Erase Your Student Loans the Howard Dean Way

[aeon flux]

November 13th, 2003 9:15 AM

On Wednesday, Howard Dean’s campaign unveiled a revolutionary—some would say radical—proposal for lowering the cost of college in America, while at the same time encouraging a fresh wave of national service. In a speech at Dartmouth College in New Hampshire on Thursday, the Democratic frontrunner is expected to announce details of a sweeping plan he claims will guarantee "every young person access to an affordable four-year college education."

The "College Commitment," as the policy is called, promises that all students will have access to $10,000 annually for college, provided in a mix of grants and loans, depending on family earnings. After school, students would make regular payments on the full debt, but they’d receive a tax credit at the end of each year for any amount they’d paid over 10 percent of their income. That way, the campaign argues, no one would ever pay out more than 10 percent of their earnings, or have to make payments for more than a decade.

cont.

[Don_G]

1. It Sounds Like A Good Start

Provided the Technical and Vocational programs aren't left out.

[Scott Lee]

2. Damn that Howard Dean!! What about the flag what about the..

flag what about the flag what about the flagwhat about the flagwhat about the flagwhat about the flagwhat about the flagwhat about the flagwhat about the flagwhat about the flag???

(sarcasm off, Go Dean).

[AP]

4. What about the fact this plan does nothing to address the fact that

students are hugely in debt alread, and this plan merely guarantees that banks get their money, and makes the taxpayers reimburse students for their loans.

Furthermore, you have to have an income to get this benefit, so lots of indebted recent grads are going to accept lower paying jobs to get the tax break rather than file for unemployment (which loses the break). Employers will adjust salaries downward knowing that students will calculate in the value of the tax credit. Ie, taxpayers will be subsidizing low wage jobs, which helps employers increase their profits.

[quaker bill]

9. That is just absurd

The only people I know who take lower paying jobs to avoid taxes are war-tax protesters.

The math does not work. More money is simply more money even if you have to pay some taxes on it.

In so far as employers lowering wages, they have all the incentive they need already, this program will not add to it.

[AP]

10. You need to be working to get the credit.

Employers will now that lots of students need to work or they loose the, say, 2000 dollar credit. As result it will be a buyer's labor market for the kinds of entry level jobs 21-31 years olds are willing to take, and it could very likely drive down wages by an amount just above the value of the tax credit.

[Scott Lee]

12. While more students can afford school!

That looks like a net win to me.

Hmmm, let's see....cheap labor in order for some students to go to school, they graduate and move on to better jobs.

I can live with that. My wife is doing that right now (but without the Dean benefit).

[AP]

16. Students have no problems getting loans now, which is all this program is.

They have problems paying the loans, which they still have to do with this program. They just get some of the money they pay back, if they're lucky enough to be underemployed, but not unemployed.

What students need help with is, say, grants to reduce the principle so they're financing less of their educations, and they need good, well paying jobs (which this program also undermines, unless, of course, you work for one of the banks or investment companies whose profits are guaranteed by Dean's plan).

Wise up.

[ShaneGR]

20. God forbidden people will have to work, horrible!

PLEASE NO!

Huh????

How is it bad to ask college graduates to work in order to pay off only 10% of their college loans per year, for a cap of 10 years?

Hell, at this pace I'll be paying the damn things till I'm friggin 60.

[Renew Deal]

5. Actually...

You have the power! You have the power! You have the power! You have the power! You have the power! You have the power! You have the power! You have the power! You have the power! You have the power! You have the power! You have the power! You have the power! You have the power! You have the power! You have the power! You have the power! You have the power! You have the power! You have the power! You have the power! You have the power! You have the power! You have the power! You have the power! You have the power! You have the power! You have the power! You have the power! You have the power! You have the power! You have the power! You have the power! You have the power! You have the power! You have the power! You have the power! You have the power!

[AP]

6. You have the power...to make Wall St wealthier.

[Scott Lee]

7. Helluvah lot more helpful, as slogans go!

But please, if you want to keep cheerleading for a stupid and distractive issue, don't let me stop you. Let's hear more about the confederate flag flap. We surely haven't heard anough yet.

[boilerbabe]

15. Are you kidding??? If they cook that flag any more...

It is going to be burned already. And you know how some folks feel about burnt flags. That was an awkwardly worded statement by Howard that got taken to its limits by all who were lying in wait. He was trying to say (and don't hold him to my interpretation by any means) that there is a segment of society that is voting against their interests without realizing it, due to social issues, whilst overlooking the economic issues...See the posts regarding Southern issues somewhere herein...very informative for those of us clueless Yankees....

