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in_cog_ni_to Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 01:54 PM
Original message
OMG! A puppy was stranded and a man picked him up because
Edited on Sat Sep-03-05 01:55 PM by in_cog_ni_to
the people can't take their pets on the busses???? WTF! Why NOT?!!! They can hold the pet on their lap. What the hell is going on? Haven't these people lost ENOUGH already??? Now they have to leave their pets too? :cry::cry::cry: BASTARDS!
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Roxy66 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 01:55 PM
Response to Original message
1. I hate our current government!!
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Horse with no Name Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 01:56 PM
Response to Original message
2. There was a horrible story the other day
That a soldier ripped a puppy out of a little boys arms and threw it on the ground while they were loading people on the bus. Told him no pets. These fuckers don't have consciences.:cry:
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in_cog_ni_to Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 01:59 PM
Response to Reply #2
11. I could NEVER do something like that. EVER.
How could anyone be so cruel to a child? This is all so damn sad. :(
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Horse with no Name Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 02:00 PM
Response to Reply #11
12. These people that were treated like this in NO
will have emotional scars from what they went through.
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in_cog_ni_to Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 02:06 PM
Response to Reply #12
18. It's breaking my heart.
I never thought I would ever see this in MY country.

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krkaufman Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 02:11 PM
Response to Reply #2
22. Actually, I expect the Guardsmen, police, etc. having to do things ...
.... like that, are also going to suffer from PTSD. I expect most all of them *DO* have consciences, but are following orders.

Yes, perhaps aren't considering the long-term effects of a child losing a pet. But then they may be considering that, but are balancing that memory against the memory of continued existence among filth and dying.
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FreedomAngel82 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 10:09 PM
Response to Reply #2
41. Oh God...
is that for real? :cry:
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JohnLocke Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 11:12 PM
Response to Reply #2
48. Link? (nt)
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Yupster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 11:57 PM
Response to Reply #2
68. I read that in Vietnam, we had many
hundreds of trained dogs, and none of them were allowed back to the USA. All were killed.

Don't know if that is true. I read it years ago and it struck me as horrible enough to remember 15 years later.

Anyone from Vietnam era have any info on whether that is true or not?
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Left_Winger Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-04-05 02:13 PM
Response to Reply #68
97. Yes, it is true
I do not have any documentation readily at hand, but the dogs were either killed or simply left behind for the ARVN to use. The Army simply viewed them as surplus property. Heart-wrenching but true.

I have no idea what happened to them after the fall of SVN, but the VC/PAVN forces had a bounty on them when the Americans were there and using them.
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mermaid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-04-05 08:52 AM
Response to Reply #2
81. Fuck, They Better Be Glad I Wasn't There To See That!!
Because me or that soldier would be dead from a fucking gunshot wound, I guarantee it. I'd have blown that fucking soldier's HEAD off! And that would be only if I'd WITNESSED it...If it had been MY DOG he did it to, that fucking soldier would wish he'd never been born (or, if he was a clearer-minded thinker, that I had never been born!)
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madmax Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 01:56 PM
Original message
A few pups or kittens wouldn't take up much space on the bus
and animals soothe most people not to mention lifting the spirit of the children. They're good for the soul.


To those in charge: God Damn them all!
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friesianrider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 01:56 PM
Response to Original message
3. Disgusting...absolutely disgusting./
I don't have anything else to say.
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SammyWinstonJack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 01:56 PM
Response to Original message
4. What more?
:cry:
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chalky Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 01:56 PM
Response to Original message
5. See this link. Shoot to kill orders for strays?
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solinvictus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-04-05 08:47 AM
Response to Reply #5
79. Strays..
Sadly enough, all the raccoons and other vectors of rabies would've come out of the woodwork with the flood.
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mike_c Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 01:56 PM
Response to Original message
6. in advance of hurrricane Ivan, Cuba evacuated nearly 2 MILLION...
...animals along with an equal number of people. Nearly 15% of the entire nation's population. NOT ONE PERSON DIED.
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SammyWinstonJack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 01:58 PM
Response to Reply #6
10. I'm moving to Cuba!
Oh wait, I not even allowed to visit! :grr:
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GoddessOfGuinness Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 11:46 PM
Response to Reply #6
61. That is amazing, truly....
Our government should be asking them how they accomplished this feat, so we can be prepared in the future.
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Roxy66 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 01:57 PM
Response to Original message
7. How many puppie lovers do you think work for the current Government?
They probably kick kittens and puppies
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cat_hair Donating Member (77 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 02:23 PM
Response to Reply #7
28. I can think of one Senator
Edited on Sat Sep-03-05 02:30 PM by cat_hair
With a fondness for torturing cats.
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NYC Liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 01:57 PM
Response to Original message
8. Pretty soon they'll be leaving the elderly behind too
"They don't have much longer to live anyway. We need to save the young first."

