Christianity, Will I suffer?

[FM Arouet666]

I am sitting here watching a documentary on WWII with commentary supplied by former presidents Carter and Clinton, both Christians.

I began to ponder the role of religion in the political life of G.W. Bush. A born again Christian, a supporter of fundamentalists, but not an honorable man. I have to admit, Bush’s religion frightens me. As an atheist, the daily headlines about, what can be best described as, Christian activism has me very concerned. In the courts: evolution, the Ten Commandments, the pledge of allegiance, gay marriage and abortion. All flashpoints in the Christian war for control of American cultural supremacy.

I have seen numerous posts on DU regarding “Christian bashing.” Truthfully, some posts can be categorized as “bashing,” but many reflect a fear as I described above. Has the Christian become an enemy of the progressive thinker? Are these thoughts justified? Certainly the republican version of the Christian is to be feared.

"I don't know that atheists should be regarded as citizens, nor should they be regarded as patriotic. This is one nation under God." G.H.W. Bush

“Our goal is a Christian nation. We have a Biblical duty; we are called on by God to conquer this country.”
Randall Terry.

“Aids is the wrath of God against homosexuals.” Jerry Falwell

I could quote ad nausem…..


What makes the democratic, liberal or progressive Christian different? As I watch the documentary I realize that both Clinton and Carter are honorable men. What does that mean? They are not perfect, they are human, but I sense that neither man would cause harm to me because of my lack of religion. I do not think either man would use religion as a political tool to harm a large portion of the American public. I submit that an honorable person may hold deep religious beliefs or lack beliefs, yet accept those with opposing views, acting for the best interest of all.

Republicans have lost the ideal I just described. What about liberal Christians? Christians are asserting their political voice, primarily though the Republican Party. Are liberal Christians pressured to choose between their faith and liberal ideals? Do liberal Christians accept pluralism? Should I be suspicious of my fellow Christian democrats?

I sincerely do not wish to be confrontational, just posting some of my concerns………

[izzie]

1. Their are Christians and then Bush's base.

Do try and not mix them up.

[ikojo]

3. Bush's christians would say the same thing...

that they are the real christians, When I confront fundies with the christian history of inquisitions, crusades, pogroms and holocaust, almost to a person their response is "they weren't real christians." Well, they claimed to worship Jesus and said they were cleansing Europe of the heathens, pagans, Jews and Muslims for Jesus. Hmmmm...sounds like they were christians to me, but what do I know for I am not Jerry Fallwell.

So, what is the definition of christian?

[lukasahero]

8. To me a "Christian" is not a person who "worships" Jesus but rather

one who follows his teachings. "Love your neighbor as yourself", "blessed are the peacemakers", "do unto others"...

That said, religion/spirituality to me is personal and should never be "forced" on others in any way - ever. I can only tell you what I believe. Do with it as you will.

[Alamom]

2. I have the same thoughts, fears, worries, etc. &

I am a Christian.

[hyphenate]

4. The Christian Right

is neither.

As I noted about a week ago in a posting of my own, the radical religious right is more about a power base than they are about practicing a faith or religion. Those who support this power base use Jesus Christ as a weapon, a tool to keep people in line. They preach intolerance, they preach hypocrisy, and moreover, they wouldn't know Jesus Christ if they tripped over him in the Bowery. To them, it's not about compassion, it's not about values, and it's not about the golden rule. It's about waging war on non-Christians, it's about waging war on anyone who is different than they are, it's about hatred, bigotry and control.

The United States is the only first world power with this monkey on its back. Every other major power in the world runs a secular government. Every other major power has put and kept religion in its place. How ironic that those who left Europe in the 17th century to escape religious persecution are now those trying to keep religious freedom from blossoming!

They may say they're "Christian" but you can tell a real Christian from a RRR member: if you say something to defend a Moslem, if you defend a Pagan, or if you say something nice about an atheist, they will immediately attack you. If they don't, they probably believe in the sanctity of religious freedom for all, and you can bet they're more of a real Christian. I can't discuss anything with my best friend, because she's been indoctrinated into the fundies so totally. She firmly believes that Islam is all about worshipping an evil god, she firmly believes that atheists are going to hell, and she has been completely taken over by both the Left Behind mythology, and creationism falsehoods. She is constantly praying for me because I have become more secular as I grow older. I only wish I could pray for her, but it won't do any good--she's been swept up by the movement and won't back down.

[shaniqua6392]

5. Sometimes I think God is allowing all of this to happen

to show his people how wrong they are to have taken someone at his word that he is a Christian. God teaches us to look at a persons actions, to avoid false prophets. GWB has many in his base who are no more than zealots. He is not a Christian and a majority of his base are not truly Christians. Maybe they were at one time, but they have succumbed to wanting power. For example, James Dobson and his sheeple. This is NOT what God wanted for us!! Then there are also Christians, and I know many of them, who vote Republican because of the abortion and gay marriage issues. I am a pro choice, pro gay marriage Christian. I have a brother and a sister who are gay. I do not cast my vote on those issues at all. They are so naive that they voted for Satan...twice. Karl Rove had a plan....hijack the name of Jesus....put the gay marriage issue on the ballot in some of the blue states to get Christians afraid enough that they would get out there and vote for George. It worked. Sorry for the rant, but I am a Christian who recognized what they were doing five years ago. I just pray to God every day that he will save us. I pray more Christians who were fooled will see the light.

[LostInAnomie]

6. Never be fooled into thinking they are winning the culture war.

They are just pushing on battles they think they can win. They know that they can attack homosexuals and atheists with relative safety. They know they can obfuscate issues like the Ten Commandments, the Pledge of Allegiance, and evolution, all of which are emotionally charged and harder to argue against.

The minute they try to put their hands on alcohol, porno, birth-control, womens rights, sex, abortion due to rape, etc. they will pull back a bloody stump.

They are having a little rally now but there will be a breaking point. When that comes they will wish they never heard of blurring the line between church and state.

[papau]

7. Are these thoughts justified? - NOPE - professed atheism or Christian

beliefs do not determine moral code or conduct.

As a Christian I am NOT surprised to find moral atheists.

I would expect you to note the existence of moral Christians without comment.

But since you want to equate moral failings with Chtistian beliefs, while saying you do not want to be confrontational - have at it.

Whatever floats your boat and is allowed under DU's rules.

:toast:

:-)