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DoveTurnedHawk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 03:04 AM
Original message
Clark Attacks the Military-Industrial Complex (NPR TRANSCRIPT)
Edited on Thu Nov-06-03 03:04 AM by DoveTurnedHawk
A caller asked a question about Eisenhower's warning about the military-industrial complex.

General Clark: "I think General Eisenhower was exactly right, I think we should be concerned about the military-industrial complex. I think if you look at where the country is today you've consolidated all these defense firms into just a few large firms, like Halliburton, and with contracts and contacts at the top level of government. You've got most of the retired generals are one way or another associated with the defense firms. That's the reason that you'll find very few of them speaking out in any public way. I'm not. When I got out I determined I wasn't going to sell arms, I was going to do as little as possible with the Department of Defense because I just figured it was time to make a new start. But I think the military-industrial complex does wield a lot of influence. I'd like to see us create a different complex. And I'm going to be talking about foreign policy in a major speech tomorrow, but we need to create an agency that is not about waging war but about creating conditions for peace around the world. We need some people who will be advocates for peace, advocates for economic development abroad, not just advocates for better weapon systems. So we need to create countervailing power to the military-industrial complex."

http://nhpr.org/view_content/5339/

Approximately 35:30 - 37:00.

DTH
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incapsulated Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 03:06 AM
Response to Original message
1. whoa!
Does he get more cool by the day or what?

:)
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Hieronymus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 03:10 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. Absolutely
he does. What a man.:kick:
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DemExpat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 06:49 AM
Response to Reply #2
11. WOW.....Wes confirms my intuition each day!
He really is fab!

:kick:

DemEx
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_NorCal_D_ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 07:07 PM
Response to Reply #1
82. Yes,
He is one incredible candidate! B-)
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Wonk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 03:10 AM
Response to Original message
3. Y'know what? He's really starting to grow on me :-)
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fabius Donating Member (759 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 03:15 AM
Response to Original message
4. Department of Peace anyone? n/t
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SahaleArm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 03:29 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. Department of International Development.
Sounds better:).
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nadinbrzezinski Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 03:38 AM
Response to Reply #4
6. Yep and you know what those two
would make a good team... Denis knows the politics and Wes knows where
the skeletons are buried...

God this is strange... we are truly seeing a revolution in the body politic
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spindoctor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-07-03 03:00 AM
Response to Reply #4
97. Hehe, my thought exactly
What a brilliant idea. How ever did he come up with that?
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 03:53 AM
Response to Original message
7. That's my "got to be" President
This man has been sent down to us as a gift.....

Plus he is electable as all "Hell"....
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DemExpat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 06:52 AM
Response to Reply #7
14. I feel exactly the same about him, Frenchie.....
Now, if he can only survive......

(My paranoia acting up again! :-()

DemEx
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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 05:24 AM
Response to Original message
8. Thanks DTH, you're always coming through
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OKNancy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 05:28 AM
Response to Original message
9. In the same interview, he talked about something
that interests me personally -- arts funding. He said arts were the soul of a country. So now I am firmly convinced that he is a true man of enlightenment ( like our founders )

One of my favorite quotes from James Madison goes something like this: I will study war, so that my children can study science and technology, and then my grand-children can study art and dance, which is the highest form of learning.
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DemExpat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 06:57 AM
Response to Reply #9
16. He sounds too good to be true, but I'll trust him.
A modern Founding Father.....just in time?

DemEx
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moz4prez Donating Member (591 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 06:26 AM
Response to Original message
10. another notable quote
Edited on Thu Nov-06-03 06:27 AM by moz4prez
Gen. Clark: I think we're at a time with American history that's probably analogous to, maybe, Rome before the first emperors — when the Repubic started to fall.

Knoy: That's pretty dramatic, General Clark.

Gen. Clark: I think if you look at the pattern of events, if you look at the disputed election of 2000, can you imagine? In America, people are trying to recount ballots and a PARTISAN MOB is pounding on the glass and threatening the counters? Can you imagine that? Can you imagine a political party that does its best to keep any representatives from another party — who've even been affiliated with another party — from getting a business job in the nation's capital? Can you imagine a political party that wants to redistrict so that its opponents can be driven out entirely—

Knoy: (something unintelligible)

Gen. Clark: Absolutely, it's a different time in America and the Republic is - this, this election is about a lot more than jobs. I'm not sure everybody in America sees it right now. But I see it, I feel it. That's why I had to run.
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DemExpat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 06:50 AM
Response to Reply #10
12. Could it be that Wes really does 'get it'?
I think so.....

DemEx
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OKNancy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 06:52 AM
Response to Reply #10
13. Amazing isn't it?
Clark can say these things with no regret. He has that gravitas.
I can see it all now, the mainstream media will call him a fruitcake, but his voice is so important.

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RandomUser Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 08:17 AM
Response to Reply #10
26. Good quote
Thank you for sharing it. This is going to be one hell of an important election.
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WhoCountsTheVotes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 12:28 PM
Response to Reply #10
45. Damn! Clark has brass balls
"In America, people are trying to recount ballots and a PARTISAN MOB is pounding on the glass and threatening the counters? "

About time somebody said it. Gore isn't president because he and the DNC wouldn't stand up to this.

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Tatiana Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 12:45 PM
Response to Reply #10
53. I will NEVER forget the fury induced by this image!


1. Tom Pyle, policy analyst, office of House Majority Whip Tom DeLay (R-Tex.).
2. Garry Malphrus, majority chief counsel and staff director, House Judiciary subcommittee on criminal justice.
3. Rory Cooper, political division staff member at the National Republican Congressional Committee.
4. Kevin Smith, former House Republican conference analyst and more recently of Voter.com.
5. Steven Brophy, former aide to Sen. Fred D. Thompson (R-Tenn.), now working at the consulting firm KPMG.
6. Matt Schlapp, former chief of staff for Rep. Todd Tiahrt (R-Kan.), now on the Bush campaign staff in Austin.
7. Roger Morse, aide to Rep. Van Hilleary (R-Tenn.).
8. Duane Gibson, aide to Chairman Don Young (R-Alaska) of the House Resources Committee.
9. Chuck Royal, legislative assistant to Rep. Jim DeMint (R-S.C.).
10. Layna McConkey, former legislative assistant to former Rep. Jim Ross Lightfoot (R-Iowa), now at Steelman Health Strategies.

I'm so glad Wesley Clark is finally just being himself, telling the truth, and taking it to those Republican SOBs! GO WESLEY!

Everyday, I like him more and more.
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in_cog_ni_to Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 06:55 AM
Response to Original message
15. Well! Thank You!
Edited on Thu Nov-06-03 06:56 AM by in_cog_ni_to
you have just finalized my decision of who I will contribute to, campaign my ass off for and VOTE for. Clark's my man. I swear, every day, the man says something that makes my eyebrows go up! Last night I caught his ending speech to Planned Parenthood and it said a lot about "the man" Clark, he TRULY cares about women's issues! He just gets better and better.

I've got to go to his site and get some T-Shirts and donate to the next President of the United States!

Thanks for the post!
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DemExpat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 06:58 AM
Response to Reply #15
17. Yoo hooooo!
Let's get him elected.

:bounce:

DemEx
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in_cog_ni_to Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 07:11 AM
Response to Reply #17
18. I feel
REALLY, REALLY good about Clark! He feels very comfortable to me, as a candidate AND President. I will do EVERYTHING I can to get him elected!
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_NorCal_D_ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 07:12 PM
Response to Reply #18
83. Hear, Hear!
B-)
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moz4prez Donating Member (591 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 07:20 AM
Response to Reply #17
19. another excellent excerpt
Edited on Thu Nov-06-03 07:21 AM by moz4prez
Knoy: How does being shot at in battle like that shape the way that you see the world afterwards?

Gen. Clark: I think you always understand what it's like to be at the pointed end of American foreign policy. And you come out of an experience like that proud of having served but determined not to put other people through it unless it's necessary as an absolute last resort — absolute last resort. You know I woke up the other morning I looked at that picture of that helicopter that crashed. I was broken hearted. Especially seeing it shot down. I was broken hearted. I thought about the troops, I thought about what they must have felt like, I thought about the families, I thought about the notification process. I may have known some of the people in the helicopter. I know all the commanders there, they all served with me at one point or another. They're all good men, they're doing everything they can do.

Gen. Clark: But war is ultimately — it's about tragedy. It's about accidents, and incidents, and people who die, and most of the deaths are unnecessary, and . . . war creates its own intensity of hatred. We saw it in Viet Nam and some of the acts perpetrated by American forces. And there was no doubt they were reciprocated, or even initiated by the Viet Kong themselves. There were terrible things done to American troops who were captured: mutilated, tortured, cut to pieces. We knew that. I knew that before I went over there. And in Iraq, there's no doubt the reciprocal acts of violence create a mounting intensity of hatred and dislike between the partisans. It's why it's so very hard to change people's minds by force and why you don't want to use force unless it's an absolute last resort.

