Now it seems the leak happened B4 Novak's story, B4 Judy

[texpatriot2004]

wrote her 1st story (I think it was before her first story). So, the "we want to get back at Wilson" thing...well, maybe it was more of a bonus and not an exclusive goal here. You know, sell the WMD/Nukular fears, stop an ongoing investigation into black market trading of said weapons (so some people die, some undercover work ends abruptly, the investigation of this issue ends, the entire mission is compromised, eh oh well). I don't know whose side Judy is on but I know whose side she isn't on...ours.

I don't have a link for this. It is gathered from reading a combination of sources and also from tonight's episode of Hardball where they discussed the issue of the CIA leak (or the conversations among the officials involved) happening BEFORE (at least 2 weeks before) the 1st story was written about. There is a video link to that somewhere here at DU.

[Lex]

1. Is there a link?

Is there more info being released about when the leak probably occured?

[nadinbrzezinski]

2. listen to bernie ward NOW

kgo.com

[texpatriot2004]

4. I turned him on and heard him say they are trying to get Rove

out from under the statements the WH made that nobody in the WH was involved, including Scotty's remarks that he talked with "Libby and Rove and neither were involved."

[texpatriot2004]

3. Tonight on Hardball they talked about it. The CIA Leak is said

to have begun, or the conversations about it started at least two weeks prior to the 1st story being published about the matter.

There is a link to the Hardball video here somewhere.

[liveoaktx]

22. VIDEOS

Part 1

Part 2

[texpatriot2004]

5. Bernie talking about the Libby letter and the June meeting

Saying it's code for "it's okay to talk about July, but not June 25th meeting."

Asking why is the NYT behind on these stories since Judy works for them. My answer is they would like the story to die.

[autorank]

6. Somebody is in biig trougle. This is like "I Love Lucy" with Judi as Lucy

"Oh Ricky, guess what I did?"



"That's right, I blew up the world."

[texpatriot2004]

7. Great picture. Lucy was always getting in over her head. n/t

[Captain Hilts]

37. DON'T insult Lucy Ricardo!! nt

[autorank]

39. God! I'm soooo sorry. I Love Lucy. You're just in a bad mood

because...aw, I won't go there.

[texpatriot2004]

8. Bernie just asked if she was a member of PNAC or if she worked

for the administration to push the stories they wanted in order to sell the war.

[texpatriot2004]

9. Bernie reading an Email that says Judy tied to NEOCONS

Daniel Pipes (mentions a connection to PNAC) has connection to Judy. Judy uses Chalabi when everyone else (outside the admin) says he has no credibility; but Miller uses Chalabi anyway and then WH uses what Miller writes to go to war w/Iraq.

[Oilwellian]

10. It's the crux of the conspiracy

They've always used Wilson's Op-Ed as their excuse for revenge. Judy's meeting with Libby in June proves it wasn't the Op-Ed and conspiracy comes into the picture.

They've always had us focused on this being about Wilson, not his wife. She was just a casualty of their revenge. I have a sneaking suspicion she was one of the CIA analysts giving Cheney and company fits for not agreeing to their sexed up intelligence on Iraq. She was a specialist on WMDS and Iraq was one of her playing fields.

It was the Office of Special Plans responsible for peddling the forged document and there's a direct connection between Rove and OSP member Steven Hadley. There may be more to that email than meets the eye. :evilgrin:

[Old and In the Way]

12. Thinking the same exact thing at 3:00AM.

:-)

Time to call it a day, I mean night, I mean morning....

[nadinbrzezinski]

13. you don't mean to say Yellow Cake, and State of the Union

perish the thought!

:evilgrin:

[texpatriot2004]

16. Oh, is that why they removed it after the speech? TeeHeeHee

Of course you didn't mean to use those two things at the same time.

[Neil Lisst]

17. Maybe Bush will get to have his cake and "eat it" too

If Rove and Libby fall, can Bush's eating it be far behind?

