Lee Harvey Oswald had a MISTRESS!

[Octafish]

The History Channel reveals the news Oswald’s life had a biographer in the form of his lover. This revelation is a true watershed for assassination researchers.

Producers of new installments to its “The Men Who Killed Kennedy” series taped an extensive interview with Ms. Julie Baker, a woman who claims — and has evidence to back up her claims — to have been Lee Harvey Oswald’s girlfriend in the last months of his life.

If true, this is like a nuclear bomb going off. What she says will help bring closure to the “Who” and “Why” aspects of the JFK assassination.

In the testimony she has so far provided is supported by more than circumstantial information. Important tangential information, that could only be rationally explained by the information she provided, is finally understood in context of the assassination.

First, Ms. Baker explained why Ferrie experimented with rats and the more interesting, and plausible, aspects of the CIA plans to knock off Castro using biological agents and immunosuppressant cancer therapies.

JFK assassination researchers for years (for me, 34) had wondered about Ferrie's "cancer experiments." The guy had all these mice in cages in his house. Visitors wondered WTF that was all about. That History Channel interview explained what that was all about.

Another loose end that Ms. Baker tied together concerded (sic) Oswald's trip to Mexico City. He went, Oswald was ordered, to drop off the viral agents. At the same time, the CIA was setting him up by staging his appearance at the Cuban embassy.

His trip to Mexico City at one time may have been to deliver bioweapons for use against Castro, but it was used as a set-up. His Agency contacts never showed. His back-up contacts ignored him. No, Oswald found himself in Cuba for another reason — He was being set up as the patsy for the crime of the century.

Now it's clear: The powers-that-be the CIA works for had already decided to use the JFK assassination as link to Castro and Cuba. Just like their Operation NORTHWOODS, the tragedy would be used to spark invasion and war. Lots of money to be made in war: A mark of the BFEE. And the Beast.

One last thing, I had always doubted Oswald went to Mexico City until yesterday. There was one thing that kept me believing the trip might have occurred: Mexico City was where Oswald wrote the note addressed to "Mr. Hunt" someone put forth years later. See it for yourself:



'N-o-v 8, 1963

Dear Mr. HUNT:

I would like information concerding (sic) my position.

I am asking only for information. I am suggesting that we discuss the matter fully before any steps are taken by me or anyone else. Thank you LEE HARVEY OSWALD.


I had always wondered about that note. Did it go to the oilman Hunt or was it was addressed to Mr. Hunt of the CIA? Now we know the answer: Mr. Hunt the oilman’s correspondence would have been addressed c/o Mr. Clint Murchison. Oswald didn’t have that guy’s address, or even name, on him or in his black book.

[southerngirlwriter]

1. Funny you should mention this....

A close friend of mine lived in Dallas in the 1960's. He frequented a restaurant where Oswald's wife worked and had many conversations with her. She mentioned to him that she was afraid her husband was having an affair. I've often wondered why this never appeared in any of my reading on the subject.

[Octafish]

2. Please invite your friend to send a statement ...

to one of the academics working on documenting the history of what happened back then. For example, your friend's testimony would mean a lot to Philip Melanson at the University of Massachusetts Dartmouth, for one. Me and the millions of other Americans and billions around the world who have wanted Justice for 40 years are another!

Thanks for the great information, southerngirlwriter! Things that can't be formerly explained fit in when they are part of a bigger picture. A hearty welcome to DU!

[southerngirlwriter]

3. Contact info?

He's in his 60's and does not do computers or internet. Is there a phone number or address??

[Octafish]

6. Philip Melanson is a scholar specializing in political violence.

I believe Dr. Melanson would welcome your friend's information. Melanson, Dr. John Newman, Dr. Peter Dale Scott and a too-small listing of others have devoted much of their professional careers to documenting that terrible history. It is important to know as much as possible, in order to determine the reasons and avoiding the intended outcomes of the assassination yet to pass.
Professor Philip Melanson:

[e-mail]

His CV indicates:

Fields of Specialization

American Politics:

Political Assassination and Violence
Governmental Secrecy and Freedom of Information
Public Policy Processes

I've read two of his books:

"Spy Saga" (1990) about Oswald's life in US Intelligence. The ground-breaking work led to new revelations by other researchers.

"The Robert F. Kennedy Assassination: Conspiracy and Cover-Up" (1991) which separates the signal from the noise, indicting the LA police, Ron Reagan's state police, J Edgar Hoover's FBI.

Professionally, Dr. Melanson is tops. On a personal level: His writings reveal him to be a truly kind person, a humanitarian.

[Very Good Dem]

26. I don' t believe

that Oswald's wife ever worked in a restaurant. When did our friend know her?

[Octafish]

34. You're funny.

Since when are you two friends?

[kskiska]

36. Marina Oswald married a very rich man

in the 60s. They eventually divorced, I believe. I can't see her working in a restaurant.