Gen. Clark: It was a fiction, the idea that we could somehow come into Iraq, overrun the country, take it over and kill a bunch of people and they'd welcome us as liberators. They weren't occupied the way France was occupied by Germany in World War II, and we weren't their cousins the way the Americans were the cousins of the French. And so it was nothing but a fiction . . . sort of a dream, a longing to create — to look backwards and create, to recreate a moment of national greatness that was somehow different in scene and hindsight. We need to look ahead and create our own national greatness in the future. We don't have to go back and try to recreate what the greatest generation did. We should honor them, but we've got a great generation here in America today and I don't want to see a single more . . . an additional soldier die in Iraq as part of that generation, over a misguided dream.
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SammyWinstonJack Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 02:03 PM
Response to Reply #15
70. I'm on board!
This man is amazing!
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CWebster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 07:28 AM
Response to Original message
20. talk...who doesn't want to believe, but
"In mid-2001, the retired Army general had joined the Stephens Group, the parent company of a privately held family financial concern in Little Rock, Ark., as a managing director for merchant banking. That December, Acxiom Inc., a Little Rock data analysis company, signed a $300,000 contract with Stephens to obtain Clark's help in lobbying the government for homeland security business.

Clark joined Acxiom's board at the same time, and after leaving Stephens earlier this year, he signed another, $150,000 consulting agreement with the company. That contract was terminated when he announced his campaign for president last month, according to Acxiom, but he had remained a paid board member.

A privacy group has filed a complaint with the Federal Trade Commission against Acxiom and JetBlue Airways Corp., which has acknowledged that, in violation of its own privacy policy, it had given information from about 5 million passenger records to a Defense Department contractor."


http://www.newsobserver.com/24hour/politics/story/1024378p-7186738c.html
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OKNancy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 07:52 AM
Response to Reply #20
23. He's given up all his board positions
and actually has given up everything to run for President.

We all know you don't support Clark. Constant posts with the same old negative spin aren't going to change anyones mind.

The fact that Clark is out there saying these things is wonderful and it is good for every candidate, including Dean.
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CWebster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 08:33 AM
Response to Reply #23
29. You are wrong
Actually, strategically, I think Clark might not be a bad choice for #2 in the present political climate- and if you were really paying attention you would know that. Personally, I am not comfortable with him encouraging our young to join the military and I would prefer those whose life experience is based primarily in the military to have subordinate positions of power.

But I do not think he should be immune from being tested or excused from
the hard questions that many Clark supporters would like to shield him from.

My contention is with a few of his especially rabid supprters mostly, and not so much Clark.
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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 08:42 AM
Response to Reply #29
30. Count me as a rabid supporter...
and I am so rabid because Clark is so
awesome and would set a great precedent for our
country and our party's future.

I think Clark is the last hope of our party before
we head off into at least 4 more years of darkness
and soft-core fascism.
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CWebster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 08:50 AM
Response to Reply #30
32. "Awesome" is not the word I would use
He isn't particularly dynamic, but he is polished and intelligent. Even if I have apprehension about him, I will give you that.
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Renew Deal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 12:44 PM
Response to Reply #32
52. Cweb, why not be excited or rabid about a candidate.
That will be our (Democrats) advantage going into the general election. I think Clark gives us a chance to significantly improve this country over the next few years. The others are either under-qualified or has beens. But of course ABB.
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TLM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 01:44 PM
Response to Reply #52
63. Clark represents an improvement only if his words are true...

and so far nothign he has done has demonstrated that his words are anything other than an empty script.
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SahaleArm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 01:48 PM
Response to Reply #63
66. And you support Dean?
Edited on Thu Nov-06-03 01:48 PM by SahaleArm
A Libertarian turned liberal Democrat; obviously no one payed attention to how he governed Vermont.
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OKNancy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 08:52 AM
Response to Reply #29
34. I pay attention
and your logic is unfathomable. He's alright for Vice President, but not qualified for President? As long as your guy is number one, is that it?

You haven't paid attention to Clark's positions while he was in the military. As far as the political climate is concerned, the political climate suggest Clark above all the rest....if you were paying attention.

Your condesending tone is getting you nowhere, by the way. And tit-for-tat, I have no problem with Dean, just his rabid supporters.


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CWebster Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 08:58 AM
Response to Reply #34
36. Nope
No experience domestically and enough questions to blow him off in the area where he has assets - by particalarlly rabid political opponents.

You need to get real about that. He can't win if he is coddled.
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in_cog_ni_to Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 12:09 PM
Response to Reply #36
41. Except,
he has a Master's in ECONOMICS. I think he is a hell of a lot more qualified to deal with domestic issues than the moran squatting in the WH. He also was in charge of his troops....all aspects. Healthcare, daycare, housing and "hometime" when away on leave. I think the man is intelligent enough to do the job. Is there such a thing as being over-qualified for President?

Rhodes Scholar, Master's of Economics from Oxford, First in his Class at West Point... and, oh yeah!, a Four Star General & Supreme Commander of NATO in a time of conflict!

Here's a fun thought for next year: Bush v. Clark debates. Not to speak for Mr. #1 at West Point Rhodes Scholar, but....... BRING 'EM ON!!! I SOOOOOOOOO look forward to THAT debate!
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fujiyama Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-07-03 06:42 AM
Response to Reply #41
101. He got a masters in Econ?
Wow, usually don't the people go for the masters in philosophy at Oxford when they're a Rhodes scholar? Econ is a pretty challenging degree and I would imagine it's extremely quantitative as well at a prestiguous institution.

Damn, that's all the more impressive. While it may not be the same as implementing policy, it is nice to have someone with academic knowledge about a subject so important for governance. It shows that he would actually understand Greenspan's jargon and would replace someone like him, if he realized his policies were crappy.

I've gotta...This is one wacky ride. I started leaning toward Kerry right after the '00 selection, then leaned Dean because of his forthright opposition toward the war, then leaned back to Kerry because I realized Dean didn't click for me, all the while hoping Clark would enter the race. While he didn't seem all that great at first he seems to have picked up pace. I still like Kerry and believe he is a grat public servant, but I wish he had avoided bringing gun control up in the earlier debate. It's a losing issue. I have always liked Clark since he defended liberalism on Maher's show...and this interview clarly shows that Clark knows what's going on.
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in_cog_ni_to Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 12:10 PM
Response to Reply #36
42. Except,
he has a Master's in ECONOMICS. I think he is a hell of a lot more qualified to deal with domestic issues than the moran squatting in the WH. He also was in charge of his troops....all aspects. Healthcare, daycare, housing and "hometime" when away on leave. I think the man is intelligent enough to do the job. Is there such a thing as being over-qualified for President?

Rhodes Scholar, Master's of Economics from Oxford, First in his Class at West Point... and, oh yeah!, a Four Star General & Supreme Commander of NATO in a time of conflict!

Here's a fun thought for next year: Bush v. Clark debates. Not to speak for Mr. #1 at West Point Rhodes Scholar, but....... BRING 'EM ON!!! I SOOOOOOOOO look forward to THAT debate!
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TLM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 12:42 PM
Response to Reply #29
48. I agree web... Clark says all the right things.


If one were to go just by what Clark is saying... now that his audience is made up of democrats and not republicans, then yeah he's saying all the right stuff.

However he also said all the right things about Bush and Reagan when he was speaking to a republican audience. So I can't trust what he says. I have to go by what he has done... and what he's done is work as a lobbyist, commit war crimes in Kosovo, and flip flop on support for the IWR.

I mean here we see Clark talking about the MIC, yet he was a lobbyist who made full use of the MIC to get his company a contract for the airline no fly list database under homeland security. So again his actions seem to show his words are empty.



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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 07:53 AM
Response to Reply #20
24. Actually, cwebster you're missing the bigger point...
Edited on Thu Nov-06-03 07:55 AM by familydoctor
Clark actually tried to moderate such so as to
protect personal privacy and liberty, more than one person
is on record saying this. You can't deny it and
you can't deny that Clark truly is a man of enlightenment.

Though the media may pander to Bush's interests, the
truth will set us free.

No one can deny that Clark "gets it" and that of all the
folks up there, he (and perhaps Kerry) knows what he is
talking about.

My current rankings:

1.) Clark
2.) Kerry

Other than that, the rest are not Presidential enough.
Edwards will be, but he needs more age and experience
for me. I would also like him to distance himself more
from litigation lawyers (they have bankrolled over
half of his donations (from what I have read)).
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in_cog_ni_to Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 07:33 AM
Response to Original message
21. THIS man is the man to
be in the WH at this time in our history.

Gen. Clark: It was a fiction, the idea that we could somehow come into Iraq, overrun the country, take it over and kill a bunch of people and they'd welcome us as liberators. They weren't occupied the way France was occupied by Germany in World War II, and we weren't their cousins the way the Americans were the cousins of the French. And so it was nothing but a fiction . . . sort of a dream, a longing to create — to look backwards and create, to recreate a moment of national greatness that was somehow different in scene and hindsight. We need to look ahead and create our own national greatness in the future. We don't have to go back and try to recreate what the greatest generation did. We should honor them, but we've got a great generation here in America today and I don't want to see a single more . . . an additional soldier die in Iraq as part of that generation, over a misguided dream.