DISGUSTING!
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Spike from MN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 11:21 PM
Response to Reply #8
53. Oh sure, they'll save the young all right. But first
they have to sign on the dotted line to enlist in the military. Then they will let them get on the bus.
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madmax Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 01:57 PM
Response to Original message
9. delete - dupe
Edited on Sat Sep-03-05 01:58 PM by madmax
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napi21 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 02:01 PM
Response to Original message
13. I don't like it either, but I understand why they can't take pets on
a bus. If you allow one pet, you must allow all of them. Try to imagin a dog fight on a crowded bus! Some of these bus trips are many hours long. You really can't schedule doggie potty breaks! Some dogs simply an't fit on your lap!

Believe me, I would have been one of the people who stayed behind because I wouldn't ever leave my 3 little Bichons behind ANYWHERE! I have volunteered for a Dog rescue group for 5+ years, and I work very hard never to leave any pet stranded or unwanted, but I do understand why they can't allow people to take their pets on a bus.
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Roxy66 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 02:02 PM
Response to Reply #13
14. What is the solution...
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mike_c Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 02:04 PM
Response to Reply #13
15. yet cuba manages to evac not only dogs and cats, but livestock...
...as well. I see your point, but the Cuban example shows that it CAN be done-- it's just a matter of there being sufficient government committment to the general welfare.
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goclark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 02:07 PM
Response to Reply #13
19. I would NEVER leave my Maltese sweetheart


Never!

Where I go he goes.

I would have to sleep by the side of the road with him. We would make it, we have been through a lot together.

He has always been there for me and I will always be there for him.
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growlypants Donating Member (846 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 11:05 PM
Response to Reply #19
44. same goes for me. I would NEVER get on that bus w/o my dogs.
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Razorback22 Donating Member (49 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 02:14 PM
Response to Reply #13
24. I grudgingly have to agree.
It would be chaos having a bus full of angry, scared desparate people and angry scared desparate animals as well. Plus, where do you draw the line? Can you tell one person they can bring their kitten and another that they cannot bring their german shepard, or goat or horse or snake or lizard or aligator? This is NOLA, people keep funky things as pets down there. Having been there many, many times,I saw some of it first hand when a guy I went to college with kept 22 snakes in his house. Born and raised in NOLA.
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Silverhair Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 02:04 PM
Response to Original message
16. How many dogs & cats do you want running around in a shelter?
Think real hard about it. 10K people in the Astrodome. If only one in a 100 people has a pet along, then you have 100 dogs & cats running around in the shelter. Where do they get food? Where do they go to the bathroom? How do you control them?

Sorry, but a bunch of dogs & cats in an emergency shelter poses a serious health hazard for the people, many of whom are already severely weakened by their ordeal.

Spot & Fluffy have to stay. Tough luck, but that's the case. Unless you want a higher death toll. Then you would be posting about the incompetence of the workers that they allowed pets in the shelter.
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in_cog_ni_to Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 02:08 PM
Response to Reply #16
21. Why am I not surprised you would say that? n/t
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Silverhair Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 02:26 PM
Response to Reply #21
30. Maybe because I look at reality?
I notice that you don't try to address the question of the health problem raised by dozens of pets in a shelter with thousands of people.