[hlthe2b]

4. Unbelievable that this is only coming out now...

Conspiracy theorists: has this not been discussed by any other investigator? Any idea why not?

[RandomKoolzip]

5. Because she only decided to come out now with her story.

....

[Media_Lies_Daily]

20. She was frightened out of her wits for one thing.

[Octafish]

25. Lots of new eyewitness testimony!

Incredible as it seems, hlthe2b, the History Channel had even more compelling eyewitness testimony. I taped the durn things and just saw the first installment of the three new shows end-to-end. It's called "The Smoking Guns." Going from memory, it lived up to its name:

1. The program showed movie film taken at Love Field in Dallas, where a Secret Service agent is seen ordering another agent off the back of the Presidential limousine. Contrary to SS protection protocols, the President's car was at the front of the motorcade, not the middle, where it could be better protected. The police motorcycles were kept back, as well, offering clear sight lines to an exposed President.

2. A newspaper reporter for a Dallas newspaper said her story was altered to remove references to an entry wound in the President's throat. A sentence was inserted to indicate the President may have been hit by another bullet (IIRC). She complained to an editor, who replied the changes were ordered "by the FBI."

3. A Texas physician, in a taped interview made shortly before her death, stated that when she was a 2nd year med student, she and a friend were at Parkland Memorial Hospital and saw a bullet hole in the Presidential limousine.

4. A glass engineer at the Ford Rouge Plant in Michigan, in a taped interview made shortly before his death, said he observed the limousine at the factory, where a new, custom-made windshield was made, patterned off the first, which was "scrapped."

5. The written report of a Secret Service agent reveals a bullet hole in the windshield of the car. The bullet hole had fragments on the inside part of the glass, meaning the projectile hit the car from the front.

There's more, but I'm gettin' seepy...

[Andyjunction]

7. As it happens...

That note was forged by the KGB. I know that might sound incredible, but compared to all the outlandish conspiracy theories it shouldn't. Especially since it's the truth.

See here:
http://www.jfk-online.com/mitrokhin.html

[Octafish]

9. Oswald didn't cause a scene in the Cuban Embassy in MC.

Oswald was not the man who was photographed leaving the Cuban Embassy in Mexico City and falsely reported by the CIA (David Atlee Phillips) to have been Lee Harvey Oswald. That is EVIDENCE of CIA a priori involvement in the assassination.



Finally, no where in that article is there evidence, other than the word of a KGB defector, that Oswald note was a forgery. All I wanted to bring up, like that photo above, there is some very important new information stating Oswald was in Mexico City to drop off some bioweapons for CIA-Mafia ops to use against Castro.

What I now find important to point out is to whom Oswald had a "concer(n)." That is, the person to whom the note was addressed: Mr. Hunt. Oswald had no flipping clue as to who the oil dude was. He had run across the real Mr. Hunt in all the anti-Castro/David Ferrie/Guy Banister work in Nawlins. Here's some background:

http://dirtypolitics.50megs.com/dirty.htm

And contrary to what the commie rat says: E Howard Hunt MAY have been in Dallas. No, I wasn't in Dealey Plaza that day to positively ID Hunt, but I do know that within a year after the picture of the Tramp was taken, E Howard Hunt underwent plastic surgery on his ears. The end result is more than a different appearance. He is rendered unidentifiable through comparisons of ears in pre- and post-assassination photos and reputed photos.

[Minstrel Boy]

11. the CIA station in Mexico City was impersonating Oswald,

fabricating a record of incriminating telephone calls before the assassination. In a case with some many smoking guns you can hardly see the guns for the smoke, this stands out.

Someone pretending to be Oswald made an incriminating series of telephone calls between September 28 and October 1, 1963, allegedly to the Cuban and Soviet consulates. And one allegedly between the Cuban and Soviet consulates, at a time when the Cuban consulate was closed and empty. In one of the calls, the Oswald impersonator mentions having met with Valery Kostikov, a man known to the CIA as the chief of KGB assassination operations in the Western hemisphere.

The CIA has lied about the tapes for decades. It said they were routinely destroyed before the assassination. But FBI documents have been uncovered which detail how at least two of the tapes were listened to after the assassination by FBI agents familiar with Oswald’s voice, who said it wasn't Oswald. And the Assassination Records Review Board found CIA documents in which the CIA itself states that some of the tapes were reviewed after the assassination, contradicting its long-held public position.

In a recently declassified transcript of a telephone conversation the day after the assassination, J Edgar Hoover tells Lyndon Johnson that it isn’t Oswald’s voice on the tapes. Hoover: "In other words, it appears that there is a second person who was at the Soviet Embassy down there."

