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understandinglife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-08-05 03:29 PM
Original message
It's Tribunal time in the United States of America.
Edited on Tue Nov-08-05 03:31 PM by understandinglife
After President Bush's disastrous visit to Latin America, it's unnerving to realize that his presidency still has more than three years to run. An administration with no agenda and no competence would be hard enough to live with on the domestic front. But the rest of the world simply can't afford an American government this bad for that long.

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/11/08/opinion/08tue1.html?hp


Indeed, the world cannot be expected to tolerate Bush and the neoconsters for even another day.

More importantly, "We the People ..." must not tolerate their presence in the Executive Branch of OUR government. It is our responsibility to remove them from office and replace them with a legitimately elected government.

It is time for "We the People ..." to make history.

I, like many here, were among the millions of people throughout the world who knew that Bush and the neoconsters were embarking on an illegal, imperialistic war of aggression on Iraq.

We knew we were being told countless lies.

But we failed to stop the murderers. Much of that failure is due to a complicit US Congress whom we now must hold accountable. And, much of that failure is the direct fault of the US commercial media enterprise that was not only complicit, but in the case of the New York Times and Fox News in particular, were propagandists of the first order.

It's tribunal time in the United States of America.

If we are ever to have any hope of restoring our credibility; if we have any intention of being perceived throughout the world as a beacon of the rule of law, "We the People ..." need to convene the first US War Crimes Tribunal.

"We the People ..." must bring charges against all who conspired and conducted war crimes.

"We the People ..." must ensure that each defendant is provided comprehensive legal defense as they are robustly prosecuted.

"We the People ..." must insist on life imprisonment with a variety of duties to be performed in service to humanity for those convicted.

It's tribunal time in the United States of America.

I do not think the Framers of the Constitution ever anticipated that the entire Executive Branch and members of both Houses of Congress would deceive the people into an illegal war, so we are going to have to deal with an unprecedented situation in an unprecedented peaceful and legal manner - NOW.

We have many brilliant and patriotic lawyers. Let us call upon all of them to help guide us in bringing charges against Bush, Cheney, and all the other neoconsters, in the Executive and Legislative Branches, who conspired to deceive us and our allies, and then launched an illegal and un-Constitutional war of aggression on Iraq.


Peace.
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understandinglife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-08-05 03:50 PM
Response to Original message
1. "Sen. Jay Rockefeller, (D-WV), wants to raise the whole curtain on ...
... the pre-war intelligence issues. Not just the tiny peep show that Pat Roberts has been proposing -- but the whole, wide-angle viewing of how the Iraq war was sold to the American public.

"Comparing public statements with what the intelligence community published does not alone tell the story," Rockefeller said in a statement yesterday. "If necessary, we may need to conduct interviews and request supporting documents." Rockefeller warned that "if the committee is denied testimony or documentation, we must be prepared to issue subpoenas."


Well, that's a whole 'nother thing -- and an extension of what the original agreement was last year on the Phase II portion of the committee invetigation. And it's about time.

Sen. Rockefeller made news this past weekend, saying "I was dead flat wrong." in voting for the Iraq War, along the vein of if I knew then what I know now about how we were being misled.

<clip>

From Lifting the Curtain by ReddHedd on November 8, 2005

Link:

http://firedoglake.blogspot.com/2005/11/lifting-curtain.html


Time to "lift the curtain" and reveal a court room with tribunal judges and jury ready to bring justice and the rule of law back to America.


Peace.

And now he wants to know exactly how misled he and the rest of the Senate were.
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Mme. Defarge Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-08-05 04:03 PM
Response to Original message
2. I agree
"We the People ..." must insist on life imprisonment with a variety of duties to be performed in service to humanity for those convicted."

Times change. Better than the guillotine.
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understandinglife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-08-05 04:12 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. "Times change. Better than the guillotine."
Yes.

We don't need any more State-supervised killing.

We need productive incarceration - prisoners producing something of value to humanity, no matter how minimal the output.

In the case of Bush, Cheney and the other neoconsters - if convicted, they should be required to spend the remainder of their lives in Iraq caring for the children whom their weapons either injured or induced genetic defects.


Peace.
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Burning Water Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-08-05 04:09 PM
Response to Original message
3. Excellent idea, but I have some questions.
First, where do we bring charges? The Supreme Court is RW already, and is about to become more so.

Second, as this is not an impeachment, Bush will still be President, and in control of the executive. Who is going to enforce the tribuanl's orders?

Third, what are the conservative sheeple going to do when their corporate, neo-con masters call on them to fight against "the illegal rebellion of traitors and communists and Islamofascist stooges and fellow travelers", of something like that? Can you doubt that they will? Can you doubt that the racist white men with guns will respond? I sorta think they will.

Before we do this, we need a plan to confront and answer these and similar questions.

