Boy, the House is really noisy today.

[Skidmore]

I wanted to follow this debate but keep getting interrupted. Lots of shouting and catcalling. Arguing, it seems, on rules.

[vanboggie]

1. It sounds like the British Parliament

Right now the repukes are holding up concluding a vote they don't like - 14 of their own came over to our side, LOL. They're still 2 behind so we must wait while they twist arms like they did on the Medicare bill. They are such disgusting, unethical horrible creatures.

[Horse with no Name]

5. I don't think that should be allowed

And the fact that our Congress openly partakes in "Let's Make a Deal" during a voting process--to the point of shutting down a legislative body...just shows how fucking corrupt they are.
A Democracy is supposed to be better than this.
How can someone vote for something and then be told as a sidenote..."Oh by the way, nice kids and wife you got there. They ARE healthy now-- aren't they?"

[vanboggie]

22. One just flipped

Hope his/her twisted arm is ok - not!

[Coexist]

2. ooh - it is really heating up

[Coexist]

3. THEY CUT THE AUDIO!!!

what the f*@k

[Coexist]

4. "is the gentleman asking for Parlimentary inquiry"

man, it is getting ugly.

[Coexist]

6. Please, someone tell me you got the video

I need to see which Dems were protesting.

I need to THANK THEM!!!!!!!!

[Skidmore]

8. I recognized Barney Frank's voice.

For one.

[ellenfl]

14. you can only hear them but i heard john kerry questioning

the longer vote time. feels just like the medicare prescription bill. i wonder if blunt is as nasty as delay was.

ellen fl

[Coexist]

19. self - delete

[Coexist]

33. "Mr. Speaker the Democratic leader is trying to be heard"

Pelosi "this is part of the culture of corruption."

Go BABY!!!

[Stand and Fight]

75. Why the hell is John Kerry in the House?

What are you smoking?

[ellenfl]

119. oops, my bad! you're right. he sure sounded like kerry.

who is in the house that sounds like kerry? it was probably just someone i have heard speak a lot lately and i got confused. not hard to do with this bunch in washington.

the senate was already on vacation.

ellen fl

[MADem]

78. Kerry is not in the House, if you hear Barney, you do not hear John

Or you are watching the Senate, not the House.

[Skidmore]

7. Every one in the house has voted but they won't close

the vote. There was a parliamentary question about closing the vote and the Chair said he wouldn't answer a "hypothetical question". Who's leading the House today?

[Coexist]

10. "doesn't this make the House a banana republic?"

who was that?!

[AnneD]

9. they are trying

to pull on the energy bill what they did on medicare drug bill (allow for more time)and the DEM's and the GOP's that are with them are calling (very loudly-complete with catcalls) for parlimentary inquiry. Things are tough when there isn't a hammer in the house.

[Skidmore]

11. Someone asked if this makes the House part of a

banana republic.

[gratuitous]

12. Gee, what was that the Republicans kept shouting at us?

"You lost, get over it." Can't imagine why that popped into my mind just now. Guess it only works one way anymore.

[Coexist]

13. "Will the vote be ended in an hour?"

response:

"not a proper Parlimentary inquiry"

[Greeby]

15. What the hell is going on?

I came in in the middle of this, makes no sense :crazy:

[vanboggie]

18. Fascism at it's finest n/t

[Coexist]

21. everyone voted - they lost

now they want to keep the vote open indefinately so they can arm-twist and deal two or three Republicans into changing their vote.

Dems are finally saying "NO, dammit".

[tblue37]

Remember Delay squawking that Earle wanted a

"do-over"? The repubs are all about "do-overs" when they don't win.

[FreedomAngel82]

73. Exactly

They can only win by lying, cheating and stealing. If not they play the victim.

[AnneD]

50. Shame shame shame

[Skidmore]

16. Better yet, we need a list of the Rs who are trying to pull a Delay.

[Coexist]

17. it says TIME REMAINING 0:00

So why is the vote still open???

[Sydnie]

20. "Banana Republic" -- DAMN!

Wish they wouldn't keep cutting the audio! If that is what we are hearing, imagine what we are missing!

[Roland99]

23. YEAs just went from 210 to 211! Is it tied now?

kinda blurry on my stream.

[Roland99]

26. It just went 212-210 and did I hear a gavel????

[Coexist]

24. TWO VOTES CHANGED!

Now 212-210

[Skidmore]

29. Wow, those moans in the back of the room sound

like someone's being flogged. Pelosi asking for a parliamentary inquiry.

[Rainscents]

25. What Bill is this they voting on?

[Skidmore]

32. They one to institute some protection for consumers from

gouging by energy companies.

[Skidmore]

37. Who is serving as Speaker today?

Bill Thomas is whining.

[Coexist]

27. Pelosi is trying to say that people are still voting

Speaker trying to ignore her.

