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Consider what it took for the Bush Loyalists to start to question him

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ComerPerro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-04-05 08:22 AM
Original message
Consider what it took for the Bush Loyalists to start to question him
Massive failures, incompetence, and coverups surrounding 9/11?
No.

A consistently declining economy?
No.

A piece of legislation, ironically called the "Patriot Act", which seems have been drafted to give the big government unlimited power and strip away at individual rights?
No.

Starting a war based on lies and forged documents?
No.

Having no exit strategy of any kind in this war?
No.

Failure to make any kind of meaningful progress in Iraq, as well as failure to find any WMD?
No.

Photographic evidence of the torture and humiliation of Iraqi prisoners, that could reach the highest levels of the Pentagon?
No.

Excessive spending which has sent us into soaring deficits year after year after year?
No.

Failure to pass any kind of legislation that he promised in his campaigns, even with majority control of the House and Congress?
No.

His outright laziness, including his record-smashing vacation time?
No.

His general apathy toward US and World Events? (he prides himself on not reading newspapers or paying attention to the news, and during Hurricane Katrina he didn't even seem to give a damn until several days after the devastation. He even fund-raised!)
No.

His track record of rewarding failure? (he gave George Tenant, a man he and other Republicans blamed for 9/11 and the Iraq WMD lies, a medal!)
No.

His associations to criminals and people of questionable ethics? (Enron, anyone?)
No.

His administration's policy of appointing people to positions of power and responsibility based on party loyalty rather than qualifications? (Brownie)
No.

His continued support of Brown, even after it was apparent to everyone but Bush that the guy never should have been even given the opportunity to fuck up that badly?
No.




So just what does it? What does it take to set conservatives off? What would make them question their blind allegiance to Bush?

Apparently, Bush nominating to the Supreme Court someone who they fear may not be fanatic enough for their tastes.

Really makes you think, doesn't it?



These people, these FReepers, are not going to be waking up anytime soon.
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babylonsister Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-04-05 08:26 AM
Response to Original message
1. Nom, because it's mind-blowing to see all his failings in print. nt
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ComerPerro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-04-05 08:29 AM
Response to Reply #1
4. Hell, that's not even half of it. But, yeah, its stunning to read
and realize that these morons stuck with him through all that.

And THIS is what it took to get them to even question him.

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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Oct-05-05 01:39 AM
Response to Reply #1
37. ABC Guide to the Bush Scandals
This is from 6 months ago and I haven't had time to get the best links that explains each one. And there's more to add, Brownie, FEMA, Safavian. That's why I lose my mind every time someone says "there's enough blame to go around". I don't friggin' think so.

A is for the Abramoff Fundraising Scandal, Asbestos bailout,

B is for the Body Armor

C is for Clear Skies and tripling mercury emissions, Chalabi Iranian spy, now head of Iraq Oil Ministry

D is for DFI, Darfur, Downing Street Memo

E is for Energy Task Force,

F is for Fake News, Fake Terror Alerts,

G is for Gannongate, Geneva Convention violations

H is for Healthy Forests, Humvee Armor

I is for IRAQ War Lies

J is for Judicial Radicals

K is for Kyoto Climate Change lies,

L is for LIES LIES LIES LIES LIES

M is for the Medicare Accounting Lies,

N is for the Nuclear Option, NCLB, Nuclear Weapon research

O is for Oil for Food (52% US kickbacks),

P is for Poindexter's Terrorism Futures Market, Privatization lies

Q is for Quagmire

R is for Richard Perle Influence Peddling, opening roadless areas

S is for Star Wars Missile Defense failure,

T is for Torture Scandal, Abu Ghraib, Afghanistan & Gitmo, tax give-aways

U is for UN nominee spectacle John Bolton, UN bugging, Underfunding Homeland Security