On October 10, 1963, the CIA notified the FBI by teletype that Oswald had been in Mexico City and had been in contact with the Soviet Embassy on October 10, 1963. Normally, since Oswald was a former defector, this would have been brought to the attention of the FBI's Espionage Section, Division 5. But the FBI "FLASH" on Oswald, which had been in effect since his defection and required that "any information or inquiry" be passed on to the Espionage Section, Division 5, was suddenly canceled on October 9, 1963. So, after nearly four years, the FLASH was removed on Oswald just hours before the first CIA cable arrived.
(See John Newman, "Oswald, the CIA and Mexico City," in The Assassinations.)

[Media_Lies_Daily]

21. Excellent posts, Octafish and Minstrel Boy....thanks!

[DrBB]

29. About that note: Lee HARVEY Oswald?

I am not steeped in assassination lore so I may be off base here, but that signature smells funny to me. I understood that the insistance on spelling out his full name like that is a post-assassination artifact of the press coverage, elevation to middle-name status being an unconscious press convention in dealing with notorious figures (John WILKES Booth, e.g.). I'm quite sure I've read a correction about this somewhere--that of course in reality Oswald didn't go around referring to or thinking of himself as "Lee HARVEY Oswald," nor did anyone else who knew him, just Lee Oswald--first name and last name, like anybody else. Which is what you'd expect here; after all, the guy he's writing to presumably knows who he is and isn't in danger of confusing him with some other Lee Oswald.

And anyway, what would he be doing using his own name in a communication that he understood to be about a covert matter? As opposed to "Alek J Hidell" (=Hide-L, "hide Lee"?), his sometime alias, or another pseudonym? I have some experience identifying documents in other contexts, and this strikes me as inauthentic, bespeaking an anxiety about the thing being "correctly" identified--something an over-careful forger might do. Not conclusive, just a little dubious.

[Octafish]

30. Yours may be the most likely explanation, Doctor...

... Thanks for pointing out a most important perspective, DrBB. Oswald only became infamous as Lee Harvey Oswald after Dallas, like the major media criminals of modern times.

The evidence, testimony and analysis in this terrible case must be weighed, compared and ranked with more likely, or easier to accept, explanations. The probability of the "Oswald Note" being a forgery must be considered and kept in mind while analyzing the confusing information in this case.

My interpretation, although less likely in general, may be more understandable from the clandestine perspective. If real, the note so signed was meant to identify Oswald and tie him to the nebulous Mr. Hunt, of which this case has several.

Oswald apparently really was in Mexico City, around the same time the man who pretended to be Oswald and who went out of his way to cause a commotion at the Cuban embassy, means someone tried really hard to set up Oswaldo. If the real Oswald discovered someone was imitating him, or figured out he had been set up, he would want to create some way of leaving a public notice of his own innocence or shed light on the organization in Mexico City Mr. E Howard Hunt worked for.

Oswald left another possible clue when he asked, after his arrest, to be represented by New York attorney John Abt. That lawyer had gained fame for defending people involved in conspiracies to violently overthrow the government.

From Mae Brussell:

4:45 - 6:30 P.M. Second Interrogation of Oswald, Captain Fritz's Office

"When I left the Texas School Book Depository, I went to my room, where I changed my trousers, got a pistol, and went to a picture show. . . . You know how boys do when they have a gun, they carry it. . . . Yes, I had written the Russian Embassy. (On Nov. 9, 1963, Oswald had written to the Russian Embassy that FBI agent James Hosty was making some kind of deals with Marina, and he didn't trust "the notorious FBI.") . . . Mr. Hosty, you have been accosting my wife. You mistreated her on two different occasions when you talked with her. . . . I know you. Well, he threatened her. He practically told her she would have to go back to Russia. You know, I can't use a phone. . . . I want that attorney in New York, Mr. Abt. I don't know him personally but I know about a case that he handled some years ago, where he represented the people who had violated the Smith Act, . . . I don't know him personally, but that is the attorney I want. . . . If I can't get him, then I may get the American Civil Liberties Union to send me an attorney."

CONTINUED...

http://www.ratical.org/ratville/JFK/LHO.html

[Fuzz]

8. The whole series is fascinating.

I've been transfixed by it this week, tivo'ing (is that actually a word now?) every night. I just got done watching 4 episodes and it's just freaky.

[Octafish]

24. The series first ran in the early 90s and really hit home.

Nigel Turner's series freaked me out, too! And I used those very words before reading yoru post, Fuzz!

The series is not perfect, the stuff about "Michelle" the French assassin, for example, seems like disinformation, but hey! The eyewitness interviews, like the testimony from the deaf-mute man who saw people behind the picket fence from his position on the overpass, is outstanding. The viewer can decide whether the testimony and evidence are credible. The program really exposes the hoax the Warren Commission perpetrated on America.

Here's an excellent online source of info:

http://jfklancer.com/JFK2.html

For DUers new to the subject, an excellent overview:

http://pages.prodigy.net/whiskey99/

[BigBigBear]

10. I've been watching The Men Who Killed Kennedy

in its evolution since it first came out. Turner has added segments on at various times over the years. Most of it is excellent.