Damn George Bush for bringing the country to this point!
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understandinglife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-08-05 04:19 PM
Response to Reply #3
5. "We have many brilliant and patriotic lawyers. Let us call upon all of ...
... them to help guide us in bringing charges against Bush, Cheney, and all the other neoconsters, in the Executive and Legislative Branches, who conspired to deceive us and our allies, and then launched an illegal and un-Constitutional war of aggression on Iraq.


That's how I propose we start -- perhaps adding the demand that Bush and Cheney resign, immediately.

Had the NYTimes Editors followed the logic of their first paragraph, that is what they would have demanded, instead of the insipid remedy they propose in their last paragraph.

Maybe a week or two more of their having to smell the rot inside the Beltway and they'll make the resignations call.

If my sources are correct, the stench should get worse sometime in the next 24 hours.


Peace.
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Mme. Defarge Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-08-05 04:25 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. Exactly!
We could start with the 10,000 lawyers that John Kerry had lined up to insure that every vote would be counted and that every vote would count. Maybe some of the money I contributed to that effort could get spent productively.
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Burning Water Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-08-05 05:06 PM
Response to Reply #6
11. These were the
brilliant lawyers that did nothing to ensure that every vote was counted and every vote would count. That makes me feel lots better.

Damn George Bush.
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_dynamicdems Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-08-05 05:22 PM
Response to Reply #6
15. I got to see some of those lawyers in action.
The lawyers were awesome! I was standing across the street from the polls holding a Kerry sign and a couple of law students joined us for a time. They were fascinated to watch the Kerry legal teams in action. They pointed out some exchanges that were taking place in front of the school where people were voting. I'm not a lawyer, but these law students were quite impressed with how astute and on the ball the Kerry lawyers were. The law students talked with the lawyers and they came back and explained how things were going to us.

You see, the Republicans had teams inside the polling place challenging voters, particularly because this was a college town. They were misrepresenting the truth and using scare tactics to turn young voters away, telling them they could lose their scholarships if they didn't go back to their home state to vote. The Kerry lawyers were outside checking with people as they left and explaining the true facts. Time and time again, they took young voters back inside to champion their rights. Now, this is a fairly small town and a small college. I'm just amazed that the "Intimidators" had teams such as this in place. Democracy at work: take your lawyer to the polls so you will be allowed to vote.

I can't imagine how many votes the legal teams across the country saved, but with this kind of widespread chicanery I'm sure a lot of people still slipped through the cracks.

Just wanted to give you an eyewitness accounting of how some of your lawyer money was spent. Hope it helps a little.




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FreedomAngel82 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-08-05 08:54 PM
Response to Reply #15
31. Thanks for your first hand experience
Nice to hear they did that. I luckily had no problems whatsoever. I didn't even have to stand in line (went early).
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_dynamicdems Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-08-05 10:29 PM
Response to Reply #31
34. Your welcome.
Glad it didn't happen everywhere.

If nothing more, enthusiasm for justice was instilled in two future lawyers. That small victory makes me smile. Who knows: one of those young men might end up on the Supreme Court when some of the old conservatives die off. :)
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hootinholler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-08-05 09:23 PM
Response to Reply #15
33. " I'm just amazed that the "Intimidators" had teams such as this in place.
Just have Abramoff whip up some Fundy Wackos (sic) for you and you're Nationwide.

-Hoot
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Mme. Defarge Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-09-05 10:45 AM
Response to Reply #15
39. Please forgive
my kneejerk response. I'm just so frustrated and appalled that none of this was translated into a serious challenge of the results in Ohio.
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Imagevision Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-08-05 10:52 PM
Response to Reply #6
37. Let's do it...!
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Burning Water Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-08-05 05:05 PM
Response to Reply #5
10. Well, we
can "demand" all day long, but Bush & Cheney do not care for our opinions. Only if we can get the Republicans to also call for the resignations will we make progress with that. Unspinnable evidence would be good.
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understandinglife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-08-05 05:17 PM
Response to Reply #10
13. "Unspinnable evidence would be good." -- see comment # 12, ...
Edited on Tue Nov-08-05 05:17 PM by understandinglife
... for starters.

And, then we have the Memoranda sent to the President of the United States by the Veteran Intelligence Professionals for Sanity on Feb 8, 2003, and March 17, 2003, that thoroughly discredit the "evidence" being used by Bush, Cheney, Powell, Rumsfeld and the other neoconsters to justify their illegal war of aggression.

The World Tribunal on Iraq has assembled a major portfolio of evidence, as well.

And, we have all the research that citizens like Laura Rozen, Larry Johnson, Josh Marshall, and others have assembled on the "Niger forgeries."

We even have the New York Times apology for publishing Judith Miller's propaganda (even if they buried it on page A10, May, 26, 2004).

The evidence of their lies and of their crimes is manifest.


Peace.
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understandinglife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-08-05 05:33 PM
Response to Reply #10
17. Also, see today's "jus cogens" post by DUer & lawyer, Land Shark, at:
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northamericancitizen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-08-05 04:37 PM
Response to Original message
7. Thank you understandinglife
I can't call a congressman or anybody else to have the bushco indicted because I am Canadian.