V is for Valerie Plame, vaccination crisis, gutting Veteran's Benefits

W is for Wildlife Refuge lies

X is for Camp X-Ray

Y is for Yucca Mountain lies andscandals of forged documents

Z is for Ground Zero EPA Lies



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spooked911 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-04-05 08:27 AM
Response to Original message
2. Excellent point. I have been thinking that there simply is no reasoning
with anyone who still suports Bush. They are fanatics past the point of no return.
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Theres-a Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-04-05 09:43 AM
Response to Reply #2
10. I met one the other night
They really are f***ing crazy.
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Lerkfish Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-04-05 08:27 AM
Response to Original message
3. yup. you got it about right
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abluelady Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-04-05 08:38 AM
Response to Original message
5. And, there are still supporters--that is even more mind boggling.
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electropop Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-04-05 09:06 AM
Response to Reply #5
8. Al Capone had quite a fan base.
Some folks just think gangsters are cool.
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kenny blankenship Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-04-05 08:53 AM
Response to Original message
6. Would they question him at all if the war on Iraq wasn't going so badly?
Edited on Tue Oct-04-05 09:08 AM by kenny blankenship
Probably not. They don't seem care about the immorality of Bush's overall war-aims, or the lying, or the systematic use of torture, or the destruction of the post-WWII international system of law. They're just miffed that he's fucked it up so badly.

They lack the capacity to understand or care about the issues involved in the Iraq invasion, or the long-term damage to our national prestige. They see only that despite his prowess at howling for war, Bush doesn't pick winnable fights, or win pickable fights. They need a better war-chimp (and some day they'll get him).

The failure to act responsibly after Katrina was finally something concrete enough for them to understand and apply to their sense of self-interest. "That could be me Bush is leaving to die. That could be ME!!!" When it was Iraqi children Bush was slaughtering they couldn't cheer loudly enough, but now after Hurricanalooza '05 they've gobe all soft and sensitive and they care about other people. (Don't count on it).

And of course there's still 35% of America that won't question him no matter what. These are folks you'd better watch out for: their nastiness has found a new license with the Bush regime of managed elections. It's NOT going to go back in its box. They don't have to curb their opinions or censor themselves anymore. Diebold democracy and corporate press censorship from now on decrees the repackaging of rightwing extremism as "centrism". The center has been shifted, we have a new normal in this land: Fascism=Centrism. (which ain't too surprising since centrism is in reality just another name for conformism--sticking out in no particular direction but taking cues from what surrounds you and from what "others agree on") If you think George W. Bush is the absolute worst that America's misruling class can come up with, that he's the worst they will ever foist on the American electorate, just you wait a few cycles. This 35% who're still SUVing around with their 2004 Wastikas in plain view will cheer on Bush's succcessor when he arrives and makes W look restrained and genial, somewhat like Reagan now seems in comparison to W.
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ComerPerro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-04-05 09:40 AM
Response to Reply #6
9. Its always that crazy 1/3 or so
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al bupp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-04-05 09:01 AM
Response to Original message
7. The kool-aid must be really strong, no doubt about it
But I suppose that we need look no farther than Nazi Germany to comprehend the awesome powers of self-delusion.

Nicely posted, sir.
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charlie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-04-05 09:50 AM
Response to Original message
11. Gas-o-line
Track their disaffection with Dubya against the price of gas closing on the magic $3 price. If gas was $1.25, I doubt the Republican rank and file would be squalling today.
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ComerPerro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-04-05 10:21 AM
Response to Reply #11
15. And, considering the increase in prices since Bush has been in office
there are still very few conservatives actually upset over the prices. They are mad to pay so much, but very few of them (if any at all) will actually blame Bush.

Apparently its not his fault that gas prices have more than doubled since he got in office.

But, back in the late 90's, they raised holy hell if gas prices ever got over $1. They would get absolutely pissed at Clinton. I know several that did that.

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corkhead Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-04-05 09:53 AM
Response to Original message
12. You may have already seen it but Tom Tomorrow
Edited on Tue Oct-04-05 09:54 AM by corkhead
recently had the PERFECT toon that summmed up this circumstance...

