Raw Story Scoops the Wash Post -Cheney Story 10/12-Raw Beats 10/18-Post

[autorank]

Damn, Raw Story beat out the Washington Post on the Cheney – Fitzgerald story. Look what Raw had on 10/12/09:



Vice President's role in outing of CIA agent under examination, sources close to prosecutor say

Cheney's role in CIA outing not known

Jason Leopold
October 12, 2005

Special prosecutor Patrick Fitzgerald is trying to determine whether Vice President Dick Cheney had a role in the outing of covert CIA operative Valerie Plame-Wilson, individuals close to Fitzgerald say. Plame’s husband was a vocal critic of prewar intelligence used by President George W. Bush to build support for the Iraq war.

http://rawstory.com/news/2005/Cheneys_role_in_outing_of_CIA_1012.html

Now, here’s my favorite kitty box liner.



Sources Cite Role Of Feud With CIA

By Jim VandeHei and Walter Pincus
Washington Post Staff Writers
Tuesday, October 18, 2005; Page A01

As the investigation into the leak of a CIA agent's name hurtles to an apparent conclusion, special prosecutor Patrick J. Fitzgerald has zeroed in on the role of Vice President Cheney's office, according to lawyers familiar with the case and government officials. The prosecutor has assembled evidence that suggests Cheney's long-standing tensions with the CIA contributed to the unmasking of operative Valerie Plame.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/10/17/AR2005101701888.html




WAY TO GO RawStory!!!. :spank: those PentaPost reporters!

[medeak]

1. Raw Story was quoted on Hardball yesterday

Yay for you guys!

[FreedomAngel82]

38. Really?

Congrats to them! Wow, that's pretty big!

[skids]

54. Lou Dobbs cited them on air a few weeks ago as well.

...not a quote, but mentioned as the primary source for a fact.

I think the best thing rawstory could do to gain a larger audience is to just keep going through the peak of the post-indictment news and then rifle back through the archives and publish a self-report-card story, which considered every story they had published on the matter, the predictions it made, when it made them, and how accurate they were.

If they can demonstrate they were consistently reporting facts early and precisely, they can cash in on a rush of new readers abandoning the MSM.

[leveymg]

2. Beautifully laid-out post! Good point, too.

How did you imbed the RawStory and Post logos?

[autorank]

25. Thanks for your kind words. Embedding....

You right click on the image, then mark and copy properties, then
drop it where you want it.

Here's a link

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=203&topic_id=397329&mesg_id=397329

When you get there, click on the link right below this statement (2/3rds down the page):

"If you want to know how post "News Banners" or other images, go here:"

:hi:

[symbolman]

3. EXACTLY HOW MANY RAWSTORY THREADS

on ONE subject are going to be allowed here..

Because to be honest if this shit keeps up, I'm LEAVING..

I'm tired of sorting through ENDLESS threads that all link back to RS..

This is ridiculous.

[lala_rawraw]

4. So what you are saying that just because RS is

Reporting a lot of good stories, those stories should be limited to a particular number so that DU members can hope and await an article on written by someone else on the same topic?

In other words, kill Raw story piece and run Bloomberg and Wapo pieces? Nice theory you have there.

[symbolman]

7. No

That's what YOU are saying. And I think that it's a deflection regarding how RawStory actually conducts the HYPE they "create" to get folks to run to that site where they are clobbered with ads - which makes them money. Each and every CLICK.

If Bloomberg and Wapo ALREADY write the story then it's NOT a RawStory "scoop", and I have seen this happen many times. Too many in my opinion, and others are saying the same things, more all the time as far as I can tell.

And those people are People *I* have nothing but respect for because they have TONS of integrity and have been here a LONG time, like I have.

Would you deny that you (assuming that you are part of RawStory) or others in the RS organization post stories which link ONLY to RawStory that have already been posted as links to the same story written by a major news outlet HERE?

And please remember that Takebackthemedia.com WANTS and ASSISTS alternative news SOURCES and has for 4 years now.

But also please consider that some people have said that RawStory wants to be a Liberal Drudge, is that true?

