The "Jobless Recovery" - what YOU don't understand!

[drb]

The jobless recovery is designed specifically to do just exactly what it's doing. It's supposed to boost corporate profits, while holding down the number of available jobs to the absolute minimum.

Why? To hold down wages and hold down benefits, by maximizing the pool of workers to compete for those jobs.

Why do you think retirement benefits are being cut? To make older folks re-enter the labor market and compete for jobs!

Why are jobs being outsourced to India? To make competition for existing jobs tougher, and make sure you'll settle for $10 an hour when you used to get $15 an hour.

Why the welfare cuts? To get more people competing for jobs, and drive down the average hourly wage!

So the question becomes, "Why are the BFEE and the rupugnicans doing this? Who will buy all their stuff if we are all broke? What will happen to the economy if no one has any money to buy stuff?"

My guess is that the reduction in wages and benefits will more than offset a slight reduction in sales. Also, a greater percentage of your wages will go for "necessities" as opposed to luxuries, and you'll work more hours to make up for it.

It's all part of the BFEE plan to remake America in the vision of Mexico, where a few uber-wealthy families and corrupt politicians own the country. There is essentially no middle class, and the peasants live in houses with dirt floors.


Bienvenidos a su pais nuevo, amigos!
(Welcome to your new country, friends!)

[dwckabal]

1. History will repeat itself

>>What will happen to the economy if no one has any money to buy stuff?

See: The Great Depression, 1929-1941.

[knowledgeispower]

17. Yup

We're in the roaring twenties now.

It should only be a matter of time before the inevitable Depression follows.

[dawgman]

36. wrong you simply give people more credit than they can afford

and make it nearly impossible to declare bankruptcy. It's as easy as that. Now you get indentured servitude and FREE labor, yippee!

[WhoCountsTheVotes]

47. exactly - and who gets to create credit?

Rich people. Property owners. Corporations. They would NEVER allow the federal or state government to open credit unions and provide credit and liquidity to the average person, now would they?

Alan Greenspan said it himself - it's about the power to create credit money.

[knight_of_the_star]

44. I hope

That would be the ONLY thing that would wake this country up as to how bad we f***ed ourselves over.

[Name removed]

2. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[mhr]

5. Chubbles, One Believes Your Criticism Would Mark You As Dumb!

eom

[Tatiana]

6. Actually the poster is dead on.

[mhr]

3. Spot On Analysis! Wake Up! This is Our Future America!

eom

[bryant69]

4. I don't buy this

I mean, I think theres a lot more self delusion going on. The future you paint is certainly possible, and in some ways, is already here. But I don't think they are specifically trying for it. I think they are just looking at the short term benefits and ignoring the long term problems--the way everybody does, I guess.

Bryant
Check it out --> http://politicalcomment.blogspot.com

[mhr]

8. See www.conceptualguerilla.com, This Will Confirm The Hypothesis

eom

[WhoCountsTheVotes]

13. Of course it's deliberate, they say so everyday

This is called making the labor market "flexible". Why do you think the Fed jacks up interests rates to prevent the economy from "overheating" - meaning unemployment drops and workers can demand more money? The Wall Street Journal or the Financial Times praise policies that result in this, it's not like it's a big secret or anything. Yes, it is deliberate. Obviously.

[chiburb]

15. I do buy this...

Why don't you think they are specifically trying for this? The evidence is certainly there. For one example, instead of public works projects employing people and stimulating the economy (advocated by most "right" thinking folks), this mis-administration has chosen to give tax cuts to the rich. Don't tell me about that hypothetical "middle class" that benefited too... the 1 or 2 grand refund they got won't mean a thing when their jobs are sent overseas.

Krugman has been calling this "class warfare" for over a year, and more people are waking up to the fact that there will only be the "rich and the rest" if current trends continue. The poor don't exist, and the 'middle' is shrinking.

[sendero]

23. I agree...

"never attribute to malice what can be adequately explained by stupidity".

The problems we have were not deliberately engineereed, for one simple reason - they cannot be controlled. Anyone attempting to create a "tightrope" situation in the economy would be running the huge risk of it feeding on itself and going out of control.

Some think that even in a full-scale collapse, the rich would do ok. I disagree with that totally. There would be anarchy, and there are a lot of guns around. How many men would let their kids go hungry?

Our economy is the victim of idealogy, stupidity and benign neglect that turns out to not be so benign.

[TreasonousBastard]

26. I agree, too.

:tinfoilhat:

Both the country and the economy are too huge and diverse for anyone, or cabal, to actually control things.

