Love is love, your special other being a Dem or Repub shouldn't matter

[ProudToBeLiberal]

Seriously. If you're in love with a person, their political beliefs whether conservative or liberal shouldn't matter.

I see a lot of people insulting people with different ideologies, calling them, "dumb, stupid, idiot, moron, and etc."

Anyhow, being in a relationship doesn't mean you can't try to bring them to the liberal cause. Just because someone has a different political belief doesn't mean you should just shun them.

Love is love.

[stray cat]

1. Agreed. I feel the same way about family members

[ProudToBeLiberal]

2. :high five:

[Yollam]

68. Family is diffferent. You don't get to choose them.

I have a couple of right-leaning family members whom I tolerate. But I don't think highly of them, even though they have some good attributes.

[fight4my3sons]

74. I agree.

Most of my family are republican. Am I supposed to hate them? Should they hate me because I am liberal?

[FreedomAngel82]

151. Right

I think I'm the only liberal in my family. I certainly don't want to be outcasted from them. Family is all I've got.

[fight4my3sons]

157. It's not only that.

I have young children now. They deserve to have their grandparents in their lives. I just refuse to talk politics with my parents and grandparents. I do have some very cool aunts, that in fact, directed me to this site. My kids are way too young to understand politics, my oldest is three, they don't need to be the ones to deal with the repercussions of family feuds over political arguments. We can all just agree to disagree on these things.

[GreenPartyVoter]

98. Me too. I married into a conservative family and love them all to bits

and pieces regardless of our differences on politics and religion.

[PowerToThePeople]

3. I have to disagree. Much of our "political" differences too much

to the core of human values. And, if someone in a true right-wing republican, their moral values would diverge so drastically from anyone with a true moral system that their would be (in my opinion) no way that the lefty could ever truly love them.

[Yollam]

70. ding! nt

nt

[madmunchie]

198. In some time periods maybe loving Republicans would be acceptable

This is a very different kind of time though. To be a full supporting Republican means to support hypocrisy, murder, lying, cheating, stealing, stupidity and arogance.....

I don't know about you, but how could any moral person that claims to be a Democrat love somebody that embraces all of that and be in their right mind and really care about their fellow man?

Personally, most of my family are moderate to conservative Democrats that HATE Bush. I pray for people that I know and care about (and I could count them on one hand) that support Bush and his policies.

[Obamarama]

4. I disagree. I have very little to do with my Republican sisters.

I was able to look past their wasted vote in 2000, but after they voted for BUsh in 2004, they completely lost my respect and I want as little to do with them as possible. There was no dramatic blowout or anything, I just started progressively cutting them out of my life.

They know I'm gay and they were well versed in the gay marriage wedge issue that was one of the disgraceful centerpieces of the 2004 Republican platform. They eventually asked me if there was anything wrong and I told them yes...you voted in favor of a system that will go to great lengths to limit my civil rights. I also told them if the tables were turned and they were lesbian and the Democrats were trying to limit THEIR civil rights and basically relegating them to second class citizens, I would break with my party and not give them my vote.

I don't hate them, but I don't respect them and I really don't trust them until they snap out of their delusional politics.

[msongs]

5. nazis need love too :-) nt

[ProudToBeLiberal]

7. hyperbole? nt

[TabulaRasa]

14. It's not hyperbole

You said people shouldn't be shunned just because of their political beliefs. Nazism is a political belief. If the statement doesn't hold universally, it's not true. Now, if you agree Nazis should be shunned just because of their political beliefs, your argument is that Republicans are not that bad. I agree they're not THAT bad (as Nazis). But they're pretty darn bad. It kind of reminds me of the argument that Bill Maher made to Ralph Nader. Would you vote for Kerry if his opponent were David Duke? Of course, he answered. Then your argument is essentially that Bush isn't that bad, Maher replied. Nader stammered but had nothing to say in response.

[TahitiNut]

6. We can love someone without choosing to live with them.

This, I believe, is one of the most difficult lessons some of us learn. I've been married twice and, due to incompatible "sleeping habits," obtained an annulment and a divorce. To say those were difficult times for me would be like calling Katrina a stiff breeze. The emotional stress was exacerbated by my presumption that I "loved the wrong person" and that, somehow, I made a mistake in loving someone who'd engage in such behavior. I now realize that's nonsense. I find far greater emotional balance in acknowledging my love for them -- people are lovable as a birthright. That I am a lover (not merely in the euphemistic sense, but in the real sense) is all about me. Realizing that I can love another person without needing something in return, even living with them, has been an emotionally healing experience - a realization that has enhanced all my human relationships. I have no obligation to commit to an interdependency (as opposed to codependency or dependency) with someone whose life choices are in conflict with my own. At the same time, I can respect their right to such choices and fully appreciate them as lovable human beings.

The worldview of anyone who, at this time, would continue to support this criminal cabal is just too incompatible with my own that the basis of communication needed to live together would be absent.

I think this is a lesson we probably each need to learn on our own. :shrug:

[Cha]

211. Definetly!

"The worldview of anyone who, at this time, would continue to support this criminal cabal is just too incompatible with my own that the basis of communication needed to live together would be absent."

My son told me yesterday that his father, my former husband, thought bush was one of the greatest presidents(sic) ever..I said "WHY?"..he said he didn't want to get into it with him cause he had already turned all hell loose when he told his dad on Thanksgiving that "bush had finally done something right..he pardoned a turkey"! His dad had to call him back and apologize for losing his temper. As you might Imagine..I feel somewhat vindicated in my own mind about seperating from him many years ago when I didn't quite understand why!

[TahitiNut]

231. While love is an essential prerequisite for a marital partnership ...

... such a partnership requires more than love. Without shared goals (and what goal could be more seminal than the social and political?), no "partnership" can exist. There are many people whom I love that I'd not live with. Thank God(dess)!

[Cleita]

8. I used to be more tolerant. Back before the Nixon

presidency, conservatives weren't crazy. Now, I find that the minute they find out that I'm a Democrat or a leftie, the hostility and rudeness from them is more than I care to put up with. It isn't us. It's them who have an irrational hatred of us and act it out.

[stray cat]

13. Its definitely them and often times its us.

There seems to be alot of labels and irrational hatred for people we know nothing about except for the label we place on them and that seems common enough for any extreme. Labeling people as good or evil while knowing next to nothing about them is always dangerous.

[TabulaRasa]

18. This I agree with

I think we're often hurting our own cause by treating everyone who votes Republican like shit, and assuming they're all completely evil and cannot be dealt with or talked to. I think there are a lot of cases of people who vote Republican, because they just don't like the Democrats. (I don't blame them; I can't stand most Democrats either ... especially of the John Kerry variety.) And often the reason for this is they can feel the condescension and contempt of the liberals and Democrats around them. Now, don't get me wrong. There are a lot of people out there who just suck. It's gonna take a lot of work to turn them into decent people. But I don't think anyone is beyond redemption. Maybe George W?

[Cleita]

35. Maybe I'm missing something.

I vote for issues and the people whose issue philosophy is close to mine. So these people and issues are to the left and sometimes extreme left of center.

I can't imagine voting as a Democrat just because I can't stand Republicans. It's what Republicans stand for and bring into law that I vote against. It's really the issues.

[Yollam]

76. I don't treat all people who vote GOP like shit.

If they are ignorant of what Buscho & the GOP are doing, I try to show them what's going on.

If they voted for GOP knowing full well about all that corruption, and that they are dead set on making the rich richer on the backs of the poor, then I will have nothing to do with them because they are scum.

[OrwellwasRight]

251. But there is a difference between "loving" you fellow man

(i.e., showing respect for, having tolerance for) and "love," the more intimate and personal relationships we choose to have with lovers/friends.

While I completely agree that "we don't help our cause by treating everyone who votes Republican like shit," I do not think that is the same as saying that we ought to be able to love in a romantic/marriage/living situation-type way someone whose basic values are diametrically opposed to our own.

And I am not saying that you implied these types of love were the same, I am just stating that I agree with your proposition-so long as I can make this distinction.

[FreedomAngel82]

152. For sure

There are people who I have known since I was a tyke who were all pro-Bush this last year. Why? Beats me. I never talk to them about politics but they're all good people who are just living their lives. People do change and grow up as well and their views change throughout time. I remember a long time ago my parents watching the RNC convention on tv and I used to want to be a republican. Than came along Clinton/Gore and I loved them both and really wanted to vote for Gore in 2000 even though I didn't know anything politically about them (just something about him). Sadly I wasn't old enough to vote yet so in 2004 I really just researched and read etc. and now I'm a very very far left liberal. So people do and can change. My mother used to be a republican but now she's an indie and George changed her and she voted for Kerry.

[TabulaRasa]

9. Sorry, I have to disagree

Political views are (or should be) as central to a person's life as anything else. They tell you almost everything you need to know about a person's character and sense of morality. Do you like picking on people who can't defend themselves? Or do you fight for those very people? Do you try to force your own tastes and preferences on others, or do you let other people pursue happiness in their own way (without hurting anyone else)? These are central features of a person's moral character; I don't see why they shouldn't strongly impact your feelings towards them. Would anybody suggest Nazis shouldn't be shunned, if you love them? No. The obvious question would be, "How could any decent person love a Nazi?" That's a political view. Now, if you think Republican political views are more or less innocuous (unlike the Nazis), make that point. I would strongly disagree with you, and the death toll in Iraq would suggest otherwise. But I just don't buy the whole "we can disagree without being disagreeable" crap. One of my favorite stories of Paul Wellstone, is that when he showed up at the U.S. Senate for the first time, he refused to shake Jesse Helms' hand. Look, if you want to preach "fags must die" or whatever, I'm not gonna restrict your free speech, but don't expect me to coddle you or treat you with respect. Just my two cents. Sorry for the length.