What I can do and have been doing is to keep myself informed, spread the word around me and support you the American People.

You are the only one entrusted with the power to put those bullies in jail. No more killing. Quoting you:
"We need productive incarceration - prisoners producing something of value to humanity, no matter how minimal the output."

We need PEACE now!

No more "melted children" in Irak.

Peace

lise
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EFerrari Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-08-05 04:38 PM
Response to Original message
8. What a sad day for our nation. Of course, you are right.
kicked and recommended.
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understandinglife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-08-05 04:50 PM
Response to Original message
9. Lott; "We can not remain silent. We have met the enemy, and it is us."
On November 8, 2005 -- Truth emerges from the mouth of Trent Lott (http://dailykos.com/story/2005/11/8/153025/799)

It is definitely "Tribunal time in the United States of America."

And, you are each witnessing the fission of the Republican party.

Expect that fission to go critical, shortly.


Peace.
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hootinholler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-08-05 06:12 PM
Response to Reply #9
20. OOOh!
Fission, critical, *that* I understand.

I'm still trying to get my head around how we can convene a legal and binding tribunal. The Constitution doesn't prohibit it, can we just do it?

-Hoot
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understandinglife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-08-05 06:33 PM
Response to Reply #20
21. "The Constitution doesn't prohibit it, can we just do it?"
I think we should get as many lawyers who are committed to preventing the further demise of America and give it a go.

We have a vanishingly thin layer of law and ethics between "We the People ..." and a legacy of lasting evil, unless we stop these criminals, now.


Peace.
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hootinholler Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-08-05 09:02 PM
Response to Reply #21
32. Wouldn't that be something akin to a
Constitutional Convention? Wouldn't it need representation from all the States?

Barring some impinging doomsday scenario, I think winning back Congress will happen faster.

-Hoot
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understandinglife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-08-05 05:07 PM
Response to Original message
12. Lying with intelligence: Who in the White House Knew About ...
... DITSUM No. 044-02 and when did they know it?

That's the newly declassified smoking-gun document, originally prepared by the Defense Intelligence Agency in February 2002 but ignored by President Bush. Its declassification this weekend blows another huge hole in Bush's claim that he was acting on the best intelligence available when he pitched the invasion of Iraq as a way to prevent an Al Qaeda terror attack using weapons of mass destruction.

The report demolished the credibility of the key Al Qaeda informant the administration relied on to make its claim that a working alliance existed between Saddam Hussein and Osama bin Laden. It was circulated widely within the U.S. government a full eight months before Bush used the prisoner's lies to argue for an invasion of Iraq because "we've learned that Iraq has trained Al Qaeda members in bomb making and poisons and deadly gases."

<clip>

It should be remembered that while Bush and his gang were successfully scaring the wits out of us about the alleged Iraq-Al Qaeda alliance, U.N. weapons inspectors were on the ground in Iraq. Weapons inspectors Hans Blix and 2005 Nobel Peace Prize winner Mohamed ElBaradei promised they could finish scouring the country if given a few more months. But instead, they were abruptly chased out by an invasion necessitated by what the president told us was a "unique and urgent threat."

Bush exploited the worldwide horror felt over the 9/11 attacks to justify the Iraq invasion. His outrageous claim, repeated over and over before and after he dragged the nation into an unnecessary war, was never supported by a single piece of credible evidence. The Bush defense of what is arguably the biggest lie ever put over on the American people is that everyone had gotten the intelligence wrong. Not so at the highest level of U.S. intelligence, as DITSUM No. 044-02 so clearly shows. How could the president not have known?

By Robert Scheer in the Los Angeles Times on November 8, 2005

Link:

http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/commentary/la-oe-scheer8nov08,0,256814.column?coll=la-news-comment-opinions


"Discovery" for bringing charges against Bush, Cheney and the other neoconster war criminals is just a google/dogpile search away.


Peace.
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il_lilac Donating Member (756 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-08-05 05:21 PM
Response to Original message
14. K & R
The only way to restore credibility in our global community is to put these bastards away! Otherwise we are complicit and deserve the wrath of the world.
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understandinglife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-08-05 05:26 PM
Response to Original message
16. "The Nuremberg trials after WWII and the current trials at Abu Ghraib ...
... teach us that no person is justified in obeying an order to commit war crimes or to conceal the location of war crimes. There is also no Nuremberg precedent allowing the Nazi press to report about gas chamber operations and yet keep the locations of those gas chambers a secret in order to protect them from “legal challenges” and “political condemnation at home and abroad”. Yet this prevention of condemnation and disruption is precisely what the Washington Post set out to accomplish regarding torture facilities.

When our finest political “reporters” tell the Nation about torture centers, but refuse to reveal their location in order to maximize the torture centers’ chances of continued operations, Thomas Jefferson’s words regarding a violation of jus cogens norms during his time comes to mind: “When I think of slavery, I tremble to think that God is just.” Do our movers and shakers tremble?