I think he was attempting to appeal to the totally overlooked disenfranchised angry white blue collar male, so why should they be rooting for the top 1%??? So they can keep and bear arms?? That's how a lot of us think. Do you think those boys in office care one iota if we can keep a registered gun or any other constitutional right? NOOO. But they put things simplistically, sound bites are the only way to reach people. Black and White Right and Wrong. OK seems reasonable, doesn't it? Who has the time to sift through the information one is flooded with every day to determine what's true, or best? I may be wrong, but I think his intent was to acknowlege that this segment of the population was maybe being led down the cowpath without realizing it.

So that's all I can tell ya....

let's work on getting this country back on track, and not get hung up in semantics any more than we need to!!

XXXXXXXXXXXXOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

the boilerbabe

[boilerbabe]

14. Ha ha!! are you a Flagwhat?? haha couldn't resist that one!!n/t

[AP]

3. Duplicate. There's a 79 post thread on this in PC

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=108&topic_id=84166&mesg_id=84166

[Pepperbelly]

8. Very cool idea ... nt

[AP]

11. Cooler idea: Edwards plan to reduce by 25% or more the amount

you have to borrow in the first place by giving a grant to pay for a year of tuition for students who work. (By the way, it's very possible that this is a cheaper option than taxpayers subsidizing billions of dollars in loan interest for 10, 15, 25 and 30 years loans).

Of course, the Wall St banks which want to get everyone hooked on debt and turn them into wage slaves won't like it.

Face it. There's NO problem getting college loans. Every bank will give them (partly because you can't vacate them in bankruptcy -- it's easy money for banks).

Dean's plan is just more credit which taxpayers finance. The real Democrats have plans which tip the balance back in favor of students rather than banks by reducing the amount you have to finance in the fist place.

This one is very obvious, folks.

[boilerbabe]

13. I would like to see that...

I am not a young person, but maybe some of us "retreads" could also take advantage of this policy. I am a volunteer on Howard Dean's campaign in CT, and I was aware that he had a plan for higher education. I really do feel that he can work out a lot of solutions to problems in this country, though that is a very big job.

But he is willing to try it, and not only does he have ideas, he has a plan!!!

[AP]

17. Ideas and plans to help Wall St. And he's willing to try.

Yippee.

[politicat]

18. It's in the right direction...

No, it's not perfect, just like Dean's Health Care policy isn't perfect because it doesn't take the profit motive out.

But cheesus, people, what do you want? ? We've got to do something and a step in the right direction that has a change of getting passed is better than standing here saying it's not perfect while parents get second mortgages and personal loans and credit card advances they may never pay off to pay for 1 year of college.

Yes, we're subsidizing college. Sorry folks, we are. College (of some sort, including vocational and technical) are now necessary. While the most radical proposal would be to make 2 years of college public (like high school) this is a lot better than what we have now. However, we subsidize college now. State schools, community colleges, land-grand schools, and the subsidized student loan program are all subsidized.

Believe me, a college grad has a far better chance of paying off her debt to society in the form of taxes paid over a lifetime than a high school grad does.

I see where this is going. Kind of like the health care proposal, we start out making it easy to get college paid for for everyone (No Young Adult Left Behind?). Then we make it free for two years.... then four years. (no one has to go after HS, but when it's a good idea....)

I paid for college the hard way - working, school, scholarships and loans and I am one of the last who could do so. College is out of most people's reach these days.

I'm willing to accept it as a start, not a finished product.

Politicat

[AP]

19. What do I want? Pell Grants. Lower debt load for students.

This plan encourages students to take on MORE debt load because they know the government is going to step in a guarantee it.

This program will cost 7.9 billion dollars. That's the equivalent of 790,000 10,000 GRANTS! Dean's proposal says the average debt load for a graduating college student is 17,000 bucks. So why don't we just give each student 10,000 outright? Or totally clear the debt of 500,000 or so graduates? (How many college graduates are there every year anyway? 4 million?)

I'll tell you why. Because this is a plan that is mostly about guarantying a profit for banks. Banks and investment companies need the guaranteed profit from these loans. And by giving a tax credit to students for part of their loans, they're making sure that the banks get their money. And Dean plans on using taxpayer money (accumulated regressively) to make sure the banks get their profits.

That aint good.

Notice that the non-libertarians running for president want to reduce the amount of money students have to finance in the first place. That's good for students, good for taxpayers, but bad for Wall St.