[undeterred]

10. No sex with Republicans

The purification rituals afterwards are just too much trouble.

[Yollam]

79. Besides, no republican would EVER have sex outside of marriage, right?

Right? LOL. Hypocrites.

[hopeisaplace]

108. rotflmao!

the "believe" system would cause me to gag..I'd need to be purified :rofl: :smoke:

[TahitiNut]

112. Yep. I'd sooner star in "American Cow Pie"

"This one time - in the cow pasture -" :silly:

[EFerrari]

11. I don't see how anyone but a lefty could possibly live with me.

A Republican would be hourly offended. A "compassionate conservative" might be moved to violence. lol

[Rob H.]

12. I'm gonna have to disagree, too

If I were interested in someone and then found out that they were a right-winger, that would be a deal-breaker for me. It'd be like a vegetarian (which I am) dating someone whose diet is 90% meat, imo, in the sense that'd it'd probably fall apart sooner rather than later.


Edited to add: With all the vile bullshit spewed by the likes of O'Reilly, Coulter, Hannity, Ingraham, Limbaugh, et al., lately, well, if someone I were interested believed even 1/10th the hate speech coming from just one of those pundits it'd be too much to overlook. Why date someone who looks down on you or believes you should be punished for embracing Liberal points of view? Life's too short to put up with that kind of condescending nonsense.

[For PaisAn]

15. I used to agree but

how can a liberal love someone who still supports these MURDERERS? The Republicans have gone too far and I'd feel like a hypocrite to associate with anyone who supports and therefore condones these evil people. This goes beyond ideology, it's peoples lives we're talking about now.

[jbnow]

245. You're right. It's not just politics

anymore.

It's changing everything America stood for, however shakily it stood on some.

I couldn't be drawn to someone who supports such horrors. I can barely be polite.

[gpandas]

16. "i would do anything for love...

but i won't do THAT."

[PowerToThePeople]

17. sweet.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

19. My love, my wife, is a socialist. I'm an anarchist.

We have gotten along for over 25 years. As time and Booosh have gone by she is moving to the left. It's pretty hard to imagine getting along with a Republican and keeping the peace.

[mondo joe]

20. What exactly do you LOVE about a person that can be that disconnected

from their values, their worldview, their morals?

Seriously -- if you love someone based on nothing but the their looks I suppose their politics might not matter. But if that love has anything to do with who the person IS it's another matter.

[ProudToBeLiberal]

21. uhh personality?

uhhh how they cuddle with you in bed? uhhhh how they make you smile when you are down? uhhh how they make you feel like you're on the top of the world? uhhh the feeling that you would die for them? uhhh?

[For PaisAn]

22. Sounds sweet but

they're still supporting murderers. So, for me, the things you mention wouldn't be enough to overcome that.

[ProudToBeLiberal]

23. hmm depends on your belief

I mean according to conservatives, you my good lady are supporting murderers when you advocate for pro-choice candidates. It just depends on the perspective. It's subjective.

[mondo joe]

27. Right - so how do you love someone you feel is supporting murder

or worse?

[For PaisAn]

29. Correct and

I wouldn't figure that an anti-choice person would want to be involved with me. You posed the theory that one's ideologies shouldn't matter, we've both demonstated that they often do, and I'm just taking it a step further and saying that they should matter. How could an anti-choice person have a relationship with a pro-choice person?? Wouldn't they feel like hypocrites and that they were condoning what they considered murder. I agree that it goes for both "sides".

[mondo joe]

32. The OP makes love sound like a random fluke rather than something that

happens between two people for who they are. As if you could just as easily fall in love with Hitler as your spouse, it's just a roll of the dice.

[ProudToBeLiberal]

37. hmmm

I guess you don't believe in "love at first sight?" It happens, and just because someone has different beliefs doesn't mean you shun them.

[mondo joe]

38. I believe in attraction at first sight. But if after that first flush I

learned the person was repellant, it sure wouldn't grow into love.

It's interesting that you could love someone who burns crosses on black family lawns so long as you like the way thhe snuggle.

[For PaisAn]

40. I'd laugh

if what you wrote wasn't so disturbing:
"It's interesting that you could love someone who burns crosses on black family lawns so long as you like the way thhe snuggle."

[mondo joe]

73. Isn't it true? You believe in random chance love. Why couldn't it be

with a KKK member?

[For PaisAn]

94. I think you meant this for the OP

I don't believe in random chance, love at first sight.
;)
If you reread what I wrote, it was in agreement with you.

[mondo joe]

104. My apologies - I did in fact intend it for the OP. n/t

[Lydia Leftcoast]

139. Right! You have to look at the whole person.

When I first moved here, I had a tremendous crush on a certain man--until I saw the way he interacted with his teenage daughter. There was something icky about it, nothing I could report to social services, but icky nonetheless.

My infatuation vanished instantly.

[mondo joe]

243. That's the thing about attraction - when it works out people say it was

"love at first sight". When it doesn't work out - which is often - people shrug and move on.

[For PaisAn]

39. I don't believe in love at first sight

It's attraction at first sight or infatuation at first sight. Love is something that develops if nurtured.

If you believe in love at first sight then what is the foundation?

[ProudToBeLiberal]

41. ummm

your soul mate? You just know that person is for you.

[shanti]

59. and then you wake up n/t

[Sapphocrat]

126. And chew your arm off at dawn's early light. n/t

[Coyul]

110. we were engaged by the end of our second date.

20 years later here we are.
(of course she's a lefty like me)

[shanti]

57. not any more...

"love at first sight"? i used to believe in it when i was young and stupid (not calling you young and stupid), but no more. lust at first sight is more like it. THEN you get to know the person and their belief system.

[ProudToBeLiberal]

62. perhaps the adage is true?

That when people become older, they become more conservative because they have a job and etc, while young people (especially college students) are liberal at heart and idealistic. I just hope that I have my idealism when I get older.

[mondo joe]

77. It's not conservative to believe that love is a bond between 2 people

that takes the whole of both parties into account, nor is it idealistic to believe love is something you catch at random like a cold.

[LSK]

225. the older I get, the more liberal I get

That old adage is probably another lie from the Republican propaganda machine.

And you are in LUST. You are in the honeymoon stage. When that is over, you have to LIVE WITH THAT PERSON. What do you discuss everyday for the rest of your life?

Sounds like you are headed for a divorce in the future.

[peacebaby3]

240. Just to let you know, I've become more liberal with age. I think

whoever said you become more conservative with age (Churchill maybe?) obviously wanted an excuse for his/her actions.

[Yollam]

82. Murdering cell clusters and potential people...

...is a far cry from murdering someone's full-formed, beloved family member.

[mondo joe]

26. How can personality be removed from values? From worldview?

You make love sound like a virus - something you catch that has nothing to do with WHO you love.

[For PaisAn]

30. Precisely

n/t

[ProudToBeLiberal]

34. maybe you're on to something

Love is a virus (a good virus). You ask "how can personality be removed from values." I see no correlation. It's like saying a person must be dumb because he's a drinker or a smoker.

[mondo joe]

36. To the contrary - unlike a virus love is not random as you seem to argue.

You argue that love has nothing to do with who the people involved are - it's just a random chance and you could acccidentally fall in love with ANYONE.

I disagree.

[Qibing Zero]

86. Exactly. I don't understand it any other way.

And if you love someone who is confused about things, or supporting things that completely go against everything you believe in, I would hope you try your hardest to enlighten them. =/

[For PaisAn]

24. The big question is, Do they support Bush?

There are conservatives who don't support Bush and his cronies. If this person supports Bush then no way, my tent ain't that big. If they don't support Bush then perhaps.

[ProudToBeLiberal]

25. does that matter when it comes to love?

love is love.

[mondo joe]

28. Sorry, but love isn't a free floating virus. If it has NOTHING to do with

who the person is, their views and beliefs, then you might as well have it for ANYONE at random rather than people in particular.

[For PaisAn]

45. It may sound extreme but

this whole subject in a way reminds me of a battered wife saying "But I love him". It's not exactly the same but some of it can be compared.


Lyrics to "My Man" from Funny Girl:

Oh, my man, I love him so
He'll never know
All my life is just despair
But I don't care
When he takes me in his arms
The world is bright all right
What's the difference if I say
I'll go away
When I know I'll come back on my knees someday
For whatever my man is
I am his
forever more
Oh my man I love him so
He'll never know
All my life is just despair
But I don't care
When he takes me in his arms
The world is bright all right
What's the difference if I say
I'll go away
When I know I'll come back on my knees someday
For whatever my man is
I am his forever more


Please, UGH.

[ProudToBeLiberal]

51. sorry i'm an idealist

I can't help it if I'm a bleeding heart liberal.

[mondo joe]

71. I don't see anything idealistic in reducing love to a random chance

that has nothing to do with the people. It is, rather, a diminishment of love.

[ProudToBeLiberal]

78. Love at first sight?

Finding your soul mate? You could say that finding your soul mate is a random chance...I mean when you meet that special person you just know that person is for you.

[mondo joe]

80. I think you have diminished love to something that happens TO you,

passively, rather than something you are involved in, actively.

Not very idealistic at all.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

140. I don't know how old you are, but I had the instant "realization"

that such-and-such a person was my soul mate several times, only to find out that my so-called soul mate was completely uninterested in me.

Sometimes it does click on both sides and grow into something deeper, but those times are the exceptions--and the times that we choose to remember. We tend to forget about the times when we became infatuated with someone within two seconds of meeting them but nothing ever came of it.