Instead you resort to a personal attack. That is what people do when they can't argue the facts.
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shireen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 02:20 PM
Response to Reply #16
27. There are WAYS TO HELP PETS/also contribute to Jennifer Pryor or UAN
If people were allowed to leave NO with their pets, they would have been able to turn their pets over to animal rescue groups when they arrived at their shelters. Animal rescuers are popping up all over the place -- all it would have taken was some coordination with the goverment relief efforts.

But that would have been asking our government to be organized and efficient.

--------------

Besides the organization posted in the original post, there are groups trying to do something about it. Besides NO, Jennifer Pryor is coordinating with groups inside NO. You can send her a donation via paypal at jennifer@richardpryor.com or go to http://www.uan.org/ . LA-SPCA is also accepting donations, http://www.la-spca.org/ . Just one small donation to any of these good organizations would be of tremendous help.

Updates about rescues posted at http://www.uan.org/

"Excerpt of email I got from Jennifer after my donation:
Rescuers are fighting to get animals out; we are supplying them with gas money and supplies and donations to rescues who will take these animals…at this time, only some are getting out….we are praying that  this desperate situation improves so we can get more animals;

We are very grateful for your donation, we will post updates on the site…"


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Silverhair Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 02:28 PM
Response to Reply #27
32. People first. Spot & Fluffy will have to wait.
A donation to help pets could have been given to help people who are dying.
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friesianrider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 11:47 PM
Response to Reply #32
62. Oh please. There's plenty of people to worry about other people.
I haven't given a dime to people charities and don't plan on it either. I gave almost $500 now to animal charities. There's plenty of people to worry about other people, I worry more about the most innocent victims of this...the animals. JMHO.
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-04-05 12:15 AM
Response to Reply #62
69. Not always
Edited on Sun Sep-04-05 12:16 AM by sandnsea
The budget where I live for the animal shelter is $300,000 or more a year. For the food bank, it's gone UP to $95,000 a year, used to be around $65,000. The animal shelter has $655,000 in assets or funds, the food bank has $128,000 in assets or funds. People care more about animals than other people these days, I've noticed it especially among older Republicans. Let's them feel charitable while ignoring the harm their tax cuts are causing.
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friesianrider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-04-05 12:47 AM
Response to Reply #69
70. Well for me personally...
I don't particularly like people all that much, so prefer to give my money to animal charities. People do so much twisted, sick shit in this world...they are so flat-out evil. Animals are the only true innocents in this world; at least, in my humble opinion :)
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-04-05 01:50 AM
Response to Reply #70
72. You're not evil
You're giving money to help animals. Others are giving money to people who help animals when they can. In these times, it's important to not let the evil blot out the good.
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mermaid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-04-05 09:04 AM
Response to Reply #69
83. Well...Tell You What
I'm a Democrat and a hard-core liberal. And I care more about animals than most people these days, too. Wanna know why? Animals never betray you, stab you in the back, talk back, treat you like garbage...and the never, ever forget to say thank you when you do something for them. More than I can say for most people!

So say what you will about me, and I don't know what this all says about me as a person, but, come to think of it, now, I really wish I had specified my donation to help the poor animals. I donated all 18,000 of my airmiles to Red Cross, because I'm unemployed, resourceless, and this was the only way I could help.

Now, seeing this...I'm wishing I'd given the miles to SPCA to help some folks manage to get their pets taken care of, outta there, and get them re-united with their owners.
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mermaid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-04-05 08:59 AM
Response to Reply #32
82. You Know What
How'd you like it if Fluffy and Spot had outevolved YOU...and said "dogs and cats first....people will have to wait! A donation to help people could have been given to help dogs and cats who are dying!"
You, sir, are a heartless, callous, cruel person. You are the first, EVER person who has managed to get put on my Ignore list here at DU. and considering I have over 3,000 posts over 3 years now, that is saying something!
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Silverhair Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-04-05 02:04 PM
Response to Reply #82
94. That's Funny.
If Spot and Fluffy had outevolved me?

I assume this writer is talking about outevolved me in intelligence, because they have certainly outevolved me in ability to run (Spot) and in ability to be a solitary hunter/killer (Fluffly). I they had outevolved me, I wouldn't know about it would I?

Heartless? Cruel? No. I simply I realize that pets in a large scale (10K+) human shelter just doesn't work. And I care more about people than about Spot & Fluffy.