I did find this mistress story very interesting, and yet curiously uncorroborated. This women purports to tie:

Oswald to Ferrie
Oswald to Clay Shaw
Ferrie to Jack Ruby
Oswald to Jack Ruby

Ferrie and Oswald to a mysterious cancer-project to kill Castro.
Explains Oswald's odd trip to Mexico City.
Oswald's previous speculated role as an attempted assasination 'foiler'.

....and oddly enough, given the cancer research at work, NEVER ONCE suggests that this is how Ruby was eventually silenced in prison - rapid onset of terminal cancer.

If this women had two witnesses or a single piece of inarguable evidence linking her to Oswald and this project, I would take her claims seriously. But I didn't see any...

[grasswire]

12. for more pieces...

...read "Richard Case Nagell: The Man Who Knew Too Much" -- an outstanding book. Nagell was a spook who allegedly was tasked with killing Oswald before Oswald could try to assassinate Kennedy. Nagell didn't make the hit (I can't remember why, I read it about ten years ago) and in order to protect himself robbed a bank so he could be put in federal custody. He was in federal prison for a long time. Years later, he cut a deal of silence in exchange for safety for his family. He died just a few years ago.

[Octafish]

13. Good points. Here's a picture of Oswald and Ferrie in CAP.

I agree wholeheartedly: To be of value, let alone credible, the woman's story requires collaboration.

Here's a photo that provides one type of collaboration. Oswald and Ferrie at least were acquainted with each other from way back. Here they are in the Louisiana Civil Air Patrol in 1955.

[FlaGranny]

14. Employment records do verify

that she and Oswald worked together in New Orleans.

[Octafish]

18. Here's what Ms. Baker told her Manatee High School classmates...

Curator of the "Lee Harvey Oswald" musuem in the Netherlands, Ms. Baker is writing a book on her story. Seems she got a good start in her high school forum...

Judyth Vary Baker

To all my old friends at MHS! As you may recall, I was engaged in cancer research, and seemed to drop out of sight. Until now, I could not have mentioned what was going on in my life. Didn't you ever wonder what had happened to me? I, who had won national recognition for my magnesium project, and whose cancer research project gained Honors in the Westinghouse Science Talent Search, plus a trip to Buffalo to work in the nation's oldest cancer laboratories, seemed to vanish.. However, between 1961 and 1963, I was trained to do special cancer research. I became involved in an anti-castro project in New Orleans. I can't even discuss the impact of this project, but suffice that by spring of 1963, I was working for Reily coffee company as a front (my boss was former FBI agent William Monaghan) while actually engaged in clandestine cancer research with 'Dr.' David W. Ferrie (supposedly committed suicide but was probably murdered during the Garrison investigation) and renowned medical specialist Dr. Mary Sherman (brutally murdered July 21, 1964 for her part in the scenario I am about to describe). You may recall that I took Russian (all fees paid) at Manatee (then Jr.) Community College. I spoke crude conversational Russian by 1963, when I was introduced in New Orleans to Lee Harvey Oswald. When I wore my hair and makeup the same as his wife, Marina, --for I was same height, weight, and spoke Russian, Lee Oswald and I could worked together. Lee was involved in an anti-Castro project whose sponsor,. dr. Ochsner, was possibly related to the CIA in fact, one of Ochsner's best friends was 'Wild Bill' Donovan, who founded the CIA and who was, like Ochsner, a President of the American cancer Society. The project included delivery of live biological weapons into Cuba, aimed to kill Castro. Not only was Oswald an innocent man, he was framed in Dallas. He was a patriot who, had he defended himself, would have led to our deaths. We had endured the Cuban Missile Crisis in 1962, and the threat of communism spreading throughout Central and South America. I have been unable to speak about this for all these years, and indeed went into hiding after the events of Nov. 22-24, 1963. I am writing this to let light fall at last upon what must have seemed my many mysterious activities even in high school--such as meeting with Nobel Prize winners in St. Petersburg, and why I was never to become a doctor or research scientist. My book will come out next year, we believe, dealing with these events, and of my love affair with Lee. A little more biography: AA degree in 1965 from U of FL Gainesville. rec'd a B.S. degree in anthropology U of Houston. Rec'd M.A. from University of Central Florida in Creative Writing/Linguisitics. ABD/Ph.D. University of Louisiana. Had five children: Susan-- M.A. Creighton U.: she has three children. Josiah has six degrees. Professor at U. of Central FL, economics. World traveled, Has two children. James; graduated valedictorian (rank #1), SE H.S. 1991. Won Gold Feather Award. Has B.S. & M.A. from Vanderbilt U. Computer guru. Has two children.. John: graduated valedictorian SE High school 1992 (rank #0, a 'higher' rank than #1, as he also graduated PRIOR to H.S. graduation from MCC with an AA in engineering and had a GPA that was off the chart). Won Golden Herald Award in Mathematics, 1992. Grad. U of Central FL and Penn State with MS in computer engineering. Does classified work for the government. Sarah: graduated 1998, valedictorian of her class at North Central HS, Lafayette area, Louisiana. Married and attends U of LA in Lafayette. Plans to become a professional artist. Just as her siblings did, she attends on full scholarships. Was married 24 years -- divorced after I left the Mormon Church, which we had both joined in 1969 (I wanted to clear my conscience of the project and the pain of it all--I had seen Lee get shot on TV, and I needed a new start in life). I had married Robert Baker just after meeting Lee, and had planned to divorce him after Lee and I fell in love (Lee was not getting along with his wife at all). Lee Oswald had been sent into Russia so that he could then be sent into Cuba. But the Kennedy assassination trapped us. Lee was a handy scapegoat. He knew he was going to be set up, but hoped he could do something to save Kennedy. This is the man who is blamed for Kennedy's death. The cruelty of the way Lee Oswald was treated is unbelievable to me. I had even met Jack Ruby, who had liked Lee. The Mafia knew of us. Forced Ruby to murder Lee, or they would have exposed his part in everything, as he had been a longtime FBI informant. I believe the mob held the lives of his sister, Eva, and of his two brothers, over his head. He knew about the cancer research project. He even thought he had been injected with live cancer cells (he died of sudden lung cancer--which was what our project revolved around originally). Lee was a courageous man -- as will come out soon. I really don't expect you to believe any of this without documentation and proof. Don't be concerned: I've got the proof. Disinformation people possibly related to the CIA may try to muddy up my reputation. They have even claimed on the internet that I never did any cancer research in high school, and many other lies. It doesn't matter. I have my defenders and I've been able to prove everything I'm saying. . I've lived in Mexico and Norway as well as having traveled extensively. I spent seven years teaching college English in Louisiana and Texas, while gathering witnesses on tape and film who knew about me and Lee. Now I am living in Holland due to harrassment in the U.S. I send my very best wishes to everyone. Judyth (Judy Vary)