[seabeyond]

31. my man is so kick ass, husband, father, human being, that when

i hear someone say i could never be with a republican, i just dont respect them. it is a so what, you just dont know what you are missing in a human being. as you point the finger at the dumb, truly,........tis a mirror thing.

just as smoking isnt all that i am as a human being, being republican isnt all that my husband is as a person either.

there are just too many republicans in my life that i love to throw them all away. then who would the moran be

[For PaisAn]

33. I don't agree with your analogy

Being a Republican or Democrat is much more indicative of the kind of person someone is than being a smoker is. How can political beliefs be put on the same level and be compared to a physical habit?

[seabeyond]

42. well firstly, whether comparison is appropriate or not, we are willing

to dismiss a good human being because of the labeling be it repug or smoker. i have read many a smoking threads on this board. for different reasons, but then end result is there.

i am not so willing to dismiss a person over a single factor

secondly, it seems we have an airtight definition of who a repug is whether we are correct or not, so there is a lot we are assuming about a person, to judge a person, to then dismiss that person,........ on assumption

[For PaisAn]

48. But it's such a HUGE single factor

and yes, you're right about the airtight definition of a repug. That's why I clarified above that I couldn't associate with a Bush supporter

[seabeyond]

63. it is such a HUGH, wink, single factor

that is the silliness in both

but still i cant even differentiate between repug and bush support at this point, in rejecting a person cause there are so many factors in even that. more so if we are just talking republican in general. why it doesn't work for me, i cannot do it in single factor

[ProudToBeLiberal]

43. YES!! I agree

:)

[serryjw]

50. Lets analyze this

They support Bushit & Company, world domination & killing of innocent people
They do not believe in equal rights for all Americans
They believe they KNOW better on what I should do with my body than I do.
They believe that Corporate American is more important than the air we breath or the water we drink.
They do not believe that we have an obligation to educate ALL Americans.
They believe we have a birth right to take what ever we want from any country to continue 'our way of life'
They believe in 'personal responsibility' and don't want to help the weakest/neediest among us
They see no need to question any thing our government does.
Money and what it buys is their driving force..MORE, MORE & MORE!Consumerism is their mantra.


Can't imagine why I wouldn't fall in love with a Republican! :sarcasm:

[mondo joe]

88. To clarify: political party alone does not necessarily reflect those

things. One could be a replublican and not agree with any of those positions.

[serryjw]

95. Then they are NOT republican

they are just VOTING republican because they are ignorant

[mondo joe]

103. No. And even BEING republican doesn't mean VOTING republican.

Republican is a party name. It does not necessarily reflect votes or beliefs (though it often does).

[serryjw]

115. You make no sense

n/t

[mondo joe]

122. Let's explain it for you then: a person can belong to the

republican party for any number of, they can belong to the republican party and disagree with some, most or all of the party platform, and they can belong to the republican party without voting republican.

Chances are there aren't too many who would fit that bill, but they exist.

What about that do you have a hard time understanding?

[serryjw]

123. You are digressing from the original question.

No I can't love/marry someone who's beliefs are so different than mine. You are republican (democrat) because you either truly support their platform with you vote or are a kool-aid drinking ignoramus. Now, I agree that no one is going to agree 100% with a platform but there are some deal breakers. I can never understand the Log Cabin Republicans. This should be a deal breaker. The thugs want to take away all your civil liberties BUT you agree with their fiscal policies....WTF?

I am on several of the singles website....I tell everyone I have two deal breakers. 1) Must be liberal minded ( you can be a Green!) 2) must love cats. Everything else is negotiable

[seabeyond]

129. what if you disagree with everything about repug, but anti abortion

that is the deal breaker for you. all the other stuff matters not.

what if you felt that strongly about abortions. and you voted repug

then defining that person as people define ALL that vote repug wouldnt fit. a lot of people vote right solely on that issue

people on this thread arent being openminded. and they are taking pride in that closedmindness. it is the same closemindeness that the extreme repug, being defined here, has. and no, i couldnt marry that person, on either side. i know a whole lot of repugs that are significantly more open than what i am reading from liberals here on the board.

but it is much easier to paint everyone in one broad paintbrush of hate

[mondo joe]

148. I already addressed the original question several times over.

And I can't love someone whose beliefs are THAT different than mine either.

What I have tried to point out to you several times is that party affiliation alone doesn't necessarily tell you anything about someone's beliefs.

You may not know it but belonging to the party doesn't mean you necessarily vote for that party or its platform.

[serryjw]

154. I give up!

n/t

[porphyrian]

44. Yeah, but I enjoy talking with people I love.

If they don't share my ideology, they don't really have a lot in common with me, don't hang around the same people, don't have the same level of intellectual observation and reflection, etc. Having a relationship with someone of the other party at this point would have to be pretty fucking shallow, given the level to which politics influences our daily lives. If shallow love is what you want, then yeah, sure, you're right.

[ProudToBeLiberal]

46. ...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x5509236#5509644

[porphyrian]

47. "Yeah, but I enjoy talking with people I love." - n/t

[ProudToBeLiberal]

49. so how was your work today honey?

Did you know that jake said his first word today
OMG Charlie just go married?
Do you want to know what happened at work today?
That is so sad that the Roinson's family dog died.
Jens a teen now, I think we can extend her curfew.
I don't like what Bush is doing with our healthcare.

[porphyrian]

58. Those could all be a conversation with a co-worker.

And the last statement is likely to either get more political or have the subject dropped. Again, if you're OK with that shallow a level of conversation, that's your right. I like to have deep, intellectual conversations about philosophy and ideology with those I love, and that is seldom possible with a fucking republican unless I'm looking for a fight. I can't love the intellectually shallow and lazy, but you have every right to, if that's what you want.

[ProudToBeLiberal]

64. Honey what are your deepest darkest secrets?

Honey I never told you this, but my dad beat me up when i was a boy
I think my uncle was lustful after me.
I wish I was a bird, so I can be really free
I'm scared. Oh honey come here we'll live through this together
I love you baby.

[porphyrian]

85. Better, but you're still missing the point.

"Honey I never told you this, but my dad beat me up when i was a boy."

A Liberal Response: That's horrible! Let's not spank our kids. What do you think?

A Conservative Response: Well, at least you aren't spoiled or a welfare bum.


"I think my uncle was lustful after me."

A Liberal Response: Are you OK now? Should we look into therapy?

A Conservative Response: I can't say I blame him. Let's pray for him on Sunday.


"I wish I was a bird, so I can be really free."

A Liberal Response: What kind of bird?

A Conservative Response: Nothing's free, and thanks to Clinton, we're still paying too much in taxes.


"I'm scared."
"Oh honey come here we'll live through this together,..."

A Liberal Response: "...let's explore our options."

A Conservative Response: "...you, me, and this .357 Magnum."


"I love you baby."

A Liberal Response: I love you, too. Let's cook dinner together and then go see George Clooney's latest movie.

A Conservative Response: I love you, too. After you're done cleaning up the dinner table, why don't you come watch Fox News with me?


Nothing isn't political anymore.

[AspenRose]

114. My husband's republican and would respond more like your liberal

responses than your republican ones.

[porphyrian]

135. Yep. - n/t

[tx_dem41]

118. Most of the conservatives I know,

and I live in Texas, would be much more likely to give something very close to your "Liberal responses".

Either I know some very unique conservatives, or its an exercise on how both sides sometimes tend to mis-stereotype (or at least exaggerate) the other side.

[seabeyond]

120. both sides sometimes tend to mis-stereotype (or at least exaggerate)

seems to be a bit strong on this board, on this thread

[tx_dem41]

121. Seabeyond, I have told you this before, but I will say it again....

I think you and I, by living in Texas, have developed and honed an art of communication "across the aisle" that can be very constructive to others. Heck, we have to have somebody to talk to! :)

[seabeyond]

133. i just refuse to allow bush plan of division become a part of my life

or my childrens life. we have got to not fall for this or participate in this, or we are all losers. i wont make good people, fellowman, my enemy. doesnt mean i wont fight for what i believe is right, but i will do it with love, ....... not hate.

[porphyrian]

134. Oh, I was both stereotyping and exaggerating...

...to make a point, and to indulge myself in some creative distraction. I have no doubt that there are exceptions going both ways. This wasn't meant as the ultimate example of my argument, just one, and one I could come up with in about two minutes.

I still hold that a couple cannot have a very deep relationship without a shared, or at least compatible, ideology.

[ProudToBeLiberal]

165. huh republicans I know would respond like the liberals...

I think you are exaggerating to the moon.

[mondo joe]

84. What a funny idea of what a couple is. n/t

[ProudToBeLiberal]

166. It wasn't me that made the claim.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=5509236&mesg_id=5510117

[Individualist]

52. Disagree

Supporting murderers is indicative of a character disorder. That matters very much to me.

[ProudToBeLiberal]

53. make love not war nt

[shanti]

54. well, you can look at it this way

hypothetical situation and all..."what if" the government began rounding up all the dems to be put in camps and left the rebukes alone? would your spouse (saying he was a repuke) go with you?

undoubtedly, there were instances like this during the nazi rule. i know this is an extreme position, but just looking at all the angles.

personally, i wouldn't allow the relationship to get to the point of seriousness if we held vastly different political beliefs. we'd make each other's lives hell if we did. and for what?

i'm sure that there are others who don't feel as strongly tho - more power to them!

[ProudToBeLiberal]

56. Let's have the situation reversed

Like when FDR issued his executive order to put Japanese Americans into internment camp. Let's say I was a white person married to a Japanese woman and in love with her. Would I follow her to the internment camps. ABSOLUTELY

[Lydia Leftcoast]

141. But being Japanese American isn't a choice or an attitude

How would you have felt about a Japanese American wife who jumped up and down and cheered at the news of Pearl Harbor?

