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Horse with no Name Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-13-05 02:58 PM
Original message
Anyone care to help debunk?LOL (puke alert)
> Before people cast stones at the administration, maybe they need to
know
the
> law, and place blame where it belongs! I received this e-mail and
thought
> you might enjoy it, too.
>
> Why The Katrina Coverage Made Me Switch To Fox News! by Lee Ellis
> Sept. 3, 2005
>
> Watching both Fox and NBC after President Bush had been inspecting the
Gulf
> Coast and New Orleans, I was shocked at how the nets, and even some
> newspapers, were trying to blame the Bush Administration for the
slowness
in
> which help was reaching the damaged cities. Obviously, Brian Williams
and
> his news team do not know the law, nor do they know the past history
of
New
> Orleans--a city built in a bathtub of a swamp. This is a city where
the
dead
> for centuries have had to be buried in above-ground structures because
the
> water is so close to the surface of this sinking city. If coffins are
put
in
> the ground, they will rise to the surface as the underground water
pushes
> them up. I have been to these cemeteries personally to witness this.
>
> For decades, New Orleans has been told that the city is sinking and
that
the
> old levees have to be rebuilt and modernized in order to keep the city
from
> being flooded. Local officials never finished the work, nor have pleas
to
> Congress for additional federal help been heeded. Congress has simply
never
> seen fit to fully complete this effort, whether controlled by
Democrats or
> Republicans. "Why did it take five days for Bush to help?" is the
mantra
> constantly voiced by all the "Talking Heads" on TV. Here are the
reasons:
>
> 1) It is against the law for any President to order troops into a city
or
> across state lines without a request and permission from the Governor
of
> that state. John Armor, a First Amendment lawyer and one of my
favorite
> writers, told me, "Federal law prevents the President from sending in
the
> National Guard until the Governor gives the order. It is little known,
but
> the Commanding General of the National Guard in every state reports to
the
> Governor, not the President, until the Governor says otherwise. U.S.
> military units (regular Army, not the Guard) cannot be used because of
the
> Posse Comitatus law, until the Guard has been authorized."
>
> According to some news sources, the Governor of Louisiana, who knew
the
> levees were weak, who knew that the city had been slowly sinking, and
who
> knew that a major #5 hurricane was approaching her city, did not call
> Washington for help.
> (2) The Mayor of New Orleans did call for evacuation over a
loud-speaker,
> but did nothing to be sure that the police went
> door-to-door, followed by transportation, to pick up all those who did
not
> have cars or any ability to leave. There was no other leadership
practiced
> by the mayor there, as had been in New York City during 9/11 by Mayor
> Giuliani.
> (3) The hurricane veered east and saved New Orleans, Brian Williams
> announced a week ago, and all breathed a sigh of relief...until the
levees
> broke a day or two later allowing the surrounding waters to pour into
the
> city.
> (4) It was this predicted levee failure which had been ignored for so
long
> that doomed the local people to be held hostage in their attics or on
> rooftops, not the storm. It was also the failure of the local
bureaucrats
> and local elected leaders to maintain law and order, and to have
> pre-arranged for complete evacuations of the city. It was only after a
> request went out to the President that troops could be sent in. Can
you
> imagine the anti-Bush media screaming that Bush had invaded Louisiana
as
he
> had done in Iraq if he had gone in before being asked? I can just
imagine
> The New York Times headlining, "A Repeat of Shock and Awe by Bush!"
>
> Bill O'Reilly, on Fox News, was the only commentator I heard who
explained
> this. All the other network commentators seemed too willing to allow
the
> implication inferred by the viewers, that this was all the fault of
the
Bush
> Administration.
>
>

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Mugsy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-13-05 03:02 PM
Response to Original message
1. Similar letter debunked.
Edited on Tue Sep-13-05 03:02 PM by Mugsy
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cynatnite Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-13-05 03:06 PM
Response to Original message
2. Where to start...
Okay, here it goes:

1)Complete lie. Blanco spoke to Bush on the 26th. Said 'send everything you have'. 27th, bush declared LA disaster area which means NG can go in. Official letter from Blanco to bush outlining problems and needs was sent on the 28th.

2)The mayor did not use a loudspeaker from what I understand, but did go on TV and tell the people of the city there was to be a mandatory evacuation. Not only that, they used buses and had pickup points which were well advertised.

3)Levees broke the next day and previous to the hurricane hitting, it was warned by the local officials they would more than likely be breeched.

4)The money asked to reinforce them was cut by leader bush.