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Greyhound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-04-05 02:07 PM
Response to Reply #32
96. Spot & Fluffy outrank most people in my book, especially you. n/t
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Lori Price CLG Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-04-05 02:16 PM
Response to Reply #32
99. The pet could have sat on the lap of the owner, as the original poster...
noted. And, that would have (emotionally) helped its owner.
Lori Price
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China_cat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 02:27 PM
Response to Reply #16
31. After Hugo
Charleston and a lot of other communities realized the need for a pet shelter as well as a shelter for people.

We have that now. Not only that but we've held seminars here and attended seminars in other hurricane prone areas on the need for preparedness for all living things.

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Silverhair Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 02:30 PM
Response to Reply #31
33. Vastly different scales between Hugo and Katrina.
In a lesser emergency, pets can be given attention. Katrina is an emergency of such a scale that all resources need to be given to people.
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China_cat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 03:49 PM
Response to Reply #33
36. Hugo was a cat 4 hurricane
and the devastation from it can still be seen today. And, at that time, we didn't have resources for our animals. BECAUSE of the lessons learned from Hugo, we do today.

And a lot of the devastation from Katrina is solely due to the lack of response from officials. Before Hugo, we had plenty of warning and worst case scenario drills. Hospitals were evacuated immediately of those who would die without power. The elderly were identified from city directories and gotten out, as well as those on the power company's list of those who couldn't do without power. (home dialysis, oxygen, breathing equipment, etc.) The rest of us were asked to leave if we could and if we couldn't, were given maps of where the shelters were, what we should take with us and (while the phones were working) the numbers to call if we needed transport to a shelter. The only ones in the mandatory evacuation were the sea islands and people were taken off in boats and by NG vehicle 18 hours in advance of the storm hitting.

While the storm was hitting...and we got a direct hit...we were listening to battery operated radio and the calls coming in to Savannah and Columbia and Charlotte where supplies were being gathered and convoys readied to start in as soon as the storm stopped.

Now, Charleston is about the asshole of nowhere and if we could do it, NO could have, also. But they weren't really allowed to, were they?

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Silverhair Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 04:04 PM
Response to Reply #36
37. The scales are still not comparable.
Edited on Sat Sep-03-05 04:05 PM by Silverhair
N.O. was worse by several orders of magnitude. You were NOT left with HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS homeless with nothing but the clothes they had. The amount of help required by this one makes Hugo look like an afternoon thunderstorm by comparison.

Yes, Hugo was a CAT 4 also, but the damage was far, far less. And it is taking all the aid that can come in just to help the people, and lots of people are still not being helped. Some are still trapped on rooftops and in attics.

Sorry, but Spot & Fluffy are just out of luck on this one. People first.
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flvegan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 11:13 PM
Response to Reply #16
49. Really? Back up your post.
Where do they get food? Same place I do.

Bathroom? Again, same.

Control? Leash.

What "serious health problem" are you alluding to?

"Tough luck" and "higher death toll" are lacking in responsibility.
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Silverhair Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-04-05 07:54 AM
Response to Reply #49
75. Easy to back up.
Common sense is sufficient.

Have you noticed that you can't take pets into restaurants, supermarkets..movie theaters, sporting events, etc. Even if they are on leases. Many beaches ban pets. Think there might be a reason for that?

I have noticed that in this thread, some people place animals above people. I don't. I think that I just have a very different value system than many of the animal first people.



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GodHelpUsAll2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-04-05 09:06 AM
Response to Reply #75
85. Well then
What has your superior common sense done for the people of NO other than sit on a discussion board and try and act superior? And I don't recall seeing anyone saying or even eluding to animals before people. That one you invented yourself. It's just some of us here believe that you can do both and not so narrow minded that we can't see that.
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Silverhair Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-04-05 01:54 PM
Response to Reply #85
91. Today, some storm refugees arrived in my town.
I called the local number to volunteer help and to find out what they need that I might be able to buy.

What have you done?

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Silverhair Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-04-05 01:57 PM
Response to Reply #85
93. No, I didn't invent it.
You said, "That one you invented yourself."