That's a closer analogy to what we're talking about here.

[ProudToBeLiberal]

167. how about

when Japanese person jumped up and down rooting for Japan in the world cup over the United States?

[Lydia Leftcoast]

221. I'll probably lose my American citizenship for saying this, but

sports are not important in the way that human lives are.

[leftofthedial]

55. weird definition of "in love" that excludes who the person is

and what they believe

personally, I can't repsect a repuke--not anymore

and I can't be "in love" with someone I don't respect

family is a different issue.

[mondo joe]

83. The OP believes love is a free floating thing that drops at random on

people and happens TO them, rather than a relationship between people.

[ProudToBeLiberal]

168. no I don't

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=5509236&mesg_id=5509644

[Err]

60. I wouldn't be in love with someone unless she's a liberal.

I don't see how I could ever be in love with a conservative.

[WhiteTara]

61. how could you love someone whose

belief system is antithetical to yours? I know they say love is blind, but I thought that was just lust and when you find out who that person is, you find things you admire and like, or things that you don't. Which is why I could never buy the Carville/Matlin marriage. Unless they thought more alike than he's more repuke than he let on.

[madfloridian]

65. That might have been true at one time.

But the types that support Bush and his cronies to the bitter end are not normal, and it would be hard to have a relationship. I have family members with whom we have lost contact because of their idiotic take on things that are hurting our country.

All they can do is spout how their Christmas is being taken away, how gays are ruining our country, and how liberals are evil and the cause of all sins.

How would one have a trusting loving relationship with someone who is acting like that.

[ProudToBeLiberal]

69. :o mad...

conservatives are human beings, just like gay people are human beings too.

[PowerToThePeople]

75. Conservatives are human beings?

No, they are green lizard beings. Swamp Rat, where are you?!

[SammyWinstonJack]

132. LOL!

:yourock:

[ProudToBeLiberal]

169. you'd disagree? nt

[Sapphocrat]

127. self-delete n/t

[Bunny]

66. Their actions are pretty important.

I know of several people who are proud George W. Bush Republicans. As nauseating as that is, they are kind, decent, and honorable people. They are people who help in their communities, give of themselves, and try to make the world a little better.

How they square their political beliefs with their actions, I'll never know. But they do.

[Yollam]

67. I suppose.

Lots of people fall in love with criminals or otherwise sociopathic individuals, but it's always been hard for me to understand why.

I could never share a bed and a home and a life with a person who was so dumb or so corrupt as to be a republican. Even a "moderate" dem would be difficult for me. If you don't believe in economic and social justice, you are not my friend, period.

[sandnsea]

72. You're right

Right after the election I was so so so angry that I swore I'd never talk to a Republican again. I just felt that I couldn't validate anybody who believed in the insanity of Republicanism. Then my sister got cancer, a Republican married to an even stauncher Republican. Then my father died, a Dixiecrat type Democrat, but gone just the same.

Even those with the most vile politics can be loved. Maybe you don't have to make them part of your every day life, like addicts or criminals, but they can be loved just the same. Anybody can love your friends, it's loving your enemies that takes real humanity. Some wise guy said that somewhere along the line.

[ProudToBeLiberal]

81. beautiful

you put it more eloquently that I ever could. Thanks

[Fountain79]

87. Personally

I believe that a person's political beliefs are a part of who they are but I don't shun a person for being a Republican. Most of my family are Republicans, they aren't bad people, and some of them are among the most generous people I know, they simply have a different way of looking at the world than I do. Republicans aren't Nazi's, even though are those on this board who are intent are labeling them as such. I have mostly dated democratic women but I did not specifically seek them out.

[tx_dem41]

89. Great post, PTBL.

There is often too much negativity and hate on this board (and many others). You can choose to lead a life full of hate or a life full of love. I'll choose the latter.

[ProudToBeLiberal]

170. Me too, me too

:)

[Vinca]

90. Some of you people are saints.

I'd rather be alone than have a Republican spouse and family.

[tx_dem41]

92. So you would disown them....

a son or daughter, if they were Republican? Or banish yourself from your parents if they were Republican?

[seabeyond]

99. wow, i think of the people i love. i think of those that give me so much

love. and have to come to wow to your post.

lets take one. my father. gave me unconditional love for 44 years. took care of me. gave me security and confidence. an honesty and integrity. taught me so much in life. but ultimately, loved me a lifetime.

that makes me a saint?

[Vinca]

102. I guess my perspective is different because 99.9% of my

family is dead and the few remaining are more liberal than I am. Still - I'd rather enjoy the company of my cat than a Republican.

[jbnow]

252. Some of the nicest people I know are

republicans who didn't vote for bush in 04.

There is nothing wrong with conservative values, though they are different then my values.
I wouldn't marry old time republicans but I could be friendly, I could respect them.

But all of that is different then having supported bush once he showed his true colors. I have some family that still support him. I stay distant.

So glad I don't have a kid who has turned out a right-winger.

When my son was in Jr.High he was dressed in a suit and tie off to a rally with a bush banner. (That was daddy bush) I said "Where did I fail?" I figured it was a way for the kid of a liberal mom to rebel and he'd outgrow it. He did.

He is married to a lovely woman who says the marriage is forever, unless he turns republican. Love her!

[sistersofmercy]

91. I agree and it's all about respect

Respect my opinions and I will respect yours. My boyfriend is Republican told me so on our first date. I asked who he voted for and he responded , "Bush." My retort was, "No you voted for the tax cut." He laughed and added that he would campaign for Hillary if she runs in 08. He meant it and still says he will. He used to get mad at me when I would grumble and curse about coverage of the war but now he understands. It's all about understanding. I don't believe most Republicans are the political junkies that Democrats are.

[seabeyond]

100. any repug man that can date a liberal is a pretty special man

my husband loves me, regardless of me getting in his friends face. his boss, his employees, even his customers. as much as we talk about how can we be with a repug, if they are painted to be such a horror, then how could THEY be with a liberal.

maybe, it is how special the liberal and conservative couple that can respect, and love and bond beyond these political views, and continue to accept understand and respect one another.

maybe those that can only be around like minds are limited.

[sistersofmercy]

190. Yes I agree

My Republican boyfriend has the kindest heart. I know it's hard for many on this board to believe that any Republican can actually do some good. I have Republican friends and liberal friends like myself, we all coexist peacefully. Even if we disagree we still respect one another's viewpoint. Heck I disagree with Democrats on many issues and I don't hold it against them. It is what is.

[mondo joe]

106. I'd have to do quite a lot of contortions to respect a Bush voter.

Especially a Bush voter in 2004.

[sandnsea]

116. Oh it's easy

When they didn't bat an eye when you needed to borrow money for an airplane ticket to your mother's funeral. When they were the first, after Dad, to step up to help put together the structures of your daughter's wedding. When they're the one to give you the hug when you're in the middle of a monstrous fight with your sisters. When they take you to the Clinton library when you know they can't stand Clinton. 101 things over the years. Especially when they have never ever ever ridiculed your political views. Yeah, I think my bil has been deluded because of the news he gets because of where he lives. But decent people are decent people, lots of people get deluded about all kinds of things, even liberals. So I'm not going to hold it against him.

[sistersofmercy]

197. If you love someone you will still love them when...

you disagree with them and even when you think they have made bad choices. I disagree with my fellow liberals all the time. I consider some of their choices to be bad ones. I don't however hold it against them. Furthermore, I don't consider their bad choices to be any better just because they didn't vote for Bush. I believe it's unproductive to cast bush-voting Republicans as bad people, it was just a choice they made. Whether I agree or disagree with their choice doesn't matter. They do have other redeeming qualities.

[mondo joe]

248. To the contrary: the choices people make DO matter.

And while I'd love my children no matter what - even if they make appalling choices - a spouse is another matter.

[DELUSIONAL]

93. Bull SHIT

[For PaisAn]

96. Yep

that about covers it.
:thumbsup:

[SammyWinstonJack]

131. second that!

:applause:

[ProudToBeLiberal]

164. Bull SHIT on your Bull SHIT

What now? :P

[seabeyond]

181. bah hahahh. that was my thought. hm, someone not open to

possibility of love to a repug, ergo never experiencing it, telling those of us who are able and do,...... that it cannot be done

what a quandry web we weave. to buy mistruths. lol lol lol

[UTUSN]

97. Sorry, Disagree. Wait a Minute, NOT Sorry.

A person's world view speaks to the core of who a person is---personal values, stance towards others and the world.

A wingnut is LITERALLY a dangerous, hurtful, degree of UNCARING being. Their social policies do ACTUAL, PALPABLE DAMAGE to mass numbers of people and the environment.

Therefore, if somebody is a wingnut, there is SOMETHING WRONG with them at a very deep level. It don't matter whether they are CUTE or FUNNY or CUDDLY----although I have yet to meet one who has attractive qualities like these in any significant measure.

[seabeyond]

101. op says republican, not wingnut. does that change anything? n/t

[mondo joe]

105. Actually, the OP also says political beliefs shouldn't matter, which is

rather more expansive than simply dem/repub.

[UTUSN]

117. Don't Matter If We're Talking abt 2 Politically Committed People

If both parties have THOUGHT about things and speak from their inner convictions, this means that one or both will have to SUSPEND a significant amount of their own selves just to tolerate the other person. In a not so far-out scenario, there would have to be a number of topics that these 2 people could either not discuss with each other at all or skip over with the agree-to-disagree deal.

If the ideal is a near-complete melding of selves, these two would have to WITHHOLD a large chunk of self from the other. Even at a pedestrian level, two actual operatives like CARVILLE and MATALIN have to NOT TALK about their jobs to each other.