I recommend to all the book “They Thought They Were Free” by Milton Mayer, showing that Germany’s path to utter moral ruin did not have a single point at which it was completely clear that Now was the time to stop it.
http://www.buzzflash.com/hartmann/05/11/har05011.html


From Keeping Secrets at the Wash. Post (Do our movers and shakers tremble?) by Paul Lehto on November 8, 2005

Much more at the link:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=5300664&mesg_id=5300664


Well we've got "points" all over the place showing us we are way the hell down the path to the destruction of everything of value in the framework provided by the Constitution of the United States of America.


Peace.

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Joe Chi Minh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-09-05 04:46 PM
Response to Reply #16
42. Thus, we hope, begins the end of the Fourth Reich.....;
Edited on Wed Nov-09-05 04:46 PM by KCabotDullesMarxIII
to its prime movers, as unexpectedly "prematurely" as its predecessor. But isn't the definition of such people that they never learn. It's always, "We wuz robbed!" Are there not too many of them in key positions, with Nazi antecedents, for it to be a matter of simple coincidence.
And what suppport their corporatism has gained for their endeavours in this decadent United Kingdom.

As in World War II, more culpable than the worst of the German Nazis. Indeed, worship of the Nazis seemed to be rife among the monied people in the West, as far afield as Canada and Australia, I believe. Certainly, in France.




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understandinglife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-09-05 08:10 PM
Response to Reply #42
44. Indeed. And, please see comment # 43 -- billmon is, as usual, on target.
Peace.
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Joe Chi Minh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 09:57 AM
Response to Reply #44
45. Thanks, understandinglife. International law seems
seems as unequivocal as their breaches of it are unambiguous.
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MN ChimpH8R Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-08-05 05:34 PM
Response to Original message
18. We need a Truth Commission
like the South Africans implemented post-apartheid. More that that, we need a Nelson Mandela to rally around.
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understandinglife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-08-05 06:08 PM
Response to Reply #18
19. I think Congressman Conyers should form America's "Truth Commission"
I think many would join.

It is "We the People ..." who now must demand accountability before the law for all those who have deceived us and caused the deaths of our citizens as well as committed crimes against humanity in Iraq and elsewhere.

We now know the names of the members of both Houses of Congress eager to suppress the truth about American-sponsored torture chambers but could care less about the outing of a covert CIA operative and destruction of our intelligence infrastructure.

We now know the names of the members of both Houses of Congress who support Bush and Cheney's reign of torture.

We have only our self to blame if we do not bring these perpetrators to justice.


Peace.
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understandinglife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-08-05 06:48 PM
Response to Original message
22. Rep McDermott: One Nation, Two Presidents
Edited on Tue Nov-08-05 06:49 PM by understandinglife
A year ago, Americans went to the polls and voted for a President, but we got two instead.

We have George W. Bush, the President of domestic policy, appointing a self-described fashion god who left the Gulf Coast underwater. And we have Dick Cheney, the President of foreign policy – an area that includes secret CIA prisons around the world.

Today, the President of foreign policy is trying to round up votes in the Senate to exempt the CIA from an amendment that would ban the torture and inhumane treatment of prisoners. It’s a sure sign that America has lost its way when we even have to talk about banning torture and the inhumane treatment of prisoners.

America has never had two Presidents until now, and America has never had a question about its moral integrity, until now. The President of Foreign Policy would have us believe that we must become the enemy to defeat the enemy. Like so much from this Administration, this is not true.

<clip>

Much more at the link:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/rep-jim-mcdermott/one-nation-two-president_b_10323.html


Congressman McDermott concludes with -- "For a long time people have wondered just how President George W. Bush could get it so wrong, so often. Now we know. He has help. America has a second President we never elected."

Everyone -- America is truly broken.

We can repair it, but we are going to have to set some precedents in the process.

If "We the People ..." can get these criminals before our very own Tribunal, then we can begin inspecting our Constitution as to at least two categories of much needed reform -- citizen-based vote verification & expansion of citizen recourse legal action as to hold accountable members of any of the three branches who violate the law.


Peace.
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DemReadingDU Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-08-05 07:04 PM
Response to Reply #22
23. Thanks UL., great selection of articles!
Two presidents, indeed. I'm not so sure that Bush was elected either.
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understandinglife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-08-05 07:38 PM
Response to Reply #22
24. "As often happens, an answer can be found with the Founding Fathers ...
... and the Constitution. They could not have foreseen the present age of nuclear missiles and cataclysmic terrorism. But they understood political accountability, and they knew that sending Americans to war required careful reflection and vigorous debate. Their answer survives in Article 1, Section 8, of the Constitution, which gives Congress -- and only Congress -- the power to declare war. That power, exercised only a few times in our history, and not at all since World War II, needs to be reestablished and reinforced by new legislation. This legislation would fix guidelines for exercising the provision jointly between the White House and Congress. It would restore the Framers' intent by requiring a congressional declaration of war in advance of any commitment of troops that promises sustained combat.