I refer you to post 83, this thread.
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Greyhound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-04-05 02:13 PM
Response to Reply #75
98. ever been to Europe?
you'll find pets welcomed everywhere, including restaurants. I don't recall hearing about 100's or even 10's of Europeans dying from exposure to house pets. :smoke:
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NVMojo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 02:05 PM
Response to Original message
17. our government has no heart, it's not about the lives of others ...it's $
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ellie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 02:07 PM
Response to Original message
20. On the Humane Society's website
www.hsus.org, they said they had teams in place waiting to go into NO. Are they not being allowed in? Are the troops going to round up all the animals at the Silverdome and shoot them? Why would they do that if there is an organization ready and willing to take them?
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Gregorian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 02:12 PM
Response to Original message
23. Now imagine what's going on in Iraq.
We can't take this anymore. Everyone on DU and everyone with a heart has been bigger than they can possibly be. We cannot take any more.

My new mantras are:

AWOL AGAIN!

Criminal negligence.
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Mutley Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 02:18 PM
Response to Original message
25. There is more than one animal rescue organization ready and willing
to go into NO and rescue every pet they can find. But the NG won't let them in. Why? I can see not taking animals on buses, I can see not taking NG and other rescuers away from the people to save the animals... but if the HSUS is ready to go, why not let them go?
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elehhhhna Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 02:19 PM
Response to Original message
26. pragmatically speaking, animals DO NOT belong on the bus.
Call me heartless but please.

Rotts, Shepards, cats, tarantulas, lizards, miniature horses -- where does one draw the line? Public health hazards, imo.

I love my dog & cats but my children come first--by a WIDE margin.
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kerry-is-my-prez Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 02:25 PM
Response to Original message
29. That's why a lot of us stay home during hurricanes - you can't bring pets.
No way in hell am I leaving my kitties and birds. I'd rather die with them than desert them.
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friesianrider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 11:55 PM
Response to Reply #29
67. Me too, kerry. I'd be right there with my fur babies.
And besides, officials TOLD people to evacuate with their pets and I believe many or most did. Now they're being told it's your life or your pet's? How sick is that?

I guess these people haven't been through enough - we need to tell them to let the nice National Guardsman shoot Rufus if they want food, shelter, and water for their family.
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mermaid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-04-05 09:08 AM
Response to Reply #29
86. Exactly!!
And me, too. Except in my case, it's a beautiful black Lab/German Shepherd mis. My avatar is an actual picture of her.

I would choose to die with Lyric, before I'd abandon her...no fuckin' way would I leave her to fend for herself in such a situation!
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Poiuyt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 02:31 PM
Response to Original message
34. Who in the world would want to take one of these on a bus?




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Silverhair Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 02:33 PM
Response to Original message
35. And if Spot (dog) sees Fluffy (cat) on the bus and decides that the
cat MUST be chased? And the terrified cat goes berserk with it's claws?

I suppose you don't see that as a problem?

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Missy Vixen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 04:20 PM
Response to Reply #35
38. What kind of problem was it yesterday
when the National Guard took a little boy's puppy away, and he screamed, "Snowball! Snowball" repeatedly till he threw up? These folks have lost so much already, and hearing that the Humane Society isn't even allowed in to round up the strays and care for them just shows me that those being rescued are considered to be less than human.

>I suppose you don't see that as a problem<

We travel with 20-pound show cats quite often. They're kept in a show carrying cage, but it is possible to fashion a carrier from a pillowcase if need be. Pillowcases are made from porous fabric. It's not perfect, but to retraumatize families by sentencing their pets to certain death isn't a great idea, either.

Julie
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Silverhair Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 10:08 PM
Response to Reply #38
40. Yes, it is a problem. But the health hazard of pets in the shelters...
is a far greater problem.

My bus scenario could easily be modified to two dogs fighting.

So Spot and Butch decide to go at each other's throats, and people start getting clawed and bitten in the melee. Does that make you happy? Well, if you have dozens of pets running around in the shelter, that is what will happen. And there is also the question of where do the pets relieve themselves?

What do you do about the pets that haven't had their shots, or at least don't have a tag to show? Most poor people don't get shots for their animals. So most of those pets will not be vaccinated.

