it's not about left/right . . . it's about up/down . . .

[OneBlueSky]

I posted this as a response elsewhere and was asked to give it its' own thread . . .

the whole left/right dichotomy is a contrivance by the corporate oligarchy to keep Americans at each others' throats over comparatively marginal issues . . . left/right is the horizontal axis, and that's where they have us playing the game . . .

by focusing on left/right, we neglect the place where the REAL issues reside: the vertical axis, the up/down . . . (another way of looking at the up/down axis is up as "privileged" and down as "forgotten") . . . the REAL issues are the ones that actually determine the nature of our democracy: poverty, the economy, unconscionable deficits, corruption in government, the environment, energy, health care, war and peace, education, etc. . .

the REAL issues involve "us versus them," i.e. the people (that's us) against the VERY small ruling minority (that's them) . . . and in virtually every case, what the "Ups" want is completely contrary to the best interests of the "Downs", i.e. the American people . . . as well as the United States as a nation and the planet Earth . . .

as long as they can keep us tied to the horizontal axis -- left and right duking it out -- we won't have the time or energy to be stepping on what they see as their prerogatives . . . and just to reinforce things, they throw out terms like "class warfare" to convince us that actually looking at the REAL (up/down) issues is somehow communist or something . . . but that's EXACTLY what we need to do if we are EVER to make any progress and actually start making changes and solving problems . . .

EVERY American -- right, left, center, apolitical -- is on the SAME SIDE in the up/down battle! . . . (excepting, of course, those very few at the very top) . . .

and what scares the shit out of the Ups is that the Downs will someday realize this and act in concert to change the system to work FOR us . . . instead of allowing them to steal us blind while we waste our time in life-or-death battles over gay marriage, abortion, prayer in schools, and pornography . . . all important, to be sure, but not the issues that define the real battle . . .

[loudsue]

1. Wow...you hit that nail on the head!

I'm glad someone recommended you give it its own post. This is something we can discuss with our wingnut friends, that may even make sense to them!

:kick:

[robertpaulsen]

2. I do believe your subject line is a Dylan quote.

And I agree completely with your post. :)

[GreenArrow]

8. once upon a time

Once upon a time you dressed so fine
You threw the bums a dime in your prime, didn't you?
People'd call, say, "Beware doll, you're bound to fall"
You thought they were all kiddin' you
You used to laugh about
Everybody that was hangin' out
Now you don't talk so loud
Now you don't seem so proud
About having to be scrounging for your next meal.

How does it feel
How does it feel
To be without a home
Like a complete unknown
Like a rolling stone?

You've gone to the finest school all right, Miss Lonely
But you know you only used to get juiced in it
And nobody has ever taught you how to live on the street
And now you find out you're gonna have to get used to it
You said you'd never compromise
With the mystery tramp, but now you realize
He's not selling any alibis
As you stare into the vacuum of his eyes
And ask him do you want to make a deal?

How does it feel
How does it feel
To be on your own
With no direction home
Like a complete unknown
Like a rolling stone?

You never turned around to see the frowns on the jugglers and the clowns
When they all come down and did tricks for you
You never understood that it ain't no good
You shouldn't let other people get your kicks for you
You used to ride on the chrome horse with your diplomat
Who carried on his shoulder a Siamese cat
Ain't it hard when you discover that
He really wasn't where it's at
After he took from you everything he could steal.

How does it feel
How does it feel
To be on your own
With no direction home
Like a complete unknown
Like a rolling stone?

Princess on the steeple and all the pretty people
They're drinkin', thinkin' that they got it made
Exchanging all kinds of precious gifts and things
But you'd better lift your diamond ring, you'd better pawn it babe
You used to be so amused
At Napoleon in rags and the language that he used
Go to him now, he calls you, you can't refuse
When you got nothing, you got nothing to lose
You're invisible now, you got no secrets to conceal.

How does it feel
How does it feel
To be on your own
With no direction home
Like a complete unknown
Like a rolling stone?

[GreenArrow]

3. man, you really hit it

But I'm not sure that the masses are ready to get it yet.

[Deja Q]

5. Ready? Or able?

[GreenArrow]

7. you can take your pick on those choices

I'm not sure that in practical terms, there's much difference.

[TallahasseeGrannie]

4. I have always thought

that the stuff that divides us from the Freeps is just the surface stuff, the window dressing. We are more alike than either side cares to admit.

Abortion, gay issues, the Pledge... things that shouldn't even be on the table.

[WHAT]

14. and both sides cross the line on these issues...

Democrats: anti-choice, Republicans: pro civil unions. I wish people would take the opportunity to discuss more deeply their experiences and world perspective that brings them to one side of an issue or another. I don't think people would be at each other's throats if they understood their opponents position more fully. Otherwise it's like juvenile and manufactured discord. Issues could be debated regardless of political persuasion without taking the fun out of arguing.

Thanks for this anti tug-of-war post,OBS. There are more important things to do than drag each other over imaginary lines.

solutions while savoring differences?...

[bloom]

6. It's why Hugo Chavez is such a threat

- why the UPs in our country want him assassinated.

[TransitJohn]

10. Exactly

If I had some real money, I would pay for a speaking engagement for him at the University of Wyoming in my hometown of Laramie....talk about eye openning. Alas, I bet if I did try to book such an event, the State Department would deny him a visa.

