Howard Dean is so close to a message that will resonate with Southerners

[kentuck]

But he may be a million miles away?

He needs to emphasize the part of his message that is populist in tone and nature, such as the part about the people in the South need someone that will help them get good healthcare and a good education for their children. Southerners, not meaning to be sterotypical :) , love populist candidates. They like plain-spokenness, like Dean's, and they vote for passionate candidates.

The candidate that can personalize their message to fit the needs of the poor and middle-class Southern whites can capture that base. He does not have to appeal to any flag, or football team, or race car driver. The Southern voter is much like the voters in every other corner of America. The racists are not the majority. Forget them.

Like everyone else, they like honesty. They want to hear a candidate that will kick the crap out of George W Bush. They want a candidate that will tell them how Dubya is doing the ol' reverse Robin Hood trick - robbing from the poor to give to the rich. That's what he's doing with his taxcut and he's putting the cost on the poor man's credit card, which will mean a poorer life for he and his children.

They want to hear a candidate that calls George W Bush a "liar" to his face. He lied about his reasons for going to war and our young men and women are dying. No one would expect a candidate to say something like that in the South, but that is exactly the type of message that will resonate with those voters, and coincidently, will resonate with other voters across America, also.

[leftofthedial]

1. he has to take a sheet from the Clark playbook

and recapture the flag--the AMERICAN flag--from the faux patriot chickenhawk GOPNAC crowd.

If you don't make southerners believe you are a patriot, you won't get anyone who doesn't already vote Democrtatic. We know that's not enough.

But you're right. We should be championing the spirit of Dean's comments and moving psoitively to accomplish what he said. Instead, we're just throwing the same old tired bigoted bricks at the South.

[ThorsteinVeblen]

4. The south fought against "patriots"

in the civil war. The South wants respect - Dean gives it to them. Why can't you?

[leftofthedial]

30. I DO give the south respect

Many who fought for the south in the Civil War also considered themselves patriots.

The disconnect between the Democratic Party and the Southern voter has far more to do with the AMERICAN flag than it does with the Confederate flag. The GOP stole the American flag as a symbol of their faux patriotism. We need to take it back and convince voters across the nation, South included, that being a Democrat and a liberal is just as American, if not moreso, as being a fascist neocon. Dean is right about that.

[ThorsteinVeblen]

31. You are playing by their rules and using their language

[leftofthedial]

32. who is "their"?

[hedda_foil]

33. Honey, Clark took the flag part from the DEAN playbook.

He started talking strongly about taking back the flag from Ashcroft, Falwell, and Limbaugh (to be exact) at his announcement speech in June and has kept it up in almost every stump speech since then. Clark is using the same meme, which is terrific because it's so important and can't be said often or strongly enough ... but Dean started using it well before Clark and has never stopped.

[leftofthedial]

35. he needs to shift the rhetoric to the OTHER flag

the one that's been coopted by the right

[1songbird]

2. But what about the large religious right factions

that will vote against anybody that is not anti-abortion and anti-gay?
Do you think that a Dem can gain a foothole in the South without tackling those issues that repugs use to divide.

Even putting the Confedrate flag aside, I believe that the South will be a tough sale. I would love to believe otherwise however.

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

5. The religious right isn't all Southern

My boss is Southern Baptist, and yet he'll never vote for Bush. I don't think you can say that everyone of a particular denomination are going to be one-issue voters. And those who are don't all live in the South. I have a friend in NY who will only vote pro-life, even though she is poor and has really been hurt by some of Bush's policies.

[ThorsteinVeblen]

6. Abortion and Gay issues

are for the radicals on both sides. The majority of the American public embraces gay people and thinks abortion should remain legal - the South included.

Give the South some credit - Dean does.

[PinkTiger]

8. Thor -- don't you mean remain legal???

I hope so. I think most southerners think abortion should remain legal.

[ThorsteinVeblen]

9. Thanks.

[1songbird]

21. You know that Rove is intended to make gay marriage

a central issue. I just think that we should be prepared for this and armed with a solid platform that focuses on acceptance.