The entire email was written by a kool-aid drinking idiot who wouldn't know how to do five minutes of research if he/she wanted to.

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Pirate Smile Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-13-05 03:06 PM
Response to Original message
3. I just got forwarded one of the RW Bullshit chain letters. Not this one
Edited on Tue Sep-13-05 03:09 PM by Pirate Smile
but one of the many going around.

Here are a couple of links to debunk things. You might want to search Snopes.com for this one specifically.


Right-Wing Myths About Katrina, Debunked

http://thinkprogress.org/2005/09/13/katrina-myths-debunked/

Debunking the "Truth of the N. O. hurricane" chain letter. PLEASE READ!

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=4758136


http://snopes.com/

edit to add - when I told my husband these had already been debunked, he said by who, I said the news, he said "liberal media" and I went temporarily insane yelling at him. Arrggghhh.
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DemsUnited Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-13-05 03:07 PM
Response to Original message
4. How about, I'll discuss these points with you right after we discuss Bush
eating cake, playing the guitar, and generally not knowing what the hell was going on until THURSDAY.
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Oreo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-13-05 03:21 PM
Response to Original message
5. It says "the nets" referring to the Internet
Edited on Tue Sep-13-05 03:26 PM by Oreo
They really do take what shrub says as gospel :spray:

Watching both Fox and NBC after President Bush had been inspecting the
Gulf Coast and New Orleans, I was shocked at how the nets, and even some newspapers, were trying to blame the Bush Administration for the slowness in which help was reaching the damaged cities.
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AlCzervik Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-13-05 03:23 PM
Response to Original message
6. a list of articles by "Lee Ellis" puke
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Horse with no Name Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Sep-13-05 04:50 PM
Response to Original message
7. Okay here is rebuttal
I do believe in backing up my educated accusations with facts. So here goes. Fox News has stated before that they are aware that they do favor the President and lean that way in their news coverage. People that watch Fox News tend to mostly be supporters of the President, and they put the spin on the news that their audience demands.
The author, Lee Ellis, is a noted right wing shill.
http://www.chronwatch.com/site_search.asp?auth=203
It isn't a far stretch to imagine him defending the President.
However, his "facts" don't match the official documents.
Notwithstanding, Bush did admit federal responsibility failure today.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9324891/
One of the facts is, that appointing unqualified people in jobs of great importance did cost lives. Croneyism--whether it is Democrat or Republican--needs to stop. There needs to be a non-partisan committee appointed to oversee such political appointees, regardless of which party is in the White House.
The safety of American lives are at stake. We need to make these positions available to qualified people, not use them for political favors and rewards.
However, so far, Mike Brown did resign.
Let me start one by one with the facts and sourcing them with official documents.
1. On August 26, Governor Blanco declared a state of emergency in Louisiana.
http://www.gov.state.la.us/2005%20%20proclamations/48pro2005-Emergency-HurricaneKatrina.pdf
Please notice Section 2 where it states:
"The State of Louisiana's emergency response and recovery program is activated under the command of the director of the state office of Homeland Security and Emergency Preparedness to prepare for and provide emergency support services and/or to minimize the effects of the storm's damage."
On August 27, she forwarded a letter to the President requesting federal assistance for the State of Louisiana.
http://www.gov.state.la.us/Press_Release_detail.asp?id=976
" Pursuant to 44 CFR § 206.35, I have determined that this incident is of such severity and magnitude that effective response is beyond the capabilities of the State and affected local governments, and that supplementary Federal assistance is necessary to save lives, protect property, public health, and safety, or to lessen or avert the threat of a disaster. I am specifically requesting emergency protective measures, direct Federal Assistance, Individual and Household Program (IHP) assistance, Special Needs Program assistance, and debris removal "
On the same day, August 27, President Bush declared Louisiana a federal disaster area.
http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2005/08/20050827-1.html
The President's action authorizes the Department of Homeland Security, Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA), to coordinate all disaster relief efforts which have the purpose of alleviating the hardship and suffering caused by the emergency on the local population, and to provide appropriate assistance for required emergency measures, authorized under Title V of the Stafford Act, to save lives, protect property and public health and safety, or to lessen or avert the threat of a catastrophe in the parishes of Allen, Avoyelles, Beauregard, Bienville, Bossier, Caddo, Caldwell, Claiborne, Catahoula, Concordia, De Soto, East Baton Rouge, East Carroll, East Feliciana, Evangeline, Franklin, Grant, Jackson, LaSalle, Lincoln, Livingston, Madison, Morehouse, Natchitoches, Pointe Coupee, Ouachita, Rapides, Red River, Richland, Sabine, St. Helena, St. Landry, Tensas, Union, Vernon, Webster, West Carroll, West Feliciana, and Winn.