Sometimes reality sucks.
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PatriotGames Donating Member (896 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 11:21 PM
Response to Reply #40
52. Not a likely scenario at all. It is not common for a human contract
any disease from a dog/cat except rabies and that is a big maybe. Most people sould tell if their animal had rabies.
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friesianrider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-04-05 12:51 AM
Response to Reply #40
71. Yeah, and the shootings and rapes ACTUALLY happening are so much better.
Edited on Sun Sep-04-05 12:56 AM by friesianrider
:eyes:

Come on, now. This shit is going on and you're worried about a dog bite? If you want to look a kid in the eye and tell him you've got to take the family dog or cat that the family has carried in their arms for 5 days, then you should do it. Tell them it is really what is best, because it isn't enough that they've lost their home, their possessions, and their entire life. They now must hand their pet over to die so they can have some fucking water and a ready-to-eat bag of shit.

What's a shame is that in America, people like you actually think we're thinking pie-in-the-sky that we could dare evacuate people AND pets.

If you think ripping the family pet out of the arms of a child who has lost his entire world is justified for whatever reason, you go right ahead. I personally think they have lost enough. I'd sooner die with my pets than leave them.
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Silverhair Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-04-05 07:44 AM
Response to Reply #71
74. You are distorting the time sequence.
Edited on Sun Sep-04-05 07:44 AM by Silverhair
Please note that the busses were taking the people AWAY from the superdome, NOT into it. Perhaps you didn't notice that. It was the superdome that had the violence and raping going on in it.

The other shelters in cities like Houston, San Antonio, Dallas, & other cities have not had any crime stories coming out of them. All the reporting is that they are a much better, more managed situation.

Yes, taking his pet away is rough. But the results of having dozens of dogs, cats, & whatever, in a shelter would be worse.

You are having an emotional response, which if decisions were made according to those emotions, instead of using logic, the injury and death toll would be higher.

Sometimes reality sucks.
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GodHelpUsAll2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-04-05 09:19 AM
Response to Reply #74
88. Making decisions with emothion
Hmmm ya think the logic that has been used in evacuating NO has been the best? I guess it's a shining example of how logic is so much better than emotion huh? And as for comparing the situation at Superdome to the Astrodome well there is no comparison. There were thousands of people rushed into the Superdome to ride out a cat 5 hurricane. The Astrodome was staffed with people and food and water and beds and electricity and air conditioning and all sorts of stuff before the people actually got there. Ya think maybe that is where the difference lies?

And last but not least, have you thought of applying for a job with our federal government? I think you would be a perfect fit.
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Silverhair Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-04-05 01:51 PM
Response to Reply #88
89. You are trying to put words in my mouth. I don't have to defend them.
I have NOT said, and do not have to defend, all of the events in the disaster.

I do support and will defend the "NO PETS" policy.
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LisaL Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 11:31 PM
Response to Reply #38
57. OMG. That poor child. And that poor dog.
It's just heartbreaking knowing all those animals most likely won't survive this even if they survived the hurricane.
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Silverhair Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-04-05 08:43 AM
Response to Reply #57
77. Yes, it is heartbreaking.
Katrina has been a disaster of unimaginable proportions and unbelievable suffering.
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friesianrider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 11:49 PM
Response to Reply #38
63. I agree. As long as in carriers...
Who cares?

These people have lost EVERYTHING. If some people think it's totally appropriate to rip the family dog or cat from some kid's hands, then I seriously worry about the future of this country.
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LisaL Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 11:32 PM
Response to Reply #35
58. What if one passenger starts beating on another passenger?
I mean, come on. These poor people had saved their pets from drowning, and now what? Are they killing these poor pets because of heartless people like yourself?
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Silverhair Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-04-05 08:41 AM
Response to Reply #58
76. So your answer is to make that problem WORSE by animal fights?
I don't see how adding an animal fight to possible human fights will help in any way.
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gauguin57 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 04:37 PM
Response to Original message
39. I have friends with severe animal allergies. SEVERE.
If they hadn't eaten in four days, and had no medication to take the edge off the allergy, and if their only way out of a flooded city was on a bus with a bunch of other people, going to a shelter with a bunch of other people, I wouldn't want animals on that bus, for their sakes.