He KNOWS war! He UNDERSTANDS the repercussions of war! He is what this country NEEDS! Yes indeed. Go Clark!

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NicRic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 07:43 AM
Response to Original message
22. Still uncommited, leaning>Clark 1
Iam still uncommited to any of the Dems running for President in 2004. I was looking very close a Dean ,however Iam turned off by his stand on the W.O.D., and I honestly just dont see Dean winning in 2004 .Now Clark is starting to get me excited ,I think as more and more voters see him and listen to what he is saying , the more that are going to move to his corner .To me the most important thing is putting up someone that can and will win in 2004. Anybody but bush , is job #1 ,and whoever ends up running against bush will have my vote !
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RandomUser Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 07:58 AM
Response to Original message
25. Spot on
He gets it!
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OKNancy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 08:25 AM
Response to Reply #25
27. Just saw Clark on CNN
He certainly has a fast learning curve. He got in all he wanted to say. Negative toward Bush, yet not a bad thing about another Democrat.
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Justice Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 08:32 AM
Response to Reply #27
28. Great On CNN
He is great. I wonder why the press keeps saying the Democrats aren't offering any new ideas on dealing with Iraq when Clark and other democrats do nothing but offer great ideas?
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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 08:45 AM
Response to Reply #28
31. Because the press is laden with befuddled buffoons...
Clark offers hope, optimism, and a new strategy.

He turned Soledad's baiting to divide us into
a call for unity and optimism.

I like Soledad though, it's a lot of the other
goofs in the media I don't like.

No matter what, Clark is coming on strong lately.

Clear, concise, optimistic, honest, forthright, Presidential.

He is out-classing the rest IMO.
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HootieMcBoob Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 08:51 AM
Response to Original message
33. He is the only one who could get away with it
talking about the military industrial complex...

Kerry might be able to but he was in the military for a short period of time really. Clark made it his life and reached the top. He knows just what it's all about, in the same way that Eisenhower was able to coin the phrase and warn us of the potential for big trouble. Since then anybody who talks about the military industrial complex is labeled a kook. We all know it's real and that the problems are now so deeply embedded in the system of government and media that it seems to me almost hopeless that any real change could take place. But if we're to even begin to adress the problem we need someone like Clark. Again -- Nixon to China.
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DoYouEverWonder Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 08:54 AM
Response to Original message
35. I still afraid to get my hopes up
That there is actually a human being on this planet who is willing to run for president and can get America back on track.

Clark is starting to handle the media very well it seems. Everyday he makes another part of his plan known. Instead of getting pulled into the issue of the moment, he is focusing on his message and taking the high ground. What's exciting is that so far he got a lot of good ideas and the experience to be able to make those ideas happen. Instead of complaining about what is wrong he is looking forward with ideas about how to fix the mess that W has gotten us into. I'm almost ready for my bumpersticker.





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DemExpat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 08:59 AM
Response to Reply #35
37. High hopes do set one up for disappointment.....
But I willingly choose to risk this when everything about Wes Clark tells me he's the real deal...
(not that he's perfect, mind you....:-))

:kick:

DemEx
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moz4prez Donating Member (591 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 09:20 AM
Response to Reply #37
38. ba dum
:nuke:
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DemExpat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 11:36 AM
Response to Original message
39. Kick for those who missed this this morning.....
:kick:

DemEx
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SeattleRob Donating Member (893 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 12:00 PM
Response to Original message
40. Clark....
I am a Dean supporter, but I like Clark. I think he is a class act. I think his presence in our party is a big plus.
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WhoCountsTheVotes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 12:13 PM
Response to Original message
43. So Clark is stealing Kucinich's ideas again?
"I'd like to see us create a different complex. And I'm going to be talking about foreign policy in a major speech tomorrow, but we need to create an agency that is not about waging war but about creating conditions for peace around the world. We need some people who will be advocates for peace, advocates for economic development abroad, not just advocates for better weapon systems. So we need to create countervailing power to the military-industrial complex."

At least give Kucinich credit for the Department of Peace!
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Renew Deal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 12:29 PM
Response to Reply #43
46. Department of Foreign Relations.
He has talked about this before. The peace part is new, but I guess him and Kucinich have something in common. When he talked about it in the past he has said that he wnated to use this Dept. to manage how we hand out aid and things that aren't Dept. of State related. I think he wants to close two other departments. I also think that he wants to use this to eliminatie the NED (National endowment for Democracy) which is a gov't funded organization.
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RandomUser Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 12:43 PM
Response to Reply #46
49. That would be a good start
Getting them to be accountable for foreign aid use and not hidden with lots of strings to fund arcane and questionable foreign activities.
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WhoCountsTheVotes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-07-03 02:46 AM
Response to Reply #46
95. I'd say Clark and Kucinich have something in common - common sense
for one. Of all the "mainstream" candidates, Clark has said what needs to be said better than most if not all.

Clark specifically said we needed a couterbalance to the corporations who are selling weapons - salesmen who go to every dictatorship, warlord, communist, and crony capitalist to sell them missiles, machine guns, and bombs. If we had peace-loving, intelligent Americans making connections with other countries instead of these weapons dealers we would all be better off.

Who is saying this? Clark and Kucinich. Maybe they are not so far apart after all. Much better than the vague speeches from politicians who never did much anyway.

Clark has an unblemished, if controversial, record of service to our country in the armed forces. Kucinich has an unblemished, if controversial, record of a fearless progressive and populist representation of Americans in his district. I respect and like them both.
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TLM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 12:44 PM
Response to Reply #43
50. Hey he didn't give Dean credit when he adopted his health care plan

so why give DK credit when he adopts his department of peace idea?
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Renew Deal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 12:46 PM
Response to Reply #50
54. He didn't adopt Dean's plan.
Edited on Thu Nov-06-03 12:49 PM by Bleachers7
Dean's plan is for full coverage. Clarks is full for Kids and full access for everyone else.
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TLM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 01:38 PM
Response to Reply #54
60. Yeah, I know, Clark pulled parts from Dean's plan...


like he was stealing parts of someone's car.

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KittyWampus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 12:44 PM
Response to Reply #43
51. Kucinich "Stole" The Idea From George Washington
Who way back in the 18th century suggested the idea and left money from his estate for its implemenation.
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jokerman93 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 02:17 PM
Response to Reply #43
72. What's wrong with Kucinich
as Secretary of Peace and Economic Development in a Clark administration?

His idea? Ok. Dennis -- Go for it!
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WhoCountsTheVotes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 04:43 PM
Response to Reply #72
75. in my dreams!
:)
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cally Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 12:25 PM
Response to Original message
44. That sealed it for me!
I just sent money and volunteered. Clark has the gravitas to tackle the major problems of our day. I think he can win!
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DoveTurnedHawk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-07-03 10:14 AM
Response to Reply #44
102. AWESOME!
I'm so glad people found this statement helpful! :-)

DTH
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Scott Lee Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 12:32 PM
Response to Original message
47. This is a good thing
I'm still somewhat suspicious of his 11th hour turn to the Democrats, but when you have a good point, you have a good point.

Now if he could just pick a solid position on the war (like Dean has).


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in_cog_ni_to Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 12:48 PM
Response to Reply #47
55. I don't think it was
Edited on Thu Nov-06-03 12:50 PM by in_cog_ni_to
an 11th hour turn to the Democrats. Didn't he vote for Clinton? Didn't he vote for Al Gore? I could be wrong...I'm new to his campaign. :7

He sure is good looking though! No-one can deny that. Here's aGREAT pic I just came across on his site.



http://clark04.com/photos/102003_nh/16/
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TLM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 01:41 PM
Response to Reply #55
61. In 2001 he was rasing money for republicans...


and saying what a great leader regan was... how great he was for the military, and what a great leader Bush was and how we all owe him thanks.

If Clark really believes that Bush and Reagan's leadership was great and that we owe them thanks... then he has no business int he white house. However i find it far more likely he was just telling his audience what they wanted to hear... just like he's doing again now.
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OKNancy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 05:57 PM
Response to Reply #61
78. Yawn
Go cheer for your guy, and quit pissing on our garden.

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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-07-03 02:46 AM
Response to Reply #55
96. That is a good photo...thanks
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hippiechick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 12:50 PM
Response to Original message
56. MPRI, anyone ?
"...we need to create an agency that is not about waging war but about creating conditions for peace around the world. We need some people who will be advocates for peace, advocates for economic development abroad, not just advocates for better weapon systems...."

Gee, how convenient that General Clark is on their Board ....

http://www.ciponline.org/colombia/mpri.htm

"Military Professional Resources, Inc. (MPRI), is a "professional services company engaged in defense related contracting in the U.S. and international markets," according to its website. Since its creation in 1988, MPRI has been run and staffed mainly by former military personnel. In February 2001, the Defense Department decided not to renew a one-year, $4.3 million contract with MPRI to perform a bottom-up review of Colombia's military.