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ComerPerro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-04-05 10:19 AM
Response to Reply #12
13. Yeah, I remember that one! It was great
Thanks for posting it again
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Czolgosz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-04-05 10:19 AM
Response to Original message
14. How is it anyone (even people here) still calls him a "conservative"? As
your post ably demonstrates, Shrub is anything but a conservative and yet the "liberal media" refers to him and his misadministration as "conservative" all the time. We need to break that habit of calling him and his right-wing agenda "conservative" because it's not and it's high time the true conservatives shun this administration and everything it stands for.
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ComerPerro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-04-05 10:25 AM
Response to Reply #14
16. But, I contend that as long as conservatives embrace him,
then he is practicing conservative policies, and is the embodiment of conservative beliefs.

They are arrogantly misnamed, yes. But as long as conservatives support W, they endorse excessive and wasteful deficit spending, rash decisions based on lies and speculation that cost thousands of lives, and a blatant disregard for morals and ethics.

That's what conservatism is to me. And Bush IS conservatism.
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Czolgosz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-04-05 11:21 AM
Response to Reply #16
19. One third of the population describes itself as "conservative." Once upon
a time that word "conservative" meant (1) favoring traditional views (like favoring the idea of having a spending budget that does not exceed tax revenues), (2) tending to oppose change (like tending to oppose radical changes to social security), and (3) restrained in style (like refraining from telling Senate colleagues to go fuck themselves on the Senate floor).

I cannot find any dictionary anywhere that gives the word "conservative" any definition that would remotely apply to Shrub.
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ComerPerro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-04-05 11:25 AM
Response to Reply #19
21. That's my point
if all these people who say they are conservative still support Bush, then he is therefore practicing beliefs and policies that are endorsed by conservative poltical philosophy.

It doesn't change the meaning of the word.

But it changes what "Conservatives" stand for.

So, yes, Bush isn't in any way "conservative". But I honestly don't think Bush stands for anything at all, except for making his backers richer and richer.

But as long as people who identify themselves as Political "conservatives" support him and his practices, then he is redefining the Conservative beliefs.

And they are going right along with him.
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Czolgosz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-04-05 11:52 AM
Response to Reply #21
24. Polling indicates that the 33%-40% self-identified conservatives are not
the same 33%-40% of nitwits who still support Shrub despite his countless glaring failures. In fact, BushInc's repeated failure to adhere to conservative views on economic matters and issues traditionally within the accepted realm of the government's role are critical fracture lines within the Rove-manufactured Republican coalition. Here's some graphs:



The "enterprisers" on this list are the Halliburton/Enron-style corporatist neo-cons, and they have different economic priorities than the rest of America and even different priorities than the rest of the Republican Party. Yet BushInc kowtows to this tiny neo-con minority. I think we stand to gain from reminding other conservatives that Bush does not support their conservative agenda in most regards.
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Inland Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-04-05 03:41 PM
Response to Reply #14
30. "kleptocrat" "fascist" "gangster" all off the lib-con scale.
You can be one of those and either a "liberal" or a "conservative" or a "monarchist", for that matter. Party affiliations and ideological trappings are just a front for selfish gain.
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Czolgosz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-04-05 04:04 PM
Response to Reply #30
31. I totally agree (and lol about "kleptocrat")
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Inland Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-04-05 04:13 PM
Response to Reply #31
32. It's a Galbraith term.
I think he used it with specific reference to some latin american polities.
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info being Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-04-05 10:50 AM
Response to Original message
17. That's because they're fascists, silly!
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ComerPerro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-04-05 11:03 AM
Response to Reply #17
18. True. Too true. I posted this for three reasons:
One: to illustrate that some people are so far gone that they are beyond any hope of conversion.


Two: to illustrate just how sycopahntic and pathetic these people are, and how strange it is that they ONLY question him now. Says alot about what their priorities are. They don't want someone in the White House who is honest, moral, and straightforward. They don't even require that the person be competent. All they care is that he clings to their fanatic view of reality, and that he is a party loyalist.


Three: its just mindblowing to list out his failures and scandals, and to consider that there are people out there still convinced that he is a good man.
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MuseRider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-04-05 11:24 AM
Response to Reply #18
20. Nice.
Nominated.