OOPS!

[babylonsister]

30. Pelosi, I think you mean. nt

[ellenfl]

28. well, they twisted some arms. eom

[mattclearing]

36. Unbelievable. n/t

[vanboggie]

31. Go Nancy!! n/t

[Roland99]

34. Nancy Pelosi nailing the bastards!!!

Being ignored by the Speaker.

[cynatnite]

35. OMG! This is incredible! n/t

[libnnc]

38. HOLY MOLEY!!

Nancy said "culture of corruption"

wow

damn them for cutting the audio!!!! :nuke:

[Coexist]

39. ITS A REVOLT!

Go Dems! Shut them down.

[deadparrot]

40. What are they voting on?

*is lost*

[Rainscents]

44. Consumer energy bill.

[deadparrot]

48. Thanks.

:)

[Roland99]

41. WTF is a "proper" parliamentary inquiry???

[Coexist]

51. a procedure question - they are not asking questions about procedure

they are just asking questions.

[Roland99]

Isn't a question re: not closing the vote once all votes were cast

a question on procedure??

[Coexist]

I am guessing that is a No from the responses of

the speaker.

[Roland99]

64. But is the Speaker saying that out of spite? It's obvious what his agenda

was by his gaveling the vote closed as soon as that last vote switched.

[Skidmore]

42. Waxman up. Asking if the vote is read.

Still holding the voting open.

[Coexist]

43. What are they chanting???

[cynatnite]

45. That's what I want to know...n/t

[Skidmore]

47. Shame! SHame! Shame!

[libnnc]

46. SHAME! SHAME!

I have never in my life!!!

:wow:

[Connie_Corleone]

THIS IS AN OUTRAGE!!

[vanboggie]

55. I 've seen it before

The Medicare bill. Bastards!!!

[Coexist]

56. YES! Shame - Shame - Shame

I am with you Dems, I am with you. Shame on this filthy administration!

[Greeby]

49. Get the snacks, ppl

:popcorn:

[cynatnite]

54. Got mine

:popcorn:

I'm totally blown away!

[Roland99]

52. What are they shouting?

Boo now...some new legislation going on?

[sabra]

58. shame shame

[babylonsister]

53. Nothing democratic about what's going on in there today. nt

[DakotaDemocrat]

59. Where can I watch this?

Cspan.org has junk on right now...

[Roland99]

60. It's over now

http://play.rbn.com/play.asx?url=cspan/cspan/wmlive/cspan1v.asf&proto=mms?mswmext=.asx

[Sydnie]

57. What the hell are they chanting?

Are they saying SHAME?

[deadparrot]

61. Yes. nt

[Roland99]

62. I Want to Know Who Changed Their Vote!!!!

:mad:

[Sydnie]

66. Probably the smuck that was worried about catching his plane in

and hour! Anything to start his vacation on time!

[MO_Dem]

71. I think that was John Dingle

I seriously doubt that he would change his vote to go along with the repigs. He (rightly, imho) thought they should call the vote instead of holding it open long enough for the repigs to twist enough arms to make them change their votes.

[Sydnie]

91. I will defer to your ears then

Honestly, other than Pelosi, I couldn't recognize any voices.

[Bernardo de La Paz]

115. Name names. Kick ass. Two cowards or cronies flipped.

[Pacifist Patriot]

110. Same here!

[Skidmore]

63. I want the Dems to call out the people who were flipped. I want to

know their names and I want to know why they flipped.

[Roland99]

65. Hell yea!

[Coexist]

67. how do we do that?

Who do we contact?

Should we start with Pelosi?

http://www.house.gov/

[Roland99]

68. Start with your Rep. and then ask the Dems that matter:

Conyers
Pelosi
Waxman
etc.

[Skidmore]

69. Let's roll... as the Freakers would say.

These people need to be shamed

1. for their tactics (I'd like to know who was doing the arm twisting)
2. for giving into arm twisting when the welfare of the people is being abrogated.

[Coexist]

89. Who else contacted whom?

anyone? I called Conyers and Pelosi and emailed Pelosi - but my email got kicked back due to my zip code.

[cyberpj]

94. I read another post on another thread that Delay was on the floor

doing the twisting - is that possible/right?

[Coexist]

98. yup - he's still there, just not Majority Leader.

so it is entirely possible. That is what he does best.

[Roland99]

116. It was in the AP or the Reuters article (I have pertinent parts at my blog

http://www.conjur.com/blog

(since sigs are off right now)

[Coexist]

70. My quick email to her:

I witnessed a terrible wrong a few minutes ago in the House and the Democrats valiant attempt to put a stop to corruption. How do I find out who flipped their vote, so I can contact that Representative?