The Defense Department Contract:
In cooperation with the government of Colombia and the United States government, MPRI provided advice and assistance in developing specific plans and programs to assist the Ministry of Defense and the armed forces of Colombia in institution building, long range planning, and interagency cooperation to enhance their counter drug capabilities.

MPRI, hired by the U.S. Defense Department, has a team of about 10 retired U.S. military officers in Bogotá to advise the military on strategic and logistical issues. The company has steadfastly declined to comment on their exact number or work.

Among the most provocative parts of the MPRI mission are plans for MPRI to recommend legislation, statutes and decrees to Colombia regarding a military draft, a professional soldier statute, officer entitlements and health law reforms. "They are using us to carry out American foreign policy," Soyster, the MPRI spokesman, said. "We certainly don't determine foreign policy, but we can be part of the U.S. government executing its foreign policy."

MPRI walked away with $4.3-million, paid largely from the $1.3-billion aid package Congress approved for Colombia last year under Plan Colombia to help fight the drug war. The Pentagon compared Colombia's Ministry of Defense with a broken factory. The job of MPRI was to fix the factory in order to produce a better soldier to fight the drug war. Before MPRI won the one-year contract, it was hired by the Pentagon in fall 1999 to assess the defense ministry. MPRI charged the Pentagon $850,000 for six weeks of work.



:hippie:

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TLM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 01:06 PM
Response to Reply #56
59. Jesus... he was on the board of ANOTHER war profiteer?
Edited on Thu Nov-06-03 01:42 PM by TLM

I knew he was one of the co directors of the NED with Frank Carlucci, he was a lobbyist for Acixom, and he was an advisor for CSIS under KISSINGER!

And now this? Every day more crap comes out about how Clark's actions prove his words are empty.
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kiahzero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 01:47 PM
Response to Reply #59
65. Don't you ever get tired of repeating the same old tired shit?
Edited on Thu Nov-06-03 02:14 PM by kiahzero
Kissinger claim: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=477004#477903

NED claim: Addressed, but I don't have the link handy. (On edit: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=104&topic_id=474693>

How exactly is Acixom a war profiteer? OK, so you have problems with him working in any way on CAPPS II, even though you have no idea what he did on/for it. But it's hardly a 'war profiteering' venture.
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Mattforclark Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 12:51 PM
Response to Original message
57. Clark is so
Awesome. We are on the wrong track, and he is the one who can put us right. He will be one of the greatest Presidents America has ever had. He is the Truman of the post-cold war world. Let him be the Lincoln of our time. We must do all in our power to ensure that he does not become our Cicero.
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TLM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 12:53 PM
Response to Original message
58. You mean the Military-Industrial Complex he used to get contracts...


for acixom to use their consumer database for the no-fly list? Sorry but I do not trust a lobbyist who used his former military position to get those Military-Industrial Complex contracts for his company, then turns around and is speaking about how bad it is.


I wonder how long before he is attacking Bush for bombing civilians in Iraq?

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SahaleArm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 01:52 PM
Response to Reply #58
67. Chomp, Chomp.
How can I trust Howard Dean when he's in the back pocket of the energy corporations? Oh that's right, the only thing Dean did in Vermont was civil unions and healthcare, everything else must be ignored.
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 02:13 PM
Response to Reply #67
71. Dean signed the same sex union bill
Because of the Vermont Supreme Court....he had no choice. Yet he takes all of the credit. A little known fact obviously, but known by some nevertheless.
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ElementaryPenguin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 01:42 PM
Response to Original message
62. Clark/Dean Clark/Dean Clark/Dean!!!!
For me - that IS the ticket - and the biggest nightmare for BushCo!
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Jose Diablo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 01:46 PM
Response to Original message
64. My respect for Clark keeps going up
His indentifying the Mil-Ind Complex as a big problem to our economic and personal freedoms is insightfull.

Though I am unconvinced the creation of yet another "counter balancing" organization is the solution. I think there are plenty of laws on the books to prosecute mil-ind fraud under RICO. I am amazed there is so much money spent with little or no accountability. Somebody desperately needs to go to jail.

I am also amazed our own 'intelligence' organizations are allowed to operate profit centers to fund non-congressional approved/authorized activities and quite possibly 'slush' funds. But this is off-topic.

Seriously, maybe the reason our taxes are so high is not the social programs, but rather simply theft of our tax money by military and industrial leaders.
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Starpass Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 01:53 PM
Response to Original message
68. Oh my god, this sounds so, so, so,.....what's the word???
..oh, DEMOCRATIC (liberal even). Lord how do we stop this guy--we abosolutely cannot let someone like that lead our party nor be in the White House. Awful just awful!----- We need a new donkey in the herd and I like his ass.
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Clark Can WIN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 01:56 PM
Response to Original message
69. I guess "I told you so" to certain individuals might be construed
by some poorly. So I won't say it.




Oh, yes I will......... TOLD YOU SO!
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RummyTheDummy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 02:59 PM
Response to Original message
73. If Clark wins the nomination, should he wear his uniform in the debates?
I'm not sure what the protocol is on this but man what a stature gap that would present, as if there wouldn't be a huge one to start out with.
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in_cog_ni_to Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 05:26 PM
Response to Reply #73
77. Hahahaha!
The vision I had of General Clark, in his 4 STAR uniform, debating shrub, the AWOL Moran, PRICELESS! If I were him? I would do it in the first debate....just to make a statement AND to make an ASS out of the shrub.
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_NorCal_D_ Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 07:17 PM
Response to Reply #73
84. That would be great!
Here is how I envision it:
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loudsue Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-07-03 10:44 AM
Response to Reply #84
103. ROFLMAO!!!! Great picture!!!
Can't stop laughing....


:bounce:
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lostnfound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 04:40 PM
Response to Original message
74. Thanks for posting this.
The empire-building and MIC is my #1 issue.
Frankly, I still don't fully trust Clark or any other candidate except Dennis Kucinich.

BUT Clark is slowly making dents in my skepticism towards him, and elbowing his way toward the top of the heap in my opinion. It occurred to me the other day just how utterly disastrous the situation in Iraq will be when someone else does finally take office, and that maybe Clark would be the type of guy who could find some solution, so that it doesn't become a permanent occupation.

Wouldn't it be great if our candidates could actually work together and decide to find places in a cabinet for several of them? If they could somehow rise above the top-dog-competition and work things out for the common good?

It would be unprecedented and would surely beat Bush.

I daydream..the next debate, the candidates should make a joint statement about the need for verified paper trails on black box voting would be a good place to start, because surely they must all know about the 2000 theft.
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chaska Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 06:13 PM
Response to Reply #74
79. The world won't help us until bush is gone, so obviously Bush must go.
And you can bet that Bush will do everything in his power to make Iraq look like it's solved as an issue come election season. Which means a whole lotta crap swept under the rug. Iraq will be a total disaster for the next president to deal with. Who better than Clark to deal with it. He has the experience (and contacts worldwide) to bring the rest of the world on board post haste. It's a no-brainer.
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eileen_d Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 05:00 PM
Response to Original message
76. kick - very impressive
I think objectively, I'm for Kerry - but subjectively for Clark!
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Donna Zen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 06:50 PM
Response to Original message
80. Soft defense/security
Edited on Thu Nov-06-03 06:52 PM by Donna Zen
The concept of an International Dept to promote economic, political and cultural development is long overdue. The money is currently spread all over the government and produces little good. One example would the State Dept. promoting the growing of rice for export in third world countries, while the Agriculture Dept. is working in the opposite direction to subsidize American rice growers. Thus, the third world finds itself out-marketed with sinking prices. Of course there is much more to the plan than this. Currently money we give to some countries ends up furnishing palaces instead of feeding the poor. Too many hands in the pot to make a positive difference.

With hatred of the US growing daily, both conservatives and liberals are calling for a move to reach out with "soft security." Clark wrote about this need long before 911. (see WMW) While Kusinich's plan leans toward a domestic application of peace initiatives, I believe that Clark is thinking on strictly international level. As Democrats we must have someone in the WH to implement such a plan if the safe guards against abuse are to be fully incorporated. The push from the right for "soft security" does not give me hope.

So_did anyone see this speech? No use holding my breath waiting for our toadie media to cover the most important words spoken today. What's the skinny?

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frank frankly Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 07:02 PM
Response to Original message
81. Clark is my VP or POTUS choice
I want Dean/Clark. If Clark had jumped in earlier, I may be pushing for the reverse.
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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 07:24 PM
Response to Original message
85. Win or lose (the nomination that is)...
I am glad Clark has a chance to get his message out.
I am so proud of him.
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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 07:27 PM
Response to Original message
86. And there's this...
General Wesley Clark New American Strategies for Security and Peace

Center for American Progress
October 28, 2003


Thank you, Ted, for that warm and thoughtful introduction. I'm going to say more about Mr. Sorenson in a moment, but let me first explain that I lost my voice last week. That forced some changes in my schedule, which has me up in New Hampshire today. So I'm very sorry it cannot be in person.