CONTINUED (scroll down, please)...

http://manateehurricane.home.att.net/then3.htm

[Minstrel Boy]

16. Here's another little piece of evidence tying Ferrie and Oswald:

In 1964, Ferrie was overheard talking about Oswald in the Winnipeg airport:

The Winnipeg Free Press reported that an FBI man, Merryl Nelson, had checked out a story told by a local businessman whose name was withheld for “security reasons” until November 1967. At that time Maclean’s, a leading Canadian magazine, ran a more complete coverage of the fascinating incident.

The informant, an obviously sincere and sensible Mennonite, and father of four, named Richard Giesbrecht, related a conversation he overheard on February 13, 1964, in the Horizon Room, a cocktail lounge in the sweepingly modern Winnipeg International Airport. The nature of the conversation led the thirty-five-year-old businessman, who was at the flight terminal to meet a client, to quickly conclude the two participants had knowledge regarding the assassination of the President. The more he listened, the more he became certain of his suspicions.

He described one of the men as having “the oddest hair and eyebrows I’d ever seen. The eyebrows were wide and sort of streaky. The hair was very shiny and it started quite far back on his head.” Giesbrecht thought this one of the pair resembled Stan Laurel “when he gets that look as if he’s going to cry,” and he recalls he wore heavy-rimmed glasses. Giesbrecht now says this man was David W. Ferrie.

...

Ferrie indicated he was concerned over how much Oswald had told his wife about the plot to kill Kennedy. Additionally, they discussed a man named Isaacs, his relationship with Oswald, and how curious it was that he would have gotten himself involved with a “psycho” like Oswald.

http://kenrahn.com/JFK/conspiracy_theories/Winnipeg/Flammonde.html

After questioning Giesbrecht and telling him that his information was important and "the break we've been waiting for," the FBI contacted him several months later and told him to forget about the matter since it was too serious and since he was a Canadian, there would be nothing the FBI could do for him if he needed protection. In a 1969 interview Giesbrecht told writer Paris Flammonde that he was 100 per cent certain the man he saw at the Winnipeg Airport was David Ferrie."
http://spot.acorn.net/jfkplace/09/fp.back_issues/05th_Issue/ferrie.html

[Neecy]

15. fascinating

If what she's saying is true, this is explosive information.

If she wants this to be taken seriously, I hope she volunteers for a lie detector test. Passing it and releasing the test publicly might give this story a push.

What surprised me by watching it was just how close Jim Garrison really might have been. And the media continues to portray him as a nut!

[Octafish]

17. Garrison was slimed by CIA stooges in the Press...

...and hindered by the conservative "Estbalishment" from D-FBI J Edgar Hoover, who covered-up Dallas (at best!) to Gov. Ronald Reagan of California, who refused to extradite a material witness in the Clay Shaw trial. As Garrison noted: It is a sign of a coup d'etat when the government's own do all they can to derail an honest investigation in the death of the government's chief executive.