There is, however, a common mentality of shooting for the bottom in expenses and the top of profitability and look only to the short term.

What's attributed to conspiracy is often enough just herd instinct.

(Not that that's any better)

[HPLeft]

7. Welcome to a new wave of protectionism

If this trend continues, protectionist sentiment comes back with a vengence by mid-decade, with the Kucinich argument making a great deal more sense, and having a great deal more traction, than it does today. Either the free traders put up in the next two years, or prepare to shut up.

If you want to know how bad the job market really is, talk to the corporate head-hunters. One of my best friends is a head-hunter who did fabulously in the late 90s, and is now strongly considering changing professions. He can't meet his expenses anymore. And people with jobs are worried about keeping them. It's a scary situation out there.

[mhr]

10. I Know, Been Unemployed For 39 Months!

eom

[HPLeft]

35. I'm right there with you

I've been out of my day job since May 2000.

[mhr]

39. Hi HPLeft! It's Good To Know I am Not The Only One!

After 1,427 resumes out the door and the resume posted on 105 job boards, I know that I am not going crazy. There is just not anything happening in professional employment right now.

Tough times!

[dawgman]

37. I am at six months today hooray!!!!!1

Go ME!!!!!!!!

[Nederland]

14. Agreed

Unfortunately, as the above poster mentioned, history will repeat itself. Protectionism helped bring on the Great Depression, and it looks like it will bring on the next one too. When will people learn that you can't fix your problems with tariffs?

[mhr]

21. Hi HPLeft, I Have a Similar Story

Last fall in a fit of desperation, I explored a return to school for yet another college degree.

My skills are technical so I sought some insight from a technical recruiter on trends he was seeing. He told me bluntly that the majority of his placements were temporary H1b and L-1 visa holders as American companies did not want to hire US citizens.

Further, he said that half of the recruiters he knew were already out of business and that he expected half of the remaining recruiters to be gone by the end of 2003.

He ended by saying that this was the worst hiring drought he had seen in his thirty years of business. Oh, he said don't waste your time on a technical degree. As an American, it would be a waste of time because these jobs are being outsourced.

He had no recommendation on future employment as he was worried about his survival as well.

[Code_Name_D]

28. Proteconisem

Is just another scare word used by the Repugs to keep the masses in line. No one I have heard, from Dennise K to Clark have been talking about proteconisem. The problem is that we, the workers, are the ones who are paying for the "free trade" for the corperations. There are now ZERO protections in place, and the corps are taking advantage of it.

[sangh0]

9. They don't want money. They want power!!

Money is just a means to an ends, and the ends is "control". They don't want to sell us stuff. That's work. They don't want that. What they really want is to tell you what to do, and have you do it.

In order for that to happen, you have to impoverish people.

[AndyTiedye]

27. The only jobs will be in the Army

> What they really want is to tell you what to do, and have you do it.

and the surest way to do that is to force you into the military, one way or another.

[Myra]

34. Bingo

EOM

[SoCalDem]

11. Military life looks pretty good when you cannot find a decent job

"poor folks" cannot afford college when the financial help dries up..

military life offers the "promise" of free medical, free dental, free training, cheap goods & services... only drawback, you might get killed..

[mhr]

12. Been There, Done That!

eom

[donsu]

19. ....or maimed, or forever ill, or insane

nt

[prolesunited]

31. Interesting article on the poverty draft

The U.S. military has long targeted the working class to become cannon fodder - from roping in starving Irish immigrants to fight in the U.S. Civil War, to today's Junior ROTC programs invading our impoverished public schools. The draft of the Vietnam era forced poor people and people of color into the military's lowest, deadliest ranks. Today's poverty draft is more devious, but just as effective. Recruiters are relentlessly using marketing strategies to woo low income youths with few prospects for education and good jobs into the armed forces. Painting the Army as a kindof job training and vocational school, and simultaneously as a financial aid institution, recruiters get youths in high school to sign up to the DEP (Deferred Enlistment Program). When young people try to back out of enlisting, recruiters often lie and tell them it is impossible or illegal to drop out.
http://www.homemadejam.org/vao/uptheante/uta-mayjune-povertydraft.html

[MadHound]

16. Spot on analysis, except for one thing

This was a trend that started during the Reagan/Bush I years, accelerated greatly during the Clinton years(NAFTA, WTO, H-1B visas) and is only being continued by Bush. It isn't W's program, he is merely carrying out his corporate masters' wishes, as do all good corporatist presidents, be they Dem or 'Pug.

