This is Saddam's war now......the way he planned it: Scott Ritter, others

[buycitgo]

I heard that this morning on "This is Hell," a radio show out of Northwestern U........http://www.thisishell.com

they were talking about how Saddam's only hope against the US was to cut and run during the opening phase of the invasion, then, once the mission was accomplished, heh, let loose his hidden war dogs, with their hidden weapons/money caches and fight the war with the intent to defeat America, not the American armed forces on the ground and in the air.

They discussed Ritter's appearance on the show some time ago--it should be archived--before the war, in which he made the above prediction.

I never heard any of that til today, but it certainly fits a hypothesis that the war is heating up, not cooling off, as today's events in the supposedly safe Kurdish zone, demonstrate.

anyone else heard about this?

if true, it bodes only ill for our soldiers over there

[Cronus Protagonist]

1. That's been my personal theory since the "fall" of Baghdad

It was too easy. And it's obvious that this method will work since a similar method worked in viet nam.

Click Here To See Fair & Balanced Buttons, Stickers & Magnets

[Eloriel]

5. Don't forget re the "too easy" part that

we bought off the Iraqis. That was what was happening, I think, during that 3-day or so lull in doing anything once we reached the outskirts of Baghdad. General Franks confirmed that we'd bribed them.

Don't disagree with your point, just wanting to make sure people understand how craven (and fooish!) we really are. Imagine: bribing our enemy to not fight, only to have them come back and fight us in a guerilla war.

Eloriel

[NewJeffCT]

12. Isn't that similar to us...

Bribing the Turks to send troops, only to have them change their minds?

[Code_Name_D]

13. Inlisting the enimey.

And think, they have been gung ho to retrain Iraqi to be the new police. Some of them were members of Husane's secret police. Kind of reminds me of Braveheart when the King sent the Irish to crush the Scots, only to have them shake hands and join forces.

We could send the newly trained Iraq police to go out and find the resistance, drink a few beers, then come back strangly emptey handed.

[nadinbrzezinski]

2. Before the war started

Tariq Azzis was interviewed by CBC's Peter Mansbridge on "The National"

He engaged in small talk but finally Mansbridge came to the conduct
of the war.

Azzis said, and I am paraphrasing

"This will be a second vietnam for America."

So the Canuck reporter (for whom I have a lot of respect) asked him,
How? He pointed to the lack of jungles in the country

Azzis without loosing a beat said, "we have them, urban jungles.
Our cities will become the jungles of this second vietnam."

Its been months, and months... and I have been waiting for the
second shoe to drop... and you can bet the PNAC crowd didn't even
see that interview... and why should they? It contradicted every
piece of manufactured intelligence they had.

Also from Iraqi history this was predictable like the sun rises every day. This is the Second Arab Revolt in less than a hundred years against a Western Power... the first one started in Karbalah in 1920
and spread to all points very fast... this one started in Karbalah in 2003 and is spreading to all points.


Hell even some of the language is back

As Group Leader Harris said in Jerusalem back in the 1930s

"the only thing they understand is force."

Did anybody ever think of giving these idiots a copy of Santayana's
sayings? IN particular that one about "those who refuse to learn
from history are bound to repeat it?"

I mean we truly have to be weary of the Tides of March.

[msmcghee]

3. And Saddam said . .

. . oh pleeze, pleeze - don't throw me in that bramble bush.

[Ress1]

4. Mission accomplished.

SH rope-a-doped Bush.

[Maddy McCall]

6. Kesselschlacht.

It is a guerilla form of Kesselschlacht.

[buycitgo]

7. scott ritter and william pitt on the same show!

Danny Muller--Voices in the Wilderness, too

http://www.thisishell.com/archives_2003.html

listening to Ritter now; so far, nothing about Saddam, but Pitt is on later

go to March 29 broadcast

this is an excellent show...check the archived guest list on main page

[Scott Lee]

8. Scott Ritter, Gods bless him, did not invent this scenario

It has been held by many of us since long before the actual war even happened. It takes no brainiac military stategist, or Jaynes Defense Weekly guru, to figure that one out.

The real question is, what colossal ego and lack of foresight in the current selected administration failed to take this scenario seriously? Is this what we call "the arrogance of power", or better yet, the "pride" that "goeth before the fall"?

[jonoboy]

9. how can a stranger ever defeat a man in his own country ?

[alcuno]

10. "This is Hell" is the absolute best. Should be required listening

Except that darn football keeps getting in the way.

[buycitgo]

17. a big AAAmen, alcuno!

I/m so frickin sick of NU football. today's show was excellent, as usual.

what do you think of Jeff Dorchen/Moment of Truth? Those are archived there, as well, and make for good reading, maybe better than hearing them on air.....my radio barely gets the station, and their internet stream is very unreliable for me

I got free tickets from TIH to see his one man show earlier this year at Old Town School of Folk Music.....he's a very good writer, not a bad performer.