[dbt]

19. The business about the Cancer Virus experiments was very telling!

I always wondered why Jack Ruby suddenly developed cancer.

:freak:
dbt

[Media_Lies_Daily]

22. Here's a book that might interest you....

Mary, Ferrie & the Monkey Virus : The Story of an Underground Medical Laboratory
by Edward T. Haslam, 1995
<http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0964398125/103-1125887-2623862?v=glance>

[Octafish]

23. Ruby had expressed fears of contracting cancer...

Seems Ruby had personal experience in the field. When he treated for a cold (pneumonia?), Ruby said he had been injected with cancer cells. His prison doctors and a family doctor disagreed over the type of lung cancer he had was from cells that do not originate in the lungs. The prison docs said they originated in the pancreas, the family doctor said the pancreas was normal.

("Crossfire: The Plot that Killed Kennedy" by Jim Marrs)

From an article on the late assassination researcher Mae Brussell, Gary Hart says he agrees:

EXCERPT...

She believed that Jack Ruby and Martha Mitchell had been injected with cancer—a tactic of the CIA uncovered in her research—and if Mae were alive today, she might well find a conspiracy behind her own death. Ah, but guess who's carrying on her work? Gary Hart! In the context of a book review for the Los Angeles Times, he writes:

     "I think President Kennedy was the victim of a conspiracy. And I've particularly thought so since serving as a member of the Church Committee between 1975-76 when, among other things, we discovered CIA efforts to assassinate foreign leaders ...The Prime target, pursued with almost demented insistence for 'executive action,' was Fidel Castro.

     "And the principal assets of these anti-Castro plots were three Mafia figures, Sam Giancana, Johnny Roselli and Santo Trafficante, now all dead. Giancana died of 'lead poisoning' and Roselli was killed during the Church Committee's investigation.., anyone involved in the conspiracy by circumstance or who seeks the truth by choice gets eliminated, one way or the other...."

CONTINUED...

http://www.maebrussell.com/Mae%20Brussell%20Articles/Lee%20Harvey%20Oswald%20Meets%20Suzanne%20Somers.html

[dbt]

27. Wow! Thanks, Media_Lies_Daily and Octafish!

I now have more stuff that I don't want to read--but must.

Jeebus! If the government will lie this long about JFK, what the fuck ELSE will they lie to us about?!?!?

And how come "Mr. George Bush of the CIA" can't remember where he was That Day--when everybody else who was alive anywhere in this country can't forget?

:freak:
dbt

[Octafish]

31. You made my political day, dbt!

The Bush Organized Crime Family seem mere stooges for the real criminals who overthrew the government on November 22, 1963. For forty years, I've wanted my country back. Reading you are more interested in discovering the reality is most encouraging! Thanks to you, and all who give a damn, America may once again be a nation of equal Justice for all, led by honest men and women.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

32. You're quite welcome.

[DrBB]

28. Note that Jack Ruby died of a sudden virulent cancer

The thought that kept occuring to me as I watched this. The other thought was that I didn't find the woman a particularly credible witness on all counts. I'm suspending judgment on all this for now.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

33. Her story checks out on all counts, and ties together some loose ends...

...that have bothered researchers about New Orleans for years.

As to Jack Ruby, he actually told a few people in the jail that he was being injected with something he believed was giving him cancer.

[Octafish]

35. CBS producer Don Hewitt confirms a woman approached "60 Minutes!"

... and claimed to be Oswald's mistress. Just now (Sunday Nov 23 2003 at 1:40 a.m. EST) on C-SPAN's living history testimonies regarding JFK, adding that she had a lot of detail regarding Oswald, was a dead-ringer for Marina Oswald, and that she said Oswald was an acquaintance of Jack Ruby. Hewitt didn't say when the woman showed up. This interview is dates November 2002.

I don't remember hearing Hewitt said the woman mention David Ferrie. Hewitt did not give her name, but added many of the things he heard regarding conspiracy.

EDIT: clarified interview time.

[9215]

38. This should be good

Ruby's link to Carlos Marcello (cited by the House Assasinations Committee as a suspect in the conspiracy) through the Campesios (sp)is what interests me here. I have a hunch that Leopoldo and Angel, who Oswald allegedly was in the company of, also were mechanics in the hit operation.

Marcello was linked to the Carousel lounge via Ruby's strippers see Russell's "The Man Who Knew" page 579. Ruby was in contact (phone records) with Marcellos as late as October 30.

Here's a snip.....