If it is I feel sorry for someone wanting to imitate a CREEP like Drudge. You can't demand integrity if YOU don't supply it yourself (and I'm not saying YOU personally.. just in general, say for any progressive..)..

I don't know if I can keep posting or stay involved as long as this keeps going on - I personally don't like it, and don't want to get tombstoned for being too rash when I'm so exhausted from working on my film and promoting it.

I may be taking a sabbatical for my own sanity, but checking my PMs so I can relate to my many pals here.

There's your answer, not an attack, just an observation.

I DO enjoy it when you get SCOOPS, and I have see it happen, so keep that up if you will.

[autorank]

26. This is a pointed comment on the PentaPost, my home town rag.

I'm sick of them missing stories, under reporting, not reporting. If Raw Story can come up with this on the 12th, why does it take them until today to do it? Because they won't cover anything negative about Bush too much or even at all.

Stick around, just don't click on links where this shows up. I don't even notice them.

[Roland99]

45. Keep up the great work, lala_rawraw!

[specimenfred1984]

57. I Second That!

People will complain about absolutely anything! And here's another interesting point, I believe Raw Story more than I believe what I read in the WP.

The WP, the NYT and other big papers have embedded propagandists, that's obvious.

[lala_rawraw]

6. Also, does this mean our big story later today should not be posted

Because you might run away?

[symbolman]

9. Yes.

I might "run away" - I assume you're calling me a coward?

How about you take a look at my site and then come back and let me know what you think? I've done a LOT of good work and activism.

Let me know.

[lala_rawraw]

23. okay there little doggie, you are

the one who said you would leave, not I... was simply indicating that your comments are in bad taste... that said, I don't know your site, but given your comments, I am not sure if I want to.

thanks anyway

[symbolman]

32. But that would be like

InDepth and Investigative Reporting, getting all the facts, you never know TBTM might even have a scoop for YOU, like I said we like to help smaller sites like yours, give them a leg up.. I KNOW you have some curiousity or you wouldn't be in the business.. how do you NOT know that WE don't have the REAL DEAL..

Something coming down the pike that we aren't interested in but that YOU could use.

It sounds like you don't like me and I can deal with that, not everyone gets along, and I don't even mind most attacks, some are really funny -

But how about answering my question I put forth above when I queried about RawStory if some (and not all, like I said I HAVE see RS get Scoops - I even know where they came from, I have friends too, lots of contacts) SOME RawStory links are actually stories that have already appeared in an MSM article, perhaps even having already been posted (darn that luck!) in the Discussion area and have dropped off the page? That could be forgiveable as it happens all the time when there is a flurry of posts..

Just answer that if you would please?

What kind of doggie? A cute one? Some women think I'm cute.. watch my appearance on Joe Scarborough and tell me that isn't an AFGHAN Hound - they THERE'S a SCOOP! "SYMBOLMAN RESEMBLES AFGHAN HOUND AND BARKS A LOT BUT NEVER BITES!"

I LIKE IT! AS Spinal Tap would say to their editor, "Let's run with it... like a small boy across an Open Field.."

Feel free to use that one, keep the money.

thanks for your response, I hope we can Meet in person some day, I'd REALLY LIKE TO MEET YOU..

I'm intrigued by the La La stuff - is that Cheerleader stuff, are you French? SO much to know so little time.. and it's all SO IMPORTANT to SOMEONE, eh?

THanks.

[symbolman]

35. How about answering my question then..

instead of saying "was simply indicating that your comments are in bad taste..." ..

How is it in bad taste? Is it because I don't agree with the WAY RawStory is doing what I would call "repackaging" other news and then Hyping the their "package"?

Please just enlighten me and answer my original question, I'd really appreciate it, you might just allay my fears that other pressing posts aren't being squeezed out, and then we could be come the best of friends, since we're fighting the good fight..

I know, YOU could interview ME, after a year of research I'd be an interesting interview and all based on investigated and Factual material. No dribs and drabs, get the whole story out for all the people in the know, like I'm trying to do after all my work..