Also got Greg Palast's book/video this year when he did a speaking thing at NU....giving book to bitchkitty (bushbodycount.com) next time I see her.

interesting that they speculated on the bona fides of Karen Kwiatkowski today, though, as she has some sort of connection to that guy from Connecticut who's seeking EU political asylum (only US citizen seeking to do so). He was on the show awhile back, and, since, then, they seem to think he might be mental.

hope they're just speculating idly about Kwiatkowski, as she's something else.....very trenchant work, archived here:

http://www.lewrockwell.com/kwiatkowski/kwiatkowski-arch.html

note who else he archives at his site:

http://www.lewrockwell.com/columnists.html

from Ann Coulter to Ted Rall; from Gary North to Robert Fisk; from Thomas Sowell to Thomas Tomorrow



course, for a REALLY mental POV, check this out, check this freeperville thread bashing Kwiatkowski (mostly host Rockwell, anything but a liberal):

Maybe they need to look up "libertarian" in the dictionary

It appears right after "liberal," their ideological soulmates.

http://209.157.64.200/focus/f-news/902498/posts

just for fun; ran across this again:

[jeffreyi]

11. Just heard a book on tape

called "crisis of Islam", published a couple years ago. It's pretty good as far as helping lay out some basics of the culture and religion in view of recent events. Anyway one claim in the book is that many in the Middle East view the war in Afganistan as a successful event that toppled the Soviet Union. Makes sense that if that's true, some would be inclined to repeat the strategy. Suggesting that the whole thing in Iraq is one big sucker punch, and the USA are the punch-ees.

[maggrwaggr]

14. recently someone posted how the Soviet Union was lured in to Afghanistan

by the U.S., by the CIA, as a trap. It worked.

What I want to know is, who lured us into this trap?

What was Putin doing back in the early 1980's?

Does anyone know?

Could this be some sort of revenge?

I know this is purely speculative, but I like to think about such things. It's getting pretty obvious the US fell into a trap.

[wabeewoman]

15. Greed, all that oil and

the supreme arrogance of bush and cheney and their corporate cronies is what got us into this. Why didn't they consider negative outcomes? Because most all of these guys have been privileged and bullies their whole lives and had the path paved in front of them. I think in their arrogance they just figured this would be the same. And really the only reason they care now is to get bush elected. If there was no election coming up, we wouldn't even be turning 'control' over to the Iraqi's. And I've seen no evidence they are concerned about the casualities except for the political consequences.

[maggrwaggr]

16. yes, but who besides Chalabi may have lured us in?

I've wondered this about 9/11 as well.

Could there be a Russian connection?

What was Putin's role in Afghanistan in the late 70's early 80's?

Bush and Cheney are stupid and are being played like violins by somebody. But who exactly? Osama Bin Laden? Yes, but .... who exactly is he? And who's behind him?

What was Poppy Bush doing with Putin a month or so ago? What were they talking about?

What exactly is Russia's new deal with Saudi Arabia?

Why again was the head of the oil oligarchy in Russia arrested by Putin and put in prison?

[NNN0LHI]

19. In the early 1980's Putin was a KGB agent n/t

[bpilgrim]

21. i am concerned about this as well...

it would be easy to spot the neoCONs hubris and arrogance and decide to LEVERAGE them.

we have so many enemies these days it will be hard to figure out even by our spooks especially if when you consider the possibility that it may be more than one.

one must also consider that even if this kind of operation wasn't before or as this admin came into office by now it is INEVITIBLE, imho.

but then again what do i know i'm just a civilian family guy.

:hi:

peace

[aquart]

18. Saddam's plan doesn't matter

Whoever gets the Americans out, gets to rule Iraq. Is Saddam the only interested party? He's in his sixties and his sons are dead. He could rule for five minutes. The plan may still be in place, but it would be no matter what or who. WE are invaders. THEY will get us out.

Unless we are prepared to kill forty million people and even then it won't work.

We need to leave. We've lost. It was a stupid, murderous idea, and now we have to go to salvage whatever is left at home, which isn't much.

[buycitgo]

20. I see your point

you may be right; e.g. Saddam may be dead.

dunno whether anyone but Saddam will be able to take credit for gettin US out, if it happens involuntarily.

at least for now, the movement is amorphous, leaderless, which makes me think, that unless someone/some group steps forward, there will be a huge vacuum left in our wake

Georgie Ann Geyer wrote a column the other day, addressing this, somewhat obliquely, saying that tribal leaders, who Saddam stripped of most of their influence during his regime, may be the ones most able to bring any semblance of order to this indefinable mess.

[molok555]

22. No link, but...

read an article by an ex-CIA man stating that this is classic Sun Tzu:

1) Attack your enemy's strategy (Shock & Awe only works if your there to experience it. Dissipate. Melt away into the civilian population. Another (admirable) strategy of the US was to limit 'collateral damage'. The Iraqis know this, so they pull back into those areas. All part of the home field advantage)

2) Attack your enemy's alliances (Obvious-UN, ICRC, Jordan, Italy, Poles. Direct attacks also work by making future allies think twice-Japan, Turkey, Pakistan, India, ROK)

3) Attack you enemy (M1A1, Chinook, Blackhawk x3, + the numerous probing 'pinprick' attacks. As the visitors lash out at these (Iron Hammer?), the civilian pop slowly comes to your side)

Read this Ritter article re: Saddam's planning:
"In the Baghdad suburb of Abu Ghraib is a compound on an abandoned airstrip that once belonged to a state organization known as M-21, or the Special Operations Directorate of the Iraqi Intelligence Service. As a UN weapons inspector, I inspected this facility in June of 1996. We were looking for weapons of mass destruction (WMD). While I found no evidence of WMD, I did find an organization that specialized in the construction and employment of "improvised explosive devices" - the same IEDs that are now killing Americans daily in Iraq."
Link:http://www.csmonitor.com/2003/1110/p09s02-coop.html?entryBottomStory

Saddam, or whoever, is NOT making the mistake of fighting the last war, as many said/hoped he would. Losing forces a refocus. The neocons in the * Admin ARE fighting the last war (not Afghanistan, but GW I), and it's not working out so well.