What happens if Libby is pardoned?

[lumberjack_jeff]

Can Bush pardon Libby before his trial?

If so, can the facts as established in the Libby indictment be used to pursue justice against Rove, Bolton and those who gave 'em marching orders?

[Avalux]

1. Did you hear what Fitgerald said?

NO ONE is above the law. He was speaking to all of those shits in the WH - just let Bush try it.

[longship]

2. Agreed. People would not like that.

nt

[lumberjack_jeff]

12. Isn't that what happened in Iran-contra? n/t

[longship]

20. Not what happened in Iran-Contra

In Iran-Contra, Reagan did *not* pardon his own cronies for crimes committed within his own administration because he would have been told by his legal advisors that that would be an abuse of power for which he would likely be impeached. It was up to his successors to do that, or not. Bush 41 pardoned people for crimes committed during a previous president's administration. It was a very grey area for him to do this because he was Veep during the crimes. People didn't like that and there were a lot of rumblings about it.

Bush pardoning Libby would be an abuse of the power of the pardon. He could be impeached and removed from office for it. I'm not saying that this would happen, but it would trigger a constitutional crisis of some significance.

[lumberjack_jeff]

6. Are we overstating Americans' attention spans? n/t

[benburch]

3. He is more likely to meet with an accident.

The GOP cannot afford the appearance of guilt.

[spindrifter]

8. They do it all the time.

They just act like they are right and others are wrong.

[Walt Starr]

4. Bush could pardon Libby at any time

it is his prerogative to pardon on a whim.

Politically, it would be a difficult thing for him to do as he's on the record stating this is a serious investigation.

[lumberjack_jeff]

5. But is it more palatable than the alternative?

If Libby goes to trial, it's not unlikely that he'll implicate the Vice President in a conspiracy charge.

[Duer 157099]

7. Bush could always claim that he was concerned about

the outing of a CIA agent, and that Libby was not charged with that crime, and so thus justify a pardon.

I could see it. Hubris unending.

[cynatnite]

9. Put that with Fitz's statement that no one is above the law...

:bounce: Well, you know where I'm going with this :bounce:

[OldCurmudgeon]

26. it opens up a can of worms...

If Libby is "pre-emptively" pardoned, then he loses any 5th amendment protection, so can be compelled to testify against other co-conspirators, including testifying in a civil case that the Wilson's might bring against Libby, Bush, etc.

If he commits perjury (again!) in the process of such testimony, then it's a new (un-pardoned) charge for him to be indicted on. Jailarity ensuses.

[tanyev]

10. Maybe Georgie will pardon him and nominate him to the SC.

[madrchsod]

11. no

[No Exit]

13. What happens? The one who pardons him is REVILED and HATED.

[lumberjack_jeff]

17. Ya' mean like Bush Sr? They treat him like a friggin statesman.

Bush Sr pardoned Weinberger to save his own ass.

[No Exit]

27. No, I mean like Clinton. Marc Rich? Or, I mean like FORD.

[AlinPA]

14. I am wondering whether Bush** can stop Fitzgerald by telling Gonzales

to fire him; then issuing a pardon to Libby (before any trial). Who could stop him? Certainly not Congress, nor Supreme Ct., both controlled by republicans.

[enki23]

15. he will be. they'll drag the process out as long as possible first, then:

he'll get his pardon *after* the next presidential election, when it'll give the nation four years to forget about republican style "justice" once again.

[lumberjack_jeff]

18. Ding! Ding! Ding!

But can this be dragged out that long? Libby resigned, isn't he kind of on his own?

[enki23]

21. yeah, he'll probably do some jail time first

but if he gets a long sentence, he won't serve much of it. at least, that's what i'd wager on. *shrug*

seems a fairly safe bet.

[lumberjack_jeff]

25. If he is compelled to testify, and is convicted - that's good enough :)

[OrlandoGator]

16. That would be the best possible scenario.

It would basically be Bush swearing on a stack of Bibles how corrupt he is.

[WritingIsMyReligion]

22. ROFL nt

[Neil Lisst]

19. Bush can pardon him and say NATIONAL SECURITY.

He can say we can't do any more harm to the intelligence community by letting these things be aired. Libby gets some admin slap on the hand, and it's over.

Remember when Cap Weinburger went to trial for Iran-contra?

Oops, he got pardoned before, didn't he?

Bush will do likewise. If Fitz had indicted Rove and several others, Bush couldn't pardon, but only one guy? He'll pardon him.


plame game end game today

[savemefromdumbya]

23. Bush intends to pardon?

on the other hand he may take a risk and remove neocons from government

[demobabe]

24. Pardoning before the trial

...would likely be seen as an abuse of power, which is impeachable.

Politically, he can't pardon Libby til he's on the way out...

[Why Syzygy]

28. Does Bush even know Libby?

What's the record?

We know Bush is a narcissistic little twerp.
Fer sure he will follow orders once again and someone may tell him that's what he needs to do. Would that be his first "pardon"? Does he even know the meaning of the word?

I think Libby is going down. I don't foresee any kind of help coming from upstairs.

And we're just getting started. I hope.