:hi: friend! Very nice post and yes indeed it is mind boggling.
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ComerPerro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-04-05 11:26 AM
Response to Reply #20
22. Thanks
How have you been?
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MuseRider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-04-05 11:57 AM
Response to Reply #22
25. Great really.
You?
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ComerPerro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-04-05 12:04 PM
Response to Reply #25
26. Good, good
Haven't been in KS forum much lately. But that place is kinda dead...
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MuseRider Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-04-05 12:53 PM
Response to Reply #26
28. Comes and goes.
I will have an announcement soon I hope about the state wide gay rights group I have been on the steering committee to create.

I am beginning to think I will not be able to go to the meetups very often. It is costing me over $100.00 to fill my truck up each week so I am sticking closer to home than ever before so I may have to keep up with you all here at DU.

Glad you are doing OK. Great post.
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Emit Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-04-05 11:50 AM
Response to Reply #18
23. I think you are right
And I've posted elsewhere in regards to this question of why they continue to support him. Personally, as I frequent another board with several Bush & Co. supporters so I am familiar with their stance, I think some have blindly supported Bush & Co. in hopes of advancing very specific goals of their agenda (i.e., authoritarian rule regarding homosexuality, abortion, etc.) that they think will rid Amurica of the 'evil secularists' and 'baby killers'.

I know that seems overly simple-minded, but some of these people have been brain washed for so long, especially those driven by their religious fundamentalism, cult-like ways, particularly in regards to the abortion issue. I think it is one of the things that drives them the most. And, I think that this SC nominee, Miers, is viewed as not conservative enough for them.

Here's a post from an avid Bush & Co. supporter from another discussion board I frequent, in repsonse to a question about why they don't want Miers:

Personally, for me she confirms my worst fears about the Bush family. They have deep collegiality roots. They are far too eager to compromise. They're closet liberals. This is not what we fought for. I hope you Looney Lefties torpedo her so we can get a real conservative like Janice Rogers Brown on the Court. It's not too late. Help us out now!


http://discussions.pbs.org/viewtopic.pbs?t=39056&postdays=0&postorder=asc&topic_view=&start=15

Here's another from a different poster, same discussion:

In response to my question: Me: "What don't you like about her?"

Bush & Co. supporter: "She was recommended by Harry Reid."

Me: "That's it?"

Bush & Co. supporter:
That's bad enough. Bush and the Republicans campaigned - and won - partly on the basis of reversing the judicial activism of the SC. He could have, and surely should have, found and nominated another Bork, Scalia, or Thomas. Possibly one more chance to do that if Stevens (age 85!) dies or chooses to retire.


I read several threads yesterday here with quotes and links to the Freeper's site that had similar sentiments (probably the same guys!).

Anyway, seems they've been going along with reprehensible things that Bush & Co. have done to get their SC pick--a 'true' conservative that will reverse Roe v. Wade, as well as other issues they see as 'leftist activism that has ruined Amurica.' It's been their 'the end justifies the means' route.
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ComerPerro Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-04-05 12:06 PM
Response to Reply #23
27. The thing that bothers me most about comments like that
is when they say that Bush is "liberal".

No. He isn't. Nothing about him is liberal.

He says he is a political conservative, and they embrace him.

you don't see liberals doing shit like this...
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Cronus Protagonist Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-04-05 01:27 PM
Response to Reply #18
29. They hire cronies too, so if you want a good job.... say nice things
A lot of cash seems to be getting thrown around too, doesn't it? Good boys get some of that too! What's NOT to like?

:sarcasm:

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DaveT Donating Member (447 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-04-05 10:59 PM
Response to Original message
33. They don't like us. US.
A while back, a reformed Freeper posted his very welcome change of heart on this board. One of his comments struck me as very significant -- he said he went to the polls in November of 2004 with the idea of "sticking it" to John Kerry.

