Why there are so many illegal immigrants

[KingFlorez]

It's because the companies who are friends to Republicans are sometimes the ones who hire these people for cheap labor. To get around the labor rules they'll hire illegals over Americans. The solution to illegal immigration is to set strict fines and penalties for companies who hire illegals, if that happened the number illegals would go down. Illegal Immigration is another problem that comes from the Republican line of thinking.

[MercutioATC]

1. Agreed. It's almost impossible to stop in on the immigrant end.

It's make more sense to stop it with the employers.

[sepia_steel]

2. cehck out Home Depot, for example nt

[GrumpyGreg]

3. You are being way too logical----do you really think anyone

in our government has the brains to figure this out?

If you ever run for office I'll support you.

[babylonsister]

4. "Give me your tired, your poor,

your huddled masses yearning to be free."
Not a problem for me. :) Yes, a smilie to piss you off.

[sepia_steel]

11. I got no problem with it, either

- When they arrive LEGALLY.

[babylonsister]

15. I think if it was legal when my folks arrived, I wouldn't be here. nt

[sepia_steel]

23. Doesn'tmake it right to keep doing it. That was then, this is now.

Illegal immigration hurts us, period.

[cynatnite]

26. I'll never say a harsh word concerning illegal immigrants...

I'm the daughter of one and wouldn't be here either.

[Bridget Burke]

31. When my people came over....

All they needed to do was show up at Ellis Island. No TB? No feeble-mindedness?

OK, you're in!

[sepia_steel]

34. I haven't said anything harsh.

Glad you're here, but that's not the point. The fact that your family is here does not mean that it needs to continue. And no, I'm not one of the assholes saying that everyone who is already here illegally has to leave.

I'm saying it needs to stop NOW. It's called 'illegal' for a reason.

[KingFlorez]

28. I don't have anything against them

It's the illegality of what they are doing that gets me. It puts our workers out of jobs. New Orleans really was the last straw for me, because giving illegals a high salary over citizens is outrageous.

[High Plains]

30. Where were those New Orleans people who wanted jobs?

Looks like the Mexicans were out busting their asses, as usual. I'm not sure where the alleged New Orleans job seekers are hiding out.

[nadinbrzezinski]

5. We have them rules

they were passed in the 90s, and signed into law

Guess what? the INS unit that was suposed to deal wiht this was cut to the bones by Bush

There is no enforcement

but the laws are there... if they were enforced

That said this is not just republicans... the central valley in California could not work as well as it does if this cheap labor did not exist, and they go out of their way to grease the palms of whoever needs greasing to keep it going. And that is only one example.

[babylonsister]

21. So are you for or against? I think it's

biased to throw people out who are doing a job.
I've also seen the borders in CA/MX or TX/MX; try to enforce any rules anywhere.
I dislike seeing people on DU that appear to be so covinced that immigrants are wrong, but I understand the sentiment. They must be worried about terra.
Too much Lou Dobbs?

[oregonindy]

yep fine the employer 10,000 for every illegal employee found

[TahitiNut]

17. I think it should be at least as much as a copyright violation: $50,000

:shrug: $10,000 is too cheap.

[bluedawg12]

6. I think it's the economics of it- cheap labor

what I don't understand is why the economy of Mexico with a democratically elected President and not a totalitarian state or some other so called "failed" philosophy- I don't understand why good workers, hard workering Mexican laborers, are unable to find good jobs in Mexico?


PBS had a four part series on tonight about immigrants over the centuries. I caught one segment it was quite good.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

7. Mexico is still suffering form its feudal past

namely a huge gap between rich and poor, one that's very hard to overcome, for various reasons.

[bluedawg12]

9. We are heading for their past- a growing gap between rich

and poor.

The next question: when we talk about immigration from Mexico, about 4,000 people/day, and when we talk about the controversy about this topic- why isn't the economy of Mexico a political topic here?

Why don't we put pressure on Presidente Fox to get his house in order?

I thought that was the point of NAFTA- to bring good paying jobs to the folks south of the order.

The man they profiled on PBS has a hard life- he leaves his family for a year at a time in order to make enough for them to live on and then when he is ahead of things financially he can go back for a while. He says it is a hard life and the family separation is very sad.

[KingFlorez]

8. Some info about Mexico

Mexican government can be very corrupt. For 70 years the PRI party had a stranglehold on the government and Mexico had one party rule. Years of their mismanangement and corruption is the cause of Mexico's problems.

[nadinbrzezinski]

10. Mexico HAD a middle class too

but NAFTA has done wonders :sarcasm: and the level of corruption and at times represion would make your head spin

[bluedawg12]

12. I would rather see a prosperous Mexico and a prosperous

US- with both having a strong middle cclass.

Instead of a border that divides poor from the wealthier- I would rather see jobs on both sides of the border and in fact, I bet Americans would move down there- especially reitree's looking for a sun belt.

Maybe the problem is China- who competes with both the US and Mexico for cheap foreign labor. Maybe we are in a cycle of exporting that China and India have the upper hand and Mexico and the US are locked in some sort of middle class death spiral.