[Coexist]

80. I called her too - here's her number in DC

[phone]

[libnnc]

100. I just called her office about 20 minutes ago

a very nice young man answered and I just quickly said I saw what happened on Cspan and that was not a constituent but that I thought she was doing a wonderful job and to keep up the good work. He sounded very happy to hear it and said he would certainly tell her.

didn't take me 3 minutes.

Call Nancy!

[deadparrot]

72. Maybe the Minority Whip? nt

[The Witch]

74. WHOA! can someone summarize what happened?

sounds like I really missed something huge!

[deadparrot]

76. Apparently the Dems were up 210-212...

two votes flipped to R, so it was 212-210, and the speaker declared the vote closed because they were ahead, and not everyone had finished voting.

I didn't see it, but that's what I got from it.

[Skidmore]

77. The Rs in the House, minus Delay of course, pulled the

same crap with an energy bill that they did with the drug bill. The vote wasn't going their way so they held it open until they could twist arms. This bill would have allowed some federal redress for consumers for gouging by energy companies.

[converted_democrat]

79. whoops posted to the wrong thread....

[goddess40]

81. I hope this runs on the Daily Show tonight

because I missed it.

[Roland99]

82. And Countdown and NBC/ABC/CBS Nightly News and everywhere!!

[Coexist]

83. HERE!!! Contact CSpan.org and ask them to carry the replay on their site:

http://www.c-span.org/about/contact.asp?code=About

[cyn2]

85. no daily show on Fri nite.

[Kurovski]

117. Look for it on TDS on Monday, if it's not a rerun.

I can't believe they'd let this one get past them.

[goddess40]

120. I realized that when I was driving to my weekly war protest

They did show some of it on MSN today, but I still hope they run it on Monday's Daily Show.

[me b zola]

90. CNN just announced that they are going to cover it after the comercial

I missed it too :(

[deadparrot]

84. The 2 votes that switched were GOP...NO DEMS voted for it. nt

[cyn2]

86. only 1 vote changed....was 211 to 211, then flipped to

212 to 210.

[Roland99]

87. No. It was 210-212 at first.

[Coexist]

88. Yup - that;s right

and the two votes flipped within a minute of each other.

[Fleshdancer]

92. FYI - MSNBC reported that Delay was on the floor.....

trying to "convince" Republicans to switch their vote.

[Skidmore]

93. Or what?! Delay need to be booed out of town.

[Fleshdancer]

95. that's exactly what I want to know too

I can't believe the House Republicans still look to a man who is indicted on 3 charges as their leader. The only thing that has changed so far is his title.

Culture of corruption indeed.

[TechBear_Seattle]

96. Dang it all, some of us are at work

Vote on what? DETAILS, PEOPLE!

[deadparrot]

97. link...

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20051007/ap_on_go_co/katrina_energy

[TechBear_Seattle]

99. Thanks! n/t

[chalky]

102. Thanks for the link, although (as expected) that article is CRAP.

The vote, which was supposed to be taken in five minutes, lasted more than 40 minutes as GOP leaders searched for the last two votes they needed to get the bill approved. They buttonholed lawmakers for last-minute lobbying as Democrats complained loudly that the vote should be closed. Finally two GOP lawmakers switched from "no" to "yes," giving the bill's supporters the margin of victory.

BULLSHIT. The repubes LOST THE DAMN VOTE.

THEN held it open so they could twist arms.

THEN slammed it shut so those votes wouldn't change.

BASTARDS.

[Hillgiant]

107. A straight up or up vote.

The way the founders intended :sarcasm:

[mestup]

101. Email Aaron Brown, Anderson Cooper, Keith Olberman

Anderson Cooper: [e-mail]
Aaron Brown: [e-mail]
Keith Olberman [e-mail]

Tell them we want to see what really happened!

[IndyOp]

108. I emailed them all - thanks mestup!

[colbushwhacker_2000]

103. Disgusting and shameful

..these repukes are nothing more than brownshirted NAZIS.."Mad Dog" Steve King, my so called representative is a disgrace, and I apologize to the rest of America for this piece of dung..

[cyberpj]

104. Reuters: Delay, Barton, Hastert and Blunt circled the chamber during vote:

When over two dozen Republicans initially voted no, DeLay, Barton, House Speaker Dennis Hastert and new Majority Leader Roy Blunt circled the chamber and cajoled the holdouts.

http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/N075245.htm

[Skidmore]

105. What do they bludgeon these people with?

DO they have pictures of them in compromising positions or something? How could people have so little integrity?

[cyberpj]

113. probably promise to ruin them if they don't go along. nt.

[Blue_In_AK]

109. DeLay, et al. sound like a pack of wolves... n/t

[Califooyah Operative]

106. CNN just showed it -

shame shame shame!

[Pacifist Patriot]

111. Could this possibly go "mainstream" or is this another

brief shining moment to be swept under the rug?

