yvr girl
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Sep-04-05 09:08 AM
Original message |
Can America ever get past the race issue? |
|
As a Canadian, this is one of the most striking differences between our two countries. It's not that there isn't racism here - anywhere where you have people of different races, it is bound to exist - but it isn't a forefront issue.
Why does the wound created by slavery still fester? Don't get me wrong slavery was a blight on humanity, I think I would rather be murdered than be a slave. And I know that the civil war didn't make things 'better.' It was another hundred years before the civil rights movement of the 60s.
I know poverty is a huge contributing factor, but it seems to me that it isn't limited to people who are poor.
Is it possible for there to be an America where race isn't an issue anymore?
|
Dez
(826 posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Sep-04-05 09:14 AM
Response to Original message |
|
Since priveledged people keep the power, and so nothing will ever change. Especially since the corporations bought all the politicians, they for sure don't care about equality in America. The rich are getting richer, and the poor are getting poorer, and it will never change. Blacks and natives, and other people of color are considered less than by those in power.. it's always been this way.
First you have to admit there is something wrong, but they like America just the way it is.
|
yvr girl
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Sep-04-05 09:23 AM
Response to Reply #1 |
9. People of privilege are in power in most countries |
|
They get the best education and have the most connections - that's why they are privileged. Also, wealth does not equal heartless bastard. There are plenty of rich people who are progressive and compassionate.
Racism can't be blamed on institutions either. It's a people problem. I know it can become institutionalized when racists are in charge, but change the people, and the organizations will follow.
|
ayeshahaqqiqa
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Sep-04-05 09:16 AM
Response to Original message |
2. I think so, but it will be slow in coming |
|
you can see it in some areas of the country now, especially smaller towns. I remember the pride of my African American students in Southern Illinois when I taught them the history of the region, how their ancestors (escaped slaves) helped settle the county and even founded a town. They were starting to get into local government when I moved away about twenty years ago-an important step-they represented only about 15% of the population. I was heartened a year ago when my boss hired on an African American college student to help with the summer rush in the pest control business. This is northern Arkansas, in a county that still has a branch of the Klan, but all my boss would talk about was how great a baseball player the fellow was-and how we would DROP any customer who complained about the fellow working for us.
|
Solly Mack
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Sep-04-05 09:16 AM
Response to Original message |
3. how do you get past it if you've never honestly dealt with it? |
|
America has NEVER EVER honestly dealt with it.
America has swept it under the rug and lived in denial about it...but give a honest accounting of the problem? Not once.
|
shadowknows69
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Sep-04-05 09:18 AM
Response to Original message |
4. Some of us never had one |
|
Its just the rednecks we put in power that perpetuates things
|
mandyky
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Sep-04-05 09:18 AM
Response to Original message |
5. Not until it is honestly addressed |
|
The South felt the Civil War infringed their rights, and they have taken it out on the black people. Then you get the coded race talk from the GOP that pander to racists.
We need to develop a race relation strategy and stick to it, but some people here in the US don't even think black people should be apologized to for slavery. Recently many of our Southern GOP senators would not vote to apologize for lynching.
Until Americans take an honest look at the past and become willing to make amends, I am afraid the race issue will continue on the same path or god forbid move backwards.
|
Mayberry Machiavelli
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Sep-04-05 09:19 AM
Response to Original message |
6. Part of it is human nature. But it's much worse if racist sentiment and |
|
resentment is actively cultivated and encouraged by those in power.
And when their actions result in a tragedy that will fuel resentment for at least a generation to come.
|
Mr_Spock
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Sep-04-05 09:20 AM
Response to Original message |
7. Well, if anything good comes from this disaster - it's the black poverty |
|
being put front and center before the nation. There is no question WHY these people were UNABLE in so many cases to make it out of the city on short notice. There lives just aren't as important in many white bigots (Bush) eyes...
|
jedr
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Sep-04-05 09:22 AM
Response to Original message |
|
and yes, there is racism in Canada... Racism is universal...why here? because when Lincoln was shot and killed, we were left with weak leadership for the next decade or so, and the whole race issue never was solved, and it still hasn't. Just as in the '60's we thought that we made progress toward equality ,we find a backlash from those liberal ideas that seem to divide us again and is used as a political tool by some very greedy and immoral people. "Is it possible for an America where race isn't an issue"; Not for a long time to come.
|
Dez
(826 posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Sep-04-05 09:29 AM
Response to Reply #8 |
|
massive amounts of therapy. I think John Bradshaw got it right, about the Family. Gererations of abused people continue down that path, until they work through it.. but this is not happening. Take the Drug War, for example .. drug users are punished by being put in prison for using drugs. If they politicians wanted to help fix the problem with these people, they would put drug users into treatment, and not in prison. But prisons are big business now in America, and of course the tax payers pay for all these prisons for pot smokers. The Americans appear uncivilized to people in Europe and other democratic countries.
|
jedr
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Sep-04-05 09:38 AM
Response to Reply #14 |
18. Recommend Michale Lind's book " Made in Texas" |
|
Edited on Sun Sep-04-05 09:42 AM by jedr
Will explain the "New Confederacy" , what brought it about and how the southern Conservatives view the race/class issue.
|
yvr girl
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Sep-04-05 09:35 AM
Response to Reply #8 |
16. I know there is racism in Canada, but it's not the same |
|
It's not a national festering issue.
Our history isn't without blemish either. We interred Japanese people during WWII. We had native children who were abused by priests in their segregated schools. A huge percentage of native people still live in poverty.