I want to acknowledge the American Prospect magazine and the Century Foundation for their role in this conference and for bringing vigorous and important debate to our foreign policy

But, I especially want to wish the very best to John Podesta and the Center for American Progress as you start your work. Thank you for speaking up for the progressive views that are often distorted and drowned out in today's public debate.

We all recognize that today marks a new beginning for all of us who believe in the ideals and spirit of American democracy. Who seek to reclaim the public dialogue -- away from spiteful epithets and unreasoning anger. Who believe in the power of enlightened reason to find better solutions to pressing problems, and to communicate those solutions with passion, wit and balance so powerful that it will change the political dynamic in America.

John, I am very honored that you asked me to keynote this morning.... And I am even more honored that Ted has introduced me.

Ted Sorenson is one of America's most beloved public servants. Some of the most inspiring words ever spoken on our American democracy came from his mind and his pen. But we also owe Ted a debt as a historian. In his book on President Kennedy, he tells us how - in October 1962, after the President made a crucial decision during the Cuban missile crisis, he stepped out onto the second story back porch of the White House, and talked about life and death. Then the President gave instructions on redrafting his address to the nation, and said: "I hope you realize...that there's not enough room for everybody in the White House bomb shelter."

President Kennedy displayed a complete understanding of the threat - and still he was cool, courageous and in command - inspiring confidence in all around him. That was a time of great danger for America, and it mattered immensely to our security that we had a President who had won over the hearts and minds of millions - and a nation that was admired around the world for its moral authority.

There could be no clearer contrast to America's place in the world today.

The losses we suffered on 9/11 - as tragic as they were - have been magnified by the losses we've suffered since.

The loss of allied support.
The loss of moral authority.
The loss of respect, admiration, and esteem - especially in the Islamic world.
Today we are at risk - a risk perhaps every bit as great as the risk we faced the day before 9/1l.

Our armed forces are fully committed as an array of new threats are emerging, with no reserves, either physical or intellectual.
The Secretary of Defense had to leak his own memo to explain that we have no strategy to deal with terrorism - something I've been saying for 2 years.
And, with this Administration, there is no prospect of help from a world that increasingly revels in our failures.
How could this have happened? How could we have slipped so far? It is a story of pride, arrogance, weak leadership, pure domestic politics, and poor decision-making. All combined with the terrible idea that we must selfishly pursue national interests with a kind of 19th century real politick.

This was the "dream team." Remember, Cheney... Rumsfeld...Powell...No need for the "dream team" to take advice. No need for the "dream team" to learn from the Clinton administrations. The "dream team" always knew better.

What did the "dream team" give us? An election-driven, poll-driven, ideologically-driven foreign policy. An array of strong-willed advisors and lieutenants...too powerful to be ignored...too independent to agree. With a president inexperienced -- and shockingly disinterested.

In fact, what the "dream team" has produced is an almost unbroken string of foreign policy failures.

Sunshine
Kyoto
Balkans - in together, out together, and even now trying to slide out
ICC
Bio-weapons
A relationship with Mexico that has faltered...
Of course, we know these men and women, and all their lieutenants. We see them, socialize with them, serve with them, talk to them...But let's be clear - their policies have been horribly, tragically wrong - and we must say so - clearly, repetitively, and with no apology for candor or forcefulness.

And then there is 9/11. There is no way this administration can walk away from its responsibilities. This wasn't something that could be blamed on lower level intelligence officers. Our great Democratic President Harry Truman said, the "buck stops here." And when it comes to our nation's foreign policy, the buck sits on George W. Bush's desk. And we must say it again and again until the American people understand it. National security, next to upholding the Constitution, is the most important duty of any President.

And with respect to the war on terror after 9/11, the record is even worse: We have an administration that led us into Afghanistan - then failed to plan and put the resources in to finish the job...allowing Osama Bin Ladin to survive and challenge us like some antibiotic-resistant bacterium.

We have an Administration that misled American people and Congress on the challenge of Iraq
The rhetoric is strong on bin Ladin, but they've pulled a bait and switch - which they planned from the very beginning. And that distracted Tommy Franks at the very moment he should have focused on getting our greatest enemies.
Mr. Bush went to the White house speechwriters and told them to make their strongest case for war. They created the axis of evil. Probably the worst formulation in the last half century of American politics. It has alienated friends, embarrassed supporters and served to accelerate and intensify the very threat it claimed to describe.

We have lost faith in our president. We have lost faith in his leadership. And the world has lost faith in our authority. The current Administration has taken our country dangerously off-course. And all of this two years after the world stood by our side following the tragedy of September 11th. And almost six months after Mr. Bush stood on the deck of the Abraham Lincoln and declared the end of "major combat operations."

Today, President Bush backtracked on his May 1 political photo op on the U.S.S. Abraham Lincoln by blaming the troops on the aircraft carrier for the declaration of 'mission accomplished' in Iraq. This is wrong, this is irresponsible, and this is not leadership. Politicizing the mission of those troops in the first place was bad theater, and diminished the office of Commander in Chief -- but to now turn his comments on those very troops is outrageous. Instead of trying to blame the sailors and soldiers, the President owes our troops in harm's way and the American people a plan to bring peace to Iraq and stability to the region.

This is not 1962. But in many ways this enemy is far more pernicious. This enemy is not bounded by a state's borders...their ideology is one of destruction...they seem to not even feel a bond of common humanity.

They recognize no boundaries. Everyone to them is a target if it serves their symbolic needs. Look at the latest: targeting our nation's Deputy Secretary of Defense then the next day the Red Cross - the world's symbol of peace and good -- and today a police station in Fallujah. Nothing is safe from their reach.

Despite the bravery and competence of our Armed Forces, we are still struggling to turn yesterday's military success into today's strategic victory, with painful consequences day in and day out for American men and women serving in Iraq and for Iraqi civilians caught in the crossfire.

The war is a disastrous turn of events. Not only because this President still has not come forward with a strategy for how we're going to succeed on the ground. But also because many governments now believe we tried to deceive them, and this Administration doesn't have the credibility to rebut them and be believed. One of the greatest national security assets we have is our ability to persuade, an ability that rests on trust. America needs a leader the world can trust. We don't have one now.

This lack of trust exacts a great cost - especially when dealing with the other very serious threats we face. We still must dismantle al Qaeda and the world-wide terrorist networks plotting to attack us. We face intractable conflicts in the Middle East and South Asia and ongoing nuclear dangers in Iran and North Korea. And this Administration's reckless actions have depleted us of the national security asset we now need most: The moral authority we have enjoyed for almost all of our history.

Our fractured alliances are a natural consequence of the contempt this Administration has shown our friends and partners. With the Kyoto Protocol, the Biological Weapons Convention, the International Criminal Court, the war in Iraq and in so many ways large and small, we sent the message: "your security is your own concern, and your concerns are of no concern to us."

This is no accident. It is a function of the backward way this Administration does business. Traditionally and ideally, we Americans meet our challenges by starting with the facts, analyzing the problem, and reasoning toward a solution with our citizens and our allies. This Administration does things in reverse. As we've seen in Iraq, they don't start with the facts and shape a policy; they start with a policy and shape the facts.

So what do we do about it? We get at the root of the problem. And the root of the problem lives at 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue.

When I am elected, America will once again be a reliable international partner. We will be open in our debates, and steadfast in our commitments. We will honor the values we expect from others, and exhibit - in the words of our Declaration of Independence: "a decent respect to the opinions of mankind."

But we'll need a strategy to fill the void that emerged at the end of the Cold War. This isn't some wooly-headed idealism. There's an opportunity today with the challenges we face to bridge the gap between left and right in America. To reach a new bipartisan consensus. Again, it will be up to this party. Its heritage of internationalism and military power. After all, it's the party of Roosevelt and Truman. It gave us the United Nations, NATO the Truman Doctrine, deterrence, containment, and the Marshall Plan.

Going forward, we'll need new labels and new ideas. Many of them will be created right here at the Center for American progress. Maybe we'll see it today. Maybe it will spring forth in a flash of inspiration - maybe John Podesta can put it on a bumper sticker. Or maybe it will come from long discussions and synthesis and hours of quiet and patient work.

I look forward to drawing on the ideas and work done here, and I want to help advance the dialogue. For if we're going to create a new strategy - however we label it - it has to reflect the principles that Americans believe in, represent and will sustain.

First, America needs to be guided again by our founding ideal of inclusiveness - the core ingredient of any democracy. We are a nation of immigrants, a missionary for ideas and ideals. We have achieved national greatness because we have systematically broken down barriers that exclude people from an equal role in society.

Even after the fall of the Berlin Wall, there are still great barriers dividing the world. Some people have the freedom to choose their leaders, speak their minds, and improve their lives. Other people have governments who deny them the same freedoms. Because historically we've been aligned with some of these governments, some of their people see us an accomplice in their oppression. This barrier between free nations and autocratic nations will not stand. Either this side of freedom will take it down, or the forces of pent-up frustration, anger and humiliation will blow it up - and our relationships and remaining sense of security with it.