And if YOU are investigating me, and think I'm a little "doggie" here's your opportunity to get THAT SCOOP, and expose ME to the world!

How much better could it get? Give me some hard questions too, so if I waffle I look completely idiotic.. but don't forget that the first time I was on the MSNBC Joe Scarborough he threatened to turn off my microphone for not pushing or falling for his spin..

I like doing that.. and if I show bad taste then you can SLAM me in public, if that's the case than I need to be EXPOSED for the Charletan I am (or you may think I am)..

Let's ROLL La La.. :) I'm all yours.

[LoZoccolo]

40. I would say it takes courage to call symbolman "little doggie"...

...but really it's just naive hubris and a lack of knowing what you're doing and who you're speaking to. As in, someone who does a lot more than just link to other people's stories. Like Drudge.

[sniffa]

42. reaLLy?

i think it takes reaL courage to threaten DUicide.

[Name removed]

8. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[symbolman]

10. Oh that's a good one that is.

How about taking a little run around Takebackthemedia.com and then tell me I'm Matt Drudge.

Matt Drudge DID link me once tho, when I was one of 14 finalists out of 1500 entries in the Bush in 30 Seconds contest by MoveOn..

The evening of the event I was on the Joe Scarborough show with my entry ARMY OF ONE..

Would you like to see me on the Joe Scarborough show, I can provide the link? I was on there twice, and also on the O'Reilly show.

Is that cool with you?

[Name removed]

11. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[symbolman]

12. Yeah, that's good.

Maybe I will take a sabbatical.. I'll be sure and let folks know why, and see what shakes out of it.

Because if this is the kind of bullshit that everyone is into, then I am wasting my time and energy here.

Keep the prozac, just hilarious by the way, ex Vietnam Veterans with Arthritis of the spine just love drug humor like that...

[ninkasi]

28. Not trying to distract from the subject...

Symbolman, I know how much pain you must be in, having arthritis of the spine. It's a daily struggle to find the will to get through the day, and people who don't suffer from chronic pain don't understand how carefully you must expend your energy. Sometimes, you have to devote almost all of your time to keep from going insane with the pain.

I hope you find something to ease it. I have osteoporosis, and arthritis, among several other problems, and the world we occupy, the world of chronic pain, is something I wouldn't wish on anybody.

[symbolman]

36. I'm sorry to hear that.. as a "Pain Person" I know whereof you speak

I wouldn't want to wish what we are going through on anyone, even my worst enemy - I literally have to crawl on my hands and knees in the morning to get to the living room sometimes after my wife Peels me out of bed..

My 9 month old thinks it's hilarious :)

I wish there was an "empathy helmet" that a doctor could put on and FEEL the pain of the person they are treating - bet they would change their recovery plan in a heart beat..

Being curled up like a dead spider in abject agony first thing in the morning is not a lot of fun - but being a fun loving guy, I get around it pretty quick and life is sweeter for it in a wierd way..

YOu appreciate and find out WHO really cares about you too..

Thanks for mentioning that, for your sympathy, and you have my FULL ON Sympathy straight from the heart :)

Hope you can get better, is it in the stars? Good doctor? Most Important, and a support group as well..

thanks!

[CatWoman]

14. can I step in here and defend my friend

you people need to back the fuck off.

Symbolman has been a member of this community for as long as I can remember, and has always contributed to the cause. He has provided us with much needed video updates, encouragement, hard news, you name it.

Why the fuck don't you try READING his post above? You know the one that outlines his concerns?

[Lex]

18. What Catwoman says.

Symbolman deserves respect--and what he says deserves thoughtful consideration.

[symbolman]

21. Here here now Catwoman, that kind of language

and in front of the kitties :)

Have I told you I love you today? HUGS! Tell them youngsters what some of us "old" folks can do :)

[CatWoman]

22. *snarf*

:hi:

btw - I owe you an email :D

[KittyWampus]

29. Your friend symbolman needs to stop acting like a jealous 5 year old

Life isn't a zero-sum game and there's room for Rawstory AND symbolman.

Have you read Brock's work on how the rightwing noise machine works?