Maybe I'm unrealistic but my view of a relationship is that it is SO COMFORTABLE that you don't have to be ON GUARD constantly against being attacked. SO COMFORTABLE that being with the other person is LIKE BEING WITH ONE'S SELF, where you can BE YOURSELF as though you're ALONE. I don't see that happening where there is a permanent war.

[seabeyond]

119. what if..........

you can be yourself and still be accepted. isn't that even more huge. what if i can talk about the very core of my political belief and not be ridiculed, doesn't that take a pretty huge man

and what if........i can value this man, that he can accept something about me he doesn't agree with and still, see me as the grandest of person. the person he wants to be with.

as i say, i have a man, that even though i readily express my political views to him and all those around us, his friends, employees, whomever, still...... i am the cats meow.

maybe what you are seeing is how you would be with someone that has polar views of yours, maybe it is your own limitation you see. maybe you dont have a realistic view how a partnership can be, in acceptance and love.

now, my husband has left the repug party and was enthused about kerry and voted kerry. but then my brother and father both voted bush, and still, i love them. and still, they love me. and still, we take care of one another.

[UTUSN]

130. Well, There ARE Some Types Who Willingly "Tolerate" for Self-interest

I trade e-mails with this Repuke who DOES "accept" discourse with Libs. He is all for the Poppy BUSH strategy of finding Clarence THOMAS types to fill Repuke slots in government. He projects a SEMBLANCE of "acceptance," but I myself am CONVINCED that a deep-down, (not so) hidden bedrock of wingnutism is RACISM. I'm CONVINCED of it. Yet this dude appears to be recruiting minorities and ON THE SURFACE is a pleasant, unassuming person.

If the personal situation you describe is actual, not hypothetical, good for you. I'm not sure that if I met those wingnuts in your life I would NOT find some less admirable traits TOO, since I'm convinced that just about every thing is a matter of the tip-of-the-iceberg---if there is a real commitment to wingnut principles in some form, it is a sign of bigger THINGS WRONG.

I've had a relative who is a wingnut and she wasn't pleasant in other ways and we don't have anything to do with each other. I broke off an e-mail relationship with a fellow Vietnam vet, who appeared in other ways to be an all right dude, over his ugly wingnutism.

It's the tip-of-the-iceberg. As for wingnuts-not-being-all-bad: It's the HITLER/LIMBOsevic syndrome:: HITLER loved dogs and LIMBOsevic loves Christmas. I'm posing the extremes to make my points. I'm sure your relatives are very nice.

[seabeyond]

138. you keep saying wingnuts, i am talking repugs. there is a differenc

and yes my husband is real not hypothetical. why he voted repug would be fiscal responsibility. nra, huntin fishin campin. (which he left in late 90's because something they did). he grew up in texas, that is what they teach, repug. they dont teach dem.

he is pro choice, individual rights, pot smokin (old days) music lovin mellow dude.

my father is a tradition man, old values, honest, hard work, fair pay. he is against abortion. he thinks people should follow the law, he does. if not they should understand they will be punished. pro business, anti capitalist. but he is a believer of pull yourself up by bootstrap. doesnt make him bad, just doesnt know any better. he hasnt met a person he hasnt liked, isnt willing to help. he would prefer being screwed than ever screwing someone.

these arent people to hate.

but they arent wingnuts. there are lots that voted for bush, or are repugs that are NOT wingnuts

[UTUSN]

143. I Hear You. For Me to Respond Further Would Be My Repetition n/t

[ProudToBeLiberal]

171. self delete

[Walt Starr]

107. I disagree completely

I cannot hold anything even close to resembling love for a Republican.

[Fountain79]

109. Just curious....

This isn't pertaining so much to relationships as it is to friendship. Has anyone ever had a friend that they cared about, but did things that they disagreed with? I take a pretty rigid stance on cheating in a relationship. If I am with someone and we are committed then I don't cheat. Still I have friends who are "players" and whom I wouldn't want ever to date my sister, yet they are still my friends. I think it's very possible to have someone in your life that you conflict with on a philosophical point but still manage to find commonalities.

[Ignacio Upton]

111. Sure, why not?

Politics is a part of my life, but so is family and friends. I have several conservative friends, although I rarely talk politics with them.

[Missy Vixen]

113. Depends on the relationship

Before DH, the man I was the most seriously involved with was (gasp!) quite the Republican. Interestingly enough, we didn't argue about politics; it was more point-counterpoint type discussion. We didn't break up over politics. We broke up over the fact that he had a job that necessitated his being outside of the US for weeks at a time, and I wasn't sure I could do that.

Julie

[SW FL Dem]

124. My grandparents cancelled out each others votes for 60 years

and together raised five kids

[seabeyond]

144. my mom and dad too. mom would always get a kick when dad

couldnt get out of work to vote. lol.

[SW FL Dem]

146. LOL My sister married a republican - the best part is he's Canadian

so he can't vote. We all tease him that if he applies for citizenship that we'll oppose his application because we don't want him to be able to vote.

[Sapphocrat]

125. How can you seriously love anyone who...

...doesn't share your core values?

It's not about "politics" -- I leave the politicking to politicians. It's a question of whether of not this person shares my most fundamental values, and whether or not our respective systems of belief are at least compatible.

I could never respect anyone who supports any of the basic tenets of modern Republicanism. Oh, I could "love" such a person, but only in the way I "love" humanity at large. But in love? Never.

I'd marry a transgendered bisexual Libertarian atheist before I'd so much as date a Republican, of any persuasion. The former wouldn't be my ideal match, but I could respect, love, and commit to a transgendered bisexual Libertarian atheist.

Of course, if you mean "in love" as in that giddy, first-blush, lusty, horny sort of crush thing, then forget everything I just said. If it's just sex, well... As my father used to say, all cats are grey in the dark.

[alarimer]

128. I categorically refuse to date right-wingers

If someone lists their political leanings as 'conservative", I don't give them a second look, even if they answer my ad. They get no response from me. It isn't worth it for me. I hate everything they stand for.

[SammyWinstonJack]

136. So I just asked my husband this very question and he said he wouldn't

love me if I were a repub/conservative and supported bushco and I expected and was grateful for that answer. Likewise for me.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

137. I can tiptoe around political subjects with my relatives, most of whom

I see once a week, at most.

But with someone I spent a lot of time with--no way, especially not someone I actually lived with.

This administration is so extremely awful that I have to wonder about the intelligence and/or morality of its avid supporters. As the Spanish used to say during the Franco regime: "Intelligent, moral, and a Franco supporter, you can be any two of the three."

And sorry, for me, lasting love (as opposed to youthful, head-in-the-clouds infatuation) includes respecting the other person's intelligence and sharing their sense of morality.

[PowerToThePeople]

172. Intelligent, moral, and a Bush supporter, you can be any 2 of the 3.

I love it!

:yourock:

[foreigncorrespondent]

142. And bringing them to the liberal cause...

...means changing the person you supposedly fell in love with. To me, when you begin to change the person you fell in love to more suit you, then you never really loved them at all. And that is the reason I would never date a repuke.

On edit: typo

[depakid]

145. Wow. Love a psychopath

Because that's in essence what you're saying.

Character doesn't matter....

Well, bullshit to that. At this point, anyone who willingly associates with the Republican party- knowing what they are and what they stand for- that's a person of poor character (and very likely someone who would stab you in the back if it came down to it).

No thanks, but integrity still means something to me- and life's too short to have people like that in my life... much less try to love them.

[BiggJawn]

147. You're right, it doesn't matter.

Because once I found out they were a ReTHUGlican, I'd be out of there.
The abuse isn't any less painful just because it's being delivered with a "Hey, nothing personal, it's just my Politics!"

[Celeborn Skywalker]

149. It depends.

If they were a reasonable Republican there would be no problem, but if they were a foaming at the mouth bigot or fundamentalist then I would have no compatibility with them and couldn't date them.

Relatives are a different issue, though. I love all my relatives, even the ones who are bat shit crazy.

[FreedomAngel82]

150. Exactly

I remember watching the documentary "The War Room" which is about the Clinton/Gore campaign from 1992. And in one part it shows James Carville leaving on a trip with who I think is his wife. She worked for the Bush/Quale team and he worked for the Clinton/Gore team. Politically they were enemeies but they appeared on camera to love each other and be all touchey feeling and stuff. So it is possible. My parents both voted for different people in the last election but we all voted for the same person for mayor. And it's the same with family and friends. One of my best, and one of my only, friends voted for Bush last year and I did Kerry.

[depakid]

153. I'm sorry, but the Carville/Matalin thing is just wrong

This isn't some game they're playing with politics- it's people's lives and everyone's future.

There's something very sick about that relationship.

Maybe they're both a couple of sociopaths.

[Conservativesux]

156. You are correct. Something is very wrong with that couple...

I wouldnt trust either one of them to be honest about it.

[ProudToBeLiberal]

212. how is loving another person wrong? nt

[depakid]

223. Didn't necessarily imply that

What I meant was there's some wrong with that relationship OR more probably- that couple.

It's downright pathological to be working every day to impose drastically different world views on hundreds of millions of people, with all of the enormous suffering that goes along with the far right vision- only to come home and kiss your supposedly Democratic spouse on the cheek, like its just another day at the office.

You'd have to be sick and twisted individual to do that. Like an Adolph Eichmann, I'd imagine.

[mitchum]

230. They are indeed a couple of sociopaths. Well paid sociopaths.

For them it IS a well-paying game of capture the flag. I find them equally contemptible.

[tirechewer]

155. It shouldn't, but it does

When you first fall in love with someone it's like your brain suspends reason. You see what you want to see and they can do no wrong.