That comment resonated with everything I know about hard right wingers in my family; from my hometown of Dallas, Texas; and, through the internet, radio, cable, television and print. What motivates these people is a straightforward resentment of what they perceive as "the liberal."

Within the American culture which is dominated by mass communications, the word "liberal" is primarily an epithet to describe a cultural stereotype -- the annoying scold who wants to punish the majority (with taxation and restrictive laws) for not thinking, speaking, or acting "correctly," while offering therapy, understanding and tax money to lazy and/or evil people. Rush Limbaugh and the Fox News Channel are dedicated to working this stereotype for all it's worth and then some.

Like all persistent stereotypes, this caracature of the "liberal" has a bit of truth in it. We all know or at least have heard of living breathing human beings who are going to scold you for not using the right word (PC) or eat the right food or worry about the right species of vermin that is in danger of extinction. The tone of voice in this scolding is extremely annoying to most Americans regardless of voting habit.

This stereotypical "liberal" is all about micromanaging civilization -- regulating hate speech, throwing tax dollars at social problems like laziness and criminality, telling people what kind of car to drive, telling people what kind of house to live in, what neighbors they are going to have to learn to love.

Above all, for the last four years, the Limbaugh conception of a "liberal" is somebody who wants to reason with terrorists.


However, in the last year or so, I am seeing signs of a "liberal" cultural revival. The right wing hacks who dominate public discourse have been pounding on everybody to the left of Attila the Hun with a redundant visciousness that has become banal -- and you are seeing a new self confidence coming out through Air America, the Jones Network, Comedy Central and among a few other platforms. Within this nascent reaction to the Right Wing hegemony in public discourse over the last 15 years or so, you hear more and more people willing to call themselves "liberals."

This effort to rescusitate the term will have to define itself away from the annoying scold to make any meaningful headway against the political bloc in firm control of America today.


So what does "liberal" mean to liberals?

Unfortunately, there is no short way to answer that question. The paradigm of "big vs. small government" offers no help. Most liberals favor a national health plan but want the government out of your bedroom. Most liberals favor an aggressive governmental policy to secure equal economic opportunity for racial minorities but want to shrink the Pentagon's budget.

The paradigm of "individual rights vs government power" is equally useless as a determiner of liberalism. Ditto "socialism vs. capitalism."

When self described liberals held high office in America two generations ago, there was no talk of nationalizing major industries, and by any but the most dishonest wingnut conception of "socialism" as a slur, there is no push for socialism among Americans who call themselves liberals today.

By the way, polls show that self described liberals make up between a fifth and a quarter of the general population.


The problem with defining liberalism is that the liberal project was almost completed in the USA with the Administration of Richard Nixon.

The self described liberals who came to power with Franklin Roosevelt and who survived the Eisenhower respite offered the country a comprehensive program of Regulated Capitalism. A self conscious reaction to the Great Depression, liberalism stood for the principle that the Government should use its power to rein in the excesses of Capitalism. The "conservatism" which they defeated was exemplified by Mr. Conservative, Robert Taft -- a man who thought it was a mistake to use the government to reduce the human misery caused by the Great Depression.

World War II settled the question of whether we would have a permanent "Big Government" as we looked at a completely changed global order in 1945. The Pentagon needed a perpetually expanding budget to keep the Soviet Union in check, and the the general prosperity that we enjoyed until the first Oil Shock of 1973 pretty well buried Taftian conservatism for at least a generation.

The contrast between FDR's liberalism and Taft's conservatism was semantically sensible. The New Deal was liberal with its use of Federal money to address social problems; it was liberal in its sense of generosity toward the downtrodden; it was liberal in its promotion of Keynesian economic stimulus -- although most "conservative" businessmen had a hard time understanding how these policies actually benefited them. Meanwhile, Taft wanted to "conserve" a social, economic and political order that had been in place for at least 70 years -- or since the beginning of the Republic, depending on how you chose to look at the concept of laissez faire.

The liberal project lost its political majority in the late 1960s due to Vietnam and the racial backlash that followed in the wake of LBJ passing the Civil Rights and Voting Rights Acts, and the series of race riots that swept through the urban ghettoes in those "long hot summers" of the late 60s.