I guess our government is a bit quicker to apologize and try to make amends.
|
jedr
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Sep-04-05 09:41 AM
Response to Reply #16 |
19. true, I just wanted to point out that racism is universal. |
Dez
(826 posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Sep-04-05 09:43 AM
Response to Reply #16 |
20. Canada is more compassionate towards |
|
people of color. I would move there if I could. I hate America, and all it stands for. It's all a LIE. It's all bullshit. Like Buffy Ste. Marie said, My country tis of the your people are dying.
|
Spazito
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Sep-04-05 09:49 AM
Response to Reply #16 |
22. Our shame is the treatment of First Nations, it is an ongoing shame |
|
One only needs to visit a reserve to see that. It wasn't long ago that the horror that was Davis Inlet was made public. First Nations are still fighting for rights that have been taken away from them, they are still treated like second class citizens.
|
SoCalDem
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Sep-04-05 09:24 AM
Response to Original message |
10. As a unit, NO...Individually, yes |
|
As long as there are selfish greedy people who REFUSE to share equally, it will never happen..
There's a hard-core bunch (and in power) who feel in their bones, that only white people matter, and everything that's "given" to non-whites is directly TAKEN from THEM. they will NEVER accept that they are nothing special.
|
two gun sid
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Sep-04-05 09:24 AM
Response to Original message |
11. I seriously doubt we will ever get past issues of race. |
|
It would take intense and public debate about race issues and relations. It serves many politicians and corporate interests purposes to keep us divided by race and class.
|
pepperlove
(345 posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Sep-04-05 09:24 AM
Response to Original message |
|
It will always be with us. Always.
|
VelmaD
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Sep-04-05 09:25 AM
Response to Original message |
13. First off some history... |
|
the civil rights movement got cracking in the 50s, not the 60s. Brown v Board of Education was in the 50s. So was Rosa Parks and the bus boybotts.
Second, racism is certainly a problem in Canada even if it isn't a forefront issue. The treatment of the native population there has oftentimes been abbysmal and it says something about both countries that the treatment of the Native Americans isn't a "forfront" issue in either the US or Canada.
Now, on to your actual point. I think there is the possibility of an America where race doesn't matter...but it's going to take work that a lot of people in America aren't willing to do yet. It takes a lot of soul searching on the part of white America; an admission that there's still a problem, a sincere effort to make ammends, and then actual changes in behavior. It's like a recovering addict..."hi my name is America and I'm addicted to having a perpetual underclass to take advantage of". Until white Americans, especially those in positions of power, are willing to do that soul searching then we're pretty much fucked when it comes to ending racism, sexism, homophobia, you name it.
|
Zodiak
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Sep-04-05 09:30 AM
Response to Reply #13 |
|
"hi my name is America and I'm addicted to having a perpetual underclass to take advantage of".
Very good
|
yvr girl
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Sep-04-05 09:55 AM
Response to Reply #13 |
23. You could argue that the civil rights movement began with |
|
the efforts to emancipate the slaves - but good points.
I don't for a second suggest that Canada is devoid of racism. We have people - 'nuff said. I mentioned some of the issues up thread. Native people are still disproportionately poor, homeless and addicted. But at least our government is making efforts to address the problems. Status Indians get a free ride in university in Canada. Education is the best way to end poverty.
I don't really want this to be a Canada vs US thread re: racism. We have different histories and different issues.
|
C_U_L8R
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Sep-04-05 09:38 AM
Response to Original message |
|
As long as there is a racist president... (bush) the worst of society will find comfort and reinforcement to keep hating and dividing our society (by race, sex, religion, sexual orientation, etc). Bush is a divider. No question. Not once has he fought for moral right. No man of god is he. He is greed.
|
journalist3072
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Sep-04-05 09:46 AM
Response to Original message |
21. Here's why the issue of race still matters |
|
The issue of race still matters in this country for several reasons I think.
First, the United States has NEVER fully atoned or apologized for slavery. Sometimes, the simple acknowledgement that wrong was done, can help free everybody.
Next, there is debt that the United States owes its African-American citizentry, and it has yet to fully pay on that debt. Corrective programs like affirmative action have been attacked as "reverse racism" and people like John Roberts have wrongly looked at affirmative action as something that forces companies and businesses to hire unqualified people just for diversity's sake.
Lastly, I think there needs to be a national conversation about race in America, and oddly, perhaps Hurricane Katrina will help us do that. Many times, you will find that people don't even want to bring up the issue of race; it's like the big elephant in the room. President Clinton tried to get a national dialogue going, which the media largely ignored.
So unfortunately, race still matters in this country.
|
GoddessOfGuinness
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Sep-04-05 10:11 AM
Response to Original message |
24. As long as racism relegates blacks to higher mortage rates, |
|
lower wages for the same work, and less adequate services in predominantly black neighborhoods, it will be...it MUST be an issue.
|
yvr girl
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Sep-04-05 10:22 AM
Response to Reply #24 |
25. I didn't mean to imply that it isn't a legitimate issue now |
|
There are two Americas. Can we look forward to a day when there is one.
|
MercutioATC
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Sep-04-05 10:30 AM
Response to Original message |
26. It would be easier if people didn't start screaming "RACISM" every time |
|
there's a situation that effects the poor.
Racism may, in part, be responsible for the overwhelming number of minorities living below the poverty level. The fact the these minorities are then disadvantaged (eg. not having the resources to leave NOLA before Katrina) is a function of POVERTY, however, not racism.
|
shadowknows69
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Sep-04-05 10:54 AM
Response to Reply #26 |
27. there are only two races in America anymore |
|
The Elite race and The Slave Race. I sleep better at night being a member of the latter. But I still want justice.
|
MercutioATC
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Sep-04-05 10:56 AM
Response to Reply #27 |
28. At least you're framing the situation accurately...it's about money, not |
DU
AdBot (1000+ posts) |
Thu Apr 25th 2024, 01:49 AM
Response to Original message |