The far right doesn't trust Bush to appoint Supremes any more. They have 3.4 more years to cash in, and I'm sure they'd rather deal with Cheney.

You can practically hear the prayers of Pat Robertson ....

"Lord, when I asked you take one of the justices, maybe I wasn't clear enough. Do I need to tell you which one was the J-E-W ACLU lawyer?!!"

-----------------------
today I shout out to DU mods and posters
http://www.webcomicsnation.com/neillisst/

[rodeodance]

18. but wasn't this office dismantle and --now the "Irag Group"--or something

like that?

.....Office of Special Plans

[hang a left]

41. OSP was in the Pentagon

WHIG was in the WH.

[Old and In the Way]

11. It appears that the "get Joe" political revenge meme is inoperative.

It was hatched before his "What I Didn't Find in Nigeria" Op/Ed. I suppose it could have been pre-emptively leaked to Judy and the neocon gang...but I still have questions.

Who did the forgeries? Why would Italian intel have motivation to develop these forgeries in the 1st place?

Why send an outsider with integrity to investigate the evidence? Does that sound like this administration’s MO? No one from the Office of Special Plans or AIPAC available? Seems like a real risk to send someone like Wilson to wreck the centerpiece on the Iraq WMD justification…especially if you knew the docs were forgeries to begin with.

I think this was always about Valerie Plame....the "political revenge" was the cover they thought they could use to get her out of the WMD loop. I suspect Ms. Plame has some damaging shit on Cheney and Rumsfield from their Halliburton/ABB days in the 90s.

[texpatriot2004]

15. Wise Old and In the Way is what you should be called. That

Cheeney is one filthy fellow...wonder why he wouldn't want nice respectable law abiding folks investigating the WMD/Nukular black market? Why would he want to throw a monkey wrench in the whole damn thing?

But, alas, it's late and you are on your way to dream land. Sweet dreams of indictments to you.

[Garbo 2004]

26. CIA sent Wilson. What's not emphasized enough IMO, is that he was the 3rd

person to independently check out the Niger story and say it wasn't credible. The US Ambassador to Niger sent reports back saying the story was not credible. A US General also said the same thing after he looked into it. Then CIA, not Cheney, sent Wilson.

Wilson was a source for media reports in Spring 2003 casting doubt on the Niger story. Wilson was told by his sources that White House folks in March 2003 decided to do a "work up" on him. So according to what he had been told, info was being gathered on him and his trip well before he went public in the NYT. http://rawstory.com/news/2005/Interview_Ambassador_Wilson_husband_of_outed_CIA_agent_sees_larger_Administration_ro_0713.html

Also in June 2003, State Dept INR staff wrote a classified document summarizing why the Niger info wasn't credible. It briefly mentioned Wilson's wife. Reportedly Fitz was extremely interested in that memo's presence on Air Force 1 in July 2003 after Wilson went public. But there were some interesting players at State at the time (Bolton, David Wurmser, as I recall) who may have had or gained access to that info prior to that time? Especially if WH staff were already investigating Wilson by June 2003. http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/07/20/AR2005072002517.html

[VolcanoJen]

14. I find this to be the best narrative, for those who want to catch up....

It's from Arianna's site, Huffington Post. Mark Kleiman's round-up, which includes the most important in-depth links to firedoglake and Next Hurrah.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/mark-kleiman/patrick-fitzgeralds-mous_b_8569.html

[texpatriot2004]

19. Yes, that is a good one. nt

[malaise]

23. Stay away from the fan

The $hit is about to fly. This is about lies told to the world to invade Iraq. Blair must be shaking too because David Kelly's death was no suicide.

[halobeam]

28. Do you think Fitzgerald is onto the Kelly aspect of this?

I would think if we are all aware of how this all relates, Fitz is on it like flies on honey. I just hope he would have enough evidence to nail this part down. There are the crooks, and then there are the victims. Kelly paid the ultimate price.