Second, we should be working to strengthen and use international institutions, beginning with the United Nations and NATO. After September 11, we should have immediately gone to the United Nations, developed a legal definition of terrorism - and brought the charges legally against Bin Ladin. The UN was our organization - we helped conceive it, shape its values, and launch it. We're its major contributor. We have to strengthen it and use it.

Action at the UN could have been enforced by NATO. After September 11, NATO for the first time in its history invoked Article V from its charter, signifying that because one nation was attacked, all had been attacked. The US ignored that unprecedented offer of help. One Pentagon official told me: "We read your book on Kosovo. We're not going to let anyone tell us where to bomb." They had learned entirely the wrong lesson. During the Kosovo campaign, Tony Blair paid me an unannounced visit at NATO headquarters. He said: "I just want to ask one single question: Are we going to win?" I assured him we would win. He answered: "Good. Because every government in Western Europe depends on the successful outcome of this operation."

If we had used NATO to launch the war on terrorism, we would have had the military, moral, political, and financial commitment of 19 nations - including Turkey - determined to make a success of the mission, and determined to defend our actions to their people and the world. This was offered to us, and the Bush Administration refused. Now we turn to NATO anyway, buts it's too little and too late - at least for this team

The third principle is to ensure our armed forces retain the edge over any potential adversary. And they must continue to be modernized to deal with foreseeable contingencies, including the possible need to pre-empt any threat to the United States.

At its peak, the force in Iraq was more than half the deployable strength of the army. Today, the Administration is asking our military men and women to occupy the breadth of the country, impose security, build democracy, prevent looting, help search for weapons of mass destruction, conduct sweeps for terrorists and guerrillas, and protect themselves from attack. It's a daunting task - and the Administration's desire to retain control closed the door on significant foreign troop contributions just when we needed them most.

It's obvious to me the limits of achieving our world-wide aims by relying exclusively on the military. Our military should be used to back international law and diplomacy - not replace them.

Operating on these three principles - promoting democracy, using our international institutions, using force only as a last resort - helps us pursue a more enlightened American interest. A decade ago, we called it engagement and enlargement. Perhaps we need a new label. But I think the direction is clear. We need to repair our trans-Atlantic relationships. We can work together to resolve our security challenges - the North Korean nuclear program and the nuclear program in Iran. We should turn our combined force toward resolving intractable conflicts in South Asia and the Middle East. We should be offering support development in Africa and enhance the battle against disease, finding a new synthesis between free markets and state intervention in Latin America

And we must turn the full force of this united power against the terrorists themselves. Winning military victories is only one part of the war on terror. We have to use our diplomatic leverage to set a legal definition of terrorism, harmonize our laws governing terrorist acts, and agree on standards of proof and admissibility of evidence.

We also have to confront the hatred spewing out of extremist religious schools in Saudi Arabia and Pakistan. We have a right and a duty to challenge an extremist curriculum that would make those goals impossible. It cannot be dealt with militarily. It has to be done with diplomacy, and it ought to be backed by every nation in the world.

We are in a difficult time in our country and the world. A lot has been lost. A lot more has been put at risk. I know many Americans feel bitter disappointment and even anger toward this Administration. But I am not angry. I am determined. And I am encouraged. As I travel back and forth across the country, I see a new American patriotism beginning to flourish. It is a patriotism that goes beyond any President -- that goes beyond party politics. We can use it - we can reestablish credibility for our leaders and for intelligence services. We can build a new system. We need an agency like the Department of International Assistance to help the United Nations cope with the problems of failed states. To help deal with other global problems: problems of AIDS, diseases, ecological catastrophes, and human miseries.

And we can take this nation forward: with a people that have been awakened again to the challenges beyond our borders. And we'll face those with innate optimism of Americans. We're at our best under challenge. We don't buckle. We don't weaken. We don't waver.

Whatever the current Administration might do, we as Americans are not a nation that manipulates facts, ignores debate, and stifles dissent. We are not a nation that retaliates against people who criticize the government. We are not a nation that disdains our allies or starts wars without just cause. That is not who we are. America was born to end all that - and we won't tolerate an administration that doesn't represent us.

This is why I'm running for President - to bring back the core ideals of our democracy - to use them to guide our foreign policy. And that's why I am so hopeful for this new Center for American Progress, and the thoughtful balance it can restore to our national dialogues. These ideals have made us great. They can make us greater. They can make us safer and more prosperous. In the end, they will ensure that America is admired for her moral authority -- not just feared for her military might. In this era, we cannot be safe without both. Thank you.
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Bread and Circus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 07:28 PM
Response to Reply #86
87. and this... (these are from Clark site -- I am sure they are happy..
for me to spread the word...)

Speeches


General Wesley Clark Outlines Success Strategy in Iraq

South Carolina
November 6, 2003


Thank you for inviting me here this afternoon.

For more than a hundred years, graduates of South Carolina State University have gone on to serve this country - as teachers, lawyers, doctors, of course, soldiers. Your ROTC -- the Bulldog Battalion -- has commissioned more than 1,900 officers, including more minority officers than any other school in the country. You should all be very proud.

I want to talk to you today about the events unfolding a world away in Iraq, and my success strategy - a strategy that will make it possible for our soldiers to come home with both Iraq and America standing strong.

This morning I visited with the family of Darius Jennings, a courageous young man who gave his life this week in Iraq. He is the third graduate of Orangeburg-Wilkinson High School to give his life for our country in Iraq. It's clear that Darius was a caring man, who loved his family and his country. We are all grateful for his service and we should honor it today.

The number of US soldiers killed in Iraq is increasing at an alarming rate. Last Sunday, 15 of our soldiers were killed and 27 wounded when their helicopter was brought down. Another two were killed today. Our troops are stretched too thin. Other countries have been asked to send reinforcements. They have refused. And now more young American men and women are being asked to do one-year tours in a foreign land than at anytime since Vietnam.

Let me be clear: there has been some real progress in Iraq. Iraqis have a better future with Saddam Hussein out of power. In many areas, life is improving. It is inspiring to see brave Iraqis working with Americans to rebuild their country. But seven months after the fall of Saddam; violence is growing, and the enemy's morale and momentum is increasing with each deadly attack.

Saddam Hussein did pose a national security challenge. There is no dispute about that. He was in violation of UN Security Council resolutions. If he didn't still have weapons of mass destruction, he was trying to acquire them. He remained hostile to his neighbors. But it was clear then and it is even clearer today that Saddam Hussein posed no imminent threat to the region or the world.

I have always believed that before initiating military action, crucial tests must be met: For example, every diplomatic option should be explored and exhausted. We must do everything possible to gain international and domestic support. And there must be a realistic post-war plan.

The Bush Administration failed every one of these tests. Instead of basing life and death decisions on hard-headed realism, they were guided by wishful thinking. They were convinced that if only we could get rid of Saddam, democracy would bloom in Iraq and across the Middle East.

We are now more deeply involved in Iraq than we have been in any foreign country since Vietnam. Failure in Iraq will not only be a tragedy for Iraq. It will be a disaster for America and the world. It would give the terrorists of Al Qaeda a new base of operations, and a victory against America. It would weaken our moral authority, destroy respect for our power in the Middle East, and throw this region, the source of so many of the world's problems, into greater turmoil. No matter how difficult it will be, we cannot shirk from our duty. There can be no substitute for success.

Today, I want to discuss the decisions that propelled us into Iraq; what we should do now, and how we make sure this never happens again.

Number one: How did we get into Iraq?

Mr. Bush made a series of strategic mistakes that have put us in danger and plunged us into Iraq. After September 11, all Americans understood that fighting terror was America's number one national security priority. All Americans understood it was crucial that we keep weapons of mass destruction out of the hands of terrorists.

Just as important - the world agreed with this approach. That is why we had international support for our war to overthrow the Taliban in Afghanistan. But after the Taliban fell, instead of finishing off Al Qaeda, the very terrorists that continued to threaten us, the Administration began laying the ground work for a different war - a war in Iraq.

Our focus should have been on winning the war on terrorism - working with our allies to track down the terrorists themselves; to develop new initiatives in Pakistan and Saudi Arabia to rip out the roots of radical terror, stop radical schools indoctrinating a new generation of terrorists day after day. That's how you win the war on terrorism.

Instead, the Bush Administration coined a new phrase - the axis of evil -- which essentially declared three dangerous nations enemies that we would deal with only by ultimatum. This phrase increased the threat it was designed to reduce - by encouraging these nations to speed up their programs to develop nuclear weapon to deter US action.

The Administration then offered the notion of pre-emption. American Presidents have always had the option of striking preemptively - it is inherent in the right of self-defense. And I would not hesitate to use that right if America was in imminent danger. But this policy was intended to be more -- much more. They made preemption the centerpiece of this Administration's national security strategy.