......Over the years since, Ruby's associations with organized crime--dating back to his Chicago days in the 1930's-- have been documented in numerous books. Some of the strippers at the Carousel Lounge were recruited from a New Orleans bar operated by Carlos Marcellos brother. Ruby's telephone records show that he called a Marcello lieutenant, Nofio Pecora, on August 4, and October 30; spoke to two of Jimmy Hoffas known hoodlums two weeks before the assassination; and remained in close touhs with Lewis McWillie, a frind of Santos Trafficante since their Havana casino days. The FBI has admitted that at least in 1959, Ruby acted as an FBI informant. Ruby has also made at least one trip to Cuba. in 1959, and wand was rumored to have run guns to Castro before the Cuban Revolution.
On November 22, 1963, attorney Frank Ragano said he recieved a phone call from an exuberant client. "Have you heard the good news?" Hoffa reportedly said. "They killed the son of a bitch. This means Bobby is out as Attorney General. Lyndon will get rid of Bobby." Indeed, Robert Kennedy's organized crime strike force would never meet again.

The evening of the assasination, Ragano had dinner in Tampa with Trafficante, who raised a toast to the president's demise and said: "Our problems are over now .... We're out of trouble now. We will build hotels, We will get back into Cuba now ". Two weeks later, in New Orleans, Ragano saw Marcello, who was angry because he had yet to recieve a $3 million he had requested from the Teamsters pension fund. "Jimmy owes me and owes me big," Ragano remembered Marcello saying. Sometime in December 1963, Hoffa told Ragano: "I'll never forget what Carlos did for me."
In February 1987, as Trafficante lay dying of heart disease, Ragano says he was summoned for one last conversation and told: "Carlos fucked up. We shouldn't have gotten Giovanni. We should have killed Bobby". This convinced the lawyer, once and for all, that his clients Trafficante and Hoffa had plotted with Marcello to kill the president......

The House Assasinations Committee concurred.

Then we need to look at who cleared the "intelligence community" out of the way so the deed could be done.


This book is, IMHO, the definitive work on the plot to kill Kennedy. This is just one page. Russell puts stuff out page after page for over 800 pages! Noone has worked as hard to piece the puzzle together.

Oswald's P.O. box# is 2915

edited for spelling, grammar

[DemonFighterLives]

37. Great Stuff

N/T Kick.

[Unknown Known]

39. Kick

A most important development and one I have never heard. Also, the segment "The Quilty Men" is extraordinary. Makes me wonder what will come out in 10 more years - if we live that long!

P.S. And thanks for this thread!

[Field Of Dreams]

40. Here's an essay that questions her credibility

http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/judyth.htm

[Octafish]

41. Interesting information, that must be considered. Still it's McAdams.

McAdams is a BFEE turd in the fecal mold of Posner. He lives to support the "work" of the Warren Commission, J Edgar Hoover and the people behind the killing of President Kennedy.

Targeting Camelot: The Official McAdams FAQ

http://www.geocities.com/justicewell/faq.htm

The essay raises many points that must be considered, including the veracity of Ms. Baker and the likelihood of her claims.

EDIT: Added kudos to researchers. Thanks also to FieldOfDreams for the essay!

[Field Of Dreams]

44. Thanks for the info...

I've watched most of the series. Very thought-provoking.

[Octafish]

47. You're welcome, Field Of Dreams! Here's a good online resource...

... for those new to the subject:

The JFK Assassination for the Novice

http://pages.prodigy.net/whiskey99/

To hear Jim Garrison's side of the story:

http://www.prouty.org/

If you visit there, please go to the menu on the left side of the home page and down to "REAL AUDIO AND RADIO INTERVIEWS." Click there and then click "Jim Garrison" when the next frame appears. There's even Garrison's appearance on Johnny Carson, where Johnny is "well prepared" with questions that border on inquisition.

One last thing: Yes, McAdams does a good job of presenting his side of the events. His website does have a lot of solid information. Unfortunately, his approach is that of using the information to establish the results he wants — what the Warren Commission found. Please accept my apologies if I came across as holding that against you, as well.

[LeftPeopleFinishFirst]

42. Why would he sign it with the full "Lee Harvey Oswald"?

Wouldn't that be a dead giveaway that it is a fake letter? Why would you sign a letter that is bound to incriminate you with your middle name, let alone even your real name? It just doesn't make sense to me.

Anyway, interesting info- thanks for sharing.

[Octafish]

43. Self-incrimination may've been only chance at self-preservation...

Oswald found himself in deepest doo-doo in Mexico City. His contact failed to show, his back-ups didn't want anything to do with him, and someone imitating him was calling on the Soviet and Cuban embassies to demand at high volume entrance visas and audiences with the most unsavory characters in the ligations.

Perhaps — and I understand this represents a very low-order of probability — Oswald figured out the big picture of what was happening. In signing his full name, he was publicly identifying himself as an associate of "Mr. Hunt" in an effort to brand Mr. Hunt as a conspirator in the Mexico City shenanigans.

Unfortunately, there are a half-dozen men involved to varying degrees to the events in Dallas with the surname Hunt. To whom this note was addressed is open to question. An open, public and thorough investigation would have named and interrogated them all.

Here's an excellent discussion of the note, which from what I understand was mailed to researcher Penn Jones. The expert testimony during the HSCA indicated the note's body probably was authentic, but the signature — particularly the middle name — was forged. So, what else is confusing?