[malaise]

29. I sure hope so n/t

[flyarm]

32. i sure hope to hell fit is onto kelly and dr. kelly's last conversation

was with judith miller via email before being murdered!!
Hutton was in blairs pocket..but fitz is not...go for this angle fitz...judy also said just prior to going to jail that inessance she was frightened by this government.,.that had to key fitz in big time..

fly

[texpatriot2004]

35. Yes. I think you're right. n/t

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

20. Wilson had already been an anonymous source...

...for several articles before he wrote his op-ed. The White House would have known he was doing this, as nobody else would have had the information. I think it's pretty likely that they knew trouble was coming down the line for them WRT Wilson.

My personal feeling is that he wrote the op-ed to preempt the character assasination that would have happened to him anyway (thus, his op-ed would not be seen as "retaliation" for the WH smear.

Just my $0.02

[texpatriot2004]

21. I think you are correct on both counts. n/t

[H2O Man]

24. After he had told CNN

on March 8 (the day after the IAEA announced the yellox cake documents were forgeries) that the White House had more information, they began plotting against him. Fitzgerald has evidence of the group going back to March.

After that, Wilson was not only an anonymous media source, he spoke openly to senators and congressmen, and to people at the State Department. The Cheney administration was very aware of this.

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

30. It'll be interesting to see how all of this pans out.

Not that it ought to matter from Fitzgerald's point of view. What they did was illegal, regardless of the reasons for what they did.

[KoKo]

36. Oddly, we hear little about Kristoff until the past few days...

:shrug: Everything's always focused on Novak. Don't even remember Kristoff being involved in testifying to GJ or any questioning of him. Perhaps because Wilson was his source.

[writes2000]

33. Thanks, H2O. I believe Wilson was the true target.

They wanted to squelch him. And they started plotting months before Wilson's preemptive NYT piece.

Unfortunately for them, they were so arrogant and so eager, they never thought twice about spilling state secrets.

And I believe they wanted to smack the CIA as well.

[H2O Man]

38. It could be.

There were several people within the core group that devised the plan to marginalize Wilson. It may be that the majority of them were only trying to nail Wilson. It may be that all were. But, one should not close the door on the possibility that one or more had reason to try to derail an investigation Plame was overseeing, perhaps especially if she was connected to the investigation into who produced the yellow cake forgeries.

[alcibiades_mystery]

25. Misreading

The leak of Plame's name and CIA status may have happened before the Wilson op-ed and the Novak piece, but that doesn't mean it wasn't aimed at Wilson. Wilson was known as the source for the Kristoff piece much earlier, and he was being "worked up" by the WHIG as early as March 2003. The war, of course, started in March 2003.

[HereSince1628]

27. Exactly,

Wilson's contact with the WH following the 16 words in the SOTU speech started things in motion. And Wilson was apparently not hiding his discontent. He apparently was an unidentified source saying the WMD yellowcake claim was false in a story in the Times months before he came out with the editorial in July.

Considering the personalities involved the WH that could have been wanting to get even with Wilson as far back as the morning after SOTUS.

[Mr_Spock]

34. Ya see, that's the way I see it as well...

We are naive if we think that Wilson's story just "appeared" when it did without him giving any signals - in fact I thought he was quite up-front with his disgust...

[autorank]

40. And you know someone in the NYT got "them" the story pre pub.

;) They're so helpfl there on Times Square. You know, I lived in NYC for 10 years (70's-80's) and the association between the activities in Times Square and the paper never struck me as illustrative...boy did I miss the obvoius point. MediaWhoresOnthestreets.

[salin]

31. yes and no - it was, I believe, after a NYT Kristoff article

which referred to Wilson's story without naming Wilson (but easy enough for bushco to figure out). It was before Wilson's NYT item (that he wrote), but I believe after the Kristoff article about Wilson's mission and findings.