Disclaimer: I've no affiliation or great love of Rawstory.

Symbolman is the one who came into this thread whining about Rawstory and threatening, like a 5 year old, to take his marbles and go home. If he doesn't want to sound like an infant who feels slighted for attention, then he should have calmly just posted his concerns. And not only could symbolman have found a way to express his concerns without appearing to be childish, he could just use the ignore feature.

[CatWoman]

34. sorry -- don't have time to respond

another Rawstory thread just started!!

Goody!!!!!!!

meet ya over there!!!!!!

[symbolman]

37. Which ONE?

I'm still wading through them..

[Catherine Vincent]

17. I'd like to see it.

[symbolman]

19. Here it is, I just cut and pasted from an older email I sent

"Takebackthemedia.com received 100 million hits in it's first year, and we were one of 14 Finalists out of over 1600 entries in MoveOn.org's "Bush in 30 Seconds" contest not long ago.

Our entry - ARMY OF ONE (a non partisan look at Bush's treatment of the troops and veterans) was not the winner but was shown the very next night nationwide when I was interviewed on the Joe Scarborough show on MSNBC. (My second time on his show - I have been on the O'Reilly show, and Lou Dobbs on CNN as well)

Mr Scarborough loved our ad supporting the troops and was very cordial. The very same ad was shown 3000 times on cable television in New Hampshire during the primaries as well.

You can view my interview (which includes our MoveOn entry) at this URL: http://66.230.230.110/radio/sym-1-13.rm

(It's a Realmedia file and will play even if it appears to give an error as RealMedia is a wonky program - keep clicking) "

glad to be of service, when I say something I Mean It :)

[Catherine Vincent]

20. Thanks Symbolman!

:thumbsup:

[Catherine Vincent]

30. I just watched it.

Now I remember when you were one of the finalist. But I don't think I had ever seen your video. Thanks for providing the link. Oh and btw, love the hair....it's groovy.;-)

[symbolman]

39. LOL

thanks.. what's really funny is the one before that with Scarborough where he said something about, "that Hat".. and I didn't get enough time to respond (as all three/four were talking) and say..

"MY HAT? IS THAT ALL YOU GOT? MY HAT is an ISSUE?"

That's a fun one too, he was accussing all these Anti War protesters of being dope smoking commies, and I was coming back with, "There were NUNS there Joe, Older women, mothers with Stroller and babies in them, Are YOU calling all these people DOPE SMOKERS?" I was on as someone who had been drafted in 1971, and didn't appreciate being called an Anti- American Commie, etc by Limbaugh, which I took issue with - I even asked for Limbaugh to Produce HIS enlistment papers to all of America, we wanted to see them..

He sort of let that one slide..

Groovy hair huh? That's my Rock Star look, I like to look like that (and so does my groupie, er Wife :), feels good - and some day when Bush is toast I can drop all this crap and go make my CD (got 50 or 60 songs I've written) after having been in a lot of bands as well.

THanks catgirl, I like your positive attitude, we're gonna need people like YOU when the HUMANS take Over :)

[lala_rawraw]

24. No need, I would have been more than

Happy to look at your site without any convincing. Your comments are a whole other story.

[mzmolly]

53. Ok, I want to see it!

I missed you on Scarryborough Symbolman.

:hi:

[Guy Whitey Corngood]

5. kick!

[robcon]

13. Raw Story reports 10 out of every two real stories.

They can't be believed or trusted. They are the Drudge of the left.

[Kenroy]

15. Correct

the site is pure bullshit,and I'm surprised the admins here allow it to be used as a legitimate news source.

[Marr]

16. "10 out of every 2 real stories"- LOL

A perfect description.

[autorank]

27. Look at the post, it's a slam on the Washington Post.

You like them? I don't. They make me sick. They screwed Clinton for months on the stupid sex story and on "White Water" before that. I never miss a chance to point out how inadequate they are.

[Catherine Vincent]

31. So did the NYTimes.

I don't understand why repuke callers on cspan constantly harp on the NYTimes and the Washington Post being liberals papers.