[Pacifist Patriot]

112. Jon Stewart really needs to run with this next week.

[Marie26]

114. It was rigged.

Republicans rigged this vote so that the bill would be passed. They did this by changing the Parliamentary Rules of the House - Republicans passed a "special rule" that waives the normal parliamentary rules & decides how debate can be held on this bill only. Parliamentary rules for Congress specify how the bill-passing process must work - when a bill can be introduced, how long the debate is, how long members have to vote, etc. But with a majority vote of the House, the House can create a "special rule" that replaces the normal parliamentary rules for the vote on a specific bill. Normally this is done to move a bill up in the schedule.

Not this time. The Republicans passed a "special parliamentary rule" this morning that ONLY applies to the debate on this energy bill. Here's the text of the "special rule". http://www.rules.house.gov/109/specialrules/109rulehr3893.htm
This rule completely rigs the system and make it almost impossible for the bill to be voted down, and also makes it IMPOSSIBLE for any Congressman to protest this vote. It's absolutely disgusting.

- Normally, if a Congressman thinks another member is violating the rules, he can rise and make a "point of order." Then he explains to the Chair why he feels the rule has been broken, and the Chairman rules. It's like raising an objection in court. If the Congressman is unhappy, he can still appeal & the whole House then votes on whether a violation has occured.

Check this out: this new "special rule" waives all points of order against consideration of the bill. This means a Congressman CAN'T PROTEST, even if he thinks the rules are being violated, because all protest against the consideration of this bill are officially WAIVED. It doesn't matter how often a member tries to protest & make a "point of order," against consideration at this time, the House simply won't consider it.

- Next, the "special rule":
"4.Provides that the amendment in the nature of a substitute recommended by the Committee on Energy and Commerce now printed in the bill, modified by the amendment printed in part A of the Rules Committee report accompanying the resolution, shall be considered as adopted."
"5. Waives all points of order against the bill as amended."

So, the "special rule" AUTOMATICALLY includes this amendment without any debate. This is not democracy - under normal rules, legislators have to debate & vote on whether an amendment is included. Not here. Under the "special rule," the amendment is automatically "considered adopted" into the bill. Representatives also can't protest this action, because ALL points of order against this bill as amended are also BANNED. You can't protest anything during the time this special rule is in force.

- Finally, the "special rule" has two new and innvotive rules for how long members have to vote. Normally, legislators have about 5 minutes to enter their vote. Not here.

"6. Makes in order the amendment printed in part B of the Rules Committee report accompanying the resolution, if offered by Representative Stupak of Michigan or his designee, which shall be considered as read, and which shall be debatable for 40 minutes equally divided and controlled by the proponent and an opponent.
7. Waives all points of order against the amendment printed in part B of the report. "

This part means that if Rep. Stupak (and only Rep. Stupak) offers up a seperate amendment (Amendment B) - the Congress will have an extra 40 minutes to debate this amendment. And of course, all protests against this action are also waived.

The Republicans knew this would be a close vote - this was their ace in the hole. If the vote is tied, or it's voted down, Rep. Stupak can then introduce his Super-Duper Amendment B, and this automatically extends the time for debate another 40 minutes. This gives the Republicans more time to twist arms, make threats, etc. to get those votes changed. Which they did. This is probably what the Democrats were shouting "shame" about. They couldn't make a "point of order" to protest the extra voting time (that's waived), they couldn't appeal to the Chair, they couldn't do anything. They were shouting "shame" in a gesture of absolute helplessness and anger.

So, Congress passed a rule that automatically adopts amendments without debate, extends the time for voting by 40 minutes, and prevents any Congressman from actually protesting these illegal actions. By "waiving" points of order, it means the Rep. doesn't even get to raise the issue or point out the unfairness on the floor. Wouldn't want those voters watching C-Span to hear what they're doing.

Now I get why Pelosi was saying Congress has a "culture of corruption" and was acting like a "banana republic." It's both. This is an action you might expect in a Third World country verging on civil war, not the United States of America. This is not a democracy. I'm just horrified. And the worst part is that they've probably been doing it all along, they're just getting more brazen and reckless as time goes by.

[i miss america]

118. From the main page of rawstory.com

Bedlam erupts in Congress over oil refinery vote; 'Shame, shame'

A controversial bill that offered abandoned U.S. military bases to private industry for the construction of oil refineries and granted federal insurance to refiners ensnared in litigation passed by a razor-thin margin in the House Friday afternoon 212-210 as Democrats chanted "shame, shame, shame."

The vote, which was supposed to take five minutes, lasted 45. About a dozen Republicans reversed their votes as the Republican leadership circled the chamber pressuring members of their party to ensure the bill's passage.

When over two dozen Republicans initially voted no, DeLay, Barton, House Speaker Dennis Hastert and new Majority Leader Roy Blunt circled the chamber to cajole holdouts.

Eventually, enough Republicans switched to pass the bill.