<clip>

This declaration process should appeal to conservatives and even neocons. It meets their valid concern that the United States often loses diplomatic showdowns and wars not on the battlefield but at home. It adds credibility to presidential threats and staying power to our military commitments. Binding Congress far more closely to war, for instance, might have convinced Saddam Hussein of Washington's resolve to fight him in both gulf wars; today it would help convince insurgents in Iraq of America's long-term commitment to make Iraq secure. Liberals and moderates, always rightly complaining about a rush to war, would welcome the restored declaration. Not least, the attractiveness of this approach would be aided by the political power of the Constitution itself.

Nor would the process proposed here diminish a president's leadership or stature as commander in chief as he makes his case to Congress. If, even with these advantages, his arguments fail, then the case cannot be very compelling.

Today Congress deliberates on transportation bills more carefully than it does on war resolutions. Our Founding Fathers wanted the declaration of war to concentrate minds. Returning to the Constitution's text and making it work through legislation requiring joint deliberate action may be the only way to give the decision to make war the care it deserves.

From No More Blank-Check Wars by Leslie H. Gelb and Anne-Marie Slaughter on November 8, 2005

More at link:

http://media3.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/11/07/AR2005110701295.html


I'm posting this Op-Ed because it's meta-value to the current thread is simple -- it affirms the scale of abuse by Bush and the neoconsters, as well as the US Congress, of the explicit intent of the Founding Fathers as stated in Article 1, Section 8, of the Constitution.

They waged not only an illegal war of aggression but they mutually subverted the very core responsibility of the Congress.

And, they also deceived the American public.

No wonder torture and ruthless killing of innocents has transpired. When you willfully violate the Constitution of the United States of America what's to stop you from committing crimes against humanity.


Peace.
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understandinglife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-08-05 08:18 PM
Response to Original message
25. "But though I have opposed Frist's general take on the war and these ...
... issues for some time -- it's still very difficult for me, just as an American citizen -- to watch any leader, Republican or Democrat, implicitly endorse the notion that America has the right to indefinitely hold without due process any prisoners or detainees in some systemized fashion.

This is what the Soviet Union did. This is what Maoist China did. This is what America fought the Cold War against! Yes, we are fighting and dealing with horribly dangerous people in the world -- but they must be brought to justice in courts of law before American and global peers.

Frist and Hastert have both blighted their careers with this letter. It's outrageous -- and they should immediately retract this effort to lynch leakers rather than holding the Executive Branch accountable for serious infractions of human rights and our legal norms.

From Bill Frist & Dennis Hastert: We Don't Care About the Secret Detention Facilities -- We Just Want to Know WHO Spilled the Beans to Dana Priest by Steven C Clemons on November 8, 2005

Much more at the link:

http://www.thewashingtonnote.com/archives/001076.html


We need to clean house - comprehensively.


Peace.

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understandinglife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-08-05 08:39 PM
Response to Original message
26. "What we have here is an administration under the sway of men with lawless
... and authoritarian tendencies. Betraying one of the country's own spies to cover up revelations about dishonest actions in leading the country to war, attempts to squelch the press to hide government policy of supporting torture. These actions are all cut from the same cloth: cover-ups and secrecy to hide lies and dishonorable acts, all backed by force and disregard for the law.

Now it seems Sen. Lott is telling reporters he thinks the leaks came from Republicans, which is at least one more sign that there are a growing number of Republicans more interested in their country's honor than in the Cheney gang's governance by violence and lies.

Let them investigate Republicans, Democrats; let them take it before judges. Whatever. Lies beget coverups which beget more law breaking into a spiralling cycle. The executive is in corrupt hands. Nothing will change till that does.

Link:

http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/006950.php


Let's get on with the changing, NOW.


Peace.

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Independent_Liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-08-05 08:43 PM
Response to Original message
27. Thanks for posting this UL!
Yes, it's time for "We the People" to stand firm and put the war criminals on trial.
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understandinglife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-08-05 08:45 PM
Response to Original message
28. They Thought They Were Free By Milton Mayer
<clip>

And when a consortium of news organizations recounted the Florida 2000 vote and it was found that Al Gore actually won the entire state -- and thus the presidency -- no matter what standard was used to count the ballots, the corporate news organizations of America buried the story (although the New York Times and Washington Post at least did report it).

Our Attorney General calls the Geneva Conventions "quaint"; our Secretary of Defense stands accused of ordering torture; our President and Vice President knowingly lie to us and the world in order to lead an election-year preemptive war; and Congress passes the PATRIOT Act without reading it -- eerily like the German Parliament passed the Enabling Acts after the Reichstag was burned.

So how to counter it?

As Mayer so movingly narrates, the experience of 20th century Europe demonstrates that those abusing power must be confronted with equally vigorous power.

In the 1930s, Germans who believed in republican democracy were overwhelmed before they realized how completely their civil liberties and national institutions had been seized.