:hi:

[autorank]

33. Great avatar -- Pat Fitzgerald

:hi: to you too!

Right NYT, liberal: hmmm...lets see, support war of aggression, make up stories to get the war going...are they channeling William Randolph Hearst ("You get me the pictures, I'll get you the war.")

[sniffa]

41. if rawstory is aLLowed to be here

i'm gonna Leave, i swear! don't make me foLLow through with more threats and whining.

[symbolman]

43. No

you just stay put, seems like your natural element, had a look at your personal profile and it is something that should be shared with everyone - almost poetic the way it captures your inner "sniffaness"

Very inspirational, changed my life, for the better..

thanks :)

[sniffa]

44. oooooh, that's it

i'm so gonna Leave, i swear!

[RandomKoolzip]

46. This thread is hilarious....

And a bit sad, since there's nothing the right loves more than to see the left fighting each other instead of them.

[sniffa]

47. i Like the foLLow up thread even better

[autorank]

48. You speak the truth. Circulalr firing squad. The right seems to do

it less.

What I wonder is this: if you think a thread is inappropriate, useless, over-kill, why spend lots of time there or even spend a little time.

:shrug:

I don't like the Post. I do like Raw Story a great deal. Raw Story beat the Post by days on this. One for our side.

[RandomKoolzip]

49. It's a win for our side, exactly....why can't we even celebrate it

without needless sniping and bitterness?

[autorank]

59. Well let's party...hardy

:party::evilgrin::party::evilgrin::party::evilgrin:

CELEBRATE GOOD TIMES, OH YEAH!!!!!!

:party::evilgrin::party::evilgrin::party::evilgrin:

[AuntiBush]

50. You Tell 'Um, AutoRank!

[autorank]

52. Washington Post, "get thee to a punnery!" And don't come out!

:hi:

[Pryderi]

51. I'm going to send them $$$. They're having a fund drive.

[understandinglife]

55. Hope everyone at DU gives Raw Story as much support as possible.

Peace.

[Nothing Without Hope]

56. Bravo and thanks to Raw Story and to our LaLa_RawRaw!!!!!

I should make that a STANDING "bravo and thanks" because they keep breaking through to new heights over and over. THEY ARE MAKING A DIFFERENCE. They broke the Downing Street Minutes and so many more stories. They have led the way. And they do it with hard, grinding work and very little reward except for recognition from a growing audience of appreciative enthusiasts like us. THIS is journalism as most in the corporate media have forgotten how it should be done. THIS is journalism of the kind that can help save democracy in this country.

Enthusiastically recommended!!!

:applause: :woohoo: :hi: :toast: :applause:

[symbolman]

58. Excuse me.

JOhn CONYERS Broke the Downing Street Minutes, I know him and was following that story a LOOONG time ago. As a matter of fact I flew from Hawaii to DC overnight to FILM the Hearings because the MSM had said they weren't going to even bother to cover it - then they decided that CSPAN 3 might be there..

THAT Story was TOO important and due to my research I knew that the Plame Outing and DSM were connected at the hip so I made sure that it was filmed by someone OTHER than the MSM.

As I explained to Conyers in the Capitol building, "I am here to represent the blogosphere, and those other cameras that have just shown up are here to create sound bites to stab you in the back on TV.."

Conyers had his aid personally escort me to the Hearing room where I fought elbow to elbow with CNN, CSPAN, everyone but FOX had decided to show up - I was taking no chances that this event might have been missed. I filmed in HiDefinition for posterity's sake as well.

Later I edited and offered the film of the ENTIRE hearing (and this is what alternative media has to do, show it ALL and then let individuals make up their minds once they have all the facts) at my site for donations to make up for the cost of the flight, cabs, room, etc..

Hundreds of DUrs who wanted the TRUTH donated to send me there and to get a complete film of the event, so I did just that - I made no money from it, and all of my labor, editing, duplicating, shipping were done by me and for the Cause. This is how I fight the Media, by showing the unvarnished truth, not by making mysterious claims from mysterious sources (Cousin? Elevator Man? Calling the paperboy before he delivers the news paper? RS likes to create the impression that they have all these connections, so do we, but we don't act like we have a bunch of "deep throats" for hype).. and people are very glad to get way more than the 'sound bites' the MSM was going to hand out..