This globalization thing is a crock. When they tell us to go ahead and let the old style maufacturing jobs go abroad- we should be retrained for more cerebral work. It turns out that computer tech workers here have a higher unemployment rate than the average. Those jobs have gone over seas, too.

[Pirate Smile]

13. Did you guys know about this? I didn't until today.

"Welcome to the post-Katrina Gulf Coast, the nation's latest immigration magnet.

Lured here by the promise of fat paychecks and an emergency federal decree temporarily suspending immigration-enforcement sanctions, ..."

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x5109439

[LaPera]

14. It's of course encouraged by BushCo...Immigrant labor is meant to break...

Unions.

Plain and simple. Always has been, for even higher profits!

That's ALL they really care about in the long run, more and more people fighting for low paying jobs, so Halliburton for example, can reap even more profits from our tax dollars...and then point the finger at the same people who'll need government assistance when the jobs are taken elsewhere. That's the republican "think tank" way, their philosophy for divide, hate and then conquer...

They don't give a shit about anything except lowering all our wages...In the process corporate profits, bottom lines will rise and will create more slaves...We will then point our fingers at the immigrants, (as we are now), who are being offered the work by these same republicans...And the republicans will then have secceded...In so much as then saying, they will create more jobs if elected...A merry-go-round!

And also that... "the Dems will raise your taxes", they'll have to...to pay for all the republican thievery!

And the republicans will fool most people (with no ideology) and get elected again!

Again, a merry-go-round...and enough will fall for it (as always) to keep the corporate republican party & machine in biz....

[bluedawg12]

16. The economy is a strong point and Dems need to state

this case in a way that people will get it.

The issue is valid and becoming more important daily.

So how do we get the repugs out of their distractions and show the US people that we are not about raising taxes for the middle class, that the gays, gun, abortion,stem cell, freedom of religion, a bible in every court house, evolution are not anything more than misdirection from a party that does not like govermment and does not want to govern?

How can we be the party of the people again?

[nadinbrzezinski]

18. We first need to speak the populist message

that is the first step

[bluedawg12]

20. nad- what is a populist message?

Other than, throw the bus out!

[nadinbrzezinski]

22. We will fight for you to have a living wage

living wages are a right of every american

National health care is a right of all americans

Our people have a right to a quailty education in the public setting.

We care for famlies and the fact that families need to make it... and need to live well.

this is a populist message...

[bluedawg12]

24. nadin- yupper- the opposite of a corporatist message. n/t

[aint_no_life_nowhere]

19. Either completely open the border or completely close it

I would favor a type of Federalized Union between five entities: the United States, Canada, Mexico, Central America, and the Caribbean, with free and open borders and one passport. Local laws could be maintained to determine local matters, but a new federal constitution largely along the lines of the present U.S. constitution would be created to insure basic freedoms and human rights. Each country could retain their native languages and culture, as they do in the European Union, but one currency, and one economic model would be created and land ownership and the free flow of labor would be enjoyed by all. I think it may eventually come to this, but probably not for many, many years.

The other solution is to close the border with Mexico to all unauthorized crossing and force the Mexican people to take matters into their own hands and start a revolution to oust the elite from power and create a more equitable society. But I don't think the U.S. wants a revolution on its borders, particularly one that could have a result in creating a society with socialistic aspects. The U.S. has long meddled in the affairs of Latin America to keep the people from having the type of society they want.

But this halfway measure of looking the other way is hurting both the U.S. working class and is making the Mexican economy too dependent on the money sent home by Mexican labor in the United States.

As for the fines, there are now provisions in immigration law for fining employers, but they are not enforced to any major extent. The USCIS (formerly INS, later BCIS) has long been one of the most poorly run parts of the federal government.

[Bridget Burke]

32. The last time Mexico had a revolution, we got a HUGE number of immigrants.

More than a million Mexicans died in the 1910-1920 Revolution/Civil War.

http://users.erols.com/mwhite28/warstat2.htm

US activists still remember Kent State. But the Mexican government killed hundreds of students (& others) in 1968. The full death toll is still not known for the Tlatelolco Massacre.

We need justice for ALL! The Political Border is not the finest invention of human beings.

[abluelady]

25. Big business needs people who will work for less.

There is no way the administration would stop that. It is just another soundbite for them to talk about.

[wuushew]

27. kick

:dem:

[mtnester]

29. After you use the illegals forever

and make sure the economy is in the toilet, then the citizens of the US will be more willing to accept minimum wage for every job, then you can drop the illegals because they served their purpose . . to drive wages down.

My hubbys comments from several years ago, which I have posted before. THIS is why it has been allowed.

[Greyhound]

33. So why are so many unwilling to deal with the real issue?

At least the repugs motives are clear, more illegals = lower wages, fewer workplace requirements (illegals never complain), no benefits, larger profits.
All the dems seem to get out of this is to further alienate their constituents by lowering their standard of living and picking up a few votes from the illegals and their supporters, if they even bother to vote.

[Mountainman]

35. Children of illegals move into the middle class in one generation.

What are some of the qualities that the repukes admire? Religious, hard working, family oriented, self made, now what are some of the qualities of the illegals, religious, hard working, family oriented, self made.

Now if the repukes would just recognize this they might have a larger base when the children of illegals get to voting age.