We must not allow it to happen in our nation. Read "They Thought They Were Free" and awaken as many as you can.

Review by Thom Hartmann:

http://www.buzzflash.com/hartmann/05/11/har05011.html


It is Tribunal Time in the United States of America - NOW



Peace.
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Independent_Liberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-08-05 08:51 PM
Response to Original message
29. One place we can start...
Edited on Tue Nov-08-05 08:52 PM by Independent_Liberal
www.recallthecongress.com

>>>>snip

To impeach George Bush for war crimes and covertly implementing PNAC, we have to get a handle on our congress men and women.

This website is created to organize local state efforts to petition the Secretary of State or other official of each state in which laws have been established for the recall process of public officials. There are 26 states in which such laws have been established leaving 24 states in which an effort is required to petition the state legislature for enactment of such a law or alternatively where the initiative has been made law to use that vehicle to bring each state of the nation into a parity of power of its citizens to control the Federal government.

>>>>snip

Objectives of We the People

To kick George W. Bush out of office, send him packing to Crawford Texas and to seek his future trial for war crimes in the docks of the International Court of Criminal Justice. To this add Dick Cheney and his rogue companions.
That We the People gain control over the Senate and House of Representatives whereby they are bound to perform according to their commitments to We the People or get booted out of office by state court upon complaint of We the People.
To teach the President and the Congress that We the People own America and the government and that every person in each of those entities is in our employ and subject to our termination by way of our reserved electoral right of recall.
To establish that the right of the people to recall members of the US Senate or the House of Representatives is a right not prohibited within the Constitution and is thus reserved to the electors of the States contrary to common myth.
To firmly establish the right of We the People to veto any acts of the Congress within 48 hours of passage which veto is final and cannot be overridden by the Congress.
To establish by use of the recall that We the People are the backbone of our government, not its vassals and that the government must respond to the will of We the People.
Not the last and not the least is that we must re-establish fiscal responsibility to this nation which is heading for bankruptcy under the present administration with the aid and assistance of our congressional delegates.






We the people of the United States

face the greatest challenge in the history of our country

It is greater than the Revolutionary war by which our country was given birth. It is greater than the Civil war which preserved the union.

It is greater than World War II which was waged to eliminate the evils of fascism from the earth. It is unprecedented in world history!




It is indeed a rebirth of fascism in our time in our own country by those who have hijacked the government from their seat in the Administration and by their accomplices within the Congress along with all other inept members of the Congress who have allowed this tragedy to come upon us. Most of these are descendants of fathers who fought and some who died in World War II to free the world of fascism. Don’t know what PNAC is? Most Americans don’t. Read up on it http://www.crisispapers.org/Editorials/PNAC-Primer.htm

How did it happen? By lies and deception and by placing the Nation under a state of fear. But not by accident. It was a well orchestrated event including 9/11 and all the suspicions surrounding it. For 9/11 was a needed event ( As stated by the paper itself) ( Sin of Omission) to implement the Project for the New American Century (PNAC) and first kicked into gear by the ill-informed interference of the US Supreme Court in a States Right matter of the election fraud in Florida in 2000. That interference resulted in an illegal electoral college vote for George W. Bush.

It was further encouraged in 2004 by a conspiracy of silence among members of the Congress on both sides of the aisle to not speak of fascism or PNAC during the election campaign which they knew or must have known was taking over America. Members of Congress who knew and were silent are guilty of treason and high crimes against the country. If they didn’t know they are inept and should be kicked out of their offices as quickly as possible. We don’t need a rubber stamp congress to the further the evil empire builder George W. Bush.

I won’t go into the parallels between September 11, 2001 and February 27,1933 when Germany began to lose its democracy and the Third Reich fascist government began. Thom Hartman has done an excellent job of that. Thom Hartman | When Democracy Failed - 2005: The Warnings of History http://www.commondreams.org/views05/0222-22.htm

We cannot allow George Bush and company to entrench our country any deeper into the un-godly agenda of PNAC. Every American needs to stand up, listen, read and learn what is going on then decide to do something positive about it. I have suggested an:



American Revolution 2005

It needs to be done beginning now and by our use of the powers vested in WE the People
Volunteers needed in all 50 states. If you have the spirit of America’s founders and wish to participate in a non-violent recapture of the freedoms associated with the founding of America, please step forward and make yourself known. A coordinated effort in all 50 states will put America back where it belongs as a nation in a brotherhood of nations.

Contact me for state organizational plans. d.a.wallace@sbcglobal.net For starters copy, paste and print the following document and send it to each member of your state congressional delegation with a request they sign it and file it with the state secretary of states office.