OSWALD: THE FINAL DAYS

EXCERPT...

ANALYSIS

According to Joseph P. McNally, the forger composed the text of this letter. After that he studied OSWALD'S handwriting, and did a good job of reproducing it. Upon completion, he misspelled LEE HARVEY OSWALD'S middle name when he signed it. Instead of correcting this error, he microfilmed it slightly out of focus, developed the microfilm negative, and printed it. Then he photographed that print. These last steps were unnecessary. Why didn't the forger simply photograph the original forgery? This indicated the letter was opened, microfilmed, then resealed, and sent to its original destination. Someone obtained a print made from an original microfilm negative, photographed it, and mailed it to Penn Jones. The HSCA testimony continued:

Klein: I have but one question. On balance, this HUNT letter, do you find more similarities or dissimilarities overall in the comparison to the other writings or letters, words that all seem to agree in other documents?

McNally: There are no dissimilarities in the body of this particular letter, the context, until you come down to the signature...a part of the signature agrees with OSWALD'S signature...and part of it does not agree...and for these reasons we were unable to come to any firm conclusion regarding this particular document...we are not able to accurately determine that it is specifically a forgery...

Klein: Is it in your opinion a fake?

McNally: No, I am not certain on this particular document.

CONTINUED...

http://www.ajweberman.com/nodules/nodule16.htm

[peacetalksforall]

45. I would read Judyth Baker's story with a grain of caution

I don't think she is lying outright, but I have the feeling she is embellising (outright). I have the feeling she is weaving her own version of relationships between characters. She appears to be hell bent on making Oswald into a savior. Everything she says at this point in time could have been created. If she had said them in 1963 and we had known, it could have meant fewer years of deception of the American people.

A fun thought - someone has written a book claiming that there was a Lee Harvey Oswald and a double. What if Judyth loved the double?

I'm thankful to have learned so many new theories which I hope will lead to more truths. Someday, one of the players will discover a conscience. Or maybe one of them has and its written somewhere.

My gut tells me that the mafia and government paid employees were absolutely behind this by themselves or on behalf of higher-ups. Question. If the CIA, FBI, and SS works with the Mafia - is any money exchanged or all their works done in trade?

Why not teach the truth to our kids? Why teach them bs about our wonderful democracy. Do government murderers go to church the way mafia members do?

One of these days, the media, CBS, ABC, NBC, Murdoch, GE, Time-Warner and Mr. Posner won't be able to push the Warren report down our throats.

[Octafish]

46. Good points all, higher class...

... All witnesses must be evaluated for truthfulness, accuracy, credibility, plausibility and a whole bunch of other things good lawyers know about.

Regarding her story with Oswald, oh yeh. She's making him out a hero, but she may be right. The late New Orleans judge and district attorney Jim Garrison said the government probably wouldn't have been able to convict Lee Harvey Oswald. The guy was identified by eyewitnesses, including a police officer, on the second floor within a minute and a half of the shooting, calmly sipping a Coke in the TSBD's second floor lunch-room. Oswald passed the parafin nitrate tests on his face, meaning he had not shot a rifle that day. Oswald's fingerprints weren't on the weapon when checked by the FBI crime lab (although his palm print was reported on the barrel of the unassembled gun).

Regarding the Secret Service-CIA-FBI-Mafia-NAZI cycle of evil:

Investigation Consolidation

After World War II, there was a heightened concern about subversives infiltrating the Federal Government, especially into law-en forcement and national-security positions. Because of this, President Truman established the Federal Employee Loyalty-Security Program in 1947. The FBI campaigned to bring this entire program under the authority of Intelligence Division, specifically under its Internal Security Section. However, President Harry Truman resisted this centralization, leaving much of this work in the Civil Service Commission. Truman reluctantly did sign a statement in November 1947 that the FBI would make all loyalty investigations, but in practice the controversy continued over the next six years. (Ibid, Book II, pp 42-45)

One of the FBI employees who had been primarily responsible for implementing this consolidation of the loyalty-security program was Robert Maheu, about whom we will read more later. Maheu later stated that one of his last assignments in the FBI was "setting up a counter-intelligence network to try to get all the agencies to cooperate." It was apparently during this effort that he became acquainted with Guy Banister. For some reason, Maheu was transferred from that program to be a Special Agent in Charge in Maine, but he soon quit the FBI in 1947, because "I had difficulty in finding a Communist in the State of Maine." (Hinckle and Turner, The Fish is Red, pg 272; for the date of resignation, see Michael Drosnin, Citizen Hughes (New York: Holt, Rinehart and Winston, 1985, pg 66).

SOURCE (with a whole lotta links)...

http://scribblguy.50megs.com/counter.htm

ScribblGuy does a heck of a good job of making it clear to find info and sources, something sorely lacking for 40 years in our nation's mainstream news media and, of course, from our very own government.