So in this document, FEMA takes control of ALL disaster relief in Louisiana.

All disasters come under the Stafford Act, Title V
http://www.ohioema.org/robertt.htm (easiest copy to read--however, it is federal)
Sec. 302. (a) Immediately upon his declaration of a major disaster or emergency, the President shall appoint a Federal coordinating officer to operate in the affected area.(disaster declared on the 27th, President took responsibility).

(b) In order to effectuate the purposes of this Act, the Federal coordinating officer, within the affected area, shall

(1) make an initial appraisal of the types of relief most urgently needed;
(2) establish such field offices as he deems necessary and as are authorized by the President;
(3) COORDINATE the administration of relief, including activities of the State and local government, the American National Red Cross, the Salvation Army, the Mennonite Disaster Service, and other relief or disaster assistance organizations, which agree to operate under his advice or direction, except that nothing contained in this Act shall limit or in any way affect the responsibilities of the American National Red Cross under the Act of January 5, 1905, as amended (33 Stat. 599); and
(4) take such other action, consistent with authority delegated to him by the President, and consistent with the provisions of this Act, as he may deem necessary to assist local citizens and public officials in promptly obtaining assistance to which they are entitled.

(c) When the President determines assistance under this Act is necessary, he shall request that the Governor of the affected State designate a State coordinating officer for the purposes of coordinating State and local disaster assistance efforts with those of the Federal Government. Governor Blanco did this in her initial letter on the 26th--per the Louisiana disaster plan.

Governor Blanco did follow up with a specific request of assistance on the 28th.
http://gov.louisiana.gov/Disaster%20Relief%20Request.pdf
In this letter, she states
"I have determined that this incident will be of such severity and magnitude that effective response will be beyond the capabilities of the State and the affected local governments and that supplementary Federal assistance will be necessary".
It then goes to list what she needs from the Federal government and what Louisiana will be able to provide.

It is also noteworthy to understand that EVERY state's disaster plan HAS to be filed with FEMA and approved in order to receive Federal assistance.

The City of New Orleans Emergency Preparedness Plan.
http://www.cityofno.com/portal.aspx?portal=46&tabid=26

The State of Louisiana's Disaster Plan
www.ohsep.louisiana.gov/plans

You will find that these are all in order and that the State and Local governments fulfilled their mandatory obligations.

He also goes into Posse Comitatus. This applies to Federal troops on American soil. National Guard belong to the state.
If they weren't fighting in Iraq, the state would have had their manpower,high water vehicles and generators needed to better handle the emergency.
On August 1, Gov. Blanco did request their men and equipment to be returned from Iraq. President Bush declined.
Perhaps even more significant has been the absence of equipment critical for emergency responses. WGNO-TV, the ABC affiliate in New Orleans, reported on August 1 that, "Dozens of high water vehicles, humvees, refuelers and generators are now abroad," warning that "in the event of a major natural disaster, that could be a problem." They interviewed Lieutenant Colonel Pete Schneider of the Louisiana National Guard, who observed that "The National Guard needs that equipment back home."
As a result of the absence of these high-water vehicles and other equipment that could have been used in the aftermath of the flooding, it appears that many hundreds of people died while waiting to be rescued. Even Thomas Donnelly of the neo-conservative American Enterprise Institute observed that, "This is what happens when you take Guardsmen and put them on the conveyor belt into Iraq."

2. The mayor did not use a loudspeaker from what I understand, but did go on TV and tell the people of the city there was to be a mandatory evacuation. Not only that, they used buses and had pickup points which were well advertised and was part of the FEMA approved disaster plan as noted above.

3. Levees were a huge concern. Levees broke the next day and previous to the hurricane hitting, it was warned by the local officials they would more than likely be breeched.
http://www.pbs.org/now/transcript/transcript_neworleans.html

4. The Louisiana legislators have been begging for the money to reinforce the levees...but the Army Corps of Engineers funding was cut. Money was diverted from FEMA for natural disasters so that it could be rolled into the War in Iraq. Again, if the National Guard was in the state where they belong and where they were requested, national troops would not have been an issue.

This entire SNAFU lies at the foot of the President.
I'm sorry. I've supported my views with official documentation, not simply an OP-Ed from a known Right Wing sympathizer.
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