UNILATERAL CONGRESSIONAL CONTRACT

State of ___________________________________
To Be Filed in the State Secretary of State's Office



(SPACE RESERVED FOR FILING STAMP)




For and in consideration of continued employment of the people of the State of ________________________,the undersigned member of the United States Congress hereby pledges to the electorate of the above named state, that I will actively work and vote to promote the impeachment of George W. Bush as President of the United States, Richard Cheney, Vice President and other civil servants involved for their conduct in:

Lying to the Congress and the public in order obtain support for the illegal war against Iraq.
For implementing the white paper of a Non Government Organization Known as the Project for the New American Century (PNAC) titled “Rebuilding Americas Defenses” which calls for global military dominance of the United States with unilateral pre-emptive military strikes against any nation deemed a threat to that dominance.
For violating international law in invading Iraq and for the deaths of innocent Iraqis and resulting unnecessary deaths and maiming of our own troops.
For using fear as a mechanism to establish fascism within the government.
In making this pledge, I understand that I will not be subject to recall by my constituency. I waive constitutional rights, if any, relating to continuity of my holding office and understand that in the event of failure on my part to perform as stated within a reasonable time from date, I may be removed from office by a complaint made to a competent court of my state by 3 or more members of my constituency. My only defense being a showing of performance.

This pledge relates only to the issue of the impeachment of George W. Bush, et al. I understand that from time to time there may be other issues which will require my pledge of support.



Dated this ________Day of _________________, 2005

______________________________________
Printed Name of Signator

______________________________________

Signature

______________________________________

Office held














Witnessed by: _______________________________________

http://recallthecongress.com/further_explanation_of_the_right.htm

>>>>snip

FURTHER EXPLANATION OF THE RIGHT OF RECALL

( For the less legally Minded )

The only assurance to prevent the hijacking of the country in the future is for Americans to assert the power of recall of congress members who refuse to abide by the Constitution and the will of the masses of the people in their inept support of a government gone awry.

Contrary to myth, Congress people can be recalled by their constituents. Any power not enumerated in the Constitution is reserved to the people. Recall is one of those powers.

In those states where there is a law establishing procedure to invoke the recall, it is available to the people to initiate it. In those
states where it is not procedurally established by law, the local state legislatures need to establish a procedural law whereby the people can initiate it. It has nothing to do with local legislators demanding something of D.C.

As an alternative to a recall procedure against a Congressperson, any member of congress can make a private unilateral employment contract with his/her constituents to pledge a certain conduct with penalties for failure to perform. ( a court ordered enforcement of the terms of the breach of contract or fired from job )

We the people can do it. You can help!
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understandinglife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-08-05 10:45 PM
Response to Reply #29
36. Thank you very much for posting this info. I am going to study it & ...
... share it with several folk, asap.

I'll PM DUer Land Shark with the link, as well.


Peace.
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FreedomAngel82 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-08-05 08:53 PM
Response to Original message
30. But wait!
I thought it was the democrats who had no plans for the country!!! So you're telling me it's really Bush? :sarcasm:
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understandinglife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Nov-08-05 10:43 PM
Response to Original message
35. Jehl in the NYTimes: Report Warned on C.I.A.'s Tactics in Interrogation
November 9, 2005

Report Warned on C.I.A.'s Tactics in Interrogation

By DOUGLAS JEHL

WASHINGTON, Nov. 8 - A classified report issued last year by the Central Intelligence Agency's inspector general warned that interrogation procedures approved by the C.I.A. after the Sept. 11 attacks might violate some provisions of the international Convention Against Torture, current and former intelligence officials say.

The previously undisclosed findings from the report, which was completed in the spring of 2004, reflected deep unease within the C.I.A. about the interrogation procedures, the officials said. A list of 10 techniques authorized early in 2002 for use against suspected terrorists included one known as waterboarding, and went well beyond those authorized by the military for use on prisoners of war.

The convention, which was drafted by the United Nations, bans torture, which is defined as the infliction of "severe" physical or mental pain or suffering, and prohibits lesser abuses that fall short of torture if they are "cruel, inhuman or degrading." The United States is a signatory, but with some reservations set when it was ratified by the Senate in 1994.

The report, by John L. Helgerson, the C.I.A.'s inspector general, did not conclude that the techniques constituted torture, which is also prohibited under American law, the officials said. But Mr. Helgerson did find, the officials said, that the techniques appeared to constitute cruel, inhuman and degrading treatment under the convention.

More at the link:

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/11/09/politics/09detain.html?ei=5094&en=50d901027e61366e&hp=&ex=1131512400&partner=homepage&pagewanted=print


Not to be picky, or anything, but since when did "... cruel, inhuman and degrading treatment under the convention..." behavior become something less than torture. This is sorta like Bush's giving the go-ahead as long as "organ failure and death" are not the result.

Just wait until some Blackwater merc or US Marine is captured and given the "... cruel, inhuman and degrading treatment ..." and watch Rush convulse and Cheney screech -- "TORTURE!!!"

It Is Tribunal Time in the United States of America, NOW.


Peace.

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understandinglife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-09-05 01:08 AM
Response to Original message
38. Milbank: Tough Times for the 'Sissy Six'
Tough Times for the 'Sissy Six'

By Dana Milbank
Wednesday, November 9, 2005; A02

It's in vogue on Capitol Hill these days to belong to a club. Senators negotiating a compromise over judicial nominees call themselves the "Gang of 14." When congressional leaders go to the White House, they are "the Big Five."