After you've been married for awhile though and you begin to actually spend time talking to each other you have to have some values that you share to get you through the bad times.

If my spouse was a Freeper I think I would go stark, staring crazy. Even more than I already am. All that "compassionate" conservatism would wear out really, really fast.

[Pushed To The Left]

158. Thank you for posting this!

When my girlfriend and I met and fell in love, she didn't talk much about politics. We were both more moderate when we met, but she moved to the right and I moved to the left.

[ProudToBeLiberal]

176. no problem

I'm glad there are people who feel like the way I do. :)

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

159. I respectfully have to disagree unless it is a relationship where there is

true unconditional love..ie parent and child.

When it comes to a Love relationship, respect and values are the glue that holds that relationship together. Anyone that can support this sociopathic administration in my estimation is either severely mentally challenged or is totally void of moral fiber.

Now sex is a different story.

[seabeyond]

160. i guess what many on htis board doesnt see is, the people i

listen to support doesnt SEE him like we do. everyone here is imagining a repug seeng bush as we do and then suporting that. the people that support bush doesnt see the immorality. they listen to msm, msm doesnt protray bush in the lite we have the information, that is what is so frustrating. MOST people dont see what we are

so to suggest these people are mentally challenge or have no moral fiber is wrong. the are not being challenged by all bush lies and corruption because they dont believe it or KNOW about it

[OmmmSweetOmmm]

162. We are talking though about being in a relationship and if you are, you

would do your best to enlighten the object of your affections. Therefore, they would be informed. If with that information they still supported these crazies, could you possibly respect them?

[seabeyond]

191. i KNOW that people are strongly conditioned. we fight our own

battles of conditioning. i have fought it a lifetime, and hate it, and feel it easily, so i am beyond most myself. but i hear a lot of it on this board. in many different subject. it is a human condition. both repug and dem and independent and totally non particpants in politics are afflicted with

i have watched many repugs refuse the truth. not because they are bad or bigoted or anything evil, but because they believe their story they tell themselves. because they are fearful to look outside their beliefs.

of course i can see more to my fellow man, than what many on this board is allowing themselves. if i can do it with you all, i can certainly do it with a brother or father or husband.

and that ..... is love

i stay in my integrity. that pretty much honors what i allow in life and these people all, gracefully meets my requirements, and then some

[PowerToThePeople]

175. So, they are just ignorant? I can't love ignorance either. n/t

[seabeyond]

178. i betcha there are some areas you arent too awfully insightful

becasue of your experiences in life, or lack of them. i will see the light of who you are regardless of your imperfections. because knowing i too am perfectly imperfect, i appreciate those that can look beyond my imperfections and love me anyway

those people, are a huge plus in my life

most of them are republicans too

so limit yourself, this is your journey to do.

i cannot be convinced to limit myself in such a personally destructive way though

[PowerToThePeople]

182. I agree with that. Some areas I am probably ignorant too.

But, I am willing to listen to any views, etc. that are presented to me. Republicans typically shun any real discourse, if it goes against their hateful, bigoted, self-indulgent, self-righteous ideology.



"I will not hear truth, need to keep believing my hate."

[seabeyond]

187. listen to you, i am laughing. even after i say, the repug may not be

"if it goes against their hateful, bigoted, self-indulgent, self-righteous ideology."

you insist on this description. just getting the picture of hands on ears adn la la la la la happening.

oh no. so funny, and sure enough i look up to your post, and what do i see. but this is the universally funny of this world we create for ourselves. isnt it.

one of my favorite pictures. thanksgiving day with my repug family, my nephew was rootin for the cowboys. when i was laughing at the incompetence of cowboy quarterback and he was making excuses for his cowboys he finally put hands to ears and start talking. i laugh...... and to all my repugs i said, yup, just like a repug. was so funny to me

[PowerToThePeople]

189. Are you arguing against this statement of mine?

"if it goes against their hateful, bigoted, self-indulgent, self-righteous ideology."

Ok, how many examples do you need to prove this fact. In fact, if you don't see this yet, nm...

I have been following current events for 4-5 hours a day since * was given the office in 2001.

I have, imo, so much proof of my statement that I take it as "fact." Though it is not set in stone.

Please put out some arguments that would lead me to see otherwise, because I don't much enjoy hating people, but I will if they are willing to be as I stated above.

[Dem Agog]

161. I guess we define "love" differently...

I can't love someone I can't respect.

I can't love someone who supports murder.

I can't love someone who supports crime.

If I did love someone, and found that they were Republican somehow after the fact, I would realize that the person I thought I loved did not exist. I do not love any Republicans.

My mother is a Republican. I humor her. I feel sorry for her. I have an affection for her, but I do not love her. I don't think she's a good person. I certainly do not like her.

My brother is a Republican. I have no love for him, and haven't for ten years. I am sad I lost the guy who was worth loving, but I don't love him and don't speak to him anymore.

A person's beliefs do matter when you consider who you love. If I were Hitler's wife, I wouldn't have stayed married to him once he went crazy. Were I Laura, I would have left Georgie long ago.

Sure you can argue that love should be unconditional. And perhaps if I had children I would agree with you. For those you bring into this world and raise it is your duty to love them no matter how terrible they become.

But I do not have children. My love is conditional. I love a person, their thoughts, their beliefs. I do not love bigots, war-lovers, murderers, criminals and thieves, even if they're simply misguided. I pity them, and I humor them, and I never tell them that I don't love them, but it's not there, because I just don't respect them.

[ProudToBeLiberal]

173. life full of hate is not worth living

If my mon was a republican, I would love her the same way. I would die for her. My love her is unconditional. This is the nature of love, sometimes you cannot control it.

[PowerToThePeople]

177. Life full of hate is not worth living? That's all rethuglikans know.

And I agree, many of those lives should not continue to live, at least outside of a prison for crimes against humanity people.

[ProudToBeLiberal]

180. you hate republicans

Kind of hypocritical of you to agree with me when you yourself admit that you hate republicans.

[PowerToThePeople]

186. I hate evil. Republicans just happen to be evil, at least in their..

current form.

Now, fiscally conservative, I would not argue against that. That being one of the last hold-outs some of these people cling to. But, that republican ideal was long ago sold out to corporate thugs, but the sheeple are just beginning to see this.

[ProudToBeLiberal]

192. Bush hates evil too according to him

so I don't see your point

[PowerToThePeople]

195. Let us look at this thread.

You sir, are the extreme minority here. Not that it is wrong to be in the minority, but it seems most people are taking the same stance as me.

* is evil. There is NO question in that.

Pre-emptive war based on lies.
Tax cuts to the wealthiest 1% while 100,000+ are still homeless in Gulf.
Cutting Medicare/Medicaid, while giving "spoils" to big-pharma.
Letting Dick's former company rape US tax-payer for billions.

What do I need to say?

[ProudToBeLiberal]

202. Bush is not evil

I would venture to say that your view is a minority in the U.S.

[PowerToThePeople]

203. Holy fucking shit!!! I can't believe you just said * is not evil.

I will not reply to this thread again.

[ProudToBeLiberal]

204. Yay last word! Victory!!

You won't reply to this thread so, I will say it again Bush is not evil. Extremism on both sides is a bad direction to lead the country. Your ideas are on fringe. Too bad you won't respond. ROFL.

[ProudToBeLiberal]

205. just in case you edit

PowerToThePeople (1000+ posts) Sun Dec-04-05 10:40 AM
Response to Reply #202
203. Holy fucking shit!!! I can't believe you just said * is not evil.
I will not reply to this thread again.

"Capitalism, the scourge of humanity."


http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=5509236&mesg_id=5515263

[Dem Agog]

207. My life is not full of hate...

And not living a life where I have to love hateful people is a much happier one than the alternative.

I have tried to love Republicans, but they are terrible people. I am much happier loving those worthy of it, being generally fairly kind to the others, and just letting sleeping dogs lie. I just can't be bothered to put the emotional effort into loving inherently bad people.

[seabeyond]

209. "but they are terrible people. " wow. and they feel the same about us

no wonder no one can get along. they as passionately think this about you and i. we both know we arent terrible people. we dont live terrible lives. but..... in their eyes, that is what they see

you seem to do exactly the same. because again i will say, i know repugs and have known them all my lives, and i KNOW they are not terrible people

[Dem Agog]

214. I have always said...

I respect someone else's right to be wrong.

They are terrible people. They support criminals. They stand idly by while our country murders and torments others for oil. And tries to terrorize its own citizens to keep power.

If someone supports Bush then they support torture, murder and theft. They approve of mass murder for oil. They approve of Abu Ghraib and the numerous torture prisons going on in secret worldwide. They approve of tax cuts for the rich while letting poor people die en masse after a hurricane. No two ways about it. No one but the truly ignorant can like Bush and not be a terrible human.

Period. If someone likes Bush I believe they're guilty (and evil) by association.

[ProudToBeLiberal]

216. oh guilt by association?

Do you stand by FDR? If you do you were for the internment of Japanese-Americans. Do you stand by Lyndon B. Johnson? If you were then you are responsible for thousands of death in Vietnam.

[Dem Agog]

219. Hey look...

I know a lot of you in this thread are looking for validation for your love of people who support and stand for awful things.

I won't give you that. I don't stand by FDR, I wasn't even around then. I wasn't around for any of those things...

You love whoever you want. I don't care about you, or who you love, but for me, I only love people I respect and I don't respect anyone who supports Bush. If you can love people who support terrible things, then good for you. I don't care.

You want an example of indifference? Here it is: you and the people you love or don't love mean nothing to me. I don't know you and I wouldn't even know you were alive if we weren't having this hypothetical discussion.

