is it the LAW that kids must recite the pledge? we don't even need it.

[mopaul]

it's just silly, the kids don't even know what they're saying when they say it, i know, i've said it a million times as a kid, it had no effect on me whatsoever.

who needs it at all? a person could live 85 wonderful productive years without ever once having recited these useless words.

[napi21]

1. I think it's because, at least some people, want to promote pride

in America, and teach children, at a young age, they should be proud to be an American. You may disagree with that, but is it really a bad thing?

[mopaul]

2. not a good or a bad thing

maybe they shouldn't be proud to be an american, or is that unamerican?

[vptpt]

6. If they want to promote pride

they should give us something to be proud of, not just make us memorize some words.

I'm not attacking you, napi, btw...

[DistressedAmerican]

8. Some Call That Propaganda And Indoctrination Of The Youth.

I am not very proud to be an American these days. Are you?

I think it best to allow people to decide without repeated indoctrination what country they should have pride in.

I sure as hell see no benefit in my schools indoctrinating my daughter. She should be allowed to decide for herself whether the United States is worthy of her respect, not have that assertion pushed on her.

So yes, it is that bad. Jingoistic/nationalist propaganda serves no positive role. It blinds us to our own country's injustices.

How do you feel about "America, love it or leave it"? That expression is cut from the very same unthinking nationalist cloth...

[SmokingJacket]

10. How about teaching them WHY they should be proud, rather

than just making them promise they will be?

Teaching about the American Revolution and the Constitution and the Gettysburg Address, etc., is a much more effective way to show kids what's best about this country.

Children chanting oathes gives me the creeps.

That said, I think Democrats have more important issues on the table and I hope we leave this one alone.

[K-W]

11. I think nationalism is a bad thing.

Why do you think most Americans have such a hard time seeing the bad parts of our government/society?

Perhaps because they were raised to be blindly proud of it?

I don't see any good reason to indoctrinate children. If America is deserving of pride, then an accurate historical and civil account of America will produce students proud of America.

What is the point of teaching disembodied pride except to prevent objective analysis?

[mzteris]

12. pride as an American is one thing

being forced to acknowledge a "God" is something else. (In this country we KNOW they mean only the white Christian God - regardless of their protestations otherwise.....)

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

20. Mandatory solemn pledges of patriotism are so creepy they're

spider-sense-triggering.

[FormerDittoHead]

3. Why say it more than once? Also: non-binding under 18...

I never understood the repetition - I mean, it doesn't say, "I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America for the next 24 hours"...

I figured I said it once, I don't need to say it again, so I didn't recite it after 8th grade (the Vietnam War didn't help either)

....and any contract agreed to by a minor is otherwise non-binding...

I agree - it's stupid.

[vptpt]

4. A kid I went to school with always

refused to say it. One teacher made him get in front of the class and say it by himself. He said it in German. Seems like he got a week of detention, or something like that.

[mopaul]

5. i'd just move my mouth

it was like a 45 second blank spot every morning, signifying nothing

[Craig3410]

18. That's what I did.... -nt-

[mcscajun]

7. It's not the Law that anyone must recite it. It's only custom and habit.

If you need to say it all, you only need to say it once. You've pledged your allegiance...once. You're done.

The words "under God" shouldn't be in there at all...they were an addendum during the Red Scare of the 50s...put there at the urging of the Catholic Knights of Columbus.

Remove them, and all the challenges would soon wither away.

As it stands, it's a red flag waved in front of a bull (for both sides of the argument).

[Modem Butterfly]

13. It's the law in certain states

[mcscajun]

25. Amazing. Also absurd. Which is why we have these court

challenges.

Those laws should be challenged and struck down wherever they may be.

[PassingFair]

9. I have to stand up and say it at EVERY damn

dem party meeting I attend and I DON'T LIKE IT.
It is religious coercion.
I tell my kids that they don't have to stand and recite if they don't want to. They usually go with the flow, but they don't like it either.

[napi21]

14. Do you stand up at a ball game when they play the National Anthem?

I DO! I am not very proud of my Country right now, and many times, downright ashamed! But I still have some hope for the future, and I get a tear in my eye when the National anthem is played. It shouldn't be mandatory that anyone say the pledge, but I don't think it does any harm either. I don't want that pride to go away completely. Some day ShrubCo will be gone, and we can have pride in out Country again. Why not keep a little spark of pride by at least letting people hear that pledge, no matter where they are?

[mopaul]

15. some folks weep at the national anthem, some don't

i don't

[PassingFair]

16. The national anthem does not require

that I pledge alliegence to a supernatural sky-god.
I believe in the United States of America.
I do NOT believe in gods.

[GOPisEvil]

19. When I recite it, I don't say the "under God" part.

:)

[mcscajun]

23. I'll stand, but I won't recite. If I'm in a situation (rare)

where I absolutely MUST say it, then I omit the "Under God" part. If asked about it, I'll provide the info I posted above.

I did just that in an American Sign Language class some years ago; we were taught how to sign the entire pledge, but when it came my turn to stand and sign it, I omitted "under God". When challenged on my omission, I told them why. :) (I also added that I'd signed the "pledge as originally written."

[mzteris]

24. My son says "under Buddha" n/t

[GOPisEvil]

17. Actually it IS the law here in Texas.

School kids must recite the Pledge of Allegiance to the US flag AND the Texas flag AND observe a moment of silent "reflection".

[Hamlette]

21. in some states and some school districts it is the law but kids can refuse

to stand and/or recite the pledge.

To me, in some ways, it did just the opposite of instilling pride. I was "forced" to recite a pledge to what I believed was a fairy tale. It was my first experience with "the government is wrong".

[Douglas Carpenter]

22. well, the rest of the democratic world agrees with you. but,

I don't think it's a battle that can be won. In principle the very notion of starting school by swearing allegiance to the state horrifies (with the exception of the U.S.) the free world. But, it is so deeply ingrained here in the U.S. I don't think we will be getting anywhere by fighting it. We might as well try to ban hunting. Something just won't sell in Peoria.

[LibDemAlways]

26. I'm with you.

It's something we teach kids when they're young and they learn to recite by rote without giving the words a thought. I could not figure out who "Richard Stands" was when I was a kid, but I was too embarrassed to ask figuring that people would think I was dumb.