[Jose Diablo]

40. Yes, Reagan started it

With the attack on unions, the air controllers. Each of the following administrations weakened unions a little more.

The media, as they always have, wrote articles that placed unions in a poor light. Look at the latest I remember, the UPS strike. The workers were "unreasonable". Do not look to the media for any decent publicity if you are a worker on strike. Look how any corruption in union officials is played like a violin in the media, yet barely a whisper on corruption in government/corporate ripoffs.

The counter-balance against corporate power has been and will always be strong unions. The government never GAVE the unions anything. It was always a fight and the government finally HAD to give workers rights or else the politicians lost politically. The only time government will side with the workers is when they have little choice, politically.

Why do you suppose the government is NOT interested in voter fraud? It is because by and large, the politico's would rather deal with the knowns. Vote fraud entrenches those in power.

There is no right/wrong in politics, only power. We Dems need to internalize this fact, just like the Reps have.

I really shouldn't say this, but where were the IT workers when they were asked to help keep unions strong?

Blue-collar work evolved into highly technical work, due to technology advances. The actual work of computer programming or network set-up is not that far from say, wiring the logic into a telephone switching device called a 'Marker' and that was definately blue-collar 'craft' work. It is too bad that the modern blue-collar technologists failed to listen to the experience of centuries of dealing with lords. It is pretty easy to get conned into thinking we are more than we are, especially if we are isolated. For my sins, I was conned too.

It is not too late though. As long as we are isolated we can be picked off, one at a time. Find a leader in the Dem party, form an efficient organization around him/her and get the voters out.

Most Americans are blue-collar 'craft'. Even if they wear a jacket and tie.

[knight_of_the_star]

42. There were only TWO Presidents

Who was good to unions, and they were both of the Roosevelts. The first one was the first president ever to side with a union during a labour dispute, the second one formed the Dept. of Labour and nearly always was on their side during the Depression. The AFL-CIO has some muscle and kick in it, but it needs a serious jolt of juice if it wants to be able to challenge the power of the corporations. If the tech jobs unionized that would make things radically different for the corporations if they were dealing with unions of people with degrees. The problem there is convincing them to unionize. I think that the only REAL professions that don't need unions are morticians, undertakers, doctors, lawyers, artists, musicians, and accountants. Beyond that, healthy unionizing PROTECTS a nation's economy rather than raping it, despite what the corporate media may be saying about unions. That and if we got a union-run and sponsored TV network and union reporters that could probably change things rather dramatically for the average Joe American. Now we just run into the problem of pulling that rather tall order off.

[Jose Diablo]

45. The hardest step is the first step

Thinking about it, how hard (expensive) would it be to set-up a studio and up-link to geo-sync sat for a cable TV show. Hardware doesn't sound too very expensive as things go.

Getting the transponder channnel on the sat may be difficult, do we have a strong Dem on the oversight committee for the FCC?

The final mile via local CATV companies should do it. Negotiating there I guess how much the CATV pay to carry the channel.

Advertising, some money here. Green companies?

Then there is the content for the news. Palast would be great asset in this area.

Actually, the Labour TV news sounds the easiest to me.

The brains behind the technology, this is much harder I think, but maybe people losing jobs may make them more agreeable.

How about doing what the building trades did, somehow get the trades people to agree to a agent to obtain work for them, then squeeze the hell out of corporations untill corporations agree to only use members, force the rest of the independents into the fold. Get rid of the "Right to Work" laws.

How to squeeze the corporations into agreements, I have no idea.

What power do the workers have? Withhold labour? Stop the money flow? Actually, collectively labour has far more power than the corporations. Far more than even the king (gov). It is only because the workers by and large are not organized to make their power felt that they are weaker than the corporations. All it would take is a one day strike, nationally, all workers. This pucker-up the corporate butts, you can bet on that. But that be hard to pull off, many are more or less satisfied as of right now. Of course we know, what the future will bring all these workers if things keep going the way they are.

The TV show could educate them though. I think the setting up the TV be the first step. Then gradually educate about the past and whats probable in the future.

Just thinking here. Throwing out thoughts.

[roughsatori]

18. I agree 100%

I was explaining this same thing to a friend the other day. He kept going on about the "no jobs" thing and I explained just what you have--"no jobs" is part of the plan. Notice how the media is already shouting about the economy making the most improvement in decades. I think it is because most of the members of the media come from a class that will not be directly touched by a "jobless recovery." On top of that they are owned by the oligarchy that controls the USA.

