How do we respond to this Freeper argument?

[joemurphy]

Basically it claims Bush needed Blanco's OK before Federal troops could be brought to New Orleans due to Posse Comitatus considerations and that Blanco was at fault in not giving it.

I'm absolutely positive that this argument is full of misstatements and half-truths. But I think this is going to be a really BIG deal in the coming days because Bush was personally involved.

Let's start looking at this NOW!

<http://www.libertypost.org/cgi-bin/readart.cgi?ArtNum=108282>

[GreenPartyVoter]

1. Follow the thread link in my sig.. there is info there on FEMA/DHS being

1st responders now.

------------------------------------------------------
Ditch Bu$h and save the Gulf: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=106&topic_id=22507&mesg_id=22507

Then save the nation!
http://www.geocities.com/greenpartyvoter/electionreform.htm

[Bluebear]

2. Since when does Bush need an OK for anything?

Even if this were true, what do you do in the face of an oncoming catastrophe? Go to the American people and say, "Well, this governor hasn't asked me for help", or go eat cake with McCain and strum a guitar?

In any case, Bush declared a federal disaster area on the 27th of August, so he didn't need Blanco's "OK".

[stepnw1f]

14. Exactly!!!!

People keep getting caught up in the legalities of who was responsible. It isn't a matter of legal responsibility, as much as it is about Bush's humanity we are questioning and judging. And to put a cherry on it all, Bush was legally responsible. The whole thing has been documented.

[Don Claybrook]

3. You tell them once that Bush displays less personal responsibility

than a garden slug.

Leave it at that. They're just not worth the effort.

[randr]

4. Even if all the city, county, and state official picked up a ran

the federal government would still be needed and responsible.
If the local people were in fact haveing a problem and the feds knew it, this would be a larger reason for a faster reaction.

[maine_raptor]

5. for once and for all, the President of the United States has the power

to "federalize" the National Guard and send in Federal Troops.

Like Ike did during the Little Rock School crisis of '56.

Like JFK did during the Freedom Marches of the early 60's.

Like LBJ did during the "Long Hot Summers" of the late 60's

Like GHWB did during the "Rodney King" riots in LA.

and

Unlike GWB DIDN'T do during Hurricane Katrina.

The President DOES NOT need a governor's permission.

That was settled by the Civil War (or War Between the States, for southern readers).

[Marymarg]

6. Just read on Buzzflash

The Governor of Louisiana requested that Bush call a state of emergency on Friday BEFORE Katrina struck.

There is a picture of the document in that article.

[joemurphy]

8. OK...Let's go over this...

Blanco declares a State of Emergency on Friday, August 26th.

On Saturday August 27th, she (along with the governors of Mississippi and Alabama) formally asks that Federal troops be sent to help in the relief effort in the anticipated devastated area.

On Monday August 29th, Katrina hits New Orleans. Communications immediately fail.

On Tuesday, August 30th, the 17th Street Canal Levee fails and 80% of New Orleans is flooded. 25,000 people are trapped by the water in the Superdome. Another 15,000 are in the Convention Center. They have little water or food. "Looting" reports begin.

Rumsfeld dithers about sending in the requested Federal troops until Friday, September 2nd, due to "legal concerns". He is possibly concerned that Federal troops couldn't be used to restore order with respect to looters and snipers without suspension of the Posse Comitatus Act (which prevents Federal troops from being employed for civilian police-keeping purposes). Posse Comitatus is no barrier to Federal humanitarian relief, however.

On Friday, September 2nd, Bush flies into New Orleans and meets with Nagin and Blanco. Bush tells Blanco that no Federal troops can be supplied unless Blanco agrees to "federalize" the Louisiana National Guard and place them, and the New Orleans police force, under
"unified Federal control".

Blanco tells Bush she needs 24 hours to consider the implications of surrendering State control of the Louisiana National Guard to the Federal government (according to NPR). Blanco and White House officials dicker for several hours. Ultimately Blanco refuses to surrender control over the LANG -- suspicious of White House motives for the demand.

On Saturday September 3rd, the 82nd Airborne goes in. It is unclear if the White House suspended Posse Comitatus or not (at least to me). The military arrives promptly. General Honore is placed in charge and he begins evacuation of the Superdome.

Apparently Federal troops are NOT being used for police type operations. Posse Comitatus was NOT suspended. Federal troops in New Orleans are now being used solely for humanitarian relief and not policing. They are presently NOT being used to forcibly evacuate
New Orleans residents per Mayor Nagin's order that this occur. Apparently only NOPD and LANG units are handling this.

