The Real Looting Hasn't Begun Yet...

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

And much of it won't be that visible.

There will be carpenters, glaziers, plumbers, roofers, contractors, laborers descending on the area because they know there will be work.

And, the way things are today, supply and demand will drive the prices up. There will be plenty of under the table dealing to get to the front of the line which will cut off the people less well financed. The labor rates will be within the law, but the larger contractors and interests will easily circumvent any law to get their piece of the Katrina pie. (note, it won't be the laborers and trades people getting rich here, it's going to be the people contracting them IMHO)

They'll be paying master rates for apprentices and let's not even get into the materials. There won't be any visible gouging, but with the sudden rush to build, there's going to be a lot of vampires out there who will be trying to be the next Halliburton.

I hope I'm wrong.

[NMDemDist2]

1. it will go further than the Gulf Coast too, the Oil giants will loot all

our wallets

[malaise]

2. Did you see this

-scroll down or find - At the Wal-Mart on Tchoupitoulas Street
http://www.nola.com/newslogs/breakingtp/index.ssf?/mtlogs/nola_Times-Picayune/archives/2005_08.html#075195

[Rabrrrrrr]

4. Reminds me of all the looting of our offices by "rescue personnel"

and firemen and other emergency workers after 9-11.

Our building was used as a morgue - nothing left. We got purses and eyeglass cases and some other stuff back, but not a single person got their cash, credit cards, or even eyeglasses back. Eyeglasses, for fuck's sake! They stole everything of value, and left the shit.

Not to mention the couple thousand computers and LCD screens that just "disappeared" from our offices, as well as, well, everything. Looted. Just done.

And this in a building that was guarded by police and probably the national guard and other federal agents! It weren't the homeless looting our building like it was the nearby apartment buildings.

[malaise]

16. The so called protectors always

get the best loot in a crisis. Makes me shake with anger while the media attack the poor and hungry who are looking for food in the main.

[ultraist]

19. Interesting

At the Wal-Mart on Tchoupitoulas Street, an initial effort to hand out provisions to stranded citizens quickly disintegrated into mass looting. Authorities at the scene said bedlam erupted after the giveaway was announced over the radio

So, they opened the store and announced a give away and then called it looting because they thought people took too much?

[Triana]

3. You won't be wrong...

...it's part of the sewage that will arise from this disaster. It's inevitable - parsites like to kick people when they're down. Just look @ George...

[achtung_circus]

5. Canadian softwood lumber, anyone?

Lower cost, doesn't warp the way Southern Yellow Pine does.

[daleo]

6. Politicians will pass a special law for the insurance industry

So that they don't have to pay off half of their legal obligations for this. That will be the most magnificent bit of looting we will ever see.

[marions ghost]

7. here we go again...

badmouth the poor and ignore the vices of the rich.

I'm disgusted by all these righteous attitudes about petty looting in the midst of this unprecedented natural disaster. In a world of Haves and Have-nots, when an area is under extreme stress, you certainly have to expect looting to occur. I'm sure looting is not tops on the list of emergency and police personnel in the Gulf right now.

The truth is that ALL of the time, street crime is pathetically insignificant compared to the regular looting of citizens by white collar criminals and corporate interests.

Puhleeze--the pontificating on this subject by those who have never faced poverty is just ludicrous.

"White collar crime is 90 times more costly than street crime, and yet no one seems to want to address the problem. Many of the ones who commit white collar crimes are the same ones who have the power to decide where funding goes. The upper class has the money, and the voting and legislative power to decide whether law enforcement will even deal with white collar crime. When the corrupt have the power, "justice" in America is a farce, and white collar crime
will continue to decay our country's structure."

http://www.freeessays.tv/a5041.htm

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

11. Did you read the post?

It was talking about corporate crime.

[marions ghost]

12. of course I read the post

and understand completely that you were talkig about corporate crime. Guess I forgot to literally give you credit for that. My remarks are only meant to be an extension of what you were saying.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

14. I'm sorry, I've been navigating windy rainy roads all day and am probably

a little more dense than usual.

:toast:

[marions ghost]

15. no problem

I agree with you completely. Also applaud you for drawing on your experience and talking turkey about construction industy protectionism and fraud. It is one of the most prevalent problems in this country. This IS the kind of looting we need to be talking about. Some poor people looting a store after a hurricane is trivial by comparison.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

17. Add to all that, i am now being inundated with spam telling me which stock

to buy to take advantage of Katrina's destruction.

They go straight to the trash bin.

[ultraist]

20. "White collar crime is 90 times more costly than street crime"

That pretty much says it all, doesn't it!

[fishnfla]

8. I'll disagree from experience

From our hurricane experiences...there is no need to price gouge, the contractors will have so much work lined up once they get it done they can retire. They will have to turn work away

The waiting is the hardest part, and the lack of materials makes it longer. Waiting on insurance adjusters, times the wait some more.

They are still working on roofs in my neighborhood. The roofers are all driving brand new dualies to the site, but charging the same rates.

Some enterprising free-lancers come in and undercut the work, no permits, cash on the barrel.

For the most part, the gov't is on the look out for price gouging, and shoddy work too

[marions ghost]

9. In many states

the government does NOTHING to help the homeowner avoid price gouging and shoddy work.

The homeowners will be sitting ducks in this.

[fishnfla]

21. Not in hurricane states. Not since Andrew

The codes and permit regulations are pretty strict in most gulf states. Believe it or not, even insurance companies are behind it....

shoddy building and price gouging were brought to light from Hurricane Andrew...

[marions ghost]

22. codes and permit regulations may be "strict" --

but what are the actual penalties for non-compliance? In most states the contractors board is not really looking out for homeowners. In most states there is no mechanism for homeowner complaints. And in many cases the homeowner can't even tell the codes and permits are being ignored.

I think the problem is much bigger than beefing up codes and permits.

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

13. I guess I should have been more clear...

It's the High rises and the well financed that get dibs on the materials and best labor before the typical homeowner does. That's where the megabucks are and thats where a lot of the looting is taking place IMO.

I spent a few years as an estimator and project manager for a glazing company and heard horror stories.

[sundog]

10. i fear you may not be far off

there are no doubt some sick contractors salivating over this disaster x(

[wli]

18. We need to arrest people who try this stuff.

Only problem is, Bushler, Cheney, & Rummy are their ringleaders (or at least the most visibly responsible marionettes).

[ScreamingMeemie]

23. No. The real looter is cutting his vacation short.

:hi:

[Tom Yossarian Joad]

24. *** Ouch!***

Well said, MrsGrumpy!