Making a big deal out of a few phone calls, and it ain't that hard to call people, which are hyped into "SOURCES SAY" (I mean that is really hilarious, sooo mysterious and important sounding) then posting "teasers" and then to have to click on this thread and find out that it's a subject that's been known for weeks (months in H2OMan's case) and is either already a LINK at an MSM site - or even better, the fact that you are "VINDICATED" by the SAME MEDIA THAT YOU CLAIM IS WORTHLESS is ridiculous..

YOU have the story? Nope, the Media does, but people have to Click throught RS to GET to the actual MEDIA LINK. Disingenuous at the least, deception at worst.

RS cannot claim to be "defeating" the MSM when RS USES the MSM STORY as PROOF that RS IS RIGHT?

Don't you see the illogic in that? If you are fighting the MSM, then WHY ARE THEY THE PROOF THAT YOU ARE RIGHT?

I thought they had no validity - but no, they are considered VALID when you need to Prove YOUR WORTH.

You might want to think about that..

Now Takebackthemedia.com heard that CNN had removed 750 words from their online reporting of Hans Blix WMD Report. We alerted the Web folks (and the DU) to that fact, and CNN was SO HAMMERED with emails that they PUT those 750 words BACK into the Blix Report..

Do you see the difference? TBTM (with the web folks help) MADE the MEDIA put out the WHOLE STORY, a Report that many Americans would now SEE on CNN and get ALL the facts, and have something to FIGHT the MEDIA/Bush co with..

That is how WE operate. We are hands on and make sure that people get the WHOLE story.. not dribs and drabs to lure people to our site to get them to click through. These web folks WORKED of their own volition and we didn't get a DIME for doing it.

And at 100 million hits in our first year alone, that doesn't make us a "little" site as La La Rah Rah suggests, not by a long shot.

We offered to help RS when they were having a Fundraiser, wrote you guys more than once. Not one answer. Then I realised that I was being tricked into going to RS when the real story was on the NYTimes or WaPost or whatever, which is what *I* wanted to read..

And THAT is what I don't like. I don't like being forced to go to a site and get bombarded with ads when it isn't their story at all.. and I might have even wanted to go to RS AFTER I went to the MSM link to see what the difference was, if there was some point that RS had picked up that needed to be pushed, on the DU or from our site and the many others I am in contact with..

But that should be MY choice, not a forced one, in my opinion I and others are being "funneled" to RS when we may not want to.

And I think in the end RS will find that Hype doesn't over come someone's right to choose NOT to go to a site to get the same story, and it will hurt their chances to make a real difference.

Agree or disagree with me, I've been in this game a long time, and I still haven't had my question answered that I ased at the very beginning of this thread - if needed I will research it and show how people have been herded to RS when the story was already posted at an MSM site.

Because I think it's not right. And it doesn't serve anyone well, especially the Left.

So call me a DOG, a Turd, a Looser, whatever childish things you want, it still will not change the fact that your business model is a poor way to go about things.. becomeing the worst part of the media is not going to change it.

And I have mentioned that RS HAS gotten some scoops as far as I could tell, and that they should do more of that.. as for the rest of it, it's not a good thing to do to people.

You'll find out, this has happened before and eventually enough people got mad, and instead of changing their tactics to suit their best characteristics the person stuck to their guns and lost.. got kicked off just about every major site.

[Garbo 2004]

60. Sunday Times of London "broke" Downing Street Minutes.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/printFriendly/0,,1-523-1593607-523,00.html

Some folks do read the Brit press. ;)

[Nothing Without Hope]

61. yes, you are correct. It came out first in the UK. I'm tallking about

the US media - Raw Story got it and pushed it early compared to other US media venues. They communicated directly with Michael Smith, the UK reporter who was working on the story, and they were an early force in getting out to the US public. My wording was faulty. Of course they didn't break the story worldwide, but in the US they played a major role in the early and active driving of the story.