The point is, Bush and Rumsfeld seemed to have dithered for over a week before sending Federal troops to New Orleans. New Orleans, meanwhile, was falling into chaos. Blanco only had 4,000 Louisiana National Guard people under her control. 3,000 of the National Guard were in Iraq along with virtually all of the Guard's amphibious equipment and emergency generators. Nagin's police was around 1,500 strong and had been depleted by around 500 resignations and/or desertions. Blanco's prior calls for Federal military intervention for humanitarian help went unheeded for around 8 days.

What the hell kept Bush from sending the troops in sooner? Shit, if he was concerned about Posse Comitatus, he could have suspended it immediately himself and didn't need Blanco's OK. As it was, he sent the 82nd Airborne in anyway -- after an 8 day delay -- to help with humanitarian relief.

Is that our answer?

[bananas]

11. Bush authorized aid for northern LA on the 26th, before Blanco requested

Bush authorized aid for northern LA on the 26th,
before Blanco requested it.
He authorized aid for the coastline on the 29th.


"Governor requested aid on 28th and specified the Parishes that were expected to receive the most damage - the SOUTHERN ONES. Bush authorized the northern counties on August 26 and the southern ones on August 29. He declared an emergency for the southern ones only AFTER Governor Blanco requested it. He definitely gave aid to the northern parishes before the southern ones when he declared an emergency for the entire state. And I don’t know what prompted him to declare the aid for the northern ones without a request from the Governor."

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=2073590&mesg_id=2073590

[norml]

12. The timeline you provide tells it all.

Great reply!

[Rainscents]

7. Once the President declared state of emergency...

IT IS FEDS RESPONDSIBILITY!!! Maybe not all, but most of it it's theirs!!!

[laureloak]

9. I read a discussion on FR saying that Bush signed

legislation in January ('04 or '05 ?) that voided the need for a sign-off by state and local officials.

I read the conversation about 9/1 but was never able to find them again so I suppose they were scrubbed.

[bananas]

10. KyndCulture: "look at the graphic..."

Here are three posts.
The first one is a great response you're looking for.
The other two raise a lot of questions.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=4723335&mesg_id=4723335
artemisia1 (221 posts) Sat Sep-10-05 02:40 AM
My response to a RW co-workers Bush apologist e-mail. I CHANGED her mind!
<snip>

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=132&topic_id=2073590&mesg_id=2073590
Maraya1969 (1000+ posts) Thu Sep-08-05 01:56 PM
I think I know why aid didn't get to NO. Also a few questions
<snip>

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x4694468
KyndCulture (1000+ posts) Thu Sep-08-05 10:32 AM
1. look at the graphic...
it's a lot worse than just New Orleans... it's the ENTIRE coastline.

[Mutley]

13. From the mouth of the White House's web page itself...

http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2005/08/20050827-1.html

The President today declared an emergency exists in the State of Louisiana and ordered Federal aid to supplement state and local response efforts in the parishes located in the path of Hurricane Katrina beginning on August 26, 2005, and continuing.

The President's action authorizes the Department of Homeland Security, Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA), to coordinate all disaster relief efforts which have the purpose of alleviating the hardship and suffering caused by the emergency on the local population, and to provide appropriate assistance for required emergency measures, authorized under Title V of the Stafford Act, to save lives, protect property and public health and safety, or to lessen or avert the threat of a catastrophe in the parishes of Allen, Avoyelles, Beauregard, Bienville, Bossier, Caddo, Caldwell, Claiborne, Catahoula, Concordia, De Soto, East Baton Rouge, East Carroll, East Feliciana, Evangeline, Franklin, Grant, Jackson, LaSalle, Lincoln, Livingston, Madison, Morehouse, Natchitoches, Pointe Coupee, Ouachita, Rapides, Red River, Richland, Sabine, St. Helena, St. Landry, Tensas, Union, Vernon, Webster, West Carroll, West Feliciana, and Winn.

Specifically, FEMA is authorized to identify, mobilize, and provide at its discretion, equipment and resources necessary to alleviate the impacts of the emergency. Debris removal and emergency protective measures, including direct Federal assistance, will be provided at 75 percent Federal funding.

Representing FEMA, Michael D. Brown, Under Secretary for Emergency Preparedness and Response, Department of Homeland Security, named William Lokey as the Federal Coordinating Officer for Federal recovery operations in the affected area.

[MrBenchley]

15. Jeering and laughter?

"Bush needed Blanco's OK before Federal troops could be brought to New Orleans"
So why didn't he pick up the phone and ASK? Because he was afraid of her?

By the way, "it has come to light" pretty much means "I'm making this up and hope you're dumb enough to buy it"...

[MasonJar]

16. For one thing the administration did not need federal troops to

air lift the meals and foods ready prior to the hurricane. The feds did not need permission to get the medically ill to the US ship which followed the storm into NO. It had 100 hospital beds and 100,000 gallons of water. This stinks to high heaven of anti-poor, anti-dem, and anti-life.