Even so, although Richard Nixon described himself as a "conservative," he actually produced the high water mark for the liberal project by creating the Environmental Protection Agency and the Occupational Health and Safety Administration. These vast government bureaucracies addressed two "externalities" of capitalism in the classic liberal tradition of regulation. Nixon even proposed a version of welfare "reform" that would have Federalized the entire project of aid to poor families with a pre-Clintonian stipend that would never expire, although this program never passed.

The current ambiguity of the term "liberal" began to show up as Nixon pretty well completed the Liberal project of providing a Federal guarantee of a social safety net to prevent another collapse of aggregate demand like the Great Depression while preventing Big Business from harming the general welfare. The only major plank in the liberal project that was never added to the modern Welfare State was health care -- an initiative first advanced by Harry Truman, then Ted Kennedy and the last time out by Hillary Rodham.

As the welfare state grew over the decades and as its aura of making "progress" waned with familiarity, it has left liberals with very little to be in favor of. Instead of liberals advocating new initiatives, they are now in the position of wanting to "conserve" a social and political paradigm that has become several generations old.

One consequence of this is that the driving energy that comes from the true believers within a social movement pushes out in new directions -- and those new directions do not remain within the old paradigm. Now that liberalism has given racial minorities their legal rights, we are left with the lingering effects of centuries of official oppression. How do you address this problem? Now that the liberal state created by FDR and Richard Nixon has defeated the Axis Powers and then the Soviet Union, what do we do with the quasi-imperial appartatus that has been flung to the far corners of the globe? How do you address this problem?

In both the case of lingering racism and lingering imperialism, there is no simple liberal program. You will find "liberals" all over the lot on those issues.



Meanwhile, the term "conservative" has gone through even more extreme changes since the studied ambiguity of Richard Nixon.

The greatest hero of 21st Century conservatism is Ronald Wilson Reagan, a man who said that he never left the Democratic Party, but that the Democratic Party left him. A New Deal anti-Communist Liberal when he became the president of a labor union, Reagan never repudiated Franklin Roosevelt.

Since the Gipper left office in 1989, his political faction has gone absolutely nuts. As probably 200 or so posts under this nick argue at great length, there is nothing "conservative" about the Administration of George Walker Bush. It has created the Biggest and Most Intrusive Government in history. It is for free trade one day, it implements protectionism the next. It has cut taxes during wartime in the most radically irresponsible fiscal assault on our government's solvency in history. It has no regard for individual liberty or due process of law. It practices state religion.

I submit that the most accurate term for Bushism is "radical nihilism." Or I guess I'd settle for "gangsterism."

So in this semantic stew, what is a liberal? what is a conservative?



Then, of course, once you throw up your hands and give up trying to make sense out of our provincial "American" conception of these terms, you run into the fact that the rest of the anglophone world never had our conception of the term "liberal" in the first place.


Oy oy oy.

What puts the cherry on the sundae is that Americans know exactly what you mean when you say that so and so is a "liberal." A liberal is defined by her consumer choices! White wine, Volvo cars, exotic salads -- long hack comedy bits still make the rounds contrasting soccer and Nascar or Lite Jazz and Twangy Country Music.
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never cry wolf Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-04-05 11:26 PM
Response to Reply #33
34. Nice post, Dave T
You should start a thread with that one and welcome to DU!

:hi:
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fishnfla Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-04-05 11:32 PM
Response to Original message
35. They are pissed about the nominee, they wanted a fight
They wanted the chimp to pick a full-blown raging conservative right-winger just so they could draw lines and pick fights. Someone they could champion as "the great white hope" and stick their noses in our face.

Instead they get a stealth candidate, more like milk and cookies than fire and brimstone.

So they turn their ire on the chimp. Too bad, so sad
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LittleClarkie Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Oct-04-05 11:35 PM
Response to Original message
36. Gas prices, and anything that effects them personally
If a draft happens, and their own kids are involved, budda bing baby.
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