[The River]

9. Flatland Politics

There is no real difference when we think in terms of Left, Right or Center when it takes place on a 2 dimensional playing field. We get yanked around from one side of the political landscape to the other but the view never changes.
Real depth in policy will only happen when real democracy is allowed to occur. Right now it seems like 95% of ALL politicians are owned by corporate interests.

[GuvWurld]

11. Great post. Recommended. Also see...

Blueprint for Peaceful Revolution which talks about shifting the balance of power between government and We The People.

Also see New Political Compass which describes a circular rather than linear view of the political spectra.

[omega minimo]

12. From Secretary of the Future Kurt Vonnegut

We have only a one party government. It's the winners. And then everybody else is the losers. And the winners divided into two parties. The Republicans and the Democrats. What a charade the combat between the Republicans and the Democrats is. It's rich kids...We had to choose between two members of Skull and Bones!

Excerpt from his new book "A Man Without A Country"
http://www.wnyc.org/books/52135

http://www.vonnegut.com

[marions ghost]

13. yes!

right, left, center, apolitical = we all want this country to work better than it is...and those at the top are NOT listening, no matter how much lip service they give to it. The leaders who really care and try, are pathetically few.

You put it very well, OneBlueSky. Now how do we get past the trap of the horizontal axis and its endless debates? Maybe we ARE realizing the futility of all that. How to help others get it--take a Freeper to Lunch Day? And if we could just get that message across to the a-politicals, some of them might actually be supportive.

[BamaBecky]

15. The problem is THEY own the media and

Americans are too lazy to figure all this out. They are also dumb as dirt. In spite of this I keep trying to tell them the facts..at least to those that will listen........

Bama

:grr:

[Greyhound]

16. Absolutely correct, with 1 point for your consideration.

They (ups) are not scared shitless. They would like to delay the inevitable as long possible, but they are prepared for it this time. The plans have been laid and put into operation. When we (downs) finally realize what has been done to us and get as pissed as we rightly ought to be, they will be prepared. They have isolated themselves from our wrath both geographically and politically. The casualties from the coming conflict are likely to lots of us (of course) and those that think they are 'they' and will find that they are, in fact, us. The 'them' club is much more exclusive than they (us with money) think it is. So when 'we' are storming the gated communities and looting the Mc Mansions that are all around us, the real 'they' will be far away in some island resorts, being catered to by those that have lived under the yoke of the masters for so long they're used to it, and can't see any alternative.
As I wrote, the pieces are already in place. The military is already in operation here on our shores, in defiance of the posse comitatus act, along with their mercenary brothers ready to ensure the ruling classes will not suffer any consequences for their heinous acts. Their major assets have already been moved to safe havens. The corporations, that are the instruments of their despotism, have nearly completed preparations to move operations into China, India, and a host of other, more friendly and sophisticated countries.
We will be left with the corrupt remains of our once great nation and an unjustified feeling of betrayal.
IMO.

[AuntiBush]

17. Exactly! And, Thank you for Posting this!

OneBlueSky has it right-one!

"the whole left/right dichotomy is a contrivance by the corporate oligarchy to keep Americans at each others' throats over comparatively marginal issues... left/right is the horizontal axis, and that's where they have us playing the game..."

That's it in a nut-shell, as disgusting as it is - if you haven't figured-it out by now, you're not paying attention.

Excellent, and most significant post!

[Griffy]

18. I say this too.. its fact vs. fiction lately!! not red v blue or dem v rep

.. and I use this in trying to explain to people the scope and scale of what is happening... how propaganda is used to create image and distort facts.

as I have said.. the 1 thing they didnt count on 20-30 years ago as this group was plotting and growing was the internet... and for the 1st time in history we the people can talk directly to we the people! And we are putting the pieces together... connecting the dots... and this is in fact what has led them to go to greater and greater lengths... to the point that we now have 2 streams of information in this nation, 1 is facts as best understood by people that value the truth, and the other is a formulated message made up of 1/2 truths, inuendo and outright lies. This is made worse in that the liars have the major veiwership. You get someone to understand that, and they will be much less likely to be suckered by faux and lintball.

[hootinholler]

19. Funny you should mention that...

This site was posted on a thread here a few days ago.

-Hoot

[proud patriot]

20. Huzzah

well said :toast:

[GreenArrow]

21. kick kick

kickety kick

[Pacifist Patriot]

22. Bingo!

[Labalanza]

23. Excellent insight...

Great post—thanks! Some thoughts: Divide and conquer, aka how to exert control over large population. You divide the population into contrived political sides to contain them. Instead of cultivating values of community, elevate the notion of competition, distrust (and disengage from) thy neighbor. Cast the people into a hundred million tribes through entertainment, diversion, (mis)information overload, and a heavy dose of social conditioning. And much more…A nice dream of mine has people dropping their tired, inflexible, artificial positions in this culture, reconnecting with one another and marching in mass of millions to DC and surrounding the Capitol, the White House and the Pentagon and telling insiders, “You’re DONE. But before you go, confess to how you’ve screwed humanity and the planet---and who you work for, really…

[raccoon]

24. "I can hire half the working class to kill the other half." -Jay Gould

Great post. The more the little people are divided, the more the power elites like it.