Then there are the half-dozen senators negotiating this week over a new intelligence committee probe: "The Sissy Six."

This unfortunate sobriquet, divulged by a committee staffer to reporters yesterday, comes from the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence acronym, SSCI. As it happens, the Sissy Six are under pressure to demonstrate that they don't deserve the name.

<clip>

More at the link:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/11/08/AR2005110801486_pf.html


It's only going to get tougher for those who remain complicit, or worse.


Peace.

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northamericancitizen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-09-05 12:30 PM
Response to Reply #38
40. kick. thanks UL for keeping us informed. nt
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Wilms Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-09-05 02:16 PM
Response to Original message
41. kick n/t
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understandinglife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Nov-09-05 08:06 PM
Response to Original message
43. billmon on Syria and Nuremberg -- Awaken America, It Is Tribunal Time
War Plan

Last year, U.S. intelligence agencies and military planners received instructions to prepare up-to-date target lists for Syria and to increase their preparations for potential military operations against Damascus.

According to internal intelligence documents and discussions with military officers involved in the planning, U.S. Central Command (CENTCOM) in Tampa was directed by Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld to prepare a "strategic concept" for Syria, the first step in creation of a full fledged war plan.

The planning process, according to the internal documents, includes courses of action for cross border operations to seal the Syrian-Iraqi border and destroy safe havens supporting the Iraqi insurgency, attacks on Syrian weapons of mass destruction infrastructure supporting the development of biological and chemical weapons, and attacks on the regime of Syria's President Bashar al-Assad.

William M. Arkin
Wag the Damascus?
http://blogs.washingtonpost.com/earlywarning/2005/11/wag_the_damascu.html#more
November 7, 2005


Article 6 of the Charter of the Nuremberg International Military Tribunal established the legal basis for trying individuals accused of the following acts: Crimes against peace: the planning, preparation, initiation or waging of a war of aggression, or a war in violation of international treaties, agreements or assurances, or participation in a common plan or conspiracy for the accomplishment of any of the foregoing. (emphasis added)

International Committee of the Red Cross
The evolution of individual criminal
responsibility under international law

September 1999


And so by means of careful preparation in the diplomatic field, among others, the Nazi conspirators had woven a position for themselves, so that they could seriously consider plans for war and begin to outline time tables, not binding time tables and not specific ones in terms of months and days, but still general time tables, in terms of years, which were the necessary foundation for further aggressive planning, and a spur to more specific planning. And that time table was developed, as the Tribunal has already seen, in the conference of 5 November 1937, contained in our Document Number 386-PS, Exhibit USA-25, the Hossbach minutes of that conference, which I adverted to in detail on Monday last. In those minutes, we see the crystallization of the plan to wage aggressive war in Europe, and to seize both Austria and Czechoslovakia, and in that order.

U.S. Prosecutor Sidney Alderman
Nuremberg Trial Proceedings Vol. II
http://www.yale.edu/lawweb/avalon/imt/proc/11-29-45.htm
November 29, 1945


More at the link:

http://billmon.org/archives/002335.html


It Is Tribunal Time in the United States of America -- NOW


Peace.



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bpilgrim Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 10:03 AM
Response to Original message
46. we have a PAPER TRAIL of their crimes of commission & omission on DU
10,000 miles long (at least ;->

and we are a FORCE to be reckoned with especially now that our version of events are coming to light.

the most effective way to begin to restore our image is to have this CRIMINAL REGIME marched out in HAND CUFFS.


more...
http://GlobalFreePress.com

peace
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understandinglife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 01:39 PM
Response to Reply #46
47. Agreed.
Peace.
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understandinglife Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-10-05 01:42 PM
Response to Original message
48. ReddHedd at firedoglake: "If you think the politicians are mad, you should
... spend a little time in America's heartland, where we send our young men and women off to war every single day because their economic opportunities are so limited that the military is the only way to pay the bills and feed their families. This is not a Machiavellian game to those of us who live in the world of reality.

Whatever you might think, Howard, the American public deserves no less than the truth about all of this. That includes well-earned criticisms of Dick Cheney, Karl Rove, Scooter Libby, David Addington, the whole of the WHIG and neocons and all of their cronies, and, yes, the Preznit -- because each and every person involved in making decisions to lie to the American public -- or even to just look the other way while someone else did it -- ought to be called to account.

Every last one of them.

Democrats -- and Republicans -- who are asking for this accounting are doing their jobs. It's been a while, so perhaps you can be forgiven for forgetting what that looks like. Maybe you ought to consider what your job is as well.

<clip>

From Apologies to the Choir on November 10, 2005

Link:

http://firedoglake.blogspot.com/2005/11/apologies-to-choir.html


One can hope that Fineman will read it and learn something about how to begin doing his job.


Peace.
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