[kentuck]

7. As for the abortion and gay-rights issues...

He will need to tackle them head on...not tippy-toe around them. He needs to say that the Repubs use the abortion issue to divert attention from real issues that affect most of our lives. Whether we agree with abortion or not, we need to keep our noses out of other people's business. If a woman has an abortion, we may not agree with it, but it is a decision between the woman and her doctor. We need to understand when we are being manipulated and used by the politicians.

As for the gay-rights issues, we believe just what the Founding Fathers said, "All men are created equal" and that goes whether they are gay, straight, or in-between. We believe in live and let live. We do not believe in denying basic rights to anyone in this country. Just because you might disagree with a certain lifestyle does not give you the right to deny rights to any individual citizen.

That is the type of plain talk that Southerners will respond to.

[ThorsteinVeblen]

13. I think we all should be tolerant

of dissenting opinions. When I was in South America (which is mostly Catholic), people I loved and respected were vehemently pro-life. They completly disagreed with abortion on moral principles but were socialist on economic issues. Some people may believe abortion is utterly immoral and I respect that. I just don't believe that they or the government should have say over someone elses body - if we don't have domain over our own bodies, what freedom do we have?

[1songbird]

17. If you're right then Dems may have a chance.

It would certainly be to poor southerners advantage to vote with us.

[hedda_foil]

34. That's exactly what he ALWAYS says, Kentuck.

You're literally taking the words out of Dean's mouth. It's time for you to start checking out his speeches, kiddo, because Dean's been delivering exactly what you're specifying for a long time!

[Eloriel]

26. We're not looking for 100% of their votes

Just enough to make a difference.

IOW: 50% + 1

Eloriel

[kentuck]

27. Very true Eloriel...

And in some of the states, we were close enough to win with a few thousand votes one way or another. The red states had a lot of blue in them.

[ThorsteinVeblen]

3. He's close

He is alot closer than Bush who is using radical religious language to further his imperialist agenda.

Most Southerners are NOT freaky religious zealots. If Dean can thread the needle and make Bush look silly by speaking in down-to-earth language we ALL can understand, he can win.

No more "evildoers and evil ones" - More language that unites us all - southern and northern, Muslim and Christian and Jew, black and white. Plain talk for people that have everything in common and who all want to live in peace.

[NoMoreRedInk]

10. Dean seems angry. He doesn't come across as a pleasant man...

that you'd like to be your next door neighbor who comes over for sweet tea and barbecue on the back porch.

Bill Clinton was that man. And sadly, so is George Bush.

There's alot more than policies and programs necessary to whoo southern voters. As a matter of fact, I think it can be summarized as God, Guns, Gays, and Race. And Barbecue.

I don't mean to be trite, but I am a tried and true and very proud Southerner, and I truly believe this is how it works.

[kentuck]

12. Jimmy Carter was from Georgia and he wasn't a racist...

and he won. I don't agree with your general statement. How did John Kennedy win? Talking about barbecue? I don't think so. And he was also a Catholic. He won big in the South.

[NoMoreRedInk]

18. That was a long, long time ago. In fact, he was the last Northerner....

from either party to win the presidency.

[Cha]

20. Time for it to happen again, then!

[ThorsteinVeblen]

15. That is 50 years of political diviseness speaking

Dean may just be the man to cut through all that bullshit. Leaders are made, not born. The U.S. is at a crisis point - Dean can lead us out.

[Cha]

16. Oh ..Dean is quite pleasant and passionate when he

asks if we "want our Country Back"! http://www.deanforamerica.com

[NoMoreRedInk]

22. During these debates, I can see the anger and resentment in Dean's eyes...

anytime someone disagrees with or confronts him. He looks like he's got smoke coming out of his ears and, if nobody else was around and he wasn't on national TV, he'd cuss his confronter up and down in a manner that would make a sailor blush.

That said, if he wins the nomination, I'll vote for him with a vengeance. But he will lose in a big, big way in the southern states. Hopefully, that won't preclude him from winning the general election.

All this "Dean can bring southerners together" is a bunch of fairy tale BS that doesn't happen. Either you've got it or you don't, and Dean doesn't "got it" when it comes to whooing southern voters.

That's my opinion.