So I'm done with it. I don't care enough about you, or anyone you love, to further explain why I feel the way I do. Do what you want. If you need to feel validated by strangers for your behavior, get it from some other stranger.

[seabeyond]

220. a lot of you in this thread are looking for validation for your love

my god you are so full of yourself. like i need any kinda validation from anyone especially on a stupid ass internet board with a bunch of people that dont know shit about me, my family or my life and the choices i have mde, allllll in the name of love. bah hahahaah

that you think for a minute i could be so insecure in myself, love or my people to need shit from you

i am just lmao. how arrogantly silly

wow

no, i am not looking for anything from you, except to say,..... you dont know. cause you arent in my life, not that you will listen, and maybe learn, and maybe experience a little growth

oh that is funny that i am looking for validation,.... wow.

my hubby of mine (use to be repug) just came in, he is off to grab our two boys we love so, to do some playing on our beautiful sunday, and man, he just walked thru looking so hot and cool, looking over at me with such a kick ass smile, i am off to play with them all. silly you.

i couldnt even get to the rest of your post

[PassingFair]

222. I'm with you, Dem Agog.

Your sparring partners surely ascribe to the axiom that:

"Love is Blind"

You, on the other hand, have your eyes wide open.
I could NOT MATE with a * supporter. Ever.

[seabeyond]

224. it is called closedminded. and you can be proud of that you

but it is still what it is. you are arguing from a position of not knowing. you are not in the experience. yet you refuse to listen. hand on ears. then you pat yourself and fellow supporters on the back for what a fine job you did. when really, you were just being intellectually lazy. too protect your own story, so it doesnt challenge your beliefs, that allow you to hate

[PassingFair]

232. If I want cheap spritual analysis, I'll call Benny Hinn.

Thanks anyway.
Is there any reason you would NOT let someone into your house?
Just curious.
If you can sleep with someone who backs a war on innocent civilians, who WOULDN'T make your cut list?

[seabeyond]

233. this. i wouldnt allow this is my door. i dont do hate. i dont care

who it ooozes out of. this is what i wont let in my door

[ProudToBeLiberal]

234. If you want good advice go here

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=104x5509236#5515812

[PassingFair]

237. what. ever. .....n/t

[ProudToBeLiberal]

238. talk to the hand!!! nt

[seabeyond]

218. anyone who votes dem is pro murder (abortion)

again i hear the same from the other side. how is it working for you. doesnt work for me.

[Dem Agog]

208. By the Way, You're Utterly Wrong On One Point

Your statement "life full of hate is not worth living" misses the point of love entirely.

The oppositve of love is not hate. It's indifference. I do not hate Republicans that I might otherwise "love" if they were decent people, I am merely indifferent toward them.

Hate takes a lot of energy and few people are worth that kind of effort. Certainly not a Republican relative.

[ProudToBeLiberal]

210. how is indifference on the other side of the spectrum?

[Dem Agog]

213. Love and hate both require feeling intensely emotional for someone ...

In some respects, hate is very much like love in that you allow yourself to become obsessed with and expend tons of emotional energy on someone. They could be considered the opposite sides of the same coin.

Alternatively, for someone to stop loving someone else, they don't usually leap to hate. They just stop caring. Indifference.

Therefore, the opposite of love is indifference. Hate is far too much like love to be its polar opposite. Just the way I see things.

[ProudToBeLiberal]

215. then what's the opposite of hate?

[Dem Agog]

217. Indifference.... As I said both are on the same side of the coin...

Love/Hate are too similar to be opposites, Indifference is the opposite of both in my opinion.

We can disagree, but if you don't get my point then I don't think I can explain it to you with any more responses...

[in_cog_ni_to]

163. Well, the problem is, I could NEVER fall "in love" with someone

who stands and supports everything I abhor. I just couldn't do it.

How could I love a person who wants abortion made ILLEGAL?

How could I love someone who wants social programs for the poor abolished?

How could I love someone who doesn't care about the homeless?

How could I love someone who is selfish and cares about no one but themselves?

How could I love someone who wants to take Social Security away from our elderly?

How could I love someone who wants to destroy Medicare?

How could I love someone who would support the likes of that Bankruptcy bill?

How could I love someone who thinks stealing elections and destroying our election process is OK...just as long as it's THEIR party doing the stealing?

How could I support someone who supports the likes of Tom Delay, the idiot and the cabal?

How could I love someone who supports PREEMPTIVE ILLEGAL wars?

How could I love someone who supports the MURDER of over 2000 U.S. troops and tens of THOUSANDS INNOCENT Iraqi citizens...men, women and BABIES?


Sorry. The DIVIDE between "Ideologies" Is TOO HUGE to ignore. You're right...love is love and I could NEVER love anyone who supports the above list.

[ProudToBeLiberal]

174. how could you not love

a person who keeps your fears at bay
a person who would chop off their arm just to be with you
a person who would go through hell just to be with
a person who worships you till death
a person that is so devoted that he would defend you to the death
a person who cries with you
a person who takes your kids to the baseball game
a person who suprises you with dinner after a hard days work
a person who loves you

[in_cog_ni_to]

184. As I stated in my previous post, the "ideology" would stop me from EVER

loving them and it would never get to marriage/children...as stated in your post. :shrug: The ideology would nauseate me. Love would never happen. I would never even DATE someone whose ideology didn't mesh with mine, let alone marry someone. The minute someone said they support the idiot...I would be on my merry way. They wouldn't get the time of day from me.

[mondo joe]

242. Could you love a KKK member who does those things?

Could you?

[Seabiscuit]

179. I don't buy it. Infatuation's one thing. Love takes time to grow, and

cannot flourish in the rancid soil of political disputes. Making love to a Repuke is bringing the right-wing fundie Repukesit waaaaay too close to home.

[seabeyond]

183. what if...... you meet this repug male, that is politically unaware

and lo and behold you see........ though he says he is repug, everything about him is not.

still a repug

in words, but not in action.

isnt that what time brings. the ability to see the beauty, the lite, the gift that we all are.

or must it only bring darkness, and evil......the darkness and evil, truly, not my personal experiences in life. sorry for those that only seem to experience this.

[Seabiscuit]

235. After that beautific journey through darkness, evil, then beauty and light

I wake up and discover he's actually a (as you mentioned, not just a repug, but a) MALE!

And so am I! Eeeeewwwwww!!!!!! :wow:

(from a happily married husband and father)

[WritingIsMyReligion]

185. I don't think I could fall in love with someone in the first place

who was intolerant, bigoted, etc. It would utterly turn me off. I often fall in love with people's personalities more so than their physical attributes.

[seabeyond]

188. intolerant, bigoted

we have decided they all are. but reality is they arent all intolerant bigoted. we can keep insisting that they are. that doesnt make them that though. only in how we see them. not in how they live their daily lives. i am sorry as a society we cannot figure that out. it hurts all of us. all over the place. and doesnt teach our children well.

[PowerToThePeople]

193. So, you are saying that your "republican" really is not.

Only in name, because they do not know the real definition of republican? And, yes definitions can change over time. But every action I have seen from these criminals tells me that the current form of republican is something that is tremendously hazardous to society, the environment, and humanity as a whole.

[seabeyond]

199. my husband is around me allllllll the time. and yes i watched him

hate listening to what i said, it almost physically hurt. i am real real blunt and non apologetic. he started doing massive research. he would work his ass off all day,. get up early, get to bed late. but.......this nonpolitical, not interested, busy in life taking care of me and the kids, providing for us wonderfully and trying to get a little play time in,...... was getting caught up with current affairs. i watched his struggles, two steps forward, one back,.... resolving lifetime perception of who the repug was, and who the repug is.

wasn't easy

bully for him

i am watching my two brothers and father doing the same now. they are seeing, disgusted feeling bad. they turn on fox, and it makes them feel better. that they aren't so stupid, they haven't fucked up so. this is human behavior 101.

but then i equally see this throughout humanity in all areas. it shouldn't be a hard concept for people, since we have all done this in different parts of our lives. i just chose to recognize this even with ............. the dark and evil repug. because that repug is people i have known all my life and i know better.

[ProudToBeLiberal]

194. hypocrital of you isn't it so?

So said that you wouldn't fall in love with an intolerant and bigoted person. You're showing the same trait. Major HYPOCRISY.

[PowerToThePeople]

196. omfg. So, you would love Hitler, Pol Pot, the Rwanda thugs?

There are some things that are just pure evil, and it is obvious to the world. No, you do not LOVE it one freakin bit.

[ProudToBeLiberal]

200. well

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=104&topic_id=5509236&mesg_id=5509379

[Bouncy Ball]

255. What?

It's not SAD that a person won't fall in love with a bigot. It's SMART not to fall in love with a bigot. Did I actually have to just type that out for someone?

Besides, most compassionate people would have a hell of a hard time falling in love with said bigot in the first place. That bigotry thing--it would be such a huge turn-off.

[LWolf]

201. I work with and live in a community of many conservative republicans.

I like them. I respect them. I disagree with their politics. I probably disagree with their religion. I teach their children, and can't keep myself from loving my students just because they are being raised in Republican households.

We get along well, because we leave religion and politics out of the conversation. It was considered good manners by my mother's generation. It also led to more community among neighbors and friends of different political and religious persuasions.

I don't hate anybody, for any reason.

I care about all people, for many reasons.

When I talk about the state of the world, I'll talk about the issues and values I care about. I leave parties and particular politicians out of the conversation, for the most part. It's hard to be a teacher without acknowledging the elephant of NCLB crushing the building, lol.

[kineneb]

206. love is love, but I still would not marry a repub.