The Administration zeroed in on Iraq. But focusing on Iraq made no sense -- if the real goal was to protect the US either from weapons of mass destruction or terrorism. The hundred tons of loosely guarded nuclear bomb-making material and bioweapons in Russia presents a far more tempting target for terrorists. But this Administration has not made that a priority. The nuclear programs of Iran and North Korea were more advanced and more threatening than Iraq's, but for months they paid little attention. Their actions made no strategic sense; they downplayed the greater threats, and exaggerated the lesser one.

Finally, after training our forces on Iraq, the Administration essentially declared - we're going it alone. Instead of using diplomacy backed by force - as we did so effectively in the Balkans - this Administration's diplomacy was only a fig leaf. The United States was going to war no matter what. The Administration went to the UN with a "take it or leave it offer," which reflected a combination of indifference and disdain. It did not explore every diplomatic option; it did not do everything possible to bring allies with us.

The Administration compounded its error by failing to plan realistically for post-war Iraq. Instead of listening to the experts at the State Department and throughout the government, who predicted the danger of chaos and looting, the Secretary of Defense Rumsfeld and his aides ignored their advice. Instead they relied on hope, hope that the Iraqi exiles would be accepted as legitimate, hope that the Iraqi police and military would provide security; hope that Iraqi oil revenues would finance reconstruction; and hope that we would be treated as liberators. How wrong they were - you can't build a plan on hope....

Meanwhile, the President rejected the advice of the uniformed military that we deploy enough troops not only to defeat Saddam's military but also to secure Iraq after Saddam's defeat.

As a result, we saw chaos, we lost the trust of the Iraqi people - and the enemy was emboldened.

When running for President, Mr. Bush assured voters he would have strong advisors in national security. But he didn't say what would happen if his advisors disagreed. Now we know. The advisors feud; the policy fractures, and our security suffers. In a Clark Administration, there won't be any question about whether the State Department drives policy, or the Pentagon drives policy, or the national security advisor drives policy. In a Clark Administration, the President will drive the policy.

Number two: What do we do now?

So how to we get out of the mess that the Bush Administration has created for America and Iraq?

First, we shouldn't give the President $87 billion until he has a plan that will work. President Bush keeps telling us we should stay the course. But what we really must do is change course.

Second, we must be honest with the American people. That's something that President Bush hasn't done. There is no silver bullet - no magic solution in Iraq. There is no easy way out.

Every American should understand: early exit means retreat or defeat. There can be neither. We need a success strategy -for it is only success that can honor the sacrifice of so many American men and women; it is only success that will allow Iraq to stand on its own; and it is only success that will allow our soldiers to come home.

What does success mean?

Success means that Iraq is strong enough to sustain itself without substantial outside forces, but not so strong as to threaten its neighbors.

Success means that representative government has taken root, so that it can be a model for the future in the Middle East.

Success means that Iraq doesn't become a breeding ground for Al Qaeda.

A new and realistic strategy for Iraq should be guided by the following principles. First, we must end the American monopoly on the occupation and reconstruction. Then we must develop the right force mix to fight and win a guerrilla war. Finally, we must give Iraqis a greater stake in our success.

End the American monopoly.
From the beginning, the Administration has insisted on exclusive control of the reconstruction and occupation of Iraq. This has cost us the support of other nations and made America a bigger target for terrorists. We must end this American monopoly.

Doing so will change the way this enterprise is viewed -- in Iraq, internationally, and here at home. The Coalition Provisional Authority, by which America controls Iraq today, should be replaced. But it is simply unrealistic to have the United Nations take over this daunting task - it's not able and it's not willing. Instead we must create a new international structure - the Iraqi Reconstruction and Democracy Council -- similar to the one we created in Bosnia with representatives from Europe, the United States, Iraq's neighbors, and other countries that will support our effort.

A high representative would be named to direct this mission, who would then bring in more resources and personnel from the rest of the world. It would have been easier to do this six months ago or four months ago, or two months ago. But even today, it is the only hope for gaining broader international support. Nations are more likely to share burdens if they are also sharing decisions. We would still have a leading role - but you can't be a leader if no one comes along - you're not a leader if you're all alone.

This new international effort should be launched immediately. The world is waiting for our leadership. They know success is critical for them, too. And we mustn't cast them aside any longer. They should have a seat at the table. But fixing the Administration's missteps won't be easy. It will require diplomacy at the highest levels. And I will call a summit of leaders from Europe, the United Nations, Japan, and the Arab World to launch this new international project.

We must also transform the military operation - turning it into a NATO enterprise. General Abizaid, commander of US forces in the Middle East, would remain in charge of the operation, but he would report to the NATO Council as well, as I did when I commanded NATO forces in Kosovo. Why - at this point - would NATO come? Again, it would have been easier if done earlier. But our friends and allies have a stake in a stable Iraq.

And our allies would be more willing to help us on Iraq if we are willing to work together on issues of concern to them, like climate change, the International Criminal Court, and a Comprehensive Test Ban Treaty. With a US commander, NATO involvement, and UN endorsement, I believe we can also get Muslim countries to step in, as we did in the Balkans. Their presence would prove that this is not an American occupation, but an international effort. Then more Iraqis will see that the people sabotaging their oil pipelines are sabotaging their children's future -- and they will help us stop them.

In these circumstances, it is reasonable to expect other countries to provide tens of thousands of new troops as well as additional personnel to help Iraqis conduct policing, police training, oversight, and border control.

Only by sharing responsibility for the management of this enterprise will we also be able to share the immense and growing burden we now face.

Force Mix
Along with NATO involvement, we will need a series of other military and security steps. No plan can be fashioned without substantial contribution from our military leaders on the ground. Their advice will be crucial. But let me tell you as Commander-in-Chief how I would approach this problem.

First off, we want to distribute our resources properly. This requires US forces to run an agile, intelligence-driven counter-insurgency campaign, while Iraqi forces and our allies perform other necessary tasks. When it comes to our force levels, it's possible that some may need to be added initially to create the right mix of capabilities. You cannot measure success by a reduction in forces, and you can't declare failure by an increase in forces. It's better to do the job right so we can succeed and then bring our troops home.

One mistake in Vietnam was trying to use conventional forces to fight an unconventional war. The more conventional forces we have in Iraq, the more logistics we need. The more unarmored humvees and trucks we have, the greater our vulnerability to roadside bombs. Most of our losses are being taken in routine patrolling and transit - not in active counter-insurgency efforts. The right mix of forces -- more special forces and other lighter units -- will reduce our "footprint," logistics tail and vulnerability, while increasing our ability to strike hard.

More intelligence resources: We have to do all we can to find out who's attacking our soldiers, and to produce the actionable intelligence that will enable us to strike accurately and hard. Success depends on good intelligence work and good rapport with the civilian population. Yet intelligence specialists and linguists are scarce.

We need to take the linguists and intelligence specialists now involved in the search for weapons of mass destruction and assign them to our military counter-insurgency efforts -- and we need to augment that with new technologies and more linguists drawn from loyal Arab Americans. We can ask international inspectors to take over the search for weapons They are ready, willing and able to perform this mission. That will make it possible to find the people who are killing our soldiers.

Iraqi Security forces: There is no more urgent priority than improving Iraqi security forces. We need a smart, patient two-tier plan - for police and the military.

We should start by calling the old Iraqi army to duty. We have to have thorough background checks, pay generous rates, and appeal to their sense of nationality. We need these security forces quickly so we can free up US soldiers to focus on our most urgent tasks of counter-insurgency - some Iraqis may go to police, some as guards for installations or borders, and some will be the nucleus for a new, still to be formed Iraqi army.

Better border protection: Today Iraq is a magnet for every jihadist in the Middle East who wants to take a free shot at an American soldier. We have to stop outside infiltration or intervention. Closing the borders will require real cooperation from the countries bordering Iraq. We should engage with the Syrians, the Iranians, and the Saudis, with clear carrots as well as sticks. We have other issues with each of these countries. But right now, closing those borders is most urgent. Unfortunately, this administration has made the region wary of working with us. We must convince them otherwise to show them that cooperation with us is in their interest and will help their region, not with more wars but with more progress.

In both Bosnia and Afghanistan, we recognized that you cannot put a country back together if its neighbors are committed to tearing it apart. In both those cases, we engaged all of the neighbors, no matter how objectionable we found their policies or regimes, in our effort to stabilize those societies. We have yet to initiate such a regional dialogue with Iraq's neighbors.

Give the Iraqis a rising stake in our success
Iraqis will be more likely to meet the security challenge if we give them a greater stake in our success. That means establishing a new sovereign government in Iraq right away. There has been a false debate between the French, who recommended turning all government functions over to Iraqis now - and the Bush Administration, which insists on waiting until a constitution is written and elections are held.

The French are wrong: we cannot transfer full authority to Iraqis before they are ready. But the administration is also wrong: we can give the Iraqis a much bigger sense of ownership over their country and move more quickly towards a government that answers to its people. Until Iraqis believe that they can control their future, they will huddle in fear and watch others attack - rather than stand with pride, expose the guerrillas and stop the violence.