[Cha]

24. And I disagree! But that's okay...we're all

different. Thank goodness or it would be very boring.

[1songbird]

25. His passion is actually one of the things that I like about him.

Why do Dems have to be relegated to being NICE. We were nice and they stole the election, we were nice and they recalled Gray Davis, We were nice and they sent our troops to war to be killed, we were nice and they ran up the deficit endangering Social Security and on and on....

I think we've been a little too nice.

[Cha]

28. "We were nice"...very good, 1songbird.

I like my Dems angry and passionate! The niceness can come later at the inaugeration! :7

[jumptheshadow]

37. There will be no inauguration

If the Dems project negativity during the presidential campaign. It will play right into the hands of the Republicans.

[Skwmom]

11. Honesty is the key word.

Unfortunately, once Rove gets finished exposing Dean for the dishonest person he is, Dean's criticism of Bush won't matter. To be able to call someone a liar and for it to work the person doing the talking has to be above reproach. That person is not Howard Dean.

[kentuck]

14. Whether Dean is honest or not is your opinion...

The voters in the South will only have to determine if he is "more or less honest" than George W Bush. he doesn't have to be a saint.

[Cha]

19. rove is the one who is "dishonest" ...Dean is an

honest, trustworthy man who is capable of leading us to Victory!

[RetroLounge]

39. Don't bother with SKWMOM

She has 800 posts, and I would bet 750 are Dean Bashes, and then she fades away, never replies.

It's Hit and Run bashing by someone totally ignorant of what Dean stands for or says.

[artr2]

29. And I assume you have evidence to back it up?

Everytime I see you name in a Dean thread I'm always sure I going to hear a knock on Dean, So this time and every other time I see spouting BS about my guy I am going to call you on it. So show me the proof to back up your allegations. I'm sure since you are so sure about your OPINION you have plenty of proof to show me.

[Andromeda]

36. Dean is not dishonest...

he is probably too honest for his own good. That's why so many Democrats love him. He's a genuine person who taps into the needs of the average American and who speaks to them in language they can understand.

A man like Rove who creates illusions for a living will have a harder time trying to pigeonhole Dean. He can try, but Dean is a lot smarter than Rove.

[RetroLounge]

40. You wouldn't know a thing about Dean because

you never stop to listen or find out anything.

You are a hit and run basher, and have NO PROOF of anything you say.

So tell us, how is Dean dishonest?

Canyou PROVE this?

didn't think so.

[UserJohnny1479]

23. He's getting closer

Dean just needs to bring the South on board and then move back to the left to keep the base intact. He has the words and smile to do it so I think we can put our faith in him.

[SCliberal73]

38. Absolutely agree

with you. Many in the South are ready to respond to an authentic populist message advocating universal health care, wage/trade/union protections and reform; education, etc. (Plus: leaving guns alone).

That is a message that works. Combine that with criticism of the Shrub's developing fiasco in Iraq; corrupt corruption; looming Haliburton Scandal, my goodness. Might be a campaign there.

To see Dean call Bush a liar to his face? In a debate? On national television? Slap me on the ass and call me Sally --- I'd watch that.

[newyawker99]

43. Hi SCliberal73!!

Welcome to DU!! :toast:

[HFishbine]

41. A lot of work ahead

While everything you write, Kentuck, is true, there are some deeply engrained misonceptions that are going to have to be broken first.

Yeah, a lot of poor and middle-class southerners are suffering, but we can't just start with "you need health care and education so vote for the democrats." Someone needs to explain in no uncertain terms just how republican policies have been working against their interests. I don't think they see it yet.

Why have manufacturing jobs in the South declined by 30% since Bush took office? Is it because of Bush policies that favor mult-national corporations? Most working class southerners don't see that. They atribute it to "leaky" borders that allow "those Mexicans" to come in "here" and take "our" jobs. The more "sphisticated" may agree and add that high taxes and environmental laws are also to blame for making their states "un-friendly" to business.

We have to start at square one. We can't just leap to jobs, and health care and education. The republicans are promising those too. We have to start by dispelling some misconceptions first.

[AP]

42. That message: vote for me in primary & I guarantee a Bush victory in GE.

That message will resonate with many southerners.