And I am a MAJOR ANIMAL LOVER.

I couldn't leave my animal behind, personally.

But there are other reasons besides heartlessness that cause rules to be made about animals on the evacuation bus.

If things had been more organized, they might have been able to take all the people with animals on the same buses and to the same shelters (though that could have been a disaster, too -- if animals got in fights or pooped in the shelters).
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MisterP Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-04-05 01:57 PM
Response to Reply #39
92. they could, you know, ask the bus passengers
as for myself, I'd feed my hands into a wood chipper before taking the hells of a little kid's past week and making them a myriadfold worse
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meisje Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 10:12 PM
Response to Original message
42. That's all we need is some attacked by a pitbull on a bus
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growlypants Donating Member (846 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 11:04 PM
Response to Reply #42
43. hey......thats an unfair statement about pitbulls!!!!
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Vektor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 11:23 PM
Response to Reply #43
55. Hear hear. No breed discrimination.
Any animal can be dangerous, just as any pit-bull (like mine) can be sweet as pie. Leaving the animals off the bus is sick and cruel.

Besides, anyone around my dog is more in danger of being licked to death:

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flvegan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 11:10 PM
Response to Reply #42
46. Because that's inevitable, right?
I mean, that's a guarantee to happen, isn't it?
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question everything Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 11:09 PM
Response to Original message
45. Yes, broke my heart, too
was a cute white poodle and the guard just removed him and put him aside - at least this was as much as the report showed.

Wonder whether they http://www.networkforgood.org/offsiteframe/?siteURL=http://www.uan.org can relly do something for them.

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LisaL Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 11:51 PM
Response to Reply #45
65. I saw a photo of a guy sitting on his roof hugging his dog.
If and when this guy is rescued from the roof, he will have to leave his dog behind because the dog won't be allowed on the bus. These poor people suffered enough, and now they are forced to leave behind the pets they saved from drowning. It's absolutely heartbreaking.
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mermaid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Sep-05-05 12:07 AM
Response to Reply #65
100. No Fucking Way!!
They either would rescue both of us, or neither of us, were it me! I'd refuse to go without my dog. She'd die for me if it became necessary...she'd risk her life to save mine, this I know without words. How could I do any less for her?
I already know that if I were in a position where I had but one scrap of food, and both of us were hungry...I'd give her the food and go hungry myself!
We're a package deal, me and my dog! No fucking WAY would I go without my dog. Not a chance.

As I said, I know, without words...that Lyric would risk her life...or give her life...to save mine, if the need arose. she'd do it without thinking. Now, how could I abandon her? No way, no how, no time!!

I would refuse evacuation if my dog was not allowed to evacuate with me.

Of course, the fact that I happen to own a car means I would have gotten out in time...and I would have had somewhere to go...so me and my dog woulda gotten out. But it isn't hard for me to imagine those not so lucky...and the idea that they abandon their pets that they saved from drowning?? that is just plain fucking inhumane! They've already lost everything, why not take from them the last thing in the world that they cherish??

Fucking bastards! I swear I'd rip the head off of any motherfucker who even SUGGESTED that I abandon my dog!!
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PatriotGames Donating Member (896 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 11:11 PM
Response to Original message
47. Seriously. Why can't you take your companion animal?
People have suffered enough. Now they will make them leave their animals behind?
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Scout Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 11:18 PM
Response to Reply #47
51. Well, Silverhair said that people come first.
And he lives in reality. Tough luck for Spot and Fluffy.
:sarcasm:
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PatriotGames Donating Member (896 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 11:22 PM
Response to Reply #51
54. Yeah, let's just take that last bit of comfort from them.
That will fix em.
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friesianrider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 11:52 PM
Response to Reply #54
66. I hate to think...
Of the many people who did what they were told to and evacuated WITH their pets, only to be told, "sorry, you've got to hand over Rufus now. It's your life or his."

Haven't these people been through enough? There are about 7 animal rescue groups with teams down there...surely we could have coordinated it so that the animals could be left with them until things settle down.