We should help the Iraqis move immediately to establish their own government, a government to replace the existing council. Because that council was chosen by Americans, it is not seen as legitimate in the eyes of too many Iraqis. But right now, there are 50 city and regional councils in Iraq - elected by the Iraqi people. Just as the State Legislatures used to elect members to our Senate in our own country, these councils should select new members of an interim government drawing from the existing governing council.

This new government would represent Iraq internationally - and control oil revenues, funds, and any frozen assets through a transparent, internationally audited process. The transfer of government functions to this new government should be ongoing, week by week, as soon as it is ready.

This interim government would then launch a new process to write a Constitution. Such a constitution would be an Iraqi document -- not written by Americans or people appointed by Americans - and would set the terms for free and fair elections.

Finally, we should open the West to Iraq with exchange programs in multiple fields so that Iraqis who have been isolated for years can see the rest of the world -- what we are doing with our economy, schooling, health care, local media, how we run our government and take community action. Then they can return to their country to help guide the growth of the new Iraq.

If I am elected President, I pledge to you that my highest priority will be this: not only to protect America from the threat of Al Qaeda, but to transform the strategy that is failing in Iraq to one that will succeed.

I would draw on my 34-year military career, my experience as Supreme Allied Commander of NATO, the lessons of diplomacy I learned in that job, the personal relationships with foreign leaders I developed, my role in bringing peace to Bosnia, my understanding of guerrilla war, and my efforts commanding the victorious war and winning the peace in Kosovo. Drawing on this experience, I will work to promote a stable democracy in Iraq, to recruit other countries to share the burden, to protect our troops, draw them down, and eventually to bring them home - to leave Iraq, but not abandon it.

Number three: How do we make sure this does not happen again?

If I am elected President, I pledge to you that America will never, under my leadership, choose to isolate itself without allies, in a "long, hard slog" that drains our money, strains our military, and squanders our moral authority. We will act with others if we possibly can and alone only if we absolutely must.

A Clark foreign policy would never let it happen - because I would not give away our alliances any more than I would give away the 101st Airborne.

Despite our overwhelming military might, our economic strength and the power of our democracy, we cannot win these battles alone. We can't pursue Arab-Israeli peace, maintain stability in the Middle East, support reconstruction of Iraq and Afghanistan, deal with the challenges of North Korea, track down Osama bin Laden, fight the global war against terrorism, face the problem of Iran, and return to prosperity in this country, unless we have allies to help us.

We have choices. We can ignore the threats. We can confront them alone. Or we can get people who share our interests to share our challenges. That is how America led the world for the last half century. And when we led, others followed -- not because we compelled them, but because we convinced them.

General Eisenhower once said leadership is "persuading the other fellow to want to do what you want him to do." America needs a President who can lead.

As President, I will restore what's been lost. I will rebuild our alliances. And I will strengthen them, so that when America has to act we can call on the military, financial, and moral resources of others.

I will propose a new Atlantic Charter to reinvigorate our security partnership with Europe - a Charter that will define the threats we face in common, create the basis for concerted action from our allies to meet them, and offer the promise to act together as a first choice - not a last. The United States will always reserve the right to act alone in our own defense if we must. No nation will ever have veto power over our security. But we have seen that it is foolish to act alone as a first resort, to determine alone the threat, to decide alone on a response, and then to say to the world, "you're with us or against us." Our first choice should be to act with the power and authority of many nations. This model could be applied to our friends and allies in Asia as well.

I also propose creating an agency that will bring the same skill to solving the problems of poverty, disease, and ethnic conflict that we have brought to the challenge of warfare. We should be using our great capacities to prevent conflicts early so we don't need to use force later. That means drawing on the skills that now exist across the federal government.

This new agency should have a budget for real research and development, real planning, and the ability to draw on the US national civilian reserves which I proposed last month. This agency will give us a power to engage that we don't have right now. Because we don't need a new strategy of preemptive force as much as we need a new capability for preemptive engagement.

It serves our interests to make sure that Afghanistan is never again a haven for Al Qaeda; to make sure the fallen states of Africa don't become breeding grounds for terrorists; to make sure the scourge of AIDS doesn't reverse political and economic gains in the developing world. America should be the best in the world in addressing and reversing the causes of human misery, and we should be known and admired for it.

For much of our history, America has been the most admired nation in the world. People around the globe admired America's strength - because they saw it was on their side. That reputation took decades to build - but only a few years for George Bush to bring down. We must recover what's been lost.

As my record makes clear, I am not opposed to confronting a dictator, setting an ultimatum, and acting with force if the ultimatum's not met. We did it twice. We fought with Milosevic and persuaded our allies to join us. And I wrestled with some of the pentagon brass along the way to get it done. If we have to confront danger again, we will. And we will win.

But we must be a country that listens, and leads again. A country that is respected, not resented. Not for its military might or material wealth, but for its values and vision; for the greatness of its goals, and for the generosity of its spirit. Respected more than feared, by nations rich and poor, Christian, Jews, and Muslim. A country governed by people with ideals, not radical ideologies. A nation where citizens speak their minds, demand more of their leaders, and serve their country. It's what I call a New American Patriotism.

This New American Patriotism recognizes the simple truth that we can't be safe at home unless we're secure abroad. We can't solve our domestic challenges - the economy, health care, and education -- unless we succeed in Iraq and extinguish terrorism around the world.

We need leadership to succeed - and when this campaign is over, I believe the American people will make me that leader.

In February of 1970, I was a 25-year old Army captain in Vietnam, commanding a mechanized infantry company. We were on patrol in the jungle, moving on foot in platoon strength, searching for the Viet Cong. The soldier walking point lost his bearings, so I went up and took point. When the hidden enemy saw that, they knew they were looking at the officer, and they opened fire. I was hit, jumped back and took cover, directing a small element from our force to lay down a base of fire while another element maneuvered against the base camp. In a few minutes, we overran their positions. Later, I was evacuated by helicopter.

After treatment in Saigon and Japan, I got home and they put me in Valley Forge Hospital. A week into my stay -- after I was up and out of my wheelchair -- my wife Gert brought me home from the hospital to meet a four-month old boy named Wes. It was the first time I ever held him. It stings me still that I wasn't there when he was born. But I think of the young men my age in Vietnam, who had babies born at home, and they never made it back to see them. Their names are engraved in black granite on our national mall.

When I think of service to country - I know that nothing I've ever done compares with that. All our principles as a country and people come down to this: I'll never commit American forces to combat without a clear and complete plan to win, and the forces necessary to carry it out - and I'll never ask an American soldier or family to take that risk and pay that price except as an absolute last resort. If you elect me President, I pledge to you today that I will return America to that sacred moral standard. This pledge alone will do as much as any other Presidential action to secure the country and keep the peace.

Thank you.

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AnnitaR Donating Member (958 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-07-03 02:07 AM
Response to Reply #87
92. Wow! I'm beyond impressed!
This is just one of my favorites:

"When running for President, Mr. Bush assured voters he would have strong advisors in national security. But he didn't say what would happen if his advisors disagreed. Now we know. The advisors feud; the policy fractures, and our security suffers. In a Clark Administration, there won't be any question about whether the State Department drives policy, or the Pentagon drives policy, or the national security advisor drives policy. In a Clark Administration, the President will drive the policy."

The General has been amazing the past week. The Pukes must be crapping their pants about this guy!



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morgan2 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 07:30 PM
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88. sounds like he's ripping off..
DK's department of peace a bit at the end of that statement
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-07-03 03:07 AM
Response to Reply #88
98. But wouldn't that be a good thing....
To have DK's ideas as part of a real administration? I think that common sense is a good idea, and we both have it. Ideas on some policies are just common sense and hopefully more than one person has the sense.
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ElementaryPenguin Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 07:32 PM
Response to Original message
89. This is this guy that take us to the promised land, folks - and I like Dea
He's just tailor made for the job at this moment in history!
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neuvocat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 07:38 PM
Response to Original message
90. The democrats have their Eisenhower.
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FrenchieCat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-03 09:28 PM
Response to Reply #90
91. Yes SIr!
As Clark would say.....
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E_Zapata Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-07-03 02:17 AM
Response to Original message
93. If he's telling the TRUTH about his views.........
I say BRAVISIMO!

I don't know -- it would take a lot to get my vote in the dem primary, but he's about to seal the deal with me.
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nothingshocksmeanymore Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-07-03 02:26 AM
Response to Original message
94. Not surprising. This is VERY MUCH the position of CDI
the Center for Defense INformation. In fact, I really think that the Defense POLICY Board formed LARGELY to undermine the GAINS CDI made following the Reagan years when they brought military waste to the forefront.
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spindoctor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-07-03 03:08 AM
Response to Original message
99. Them are fighting words
You could wonder if CNN isn't part of the military-industrial complex. After all, they (and Clark) do make money off of war.

Clark of all people should also know that Halliburton is a relatively small player in that game.

But having said all that, these are words close to my heart. Nodge one up for the General.
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Nov-07-03 04:01 AM
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100. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
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