I am happy with my aging 60s hippy hubby. I simply am not attracted nor wish to spend lots of personal time around people who are rightwingers, either of politics or religion.

My step-father is a repub, and while I like him and try to be polite around him, I maintain a certian distance. Little Brother, on the other hand, got a verbal reaming from me when he started spouting repub blather. It must have done some good: when I had to take time off of work for Hubby's surgery, Little Brother sent me extra living money (and I thanked him graciously).

[lukasahero]

226. If you're trying to change someone

(as in "doesn't mean you can't try to bring them to the liberal cause"), you're not loving them. You're loving what you think they could or should be but you're not loving them - as they are.

Yes, "love is love", except when it isn't.

[leeroysphitz]

227. Love anything..... n/t

[LSK]

228. i could never do that

Lust lasts a while but wears away. Then you have to live with them. Your profile says you are in college. Can I guess that you are still young? Listen to some of these people, they are not telling you stuff just to be an ass. They might have already gone through the hell.

In addition, I would assume a lot of the people here at DU are passionate about politics. It is a large part of most of our lives. So therefore, how can you SHARE that large part of your life with someone who might dissagree with that part of your life?

[ProudToBeLiberal]

236. I suspect many people are letting their distaste for republicans

getting in their way of judgement. love transcends all boundries. :)

[mondo joe]

241. I think you are letting naive notions get in the way of judgement.

Like believing love just HAPPENS to people.

[ProudToBeLiberal]

244. how about love at first sight?

or finding your soul mate?

[mondo joe]

247. How about fairies? How about unicorns? How about love built on

a relationship between two people that takes into account who the people are instead of how they snuggle?

[ProudToBeLiberal]

266. how about a person that makes you feel safe? nt

[Bouncy Ball]

257. Yes, I also have a distaste for people who

have no manners when eating. I have a distaste for people who don't tip. I have a distaste for rude, loud, obnoxious people. I have a distaste for bigots and racists.

I know, crazy me! I married a kind, compassionate liberal man and a big part of the reason I fell in love with him is BECAUSE we share the same values. If he were a big flaming bigot, I couldn't have gotten past the first or second date with him!

[mitchum]

229. Fuck that...it's just sleeping with the enemy...

no matter how much one may try to rationalize it.

[catmother]

239. i just read your thread and the responses. it seems like there's

a lot of hate out there. my husband and i have been together for 36 years. when we met he was liberal and so was i. as he got older he became more conservative and i have stayed liberal. we do discuss/argue politics but there is a deep love between us that can not be shaken by one's choice of a political party. i was on another thread yesterday where someone was calling my husband a dumbass among other nasty things. i thought we were the party of tolerance. i'm beginning to wonder about some of the people who posted on this thread. it seems like they have very little tolerance. my husband is a kind, gentle man who won't even kill a bug. to refer to him as a murderer or warmonger is insane. he didn't vote for bush. didn't like him, but he liked kerry less so he didn't vote. he's a registered independent. he does like mark warner -- he heard him speak on C-span and said he would vote for him. so he's not a hardass repub.

[yorkiemommie1]

246. 32 years this month

my husb voted for * twice. the 2004 vote put a real wedge between us because he refers to rw talking points whenever an issue comes up. he has given bushco a pass on everything they have done.

our world views have come into sharp contrast during *'s administration.


for instance: when i mentioned that so many of our soldiers had died in Iraq, he said, 'well, they would have been dead anyway." meaning, that their lives here in the U.S. would not have been worth much anyway so why not die in Iraq!

while i think that he has lost some affection for *, he still would give the rats in power a pass on every single issue, even those that have obviously hurt us.

my husband is a very hardass repub! he delights in being so.

[catmother]

258. but you're still together -- so obviously there's more to your

relationship than politics.

as far as our troops dying, my husband says what bush says "we're fighting them there so we don't have to here".

like i said he didn't vote -- the next day i was crying because kerry lost and my husband said "i'm sorry that your candidate didn't win". even though he couldn't stand kerry he at least cared about my strong feelings.

he said yesterday that he thinks one's political views have a lot to do with the people they work with. he works for a very conservative company and i imagine his co-workers are repubs. i, on the other hand, cannot be swayed by people around me. i am a democrat down to my very soul. i had a real hard time here in phoenix during clinton's impeachment. i mean, it was all over the news -- storekeepers had radios on, etc. and of course, i couldn't keep my mouth shut (i'm a former new yorker -- i speak my mind). i'm surprised they didn't "run me out of town on a rail." lol

but things are changing here too, kerry did get 45% of the vote.

[yorkiemommie1]

260. my husband says that too

i notice he has stopped listening to talk radio, though.

his mother ( the best MIL ever ) was strong democrat and a very fair minded woman, a union official in her day.

my husband is the only repub in the family and very anti union. i still think it's a remnant of decades old rebellion.

[catmother]

261. my husband listens to talk radio whenever he's driving -- my

mom has commented to me about it. when i get in the car with him i tell him "get that right wing shit off the radio". but you know, i studied hypnosis and when you're driving you're in an altered state so that shit goes right to the subconscious mind. i have a feeling that's made a big change in him. when we lived in new york he always listed to WBAI which had mostly liberal talks.

my husband's parents were both republicans. during the watergate hearings my father in law said "you watch nixon is just waiting and then he's going to lay his cards on the table". after the truth came out it broke my father in law's political spirit. he used to say "show me a politician and i'll show you a crook".

i, on the other hand, was born into a democratic family. my grandfather was president of a democratic club for as long as i could remember, but it wasn't my family that shaped by beliefs -- i've just always felt that the dems were for the little guy and the repubs for the rich.

well you've been together 32 years. are you happy? i think a lot of people just give up on a marriage as soon as there's a disagreement. my husband is my second, but both my sisters who are younger than me are on their third.

on edit: i just noticed a post down at the bottom where the person says that repubs hate gays. my husband is nothing like that, in fact, we have gay friends. wanna hear something weird, 4 of my gay friends are repubs.

[yorkiemommie1]

265. am i happy?

i tell my husband i will not listen to that rw shit either! i notice now that whenever i get in the car it's on an oldies ( REAL old oldies ) station. and whenever * is on tv, my husb. clicks right past him. used to hang on his every speech and word but he hasn't listened to ANY of his speeches for a year. ( DEEP down inside he knows what the truth is but still feels compelled to stick up for * whenever the subject comes up in conversations - odd ).

One would think that w/ a grandson in the Marines, he would be doubly
aware of this administration's maneuvers which could affect the grandson. i don't ask him, though. maybe he is.

i have always been for the little guy despite coming from a republican family , tho my mother was a democrat. ( my uncle was a bigshot repub. in hawaii ). my husband sides w/ the bigshots - as w/ so many, he identifies w/ the ruling class.

the nearest we have ever gotten to divorce was last year pre-election. we had raging arguments and frankly, i distrust some of his iinstincts because i can see him filtering incoming info thru a rw screen. still, he is pro-choice, a definite evolutionist, NOT a fundie - on the rare occasions that we have been to church, i have had to drag him; except for his repub. blinders, he is a very likable guy, just like your husband. gays, not an issue, either.
this is his third marriage; my first.

just as political divisions have crystallized and sharpened nationally, i think they have also done so on a more personal level, as witness many of the posts on DU over the past years. I know that just beneath the veneer of conversations that i have w/ people is the question of * and his effect on our lives. just today i said to someone that i felt depressed and he said, 'as soon as HE is gone' we'll all feel better. if another repub. gets elected, well, we will take it from there.

i wish the best for us all!

[catmother]

267. sounds like deep down he knows bush is wrong but he can't

admit it. hang in there. don't know if i told you but when my husband saw mark warner speak on c-span he said he would vote for him.

[Bouncy Ball]

256. Well, um, there you go.

He's not a bigot. He didn't vote for the warmonger. So where's the problem?

[catmother]

259. i'm not having a problem but a lot of people on the DU think that

it should be a problem. just read some of those posts.

[OrwellwasRight]

249. Yes and no.

I see your point, but, as for me, I could not fall in love with somebody whose political philosophy boiled down to "every man for himself," which essentially the starting point for all republican political arguments. (fyi, under this theory, the essential starting point for all democratic political arguments is "we're all in this together").

Lust yes, love no.

:dilemma:

[Bouncy Ball]

250. When their values are so diametrically opposed to yours?

Are you kidding me?

Yeah, right. I'm not going to fall in love with someone who thinks "gays are going to hell," with someone who believes in tax cuts for the rich, screwing the poor, and attacking countries that did nothing to us.

Those are basic VALUE differences and huge ones, too.

[mondo joe]

253. The OP does not believe in loving a person - the OP believes love just

HAPPENS to people at random, like an accident, and then they are simply linked.

It's a very strange and naive notion, but there it is.

[Bouncy Ball]

254. I agree, that is quite odd.

I mean, when you are getting to know a person, wouldn't you find out what their values are? While you're dating them?

I went out on a blind date with a guy who bragged about his cocaine use and then went on some sort of deranged racist rampage that would make Archie Bunker blush. He was pissed off that things weren't looking good for bush the first's chances for re-election, then spouted off about how morally superior repukes are. I asked him to take me home, immediately.

He stalked me for weeks, leaving notes on my car, following me to work.

My rule was ALWAYS "date liberals." I wish the friend who had set me up had told me he was a nasty repuke, I would have refused the date.

(I married a liberal!) :-)

[enki23]

262. hate the torture, love the torturer, i always say.

.

[Dances with Cats]

263. All we would do is fight....

n/t

[Balbus]

264. Agree 100%

To me, politics is 1/1000th of a person. Hell, I don't even know the politics of the person I'm currently seeing. And I don't really care :P