These families have lost everything - it sickens me to think that they are having the family dog or cat ripped from their arms. Sick, sick, sick.
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friesianrider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 11:50 PM
Response to Reply #51
64. Good post, Scout :)
You're absolutely right, I'm afraid.
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mermaid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-04-05 09:15 AM
Response to Reply #47
87. Speaking OF Companion Animals
what if one of the people needing to be evacuated had a Seeing-Eye Dog?

Even Seeing-Eye Dogs are allowed in grocery stores, restaurants, any public place they need to be.

I just cannot believe the depravity of these "rescuers" Why the hell couldn't you designate some buses could have animals, whereas others would not?
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Greeby Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 11:16 PM
Response to Original message
50. All those abandoned cats
And Bill Frist is down there now :scared:
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Vektor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 11:24 PM
Response to Reply #50
56. Maybe they will all attack at once and gnaw the flesh off his bones.
Ahh...sweet, sweet justice.
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Scout Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 11:33 PM
Response to Original message
59. so there's one or two busses from each caravan that *DO*
allow pets, and all the rest of the busses don't. Like smoking/non smoking sections.

Duh, how hard is that to figure out?
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MsMagnificent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Sep-03-05 11:41 PM
Response to Original message
60. LINK TO HELP NEW ORLEANS STRANDED PETS
http://www.petfinder.com/

Scroll down a bit -- you can donate and help them too!
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bring_em_home_bush Donating Member (263 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-04-05 03:56 AM
Response to Reply #60
73. That's a great link and it shows exactly how people & pets can both
Edited on Sun Sep-04-05 03:56 AM by bring_em_home_bush
be evacuated.

LA ARF has opened pet shelter in Lafayette
Wednesday, 31 August 2005, 11:50 am EST
"Please let all Petfinder members know that we have opened a pet shelter at Blackham Coliseum in Lafayette, right next to the Cajundome. Evacuees may bring their pets there for housing. We have PLENTY of food, water, crates, cages, bedding and newspaper. BUT the owners are responsible for feeding, watering, walking and medicating their own pets."

http://www.petfinder.com/disaster/



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FourthPoint Donating Member (5 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-04-05 08:45 AM
Response to Original message
78. Not Without My Pets!
My wife and I have no children but have a 8lb Yorkie and a African Grey parrot. Neither are cheap pets but we love them very very much. Anyways, we would not leave without our pets. Such a heart breaking disgrace. Im glad there is media coverage on this topic!
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mermaid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-04-05 08:49 AM
Response to Original message
80. What The MOTHERFUCK?!?!!?
Then I'd stay there and if I had to...DIE. No fuckin' WAY would I ever leave my dear sweet dog behind! She's give her life to save mine in a heartbeat, this I know to be true.

And if I had but 1 scrap of food left between the two of us, I would be the one to go hungry, and she knows that!

The government are being real heartless bastards here!! You're talking about people who've already lost everything, and in many cases, have already lost some or all of the people they love...now you're going to ask them to lose something else that they love?!?
:mad: :nuke: :mad: :nuke: :mad: :nuke: :mad: :nuke: :mad: :nuke: :mad: :nuke: :mad: :nuke: :mad: :nuke: :mad: :nuke: :mad: :nuke: :mad: :nuke: :mad: :nuke: :mad: :nuke: :mad: :nuke: :mad: :nuke: :mad: :nuke: :mad: :nuke: :mad: :nuke: :mad: :nuke: :mad: :nuke: :mad: :nuke: :mad: :nuke: :mad: :nuke: :mad: :nuke:
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Catchawave Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-04-05 09:04 AM
Response to Reply #80
84. My thoughts exactly......
Alot of people don't evacuate because of their pets. I couldn't leave mine behind :cry:
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Fleshdancer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-04-05 01:52 PM
Response to Original message
90. and what makes this even worse:
I watched an interview with the man responsible for preparing the Astrodome in Houston and he told the reporter that they even set up a place for the pets...they were welcoming the pets!
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2bfree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Sep-04-05 02:06 PM
Response to Original message
95. How sad.......
But at least they are getting the people out of there. Some places have shelters just set up for pets.
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