[qanda]

38. You are absolutely right about the media

You would think that after that 7.2% increase, there were no hungry, homeless, unemployed or uninsured people left in America. Like everything just suddenly improved for us all. I know so many people who are still out of work that it is ridiculous.

My b-i-l is an executive for a bank and he said that he received over 140 applications for the lowest job they have available in their system. Many of the applications were from people with advanced degrees. Think about it, if these people are willing to take such a low paying job with a good deal of education, it says to management that there are many positions which can be replaced with people who will settle for a lot less money than those who are currently working in those jobs.

[tom_paine]

20. Nicely, truly and succintly said, sir!

You are absolutely right.

It's clear to me that the Busheviks don't much care for how the American Experiment has turned out, and they are in the process of turning us back to a more Third-World existance.

You are absolutely correct, but it's an open secret to anyone who's looking.

[grannylib]

22. All too true.

[sandnsea]

24. The Investor Class

They keep talking about this Investor Class. That's the writing on the wall. You'll either be part of the Investor Class and make your money from capital investment off the labor of third world countries; or you'll work for peanuts in the U.S. serving the Investor Class. There isn't going to be alot of in-between. It's so obvious, I don't see why some on this board are trying to deny it.

[Redleg]

25. Cheap-labor Conservatives in action!

Another example of what is wrong with unregulated capitalism.

[caledesi]

29. They want to steal our country, just like they stole the election.

You think these people care that 3 million jobs have been lost? Hell no. These thugs want to make it so bad for "the rest of us" that hopefully we will leave and they can have their "white bread" rich country.

[rucky]

30. We The Consumers

Are the only ones who can reverse this trend. The government won't do it, and even if they did, their powers are limited.

Unless you absolutely can't avoid it, only support owner-operated businesses. Reward good businesses and punish the bad ones with your dollar. And try to buy stuff that's made in the USA.

It's difficult, and we may not get everything we want, or have to pay a bit more for it. Small sacrifice to make. Consider it an investment.

[KayLaw]

32. Like they say...

Economic depression returns money to its rightful owners.

[Myra]

33. Agree totally

Another part of the BFEE's reason to
trash the economy and elimiinate jobs
is so that many will have no alternative
to enlisting in the armed forces.
Then they finally have a (low paying) job:
killing Iraqis and Afghanis, and risking/losing
their own lives for oil and the United Corporations
of Amerika.

[Woodstock]

41. and ravage the land - we live in the barren toxic dump

while they live in a luxury bubble

they are DESTROYING our environment - amazing that people just don't know to what a HUGE extent this is happening

[knight_of_the_star]

43. They will wake up to it

But when they do it will already be too late. If people think that the disasters that we are having NOW are bad, just wait until they have incurred the full wrath of the Mother...

[Avalon Sparks]

46. To answer your question~

So the question becomes, "Why are the BFEE and the rupugnicans doing this? Who will buy all their stuff if we are all broke? What will happen to the economy if no one has any money to buy stuff?"


Because these jerkoffs never look at the big picture on ANY issue.

I've been thinking for 3 years that the race to the bottom of wages will eventually equal a race to the bottom on sales/profits.

[srpantalonas]

48. Thank the DLC

and sign the petition: http://www.crystleforsenate.com

[mhr]

49. Job Losses Continue Despite GDP Growth Hype

Hi All,

A short snippet from CBS news indicates that US job losses continue.

Despite the GDP growth hype last week, it is clear to those unemployed
that the US economy is still faltering.

Enjoy
------
http://cbs.marketwatch.com/news/newsfinder/pulseone.asp?dateid=37929.4167939815-809414361&siteID=mktw&scid=0&doctype=806&

10:00am 11/04/03

U.S. October layoffs surge 125%, Challenger says By Rex Nutting
WASHINGTON (CBS.MW) -- Layoff announcements from U.S. companies more
than doubled in October to 171,874, the highest in a year, according to
the monthly tally released Tuesday by outplacement firm Challenger Gray
& Christmas. October is typically the largest month for layoff notices,
as companies slash costs at the end of the fiscal year. The Challenger
survey is not adjusted for seasonal factors. Layoff announcements had
fallen for three months in a row before October's 125 percent increase.
In October, the auto industry sacked 28,363 workers, followed by 21,169
in the retail sector. Telecommunications companies cut 21,030. So far in
2003, 1.04 million job reductions have been announced.