making derogatory comments, I was simply recognizing that there are unhelpful and unconstructive trends going on in Venezuelan policies. This is not personal."

Full Article

I recommend listening to the clip from the hearing. Linc is kicking her ass. I wish he was a Democrat :(.

Er and about the flag thing. It seems that it has all been resolved. The ACLU of Florida is going to be sending a letter to make sure it never happens again. :)

[Beaverhausen]

32. a friend was telling me he is a major drug kingpin and assasinates people

it was at a party so I couldn't ask him what his sources were but I wanted to find out more.

Anyone ever hear this?

[Judi Lynn]

33. Of course not. It's also no wonder he and you have no sources.

Absolute gibberish.

[Beaverhausen]

37. the thing is this guy is usually pretty well informed

but I had never heard anything like that about Chavez and wondered if that is something the right wing is floating to discredit him.

[txaslftist]

42. Well, he IS from South America...

And he has an ethnic last name. Certainly he is involved in selling drugs. And all of those brownies down there use death squads, so he must use them, too. And with a name like "Chavez", surely he's corrupt. And an election with 70% of the vote...that could never REALLY happen, so obviously it was rigged.

And of course, being a South American country, it simply MUST be a brutal dictatorship. I mean, those brownies couldn't actually make a REAL democracy work.

Obviously he's a socialist if he's for setting up a social 'safety' net for the very poor. I mean, what kind of commie country would do that? I mean, other than us, that is, what with social security... but we're trying to get rid of that, aren't we?

Its just so confusing. It's so much easier with a nice, old fashioned progressive monarchy like Saudi Arabia. We LIKE them, doncha know.

[Bridget Burke]

43. Floating?

Is that like just mentioning the charges without any backup?

Sounds like something the right wing would do.

[SeveneightyWhoa]

38. Yes. Of course.

Chavez is a drug dealer, a strong-arm dictator, a dangerous hoarder of weapons of mass destruction, and a Muslim terrorist.

What, you didn't know that? You must be reading the wrong propaganda.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

49. We also want to know about the yellowcake being imported from....

...Niger, and the regular meetings being held by Al Qaeda in Chevez's office!

[Media_Lies_Daily]

48. No. Absolutely untrue.

[EuroObserver]

39. Briefly droppping firewall security level

(in place in order to prevent infestation from evil commercial spyware emanating from the site) in order to post this comment:

The President of the Republic of Venezuela is entirely legitimate, very respectable both at home and internationally, much loved by very many people (we need more like him, everywhere), honourable, and has balls.

If a truly Democratic Republic with strong leadership does not represent the social as well as economic interests of the majority (that means, in present circumstances, the poor) as well as the creative and intelligent, rather than merely those of the warrior and parasite classes, then we'll have to design a new ball park.

If the US war party dares again to interfere there will be deep trouble. Internationally.

Viva Chavez!

PS. If you look closely, you may find that both Venezuela and Cuba have offered aid and assistance in the wake of Katerina. Offers of neighbourliness as usual treated with contempt (as well as aggression) from your side.

Cheeky, you think. But in order to help the poor (especially those some of you call the underclass - aka untermenschen circa 1930's-40's), while some of your civil protection forces have been sent overseas to fight illegal wars for the rich, nevertheless for real. Ask Jesse Jackson, amongst others.

In solidarity, solidaridad, solidarité with one of the most multicultural regions of the USA, Gulf Coast Mississipi, Luisiana, Alabama, Florida. Close neighbours, should be friends.

Hearts are with you.

Ánimo.

[Balbus]

41. No one on this board bashes Chavez...

They've all been banned.

[mitchum]

50. Because they are ignorant, trolls, or just plain stupid

Viva Chavez

[sniffa]

51. that's commie taLk